thats a big dip...

9/15/2008 3:29:45 PM

Yep today hurt... really bad

9/15/2008 3:32:58 PM

i'm about ready to just sell everything and hide my cash in my yard.

i'm serious.

9/15/2008 3:43:35 PM

End of the day woes - we've dropped about 100 points in the last 10 minutes

9/15/2008 3:53:41 PM

for real w t f

9/15/2008 3:59:46 PM

shit's overdone

just bought CHK and GS a minute ago

9/15/2008 4:00:08 PM

Some bad times for the economy, arguably the worst since the Great Despression... a "perfect storm" of sorts. I am nervous as to what the next few years hold...

9/15/2008 4:00:52 PM

-503.99 -4.41%

9/15/2008 4:06:02 PM

next up - i'm dumping everything - fuck it

9/15/2008 4:07:45 PM

yeah i might be getting out on the next up day, might be too late though

9/15/2008 4:16:28 PM

Now's the time to be buying

9/15/2008 4:59:42 PM

I'm going to dca all the way to the bottom.

9/15/2008 5:02:03 PM

Quote :

"Now's the time to be buying"

yes, it is.

.... if you want to lose more money tomorrow. and next month. and through the end of the year.

9/15/2008 5:28:55 PM

WaMu is next

9/15/2008 5:43:52 PM

I am concerned about the repercussions of letting lehman fail. I "understand" why Paulson was reluctant to put anymore taxpayer money on the table after the Fannie-Freddie nationalization. However, I still am not sure letting Lehman go under was the best plan.

I have not heard enough about how a Lehman asset sale will be arranged. Are there wholesale buyers? Are the chunks going to be big enough that they won't force a revaluation of the underlying assets. A true fire sale would be disastrous for Citi, WaMu and possibly Wachovia as it would require even deeper writedowns of already distressed assets.

9/15/2008 5:53:44 PM

What no one in the media is focusing on is WHY these institutions are failing. Lehman Bros., Bear Stearns, Merrill Lynch...aren't these supposed to be the absolute best money managers in the world? What does it say about Wall Street that it is precisely these institutions that got us into this crisis in the first place with their bad investments? Why is no one sticking their finger in the chest of these companies and demanding accountability, or at least an explanation?

Because what is in Wall Street's best interest is not making money for you, the investor. They are interested in making money for themselves...and how? Through selling YOU their bad investments, i.e. through their endless lists of mutual funds. If CNBC or the WSJ pointed this out they wouldn't be able to peddle their products to the average Joe like they do. They bank on your transactions and fees and if things go south, guess who loses in the end.

Avoid these funds like the plague. Try to predict future value of individual companies then buy those companies at a discount. If you must invest in a mutual fund, make it a no-load index fund or ETF with extremely low fees.

Read this guy's blog, it is an excellent insight on how to invest and where I have learned about 99% of what I do with my money. Here's what he had to say about the "meltdown" today, it pretty much mirrors what I said earlier: http://www.fwallstreet.com/blog/153.htm#more

9/15/2008 5:59:53 PM

Quote :

"yes, it is. .... if you want to lose more money tomorrow. and next month. and through the end of the year."

Big deal. You planning on retiring in the next few years?

9/15/2008 6:26:31 PM

I want to get into Cisco now that it is hovering around $22 and some change.

[Edited on September 15, 2008 at 6:31 PM. Reason : l]

9/15/2008 6:31:11 PM

^^ no, but point is - if you're not already in, why buy now, when the market is almost surely headed nowhere but down for quite a while now

9/15/2008 6:38:21 PM

I'm not about to start trying to time the market.

9/15/2008 8:00:36 PM

well neither am I. And if you want to buy in now, i'm sure you'll still be fine in the long run.
but it's foolish to think that since we just hit a one day 5% crash that now's the time to start buying all of a sudden

9/15/2008 8:51:39 PM

Would you prefer to buy after a 5% jump?

9/15/2008 9:22:12 PM

I'm not too knowledgeable in the stock market, so correct me if I'm wrong...

What are the odds that there would be a 5% jump in a day? Granted, I know that the market will eventually pull itself back up, but I would figure that it would do so in smaller increments than that. I mean, if the market drops 15% over the course of a month, then inexplicably jumps 5%, one would still be buying 10% cheaper than before.

I think stocks still have some more bottoming out to do.

9/15/2008 9:29:26 PM

david's just mad he's so far under, ignore him

..i'm just as far under though lol

9/15/2008 9:55:34 PM

Me too , yeah it seems very easy to have a horrid day like this, but almost impossible to have an equally good day, lately it has really seemed like one step forward, 4 steps back. Usually one good day out of the week the rest are bad.

9/15/2008 10:26:06 PM

Quote :

"I mean, if the market drops 15% over the course of a month, then inexplicably jumps 5%, one would still be buying 10% cheaper than before."

True, although I'm going to be buying when it's down 15% where as you'd only be buying when it was down 10%.

9/15/2008 10:50:21 PM

Classical investing strategy, don't catch a falling knife.

9/15/2008 11:58:06 PM

I'm buying everything I can right now, haven't sold anything. There are some bargains out there.

9/16/2008 8:08:39 AM

^like what?

9/16/2008 8:11:38 AM

your mom

9/16/2008 8:18:10 AM

Yeah, that shit's goin on the cheap right now

9/16/2008 8:34:07 AM

I think we'll be seeing a lot more pain for a while. Hedge funds are going to be scrambling to raise cash, so there'll be a lot of sell-offs.

The only conservative moves right now that i see:
1. Utilities - not just the dividend. I think most utilities will be raising prices as of Jan 1st
2. Gold
3. Money market fund
4. QID
5. Mattress Stuffing

9/16/2008 8:46:16 AM

I feel like I pretty much picked the worst time in history to jump into the market (May 2008). Now am I pissed that I am down like 40% since then? Yeah pretty much but I dont feel so bad about people our age, we have time to weather this storm and an opportunity to actually buy up some stuff on the cheap for long term. The people I feel really bad for are the people in their mid to late 50's who all of a sudden have gone from looking forward to retirement in a few years to now maybe having to work another 10 years. Either to recoup some of the money they have lost through a few extra years of cash, or waiting until the market finally recovers.

9/16/2008 8:51:56 AM

Europe is getting crushed again this morning.

1,000 down in 2 days? Maybe?

9/16/2008 9:01:36 AM

preopen bid & ask on GS is less than 120

http://finance.google.com/finance?q=pwnt

9/16/2008 9:15:31 AM

See this is what I get for trying to grow up and think about my future and all that crap. If I had instead taken that money and bought my big screen TV that I wanted I would be a much happier person lol.

9/16/2008 9:32:50 AM

sucks, but looks like i'll have to sit tight for a bit or maybe do a little buying as stuff goes down.

9/16/2008 9:36:59 AM

http://finance.google.com/finance?q=AIG

down 65%

[Edited on September 16, 2008 at 9:39 AM. Reason : ]

9/16/2008 9:39:18 AM

Damn, 40 % doss? In what did you invest?

9/16/2008 9:47:48 AM

Make that 44% after today so far Well my first mistake was not being disciplined and minimizing losses, now I am down so far in several stocks that I feel its better to just hold in hopes that they go up rather than sell. At least until I feel like there is something better even worth buying. I have a lot of stocks tied to the energy sector, hence why I say I got in at the worst time (right as everything was peaking). Basically to feel positive I am treating my losses as payment for a crash course in what not to do from now on haha

The good news is things appear to have settled out a bit... for now

[Edited on September 16, 2008 at 10:22 AM. Reason : .]

9/16/2008 10:06:50 AM

Don't worry, it's all part of the learning curve.

I lost 100% of my investment back in 2000 after COVD tanked. I bought a ton on margin, and after the stock dropped 50%, i ended up losing it all after margin calls.

9/16/2008 10:23:52 AM

Yeah plus this market seems much different that the market I grew up watching and talking with my parents about. It really seems very geared towards traders rather than investors as things move so much on the slightest move now. Of course I tried to play that angle to start but unfortunately energy was what I tried to play and it decided to tank and I didnt get out early like I should have. So now Ive become more long and am trying to average the ones I like long term down some at these prices in hopes that 3 or 4 years down the road I will feel like I made a good choice. Either than or be crying when all the money is gone. I had a set amount I wanted to slowly build my account to for this first run and I am almost there so buying opportunities are coming to an end and then its just hold and wait and hope I can get some of these to recover so I can start over again basically.

9/16/2008 10:29:54 AM

On a side note this will be the first year of doing taxes including investments, with the amount of loss I have suffered how much should I expect my tax return to increase? lol

9/16/2008 10:44:21 AM

You fully deduct capital losses against capital gains on Form 1040, Schedule D. If capital losses exceed capital gains you can deduct the excess on your tax return as follows. Your allowable capital loss tax deduction on your tax return for any tax year, figured on Form 1040, Schedule D, is limited to the lesser of:
$3,000 ($1,500 if you are married and file a separate tax return), or
Your capital loss as shown on Form 1040, line 18 of Schedule D.

If you have a capital loss on Form 1040, line 18 of Schedule D that is more than the yearly limit on capital loss tax deductions, you can carry over the unused part of the tax deductible capital loss to later tax years until it is completely used up.

[Edited on September 16, 2008 at 11:02 AM. Reason : ]

9/16/2008 10:53:59 AM

So in simple terms at this point I should assume I will be deducting 3k for loss

[Edited on September 16, 2008 at 11:05 AM. Reason : .]

9/16/2008 11:05:07 AM

it's important to note the wash sale rule: http://www.fairmark.com/capgain/wash/ws101.htm
you can still make the deductions from the basis adjustment, just depends on which year you sell.

imo, this is the best investment:
http://www.google.com/products/catalog?hl=en&q=the+intelligent+investor&cid=11160572797603025457#ps-sellers

9/16/2008 11:24:51 AM

I'm trying to read The Intelligent Investor for the 2nd time.

The first time, it was a bit over my head

The 2nd time looks much of the same. Stay tuned

9/16/2008 11:28:15 AM

Ah I forgot that I actually have to sell the stock for the loss to count so maybe I wont be claiming 3K because a lot of these I plan on holding for a while now. Either way I am fairly certain for ones I have sold the negative outweighs the positive at this point.

9/16/2008 11:29:04 AM

Why not just sell off 3k and then buy back a month later.

9/16/2008 1:02:08 PM

Quote :

"if the market drops 15% over the course of a month, then inexplicably jumps 5%, one would still be buying 10% cheaper than before."

Semantics/nit picking ... I think this is wrong.. for example say the market is @ $100

It drops 15% to $85

It jumps 5% and now increased to $89.25

You'd be buying for 10.75% cheaper than before.

This is based on that old saying "Once you lost 95% of your money, you would have to gain 1,900% just to get back were you started."

Oh, and this thread gets added to my topics

[Edited on September 16, 2008 at 1:11 PM. Reason : Add to MY Topics.]

9/16/2008 1:10:23 PM