According to this, we were 6th:

http://northcarolinastate.scout.com/a.z?s=178&p=9&c=14&view=2&yr=2009

2/5/2009 9:46:06 AM

give me a class full of character guys who will make grades, play hard and who were identified from the beginning of the process as guys our coaches want it and I could not care less about their ranking.

this is a solid class.

2/5/2009 9:46:50 AM

scout has us at 6
rivals has us at 10

rivals has us inking 1 4* kid but Scout has Good(e)? as a 4* giving us 2 instead of one

[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 9:55 AM. Reason : im sure that has something to do with it]

2/5/2009 9:53:02 AM

I wonder how much speed Baker has lost, or how good Barnes will be from the first game. I would like to see Toney Baker used as a hybrid power back/receiving fullback somewhat like Jacob Hester was used at LSU (although probably less of a workload). That formula could let us get the most from our talent on the field and hopefully keep Baker healthy.

2/5/2009 9:57:45 AM

Quote :

"I wasn't aware our class ranked 10th in the ACC. I thought I read it was something more like 6th or 7th. *shrug* "

I'm not at all surprised the N & O used the lower of the two rankings. They are the N & O after all.

2/5/2009 9:59:09 AM

well, with Sam Jones upgraded to a 4*
then that should give us three 4* kids in Byrd, Good? and Jones

fuck rivals and the N&O

edit: wait a minute...how come scout hasnt updated Byrd to a 4 star yet?

[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 10:03 AM. Reason : i dont get it]

2/5/2009 10:01:35 AM

Asa Watson is a 4*

2/5/2009 10:02:06 AM

Scout never had Byrd as a 4*, only Watson and Good from our class at Scout were 4*'s.

2/5/2009 10:05:29 AM

ok so scout has Watson and Good as 4 star kids
rivals has Byrd as our only 4 star kid with Sam Jones not even listed

2/5/2009 10:06:32 AM

I think tight end rankings is one of the biggest crapshoots

Most start TE's in the NFL didn't even come into college at TE's

Lots are converted LB's or DE's, or WR's that are just a little too big or OL that are just a little too small

2/5/2009 10:08:21 AM

I'm not worried about TOB's recruiting yet.

He was a solid recruiter at Boston College and I still think he's filling holes left over from the Amato era.

But I'd still like to see consistent top-25 classes from here on out. You can say what you want about recruiting rankings, but there's a reason you see programs who consistently get top 10 classes (Florida, Texas, USC, Ohio State) stay in the top 10 in the football rankings.

2/5/2009 11:11:36 AM

Solid fundamental coaches (like TOB and staff) and great facilities make for a substantial recruiting platform. Once the wins start coming more frequently and more consistently, recruiting will all but take care of itself. A couple-few good seasons, and I feel that TOB & Co. will have a top 25 recruiting class consistently.

2/5/2009 11:24:31 AM

I think as long as we have a winning season next year and don't have any head scratchers, recruiting will be up for good. You can talk all you want about building a program, but most coaches don't do it overnight, and its tough to recruit with talk (unless your talk has $$$ involved).

I personally don't think you will see O'Brien with many top 10 classes but I think his system and our program can consistently recruit top 20-25 classes and bring some ACC championships. If he does it long enough...who knows. But O'Brien isn't out recruiting stars, he's out recruiting football players, some just may happen to have a lot of stars.

IMO, he sounded more excited about this year's class than he did about last years in his PC, which is telling.

2/5/2009 11:51:18 AM

Quote :

"You can say what you want about recruiting rankings, but there's a reason you see programs who consistently get top 10 classes (Florida, Texas, USC, Ohio State) stay in the top 10 in the football rankings."

this again? how many times does this need to be discussed?

we are not Florida, Texas, USC or OSU - understand? we might get there with TOB and we might not.

what we do know is that TOB and company will take this #37-39 or whatever class and compete

at the highest level (unless we have a crazy number of injuries again). Hell, as of right now we are

looking at 2 or 3rd place finish next year with the classes he has already brought in. you know

with that 2 Star All ACC starting QB Russel Wilson.

Stars are meant for hotels and Tar Holes .... I'll take the ability of our staff to identify talent over

pretty much anyone in the ACC right now.

2/5/2009 11:55:40 AM

Quote :

"You can say what you want about recruiting rankings, but there's a reason you see programs who consistently get top 10 classes (Florida, Texas, USC, Ohio State) stay in the top 10 in the football rankings."

Look at what Florida, Texas, USC, and Ohio State have to work with right in their own back yard. Now look at what we have. Our state produces a fair amount of talented players, but not enough to spread around to 5 D-IA programs, 4 of which are BCS programs. And when you factor in that UF, UT, VT, CU, UGA, FSU, etc. like to come in and snatch some of our best players, you have an even more diluted talent base. That's why we went to Georgia and got 7 players. Georgia only has UGA and GT, and that state produces more and better talent than NC every year. It would be stupid to ignore that state, especially since they are so close. Also you have to consider that since UF, UT-A, USC, and tOSU have so much success, b/c of the homegrown talent, they can go out and recruit nationally when they need a high caliber player to fill a need that the state's talent won't for that year.

2/5/2009 12:47:58 PM

^ding ding ding

the way to bring in the top classes is to establish ourselves as the best program in the state, while beating everyone in the state helps, we need to start winning more games than everyone else too.

2/5/2009 1:33:37 PM

the most telling thing to me is that TOB said that most of the kids they signed were identified by the staff as kids they wanted very early in the process...meaning most of the kids were at the top of their internal wish list at this time last year. they got the kids they wanted.

2/5/2009 1:34:25 PM

Well we got raped on in-state recruiting by UNC this year...so that doesn't necessarily make me feel that good.

But I'm not down on it. I have faith in TOB, recruiting and coaching. I'd just like to see a little more improvement "on paper" next year.

2/5/2009 1:38:05 PM

yeah well I mean one 41-10 game may or may not stick out in a recruits mind enough to sway him, especially that late in the recruiting trail. Our slow start really hurt us last year I think, but we did pretty well last year in-state i think. UNC despite being kind of overrated last year, was still a very good football team. If we get a better start this year (better than .500 plz) before acc play, I think we'll see alot of strides in recruiting.

2/5/2009 1:45:45 PM

lots of teams got raped by UNC this year in recruiting



and state has been out-recruited for most of eternity, with a few exceptions, especially the last couple of years.



41-10



that is all

2/5/2009 1:46:09 PM

Miami hasn't had a recruiting class worse than 17th the last 4 seasons (06-09....yes 09 hasn't enrolled yet), and the other 3 classes were top ten.....they have been lucky to be bowl eligible recently and disgraced the orange bowl in it's last season, ND in a smiliar situation. The big boys (USC, UF, tOSU, UTex, OU) get good recruiting, and do well. Boise, Utah, and Fresno get less than mediocre recruits and do well. And of course, Temple, Middle Tennessee St., Directional U get below average recruits and don't do well. There are many different situations and scenarios, but to know the rank of a recruiting class takes 3 years and ranking the 08 recruits in 08, or the 09 recruits in 09, is just hype. I'd venture to say that our non top-25 2002 recruiting class of Manny, R Wash, McCargo, AJ Davis, T.A. was better than the top ten 2003 class of Mario, Tulluch, and Stone

[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 1:58 PM. Reason : .]

2/5/2009 1:49:39 PM

not to mention the success wake forest has had recently using a similar system that tob is. recruit football players, and players that will fit well into that particular system and that mentality, redshirt them...profit.

[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 2:00 PM. Reason : asadf]

2/5/2009 1:59:51 PM

I can only think of 3 guys that UNC got who we really wanted;

Bond
Moss
Boyd

2/5/2009 2:03:36 PM

Quote :

"Well we got raped on in-state recruiting by UNC this year...so that doesn't necessarily make me feel that good."

and we won the in state battle the year before

2/5/2009 2:54:18 PM

The recruiting classes TOB and staff are landing here are ranked better than any he had at BC. If you look at the rankings when he was there, he was generally in the 50s and 60s and still turned out 8 and 9 win teams.

There is nothing to worry about here.

2/5/2009 3:06:32 PM

Quote :

"and we won the in state battle the year before"

I don't think we've ever won the in-state recruiting as well as UNC did this year. I'm not panicking/worrying...I just don't like it and I hope it doesn't set a trend. Butch is a great recruiter.

Quote :

"The recruiting classes TOB and staff are landing here are ranked better than any he had at BC. If you look at the rankings when he was there, he was generally in the 50s and 60s and still turned out 8 and 9 win teams. There is nothing to worry about here."

That can be taken both ways. First, it makes me feel great about his talent evaluation, player development, and coaching skills. At the same time, you would hope that after being at a decent sized school for so long, and doing well at that school, that he'd have better classes.

Either way guys...calm down. I'm not saying I'm disappointed in the class (I like our guys and I feel like we've met our needs)...I just expect "better" classes in the future.

2/5/2009 3:24:38 PM

Ones loaded up with STAAAAASSSS, right?

2/5/2009 3:26:02 PM

would YOU want to go and play at BC? me neither.

Quote :

"Butch is a great recruiter."

of flashy talent.

their o-line is gonna be hurting in a few years due to lack of recruitment there.

the D is gonna be good, without doubt although FSU killed in terms of D signings...

but I think we did just as good last year as UNC this year

2/5/2009 3:26:46 PM

With better facilities, better fans, better weather, and better talent within driving distance I think it's safe to say the ceiling is higher at NCSU. I'm not sure any coach can keep BC at a consistently higher level than TOB did.

2/5/2009 3:30:02 PM

Jesus Christ guys. I'm not arguing any of those points.

He did fine at BC and I'd love to have a string of 9-win seasons here at State (with an ACC championship sprinkled in here and there).

Can't a guy just hope for higher rated recruiting classes without getting blasted??

2/5/2009 3:39:35 PM

i think that most people just have high hopes for good classes, where as you only seem to care about stars. i dont care if we get players with 1 star as long as we win.

[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 4:02 PM. Reason : .]

2/5/2009 4:01:56 PM

his last 2 classes have been rated higher than most he pulled in at BC. IMO he will keep getting better if our team continues to improve.

2/5/2009 4:03:27 PM

I still can't understand how Rashard Smith, the two time Class 2A Defensive POY in Georgia, is only rated a 2*. Heck Prep Ticket did a whole video story on him.

2/5/2009 4:12:25 PM

same way james washington kicks ass in 6A florida HS football and doesn't get a 3* (on scout) ranking till about 2 months after he comitted to us


and it doesn't seem like people understand some things about UNC recruiting. the school recruits itself. hell they offer guys they really want a shot at walking on to the bball team. that basically means "no matter how good or bad unc football is while you're here, with bball you've got probably a 95% chance of winning a major sport ACC title, and a good shot at a national title." how are you gonna say no to that?

not to mention they go after kids even ECU couldn't get into school, yet somehow those kids turn into academic all-americans and graduate in 3 years.


[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 4:52 PM. Reason : .]

2/5/2009 4:47:06 PM

Quote :

"where as you only seem to care about stars."

Where the fuck did I mention stars??

I was in school during the Chuck Amato era, I know stars don't mean shit if you aren't filling needs and coaching the players when they get there.

That being said...who wouldn't want top 25 classes every year (that fill needs) that TOB can mold into ACC Champions??

2/5/2009 4:50:29 PM

This year's class isn't bad at all. Many of these guys still haven't been evaluated (which is why a lot of them are 2 stars). For example, Rashard Smith was the top defensive player in a state that had a 5 star CB, 6 4-star LBs, 5 4-star DBs, and 2 4-star DL. And he was only a 2 star player.

2/5/2009 4:54:49 PM

^yeah, that's what i was assuming. It's my understand that if they're not evaluated, they're a 2-star. And often times, if they commit early, they're never evaluated. Hence, Smith being ranked a two-star

2/5/2009 5:09:07 PM

O'Brien's horrible classes at BC have been in the ACC Championship for the past 2 seasons.

I'll take that.


Stars are fun and a good indicator overall, but give me high motor 'undersized' players with O'Brien coaching them and 9-10 wins a season and all is well. Don't get me wrong, I'd love the #1 class, but I do know we have a coach who is a proven winner with ho-hum classes

I actually know (Friend of friends) a graduate assistant on O'Brien's staff who said last years class was the best O'Brien said he'd ever had all the way through....by far. The assistant I knew said almost all of the freshmen looked very very good in practice and more could have played this year but O'Brien wanted to redhirt them. Apparently, he thinks even higher of this class according to his comments at the presser yesterday. IMO, that bodes well for us .

Oh, and he said RJ Mattes is going to eat people for breakfast in a few years


[Edited on February 5, 2009 at 5:38 PM. Reason : ]

2/5/2009 5:29:24 PM

^^9 times out of 10 all 2 stars means is they were offered by a few and committed to a BCS school.

2/5/2009 5:33:19 PM

It's always hard to evaluate how a guy will translate to a higher level. I dont care if they are 5 or

4 star recruits. That doesnt mean that they are going to be good college players. You never hear

about the guys that were high recruits and busted. I trust TOB and his staff. An ACC

Championship is highly possible next year if we can sure up our pass defense.

2/5/2009 5:52:50 PM

there was an interesting article in the denver post this week about how more and more top HS football recruits are picking colleges based on the depth chart, and how that's hurting the 'big boys,' and helping the middle of the pack programs.

i.e. top running back this year doesn't want to ride the bench at USC for two seasons.. etc and it was saying that even QBs and lineman are starting to get that attitude.

2/5/2009 10:35:53 PM

Some 2010 updates

Anthony Creecy was here on an unofficial visit for the UNC basketball game. He still has us listed as High Interest on Rivals. I've gotta say if we land him, it seems like he will be an awesome pick up. Here's a list of all the programs that have offered: Oregon, Stanford, Wake Forest, East Carolina, Clemson, Duke, Florida State, Maryland, Ole Miss, North Carolina

DE Fre'Shad Hunter, out of Cary HS, has an offer from us and he has us listed as High Interest on Scout.

OT Logan Stewart from Boiling Springs, SC has us as the only school listed as High Interest on Scout. An article I posted on page 41 said that he had been contacted by South Carolina, Clemson, Alabama, Buffalo, Duke, Georgia, N.C. State, Tennessee, Vanderbilt, Virginia, Wake Forest and West Virginia. It also said that NC State and Vandy lead. He looks to be a good prospect. He's a player that takes academics seriously and has a 4.2 GPA.

Listed below is all of the uncommitted players that have known State offers.

OT Robert Crisp
WR Anthony Creecy
OT T.J. Leifheit
DE Fre'Shad Hunter
DE Prince Shembo
DE Gabe King
MLB Kendall Moore
S Dontae Johnson
DE Ego Ferguson
DT Evan Hailes
RB Mustafa Greene
WR Andrew Carswell
WR Justin Hunter
OT Mark Shuman
ATH Keenan Allen
ATH Joshua Snead
CB John Fulton
CB Lamarcus Joyner
CB A.J. Marshall (teammate of Creecy's)
S P.J. Clyburn
OLB Chris McCain
OLB Travis Williams

2/5/2009 11:25:29 PM

Quote :

"Where the fuck did I mention stars??"

you said you wanted higher rated recruiting classes.

that's solely based on stars.

2/6/2009 7:09:07 AM

^While the rankings are heavily dependent upon star ratings, they're not solely based on them...

http://www.scout.com/support/teamrankings.html

http://ncstate.rivals.com/content.asp?CID=59026

But yeah I know what you meant, not trying to be a wise ass, just clarifying.

2/6/2009 8:29:47 AM

i really really really hope we get Crisp and Creecy
those two guys are going to be studs

2/6/2009 8:52:10 AM

the competition for Crisp will be out of state IMO.

the competition for Creecy will be in state.

2/6/2009 9:53:34 AM

^^^

yeah i should have worded that differently.

2/6/2009 10:31:04 AM

http://www.newsobserver.com/826/story/1380968.html

Quote :

"But getting the best players doesn't always equate to winning games and titles, especially in the ACC. The top-ranked classes in the ACC for the past five years were, in order, Florida State, Florida State, Florida State, Clemson and Miami. Florida State won the ACC title in 2005, but hasn't reached the league championship game since. Virginia Tech's classes were ranked as Nos. 7, 3, 6, 7 and 4 in the ACC, yet the Hokies won league titles in 2004, 2007 and 2008. Wake Forest's classes were Nos. 11 (Boston College had not joined the league in 2004 and there were only 11 ACC teams), 12, 12, 12 and 10, but the Deacs won the title in 2006. Boston College, with classes ranked Nos. 10, 7, 9 and 7, played for the league title in 2007 and 2008."

2/6/2009 11:02:15 AM

Quote :

"^While the rankings are heavily dependent upon star ratings, they're not solely based on them... "

Yeah, thats how UNC can recruit one 5 star player, a couple of 4 stars that won't ever make it to campus, and 10 wide recievers in one class with some questionable offensive line recruits and get a top 5 class, when every other team in the top 10 has numerous blue chip recruits that will be impact players NEXT season.

Go figure

2/6/2009 11:03:41 AM

^I'm not begging for top-10 classes.

I'd just be happy with a top 25 class on a somewhat consistent basis. I think the difference between those top 50/60 classes and top 15 classes is the occasional superstar/difference maker per class. I trust TOB to find a few diamonds in the rough...but it would be nice to hit a home run or two every class.

2/6/2009 11:06:51 AM