Quote :

"How many people in here wait until the cop is at your window before you even bother to get your license and registration?"

The first time I got pulled by an NCSHP (I was 19) I was proactive as was mentioned. I got out my license and went in my glove box and got my registration all ready for him. The officer asked me what I thought I was doing when he walked up and I explained I was getting out my information in advance. He told me thanks but that was the wrong way to handle it and to never do this until an officer asks you because he said it looks suspicious as fuck. Since that time I roll down the window and keep my hands on the steering wheels and do exactly what is asked of me. Especially since I have my concealed carry, although thankfully I have not been pulled any since I got my permit.

[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 10:03 AM. Reason : ]

6/22/2017 10:03:20 AM

in drivers ed they taught us to just wait for the officer so it doesn't look like you are stashing/grabbing something

but this is all a silly point because the cop murdered a dude who wasn't a threat

6/22/2017 10:19:11 AM

yah that video is pretty fucking conclusive :x

If I'm being honest I bet, "Sir ... I have to tell you... I have a gun in my front pocket, I'm going to get my wallet from my back pocket so I can get my ID" (with hands at 10 and 2) Probably would have been the WAY better thing to say. Or even "Sir I have a gun in my front pocket. What would you like me to do with it."

That being said, cop totally just freaked the fuck out. The not guilty verdict was a sham. It's not Castille's fault. He could have been more clear, but he still shouldnt have been shot in that scenario.

6/22/2017 10:23:19 AM

I can't think of a situation where one would tell an officer that he had a gun, before shooting him.

6/22/2017 10:39:58 AM

Neither can I

6/22/2017 10:45:06 AM

we all know marijuana turns you into a violent sociopath, he obviously wanted to scare the officer before killing him because he was all hopped up on the marijuana

6/22/2017 10:57:45 AM

Quote :

""I thought, I was gonna die," Officer Jeronimo Yanez told investigators from the Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension fifteen hours after the shooting. "And I thought if he’s, if he has the, the guts and the audacity to smoke marijuana in front of the five year old girl and risk her lungs and risk her life by giving her secondhand smoke and the front seat passenger doing the same thing then what, what care does he give about me. And, I let off the rounds and then after the rounds were off, the little girls was screaming.""

6/22/2017 11:19:23 AM

Quote :

""ANY LIMITATIONS ON THE RIGHT TO BEAR ARMS IS AN INFRINGEMENT OF THE 2ND AMENDMENT AND A SLIPPERY SLOPE TO GUN SIEZURES" --cop murders a black CCW permit holder-- "Well his address changed and he smoked weed, so the 2nd amendment doesn't apply here.""

I'm not sure what the disconnect is between leftists and the concept of "individual responsibility" or "following the law". Mental gymnastics kick in anytime there is a black victim...

The guy was illegally carrying a weapon, and you're acting as if it is hypocritical for the NRA to not support him? You're acting as if the NRA is racist by not supporting him? It was an illegal carry, you regressive race-baiting shits.

I know it is hard for the cult of social justice to understand, but people outside of your cult actually care about the content of one's character, and the actions of the individual, over the color of one's skin.

While your cult likes to worship thugs that assault cops as martyrs for social justice, some people outside of your bubble actually care about the lawfulness of the person.

-and I'm not defending this terrible shooting, I'm just trying to stop the SJW race-baiting and stupidity... you guys have made it very clear you can't objectively look at police shootings without melting down into SJW-riot mode.

6/22/2017 11:21:42 AM

So fucking low energy. No Marxist reference even. Sad!

6/22/2017 11:23:57 AM

SJW barely even made it into the post too

very low energy. sad!

6/22/2017 11:24:50 AM

it's just funny when people make the argument that ANY regulation of the 2nd amendment is unconstitutional while out of the other side of their mouth dismissing Castile's 2nd amendment right because he happened to smoke weed and didn't update his address.

What part of "shall not be infringed" don't you understand???

6/22/2017 11:26:06 AM

Quote :

"hopefully we can have some actual discussion and discourse"

silly me

6/22/2017 11:36:15 AM

requiring background checks for all gun purchases = infringement and is serious enough that people will vote based on this single issue
murdering a black guy because you think he smoked weed and he is carrying a gun = not infringement

#whitepeoplelogic

[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 11:37 AM. Reason : y]

6/22/2017 11:37:14 AM

Quote :

" didn't update his address."

I mean ... that still makes it illegal. You ignoring/marginalizing this point just gives him the nerd fuel to power on with his argument.

The bigger point being ... Legal or Illegal carry in this case makes absolutely no fucking difference to the outcome of the situation, unless your postulation is "since he wasn't legally carrying, he shouldnt have had a gun in the first place."

That doesn't address, at all, the situation that -DID- happen, however.

6/22/2017 11:46:50 AM

I'm not dismissing Castile's 2nd amendment right. I'm pointing out to you why the NRA isn't using his case... because he was illegally carrying.

That isn't a justification for the shooting, that is just an explanation for why the NRA isn't speaking up on this case, since you seemed to think it was about race.

6/22/2017 11:48:19 AM

How is he illegally carrying a gun when he has a concealed weapons permit?

6/22/2017 11:51:06 AM

his Permit was submitted in another county before he moved. He didn't update his address or notify the sherrif's department he'd moved. As you can see in the cover letter for his permit he was required to do so within 30 days of his move. Thus, he was guilty of a misdemeanor for not providing said notification.


Again ... none of that is important. Even if he was illegally carrying, it should have just come down to either a reminder to change his address or a fine. Completely irrelevant to why he was gunned down.

6/22/2017 12:03:47 PM

^^because he wasn't complying with every detail of said permit.

^^^and I'm telling you it's laughable that an organization that calls permitless Concealed carry laws "Constitutional carry" (suggesting that only permitless carry rules are constitutional) is suddenly concerned about the status of Castile's permit.



[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 12:08 PM. Reason : ^but it's not irrelevant to point out hypocrisy in reactions people are having]

6/22/2017 12:05:48 PM

^ because he wasn't complying specifically with the part that said "you will be guilty of a crime if you do not do this"

you're doing it again. Second part tho, quite true.

6/22/2017 12:07:00 PM

Quote :

" it's laughable that an organization that calls permitless Concealed carry laws "Constitutional carry" (suggesting that only permitless carry rules are constitutional) is suddenly concerned about the status of Castile's permit."

qft

6/22/2017 12:07:05 PM

the NRA and gun nuts get mad when they have to show proof they are carrying legally since cops should always assume a gun is legal until they know otherwise

when its a black guy though...

6/22/2017 12:07:29 PM

I honestly don't think any posters ITT actually disagree that it was a terrible shoot with the facts we have, I think the only disagreement is with the race-baiting shits like ^ ITT

6/22/2017 12:09:26 PM

I can't tell if you two are joking or not lol.

6/22/2017 12:09:30 PM

^^fine, we all agree it was an unjustified shooting. So why did the cop get acquitted of all charges?

6/22/2017 12:13:06 PM

if carrying a gun is a legal thing to do, and you see someone carrying a gun, you should assume it is legally being carried

kind of like how since driving a nice car is a legal thing to do, you should assume someone is driving a nice car legally

when it's a black guy driving a nice car though...

6/22/2017 12:16:05 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ue8XaSWYDaQ

So if someone sees me, and thinks "I bet that dude is gonna shoot me"

And I walk up and shoot them. Should I still be offended that they thought I looked like a guy that would shoot them? Is it valid to get upset, when they correctly identified that I was going to shoot them? It's hard to maintain the morale high ground when you're actually doing the thing you're assumed to be doing

Either way, how the living fuck did we move on to the assumptions of his carry status? I didn't hear the cop say "since you're illegally carrying your gun, don't take it out" Who the fuck gives a shit? How do y'all manage to drag people into these retarded arguments.

Or are y'all mad over the assumption that his carry status was only investigated because he's black, and if a white dude had done it no one would have looked up his pistol permit? (probably much more valid, and where you should direct your attention, although in the end he fit the sterotype and fucked up everybodies need to be offended.)

6/22/2017 12:19:07 PM

According to the republicans and NRA there should be no laws against anyone carrying a gun anywhere.

6/22/2017 12:26:33 PM

meh

6/22/2017 12:28:07 PM

^ the entire gist of the defense was the cop "acted appropriately in the presence of a gun."

Which, of course, is insane. But it raises legit questions on what cops are allowed to do around a legally carrying gun owner. Which naturally leads to questions of if Castile was legally carrying or not and what assumptions the cop was making on Castile's status as a legal CC.

6/22/2017 12:36:13 PM

yah that's insane. Dude flipped the fuck out when dude reached for his wallet. His VERY first question should have been "ok, where is the gun," everything in this situation is avoided if Cop asks where gun is (IE not in back pocket or console near wallet)

6/22/2017 12:40:09 PM

Quote :

"it's just funny when people make the argument that ANY regulation of the 2nd amendment is unconstitutional while out of the other side of their mouth dismissing Castile's 2nd amendment right because he happened to smoke weed and didn't update his address. What part of "shall not be infringed" don't you understand???"

I appreciate that as a pedestrian I have the right-of-way to cross at crosswalks to get to the beach in the summertime. I also stop to look both ways and make sure cars are actually slowing down to let me pass, because right-of-way isn't enough to keep me alive.

There are way too many people in here pretending like Castile did absolutely nothing wrong and got shot for no reason. He didn't deserve to get shot, but he made some dumb decisions that contributed to his death. Yanez made some really dumb decisions as well. The biggest issue for both of them was piss-poor communication, with Castile just stating "I got a gun on me" and Yanez just stating "Well don't reach for it.". Castile clarifying "I am a CCW holder and have a gun, how do you want me to proceed?" while remaining still would probably have resulted in him being alive today. Yanez responding with "Please place your hands on the steering wheel and inform me where the firearm is" or something of that nature would also likely have resulted in Castile being alive today.

6/22/2017 12:54:43 PM

So, you don't believe Castile "flashed" the gun at the cop anymore? What changed?

Also, I personally believe the burden of communication and "acting appropriately" rests MOSTLY on the guy who has 1,000s of hours of training on what to do and say during a traffic stop. While Castile doesn't have a right to act a fool, expecting him to repeat verbatim whatever he learned in a 8hr CC class, in order to save his life, is insane.

[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 1:04 PM. Reason : The cop lost his shit. Period.]

6/22/2017 1:01:07 PM

if someone isn't okay with interacting with an armed person without immediately assuming they are a threat that requires lethal force, then tough shit don't be a cop

since even eleusis now acknowledges that he didn't flash a gun then everyone must agree that shooting wasn't justified

6/22/2017 1:09:51 PM

"flash" means to display briefly, which is still what I believe happened - fumbling for wallet, gun becomes visible, cop goes apeshit and starts shooting.

[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 1:35 PM. Reason : what he was taught in his CCW class could have saved his life]

6/22/2017 1:35:02 PM

I'm pretty sure eleusis would also tell that girl she got raped because she was showing too much skin.

6/22/2017 1:44:48 PM

Quote :

"cop goes apeshit and starts shooting."

so he does agree it was unjustified

6/22/2017 1:48:00 PM

Quote :

"So why did the cop get acquitted of all charges?"

Because based on the evidence/arguments presented in court, the jury believed the officer had a reason to fear for his life.

6/22/2017 2:02:58 PM

Yeah the take home point is that you will never find a jury that doesn't have a combination of adoration for police and contempt for black people. Not in this country.

6/22/2017 2:18:29 PM

It pretty much all rests on the cop's claim that he saw Castile put his hand on his gun. However, in the dash cam video the cop can't relay where the gun is on Castile, in fact, he openly admits "I don't know where the fucking gun is" while being interviewed in the back of the squad car. None of the other cops can even locate the gun, or even seem concerned to look for it until after they've been doing CPR for 3 mins and it basically falls out of his pocket. It's bullshit.

6/22/2017 2:21:58 PM

I hate to break it to you... but the jury was actually in the courtroom and was presented with all the evidence and arguments, so I'd say they have a little bit more credibility than a few emotional "SJW Hot Takes" on TWW.

But hey, who knows, maybe the jury could have phoned in to Chit Chat during the deliberation... I'm sure they would have appreciated your #outrage

6/22/2017 2:34:43 PM

The same could be said of Former Director Comey and his decision not to pursue charges against Hillary over emails. But that doesn't stop you from whining endlessly about it.

6/22/2017 2:37:38 PM

damn...shit just got real up in hurrrr

6/22/2017 2:48:05 PM

Quote :

"The same could be said of Former Director Comey and his decision not to pursue charges against Hillary over emails. But that doesn't stop you from whining endlessly about it."

Except in that case the justice system was bypassed due to partisan politics. I'm not a fan of that.

Whereas with Jeronimo Yanez, evidence was presented, and a jury made a decision. I am a fan of that.

That was a nice pivot though

6/22/2017 2:55:01 PM

6/22/2017 3:09:22 PM

Quote :

"so he does agree it was unjustified"

yeah, I agree the shooting was unjustified. I'm not arguing that the cop was in the right or that Castile deserved to get shot - just that Castile did a lot of dumb things that contributed to his death. Claiming he got shot for doing everything right is a stretch, as this situation could have been avoided if Castile made one change to any of these dumb decisions.

- poor communication. clarifying where the gun was or that he had a CCW license and not fumbling around until the cop has time to process what was said might have kept him alive.
- carrying a firearm when you've been smoking weed and have weed in the car. Avoiding either one might have kept Castile alive, either through improved reaction time to what the cop was screaming about or by having the gun locked in the trunk so that he didn't have to bother even mentioning it to the cop.
- carrying a firearm when your CCW is invalid. no gun on him, and he likely doesn't get shot.

there's a lot more to be learned here than just "hurr durr cops shoot black people". There are multiple take-home messages for gun owners regarding this case that might help someone on here one day not make the same mistake.

6/22/2017 3:11:44 PM

except that "hurr durr a cop shot a black guy" is still valid because a cop overreacted and needlessly murdered a black guy who wasn't a lethal threat

[Edited on June 22, 2017 at 3:18 PM. Reason : and it keeps happening and no one is held accountable ]

6/22/2017 3:18:24 PM

I wonder how many police shootings are actually prosecuted and the officer found guilty. Surely they're not shooting at 100%....

6/22/2017 3:21:05 PM

a very low number

6/22/2017 3:27:32 PM

Quote :

"except that "hurr durr a cop shot a black guy" is still valid because a cop overreacted and needlessly murdered a black guy who wasn't a lethal threat my political agenda and religious cult"

6/22/2017 3:34:45 PM

Quote :

"Whereas with Jeronimo Yanez, evidence was presented, and a jury made a decision. I am a fan of that."

Well, not all of the evidence was allowed to be presented to the jury:

http://m.startribune.com/case-file-in-philando-castile-shooting-to-be-made-public-juror-said-dashcam-video-didn-t-show-enough-to-convict-yanez/429482323/

Quote :

"The Minnesota Bureau of Criminal Apprehension also is expected to release the interview its investigators conducted with Yanez after the shooting, which became a point of contention during the trial. Prosecutors did not introduce that interview as evidence until cross-examining Yanez on the stand. Judge William H. Leary III denied that request but allowed it to be referenced during Yanez’s cross-examination. During deliberations, jurors asked to see the interview transcript. Leary said no."

Allegedly in this interview (it's supposed to be released but I haven't found it yet), yanez never mentions he actually saw a gun. Either the Judge or the DA's prosecutors fucked up on this. No surprise considering most local justice systems and local law enforcement are all buddy-buddy and looking out for each other.

6/22/2017 3:36:58 PM