You can calm down, it was just a suggestion. I was not suggesting that their are crazy accidents, because or that CCP'ers are irresponsible. It just seems that some people actually think they these things. I was just offering this as a suggestion as to why administrations are against allowing it.

[Edited on February 16, 2009 at 8:17 AM. Reason : hgh]

2/16/2009 8:15:08 AM

have there been ANY incidents at schools that DO allow CC on campus?

2/16/2009 8:15:14 AM

^not that I know of
^^I am calm. I was hoping for you to add some details to your statements so as to make them worth while or disprove them. We can all think of reasons why the university admin doesn't like this idea (and they go much deeper & dumber than the "not a good idea" BS).

2/16/2009 8:29:38 AM

I don't have any details. It was just a suggestion, but from some of the comments I've read in here some people disagree with allowing CCP for asinine reasons and it seems that U administrations and Campus Police Officials can't or won't give a straight reason why they are against it other than 'its a bad idea.'

Is it a money issue? Stupidity? Faculty? They just can't give a valid reason.

2/16/2009 8:36:43 AM

ah, ok I see.

Well their (University & CP) lack of good reasoning, I suspect is due to many things.
1.) Lack of knowledge about CCPs, CC'ers, legal aspects, basically anything gun & CC related
2.) Lack of knowledge about what SCCC supports and is attempting to accomplish
3.) They believe they can mostly ignore SCCC and that it will eventually go away
4.) Personal politics; pressures from above.

This last point is quite bothersome to me - people and small groups in the NCSU administration like to push their personal politics on everyone else. I know this from first hand experience - and it goes up fairly high in the chain of command (I won't go into any more details - teh interwarbs are being watched ). These personal political agendas prevent a lot of good from happening at NCSU. Also, those with these agendas basically force others to agree with their opinion. Kind of reminiscent of some good 'ol dictatorships, totalitarians, etc - cue the Nazi's, Stalin, Saddam, and the list continues. Not that I'm exactly comparing them - hell it's just like the U.S. military used to be run - whatever the top said was God's word and no one else dared to differentiate.

Another reason I believe that some people at the University are forced to "represent" other people's opinions and are misinformed about SCCC is because CP's stance on CC doesn't follow with many fellow LEO organizations, who strongly approve of CC.

[Edited on February 16, 2009 at 9:08 AM. Reason : + ) = :crack ahahah, opps]

2/16/2009 9:07:44 AM

Quote :

"This last point is quite bothersome to me - people and small groups in the NCSU administration like to push their personal politics on everyone else. I know this from first hand experience - and it goes up fairly high in the chain of command (I won't go into any more details - teh interwarbs are being watched ). These personal political agendas prevent a lot of good from happening at NCSU."

this is all bullshit unless you give us examples where this is the case

2/16/2009 1:00:15 PM

You can take my word for it or don't - I don't care. However, I don't feel like calling out certain people in the University at setting such as this. And where would your evidence be to support that there are not personal agendas and politics occurring?

[Edited on February 16, 2009 at 1:02 PM. Reason : r]

2/16/2009 1:02:05 PM

Actually it is quite true.
When you work for the university as we both do, you experience it first hand.
I also agree with leaving out names and examples.

2/16/2009 3:20:26 PM

you dont want to provide legitimate examples, fine; i say it smells like bullshit

2/16/2009 3:24:07 PM

smells like trolling?

2/16/2009 3:33:34 PM

no, it just seems to me that if you are going to cast legitimate aspersions (well, what you think is legitimate) without actually naming names, then all you do is blanket everyone negatively which is unfair to those that actually dont try to promote their individual agenda

i think that either you man up and name names, or you just dont even mention anything

2/16/2009 3:36:26 PM

^^^^ i, too, work for the university, and do not want to get fired for naming names.

[Edited on February 16, 2009 at 3:48 PM. Reason : ]

2/16/2009 3:48:12 PM

here is a hint: dont fucking post anything then

2/16/2009 3:51:02 PM

you can't back up your argument because you lack any concrete proof. we can't back ours up because our jobs could be at stake.

big difference.

2/16/2009 4:37:13 PM

No one said everyone at the university has personal agendas, etc that they are pushing on others.

And the fact that 3 people have now confirmed experiencing this begins to give support to the idea. I'm pretty sure that you believe some things exist in this world, without every seeing or experiencing them...

2/16/2009 5:09:07 PM

i dont think you understand

if you were so worried about your job, you wouldnt have even posted what you did...its not like the cops havent come around here for less that this

im telling you that if you feel that you need to post that people are, then you need to go whole hog because you dont have any anonymity on here anyway

people have been fired from webassign jobs for posting fake threads to give away answers

[Edited on February 16, 2009 at 5:34 PM. Reason : 

2/16/2009 5:30:06 PM

Actually, saying there are problems in a job, and calling out bosses are entirely different.

________________________________________________________________________________

This column appeared in my school newspaper yesterday.
http://www.alligator.org/articles/20...90212_col1.txt

Guns have a rightful place in schools
By JONATHAN LOTT, Alligator Columnist
A Gainesville teacher was arrested on Monday after he was found to be in possession of two loaded firearms — a small one in his pocket and a larger one in his car.

The teacher, Mark Stockdale, was being investigated for a battery charge that allegedly occurred the night before. We have no idea what Stockdale’s motives were, but we do know his crime. He was charged with two felonies for having concealed handguns at his school.

My question is why are we so concerned about people bringing guns to school?


Guns are not bad per se. Guns are tools of self protection. Some estimates place the number of times people use a gun for self–defense as high as two million a year. The Supreme Court has ruled that the Constitution protects the individual right to keep and bear firearms.

Guns are only bad when they are used to hurt the innocent. Simply having a gun in your possession does not mean that you are planning to use one illegally.

Then we come to the question of schools. We remember the horrible tragedies at Virginia Tech and Columbine and want to do everything we can to stop recurrences, so we think that banning guns in school will reduce crime.

It’s already illegal to shoot a gun at an innocent person, so how will banning the presence of guns at school keep us from doing this? If someone plans to commit murder, charging them for gun possession isn’t going to deter them.

What a gun ban is going to deter is someone who plans to use it for self–defense. Without good people carrying guns for self–defense, the only people who have guns are criminals. A perpetrator with a handgun can fire the weapon well before police arrive. Seung–Hui Cho went on a rampage for nine minutes at Virginia Tech before police arrived.

The only way we can stop criminals from using guns is to let good people have guns, too.

Concealed weapons permits allow people to carry completely hidden guns on their person for self–defense. These permits require training to obtain, and carriers are highly unlikely to commit a crime (one out 350,000 carriers was convicted for homicide, according to a study done from 1987 to 1997).

But, wouldn’t it be unsafe to have thousands walking around with guns in our schools? No. Only those over 21 and trained could carry a firearm. The weapons would be concealed and only used in the event of a true emergency. Criminals fearing for their lives would be deterred by just knowing that guns could be present, and if criminals are still crazy enough to start shooting, they could be quickly taken down before they do nearly as much damage as they otherwise might.

I’m not sure of the intentions of Stockdale, but just carrying a firearm at school should not be a felony. Trained, well–intentioned carriers are the only thing that can prevent a tragedy from becoming a massacre. Criminals know this, and hence, so many massacres occur in gun–free zones like schools and post offices.

How many lives could have been saved if a trained teacher at Columbine had a gun?

We will never know the answer, nor will we see any tragedy prevented, so long as we continue to allow criminals to monopolize guns.

Johnathan Lott is a political science and economics sophomore. His column appears on Thursdays

2/17/2009 7:25:24 PM

^ picked up my CCP today from downtown. It actually took a lot less time than I thought it would, what with changes in administration/personnel up in Washington.

2/23/2009 7:40:57 PM

congrats.

The next meeting of NCSU chapter of SCCC is tomorrow at 7:30 at I Love NY Pizza, and the second floor seating area is where we will be meeting.

[Edited on February 23, 2009 at 9:27 PM. Reason : .]

2/23/2009 9:17:23 PM

Another article; This one from JMU:

http://breezejmu.org/2009/02/26/firing-back/

2/26/2009 3:31:04 PM

man - that article started out so well and then crapped all over the place at the end. I was really looking forward to a well laid out argument.

2/26/2009 4:04:03 PM

I too had high hopes for that article.

The comments are the best part of that article.

2/26/2009 4:49:43 PM

http://www.thepinelog.com/media/storage/paper954/news/2009/03/02/Opinion/Do.Guns.On.Campus.Make.Us.Safer-3655267.shtml" target="_blank">http://media.http://www.thepinelog.com/media/storage/paper954/news/2009/03/02/Opinion/Do.Guns.On.Campus.Make.Us.Safer-3655267.shtml
Do guns on campus make us safer?
By: Julianna Backer
Issue date: 3/2/09 Section: Opinion

When I first heard about the idea of allowing concealed carry on campus, my immediate reaction was shock and horror. For those of you who may not know, concealed carry is the ability to carry a gun concealed on one's person. The idea of SFA suddenly becoming a campus full of gun-toting students is a little discomforting.

But every story has two sides. After all, if one of the students in the Virginia Tech massacre had been carrying a gun, perhaps the massacre would have been prevented. Or perhaps not. The simple fact of the matter is that someone carrying a gun may be too paralyzed to use it.

But the people who are going to commit acts like the Virginia Tech massacre don't worry about permits and laws. When you've made up your mind to kill as many people as possible, it stops mattering whether the gun you're carrying is legal or not.

A tragedy like Virginia Tech could happen anywhere, but is that risk high enough to allow students to carry guns on campus, thereby risking more accidents? There is a long and involved background check for anyone who wants to get a gun, one that might hopefully eliminate things like mental instability or previous criminal history.

But background checks can't eliminate certain things. They can't eliminate the effects of someone drinking heavily and losing some of their inhibitions. They can't eliminate anger over things like infidelity.

SFA is, relatively, a safe campus. According to the Campus Crime Statistics, no SFA students have been murdered here in five years. Violence is rare here. Does it discourage or encourage students to tell them that they can bring guns on campus? By allowing them that freedom, are we making them feel more safe or less safe? Would it reduce or increase our crime statistics? These are questions almost wholly without answers, and unless such a program is enacted, we'll probably never know. But the simple question is, is there a pressing need?

There is already a national group called Students For Concealed Carry On Campus that is trying to promote the issue to legislators and Congress. From an interview with Newsweek:

"There are currently 11 U.S. universities that have for a combined total of 60 semesters allowed concealed carry on campus without an incident. You haven't seen an incident of gun violence, an incident of gun theft, no gun accidents," said W. Scott Lewis, a board member for the group.

What it comes down to is that we simply don't have the resources to stop kids bringing guns on campus. After all, there are no metal detectors at SFA. There are no random searches. Students are allowed to come and go freely every day. It is currently not allowed at SFA, and there is no expectation that this will change any time soon. Still, the question has been raised and the issue should be given due consideration by every SFA student. Is there a compelling reason to allow guns on campus? Would it make us all safer or more at risk?

3/3/2009 6:57:10 PM

Instead of making a new thread, I'm bringing this one back.

Students for Concealed Carry on Campus is having its third Empty Holster Protest the week of April 20th-24th.
We will be wearing our empty holsters around campus all week. We have a number of events set up as well.
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/event.php?eid=56175158994&ref=nf

The NCSU Chapter of SCCC event page for the Empty Holster Protest:
http://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#/event.php?eid=70625983717&ref=nf

The NCSU Chapter of SCCC event page for our Brickyard Information Day:
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=91235676288#/event.php?eid=70828148907&ref=nf

The NCSU Chapter of SCCC event page for the Private Range Day:
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=91235676288

The NCSU Chapter of SCCC Grill Out, Go Karts, and Putt Putt:
http://www.facebook.com/event.php?eid=64535383862

4/7/2009 11:49:24 PM

busy man this evening!

4/7/2009 11:50:51 PM

Everyone!!!!!!!!!!! Read and spread this article.

Pretend "Gun-free" School Zones: A Deadly Legal Fiction David B. Kopel
Working Paper Series, Social Science Research Network
March 28, 2009
http://papers.ssrn.com/sol3/papers.cfm?abstract_id=1369783

4/8/2009 12:03:26 AM

Missouri House OKs concealed guns on campuses
http://www.ksdk.com/news/local/story.aspx?storyid=172089&catid=3

JEFFERSON CITY, Mo. (AP) -- The Missouri House has voted to lift a ban on carrying concealed weapons at state colleges and universities.
On a vote of 106-41 yesterday, the House approved an amendment rolling back the existing prohibition. The ban is part of the Missouri law allowing qualified citizens to receive permits for carrying concealed weapons.

The amendment was added to a bill lowering the minimum age for getting a concealed-carry permit to 21. It's now 23.

Republican Brian Munzlinger of Williamstown sponsored the measure allowing concealed weapons at public colleges. Munzlinger says it would improve school safety because people seeking to cause harm sometimes target gun-free zones.

But Democrat Chris Kelly of Columbia says no good can come from mixing guns with college dormitories and fraternity houses.

4/9/2009 4:54:27 PM