(since nobody reads the last post)


Pat Forde was just on the Tony Kornheiser radio show and the both agreed that there is absolutely no way that Roy survives this

Forde also called for both banners to come down

10/31/2014 11:32:43 AM

30 for 30: Pony Excess

SMU: "when the local media turns its guns on you, you're finished"

"if you are going to be a dirty program you better be good at it"

"if the NCAA comes and talks to you, you lie.... Deny, Deny, Deny"



[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 11:50 AM. Reason : _]

10/31/2014 11:45:30 AM

^^
How about 93 too? And the 1924 one from the bakery?

[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 11:45 AM. Reason : ]

10/31/2014 11:45:34 AM

http://www.icontact-archive.com/Y2ByayiZT8VlsRxEhjk2VM6QTscWtsQC?

10/31/2014 12:00:32 PM

I wonder what is worse, SMU and buying recruits/players after being put on probation or UNC and using ineligible players for 18 years? SMU fired the coach, the AD and the president of the university. I'll take two head coaches from UNC and dropping at least 2 banners.

Honestly, UNC sounds so much worse especially since SMU had no National Championships and UNC is sitting on at least 3 that had ineligible players.

The death penalty for UNC would be so awesome though. I hope the NCAA representative who reads out the penalties to UNC also faints after standing up.



[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 12:20 PM. Reason : _]

10/31/2014 12:17:46 PM

I wonder if NCSU would use the red lights on the bell tower if they announce the death penalty?

10/31/2014 12:22:00 PM

If UNC gets the death penalty we should bring David Thompson back to Raleigh to play a pick up game, lol.

10/31/2014 12:44:58 PM

Quote :

"Pat Forde was just on the Tony Kornheiser radio show and the both agreed that there is absolutely no way that Roy survives this Forde also called for both banners to come down"

just reading that makes me giddy

10/31/2014 1:00:43 PM

Holy Shit, June Jones is on the market!!! Watch out Doeren!

http://collegesportsblog.dallasnews.com/2014/10/ex-smu-coach-june-jones-school-not-doing-enough-to-help-student-athletes-academically.html/


To the people saying they won't take away Championships, tell that to Reggie Bush and his Heisman






[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 1:05 PM. Reason : _]

10/31/2014 1:00:54 PM

They could legitimately keep pressing this narrative since there is no smoking gun connecting Roy to the steering of athletes into those classes. Yes, they can still definitely fire him for lack of oversight, but it sounds like they'd rather defend him and his legacy by insisting he was totally uninvolved. The question is how big of a punishment from the NCAA could he withstand before UNC cuts the cord. At some point, they'll dump all the blame on him to defend Dean Smith's legacy.

10/31/2014 1:16:59 PM

Somehow they'll blame it on Doherty.

10/31/2014 1:21:18 PM

the extent to which human beings will deify men who are good at getting other, younger men to move a ball around some field of play better than an opposing man and group of younger men is just fucking astounding to me.

10/31/2014 1:23:07 PM

yet here you are, in the sports talk section on tww.

10/31/2014 1:29:11 PM

^^they sound like a cult more than anything else

[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 1:29 PM. Reason : ^]

10/31/2014 1:29:16 PM

^^ it's in response to the idea that unc could have an "anything to prevent dean smith's name from being sullied" mentality here. we saw the same thing with penn state fans, and any other school with old sports traditions and a guy who coached for a long time is the same way. duke does/will do it with K. not sure what exactly you mean by acknowledging the fact that I'm in sports talk discussing sports

[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 1:45 PM. Reason : .]

10/31/2014 1:40:43 PM

What he is saying without saying it is your message has this underlying tone that you are above anything having to do with sports because of how barbaric it all is. At least that is my guess from reading what you wrote (which I had to do a double take on to make sure I thought I understood what you meant).

10/31/2014 2:22:07 PM

^ right. this isn't the comments of a cnn article, you're going out of your way to talk about unc basketball right now.

10/31/2014 2:30:05 PM

10/31/2014 2:31:35 PM

I think he was just saying how ludicrous it is how some fans deify college coaches.

[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 2:46 PM. Reason : ^and wth is that from?]

10/31/2014 2:45:52 PM

Now see, I thought he meant defy, but that didn't make any sense. Then you said deify again, so I knew it was a word!!!!

This is why I stuck with Maff.

You assholes could just say worship....




[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 2:51 PM. Reason : aff]

10/31/2014 2:49:58 PM

Bullet, its from here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2WisXFOD8Jk

A video Marcus Paige made immediately after Mary Willingham resigned.

10/31/2014 2:55:12 PM

That woman may have gone a little off the beaten path, but her report had solid data and they tried to make her look like she was insane. I feel like we are watching the move The Insider or some shit.

10/31/2014 4:25:46 PM

there should be more threads on specific topics of information within this topic. there is way too much chit chat about why we hate unc to get information out of this thread. i dont want to peel through 5 pages of gifs before i find out some local journalist said something bad about unc.

10/31/2014 5:02:18 PM

I would say PP is a better place to get your info, but again, you've got to wade through tens of pages there

10/31/2014 5:08:07 PM

I'm not saying theres no info or bad info. It just needs to be organized into more threads with more specific categories. One thread for this whole situation is pretty ridiculous. Especially when you consider the attention and number of posts its getting.

I don't know why there is an obsession with one thread anyways. Like, why is there only one thread for the entire college basketball season?

10/31/2014 5:26:05 PM

fuck off earl

10/31/2014 6:05:05 PM

Quote :

"I think he was just saying how ludicrous it is how some fans deify college coaches."

this is what i was getting at. and not only fans, but the institutions too. the school and its legion of fans are going to treat roy and dean (if we go that far down the rabbit hole) like they're saints, all because they coached kids to win basketball games. that's it. basketball games were won, and we're going to get to hear all about how these guys don't deserve to be shitcanned and/or have their legacies tarnished even though they were at best enablers (roy) and at worst complicit (possibly dean) in a major case of fraud where there are implications that could adversely affect regular, non-douchey people (i know that won't compute with a lot of you, but they exist) who went to UNC.

but leave roy and dean out of this. they won basketball games.

10/31/2014 6:45:39 PM

^Honest question...What are your thoughts on State fans' views of Valvano? Has he been similarly deified by the fans? Or is that different?

10/31/2014 7:51:58 PM

i'm not really sure. obviously he's an nc state icon that all state fans think highly of due to the ridiculous run made by the 83 championship team and also the unfortunate fact that he got cancer and has a pretty well known cancer research foundation named after him. if state fans have deified him to the same level, i haven't seen it among my friends or on these boards. not to say he hasn't been though. he was also only around for 10 years, which is the same amount of time as ol' roy, but let's face it, roy's been pretty damn successful with a high-profile program in a much different era.

i really hope valvano hasn't been similarly deified to the point where people who don't even know him would automatically rule out that he could've ever done anything supremely shitty because he was a good sports coach. because that wouldn't make state fans any better than the average unc or penn state fan.

[Edited on October 31, 2014 at 9:52 PM. Reason : .]

10/31/2014 9:48:43 PM

Quote :

"Coaching the Mind @BethelLearning · 10h 10 hours ago Utterly appalled that faculty members at research university would demand an apology to a person who violated fundamental research ethics. Coaching the Mind @BethelLearning · 10h 10 hours ago I'm at meeting, but I'm too furious, at the faculty's hypocrisy and selective attention to the Wainstein Report, to speak with composure."

u mad bro?

11/1/2014 2:32:57 AM

I don't think more threads is the answer, but Earl does have a point. Could someone just summarize any latest developments? I saw the Pat Forde thing.

Thanks

11/1/2014 8:37:59 AM

Quote :

"i'm not really sure. obviously he's an nc state icon that all state fans think highly of due to the ridiculous run made by the 83 championship team and also the unfortunate fact that he got cancer and has a pretty well known cancer research foundation named after him. if state fans have deified him to the same level, i haven't seen it among my friends or on these boards. not to say he hasn't been though. he was also only around for 10 years, which is the same amount of time as ol' roy, but let's face it, roy's been pretty damn successful with a high-profile program in a much different era. i really hope valvano hasn't been similarly deified to the point where people who don't even know him would automatically rule out that he could've ever done anything supremely shitty because he was a good sports coach. because that wouldn't make state fans any better than the average unc or penn state fan."

Yeah...there's certainly no comparison to, say, Joe Paterno. And I'm too young to really know exactly how things were at the time of Valvano's dismissal from State. It seems like a lot of State fans are well aware of his shortcomings later in his career that led to NCAA violations and such. Maybe you could argue that some fans don't necessarily hold that against V, and instead blame the NCAA and the university for punishing the basketball program too harshly. But I've always gotten the impression that most State fans are aware of the NCAA violations and stuff under V and hold him accountable for what happened. And you're right. A lot of his legacy seems to also be tied to the Jimmy V foundation and cancer research. Which, I guess, lends some perspective to his basketball legacy...in that, he's maybe better known for all the cancer research than he is for being State's basketball coach.

11/1/2014 8:53:35 AM

am i forgetting something? V wasn't found guilty of any ncaa violations, which hilariously pales in comparison to dean smith and roy williams. the selling of shoes and tickets by players was found to be fine per the letter of the rules, only a violation of the "spirit" of the rules. despite this, V was railroaded by the school and the conference including swofford.

i'm not naive enough to try to sit here and say V was perfect, nobody is, but i respect him a heck of a lot more than two self righteous and proven cheaters.

[Edited on November 1, 2014 at 10:53 AM. Reason : fact check]

11/1/2014 10:52:42 AM

^Nah you're right. I was just wondering what dingus thought about V's situation since he was mentioned "deifying" coaches. They are different situations and not exactly comparable. I was just curious about his thoughts on how and if V compared.

11/1/2014 11:31:39 AM

Sylvia Hatchell bringing some deep insight on the issue:

http://www.heraldsun.com/news/localnews/x1726675741/Hatchell-says-she-was-unaware-of-academic-fraud-lauds-Boxill

On Jan Boxill:

Quote :

"there’s no one I’ve worked with on this campus that’s more ethical than Jan Boxill"

On how she feels about academics/counselors during her time at UNC:

Quote :

"She said she was proud of the job the academic counselors did and that only three players haven’t graduated in her 29 years at the school."

They still don't understand... can't pull their heads out of their asses long enough to realize that bragging about their graduation rates is idiotic. NOBODY IS BUYING THAT SHIT ANYMORE

Meanwhile you have your Athletic Director trumpeting his PR firm-fed spin that 'when you really think about it, its not that bad... looking at it another way(as to make it seem not as bad for BBall and football), only 3 kids per year per team took fake classes.

Yeah Bubba, I'm sure the kayak team was just as dirty as mens basketball.

11/1/2014 11:43:47 AM

surely they dont believe what theyre saying... right?

11/1/2014 11:52:22 AM

Well if they do get to the bottom of this like they should, Sylvia is going to have to go.

Gonna be tough to shitcan a cancer-survivor coach. The world will never know if she was worth a shit at her job because she only had half the responsibility of a typical NCAA coach

11/1/2014 12:11:04 PM

High graduation rates at a school with systemic academic fraud for the sole reason of keeping athletes eligible? You dont say. Congrats...that just shows that your academic fraud worked liked you hoped it would

11/1/2014 12:55:59 PM

Quote :

"Hatchell said her son – a business major who made the dean’s list at UNC – even took an AFAM class, which he enjoyed and said was taught normally."

LOL,gives more credence to the idea that athletics/athletes benefited from the courses being corrupted.

#RacismOfLowerExpectations

[Edited on November 1, 2014 at 1:06 PM. Reason : ]

11/1/2014 1:05:57 PM

Quote :

"Meanwhile you have your Athletic Director trumpeting his PR firm-fed spin that 'when you really think about it, its not that bad..."

That strategy could backfire.

"It's not that bad."
"Oh really? Well if you're too stupid to see how that wasn't bad here's a punishment to teach you just how bad that sort of thing is."

But it's UNC. The strategy will pay off.

11/1/2014 2:09:38 PM

Lol you guys expect someone to comb the thread for you? Just scroll down the damn pages and usually if you don't see links, there is nothing new posted "USUALLY".

I think everyone needs to listen to ACC Commissioner John Swofford, this is the type of shit that has me worried for the ACC in the wake of this BS.




I just watched this and this guy makes me want to puke, we need to get him out, now, or the ACC itself is at risk. Hell, now in hindsight, I think Maryland had the right idea.

http://www.statefansnation.com/2014/10/john-swoffords-presence-hurting-acc/


http://www.statefansnation.com/2014/10/live-charlotte/

Skip to 4 hours and 35 minutes to hear him talk about infractions.

Quote :

"John, you found the UNC report disturbing and troubling and shocking. I'm not getting any kind of sense of what your personal reaction was as the commissioner of this conference? I mean, are you just disgusted by that report, what you found in there, revolted? Seemed like athletes were kind of given a disservice here by people that just wanted to keep them eligible. What were your personal feelings about that report? Well, I'm not going to get into my personal feelings about it a great deal. From a commissioner's standpoint, it's something that, you know, you don't want to see. I think Carolina through this last report has addressed it with a great deal of transparency and thoroughness. Now it's time to-- for that institution, with the NCAA, to bring the NCAA investigation to closure, and then that-- and I think they're on their road to that now. And then with whatever that brings, then move forward, as I said earlier, move forward, make the changes that need to be made, strengthen yourself, set in motion things that will guarantee as much as you possible can, that something like that will never happen again, and, you know, and learn from it. And one of the things about being in a conference, and I think particularly this one, is when there are issues, and fortunately we haven't had a lot of them, so anytime we have a cluster of them, it seems like a lot of them, but when we do, when it's over with at each institution, that institution sits down with the rest of the league and says, here's what happened; here's why it happened, we believe; here's what we learned from it; here's what we've changed. And take this and apply it to your particular situation, and maybe it can be helpful to you. We do that every time there's an NCAA problem of any significance. "

How the fuck is UNC anywhere near closure when they are denying and deflecting all questions, spending close to a million dollars on PR for this and the NCAA hasn't even weighed in? Yea I am sure when all this is said and done UNC is going to sit down and say "here is what we did". Are you fucking serious??

Quote :

"John, in 1982 when you were still athletic director at North Carolina and the NCAA brought down sanctions on Clemson university one year, you advocated that the conference add an additional year or more to Clemson in light of all of the new sanction-- or all of the new allegations against North Carolina, will you advocate more sanctions against the Tarheels? Well, first of all, I didn't advocate in 1982. That was a situation at that point in time where even if I had, I don't think anybody would have listened to me, because I was the rookie in the room. But that was a situation and a time when the conference, through the faculty athletic representatives and the presidents would take a look at every NCAA sanction that came down. Not that-- again, not that there were very many, and decide whether the conference should add to that. We no longer do that in the Atlantic Coast Conference. The presidents decided that that wasn't something they wanted on the books any longer, that they would accept whatever the NCAA sanctions were and would not take those sanctions any further. "

[Edited on November 1, 2014 at 2:33 PM. Reason : _]

11/1/2014 2:30:40 PM

^Double post

11/1/2014 4:37:33 PM

People are asking us to basically summarize anything important so I gave them something that would be considered important and it is not a double post because this is at the top of it:

Quote :

"Lol you guys expect someone to comb the thread for you? Just scroll down the damn pages and usually if you don't see links, there is nothing new posted "USUALLY". I think everyone needs to listen to ACC Commissioner John Swofford, this is the type of shit that has me worried for the ACC in the wake of this BS."

11/1/2014 8:36:55 PM

This is a good one:
http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/10/28/4272207/whether-quit-or-be-fired-by-unc.html

11/2/2014 6:28:44 PM

They can't fire him. That would basically be an admission on their part that he knew the whole time.

11/2/2014 7:29:55 PM

NCAA President Mark Emmert, UNC AD Bubba Cunningham differ on Wainstein report
http://www.newsobserver.com/2014/10/28/4271606/ncaa-president-mark-emmert-unc.html


http://www.dailytarheel.com/article/2014/11/faculty-call-for-unc-to-apologize-to-mary-willingham

11/3/2014 10:03:31 AM

Quote :

"Roy Williams’ claim that he was gobsmacked by the Wainstein report shows that he is out of touch and basically running a rogue operation. He needs to resign. If not, UNC needs to do the right thing and fire him. He deserves it."

11/3/2014 10:39:58 AM

so how many people have died from choosing "rogue" as their drinking game word over the last four years?

11/3/2014 11:36:20 AM

Quote :

"They can't fire him. That would basically be an admission on their part that he knew the whole time."

They should fire him because he knew. Either that or because he should have known. Poor Butch Davis.

11/3/2014 11:56:31 AM

I haven't followed the "what Roy knew" angle. Please correct me where I'm wrong.

He made sure his players transferred away from AFAM, citing clustering as the reason. Were all the players encouraged to transfer away from AFAM or just a few? You'd only need a few players to transfer away from AFAM to avoid clustering.

Didn't the players move to communications en masse? In other words the end result was clustering in a different major.

Roy apparently didn't have a problem with players clustering so long as it wasn't in AFAM.

How could any reasonable person look at that and not come away with the conclusion that Roy knew something was going on with the AFAM department.

Gee guys, I don't know why but you've all got to get out of those gosh darn AFAM classes. Call it my dadgum intuition or some other new age crap. Just make sure to get out.

[Edited on November 3, 2014 at 12:19 PM. Reason : -]

11/3/2014 12:18:40 PM