^^^ fyi, liberals dominate the internet.

[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 11:59 PM. Reason : which is why obama wins internet polls]

9/26/2008 11:57:33 PM

they are on cbs and cnn, why dont you look at them

9/26/2008 11:58:45 PM

Those are the polls that CNN and MSNBC reported right after the debate. I don't know if they use simple random, systematic, stratified, or cluster sampling.

9/27/2008 12:00:42 AM

But they're not like web polls?


The numbers makes sense, though, assuming the people polled knew what was at stake for the two candidates.

9/27/2008 12:02:56 AM

Quote :

" Obama is about as centrist as you can get."

What is one of his centrist stands?

Quote :

"Lehrer, at least at the beginning, was trying to get them to talk to each other"

These two are both senators. That's not how they usually talk to each other on the floor. They direct their comments to the chair. The senate is a deliberative entity...not really comfortable with in-your-face confrontation. Obama was better, I think, because he hasn't been in the senate as long.

Quote :

"your campaign advice to mccain is to be more didactic"

If you do it right, it can be very effective...Reagan for example was pretty effective at explaining conservatism to blue-dog democrats.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 12:03 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 12:04 AM. Reason : ..]

9/27/2008 12:03:10 AM

Obama won the debate.

9/27/2008 12:04:04 AM

That's what I said, hehe.

^^^ I don't know the nature of the polls themselves, just posted what CNN and MSNBC reported.

To be fair, McCain did do well, and made several points, but most importantly... he didn't lose his temper.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 12:08 AM. Reason : -]

9/27/2008 12:05:01 AM

I don't think McCain is a bad guy, I really don't. But he has turned into a fucking caricature of himself. Between Palin and the maverick shit, I seriously can't believe he's for real. The old John McCain is gone people. This dude is one step away from being someone's weird grandpa that can't stop talking about his time in the fucking military. Hell he might already be there.

9/27/2008 12:14:22 AM

i think obama demeanor looked more presidential than mccains

9/27/2008 12:16:18 AM

I'm disappointed that there wasn't a "nice of you to show up" joke somewhere in the debate. Lehrer could've made it.

9/27/2008 12:21:49 AM

"Obama was a little pitchy and McCain forgot some of the lyrics."

9/27/2008 12:30:28 AM

In many respects, Obama is the political maverick and John McCain is not. Obama has not taken money from lobbyists or from political action committees (PACs) that fund big business ideologues that harm the middle class. Obama was brave enough to shun business as usual in Washington and instead accepted money directly from the American people in a grassroots venture. Lobbyists and political action committees have most certainly funded McCain's campaign, and have not funded a single dime of Obama's. It can be suggested that McCain is a maverick when the system allows it, and Obama is a maverick despite the system. So if the whole Maverick thing really sells McCain to undecided voters, then people aren't taking everything into account.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 12:58 AM. Reason : -]

9/27/2008 12:47:41 AM

Quote :

"McCain doesn't have a lapel pin... he must hate America"

Hehe I also noticed this.

I thought it was fairly even. McCain did better than I expected.

9/27/2008 12:54:44 AM

McCain came off as pretty crotchety, wouldn't even look at Obama, and I think Obama came out with a slight edge. But I think regardless of party affiliation, and regardless of who you think won, you would agree that no one won by much and its was close to being a draw.

Foreign policy was supposed to be McCain big chance to change the game and come out as a winner in the debate. All his grandstanding about pretending to call of the debate, if anything, made this perhaps the most highlighted debate of all the presidential debates (but not the VP debate perhaps). The shift towards the economy, Obama's strong suite, may be why McCain didn't get a chance to steal the show in a large way. Either way things are pretty close to where they were before the debate which isn't what McCain needed from this.

CNN & MSNBC's online polls are showing an Obama win, and the polls MSNBC was just talking about said independent leaning voters were more impressed by Obama by this debate by about 20% (although as you break it down into the details they leaned different ways on different parts, even if it was over all better for Obama)... although how much can you tell from such an immediate poll before anyone has really digested it?

9/27/2008 12:54:52 AM

not gonna lie, every time i see mccain pull out his "veto pen," i expect him to also pull out a werther's original candy. it just seems like one of those grandfather moments.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 1:04 AM. Reason : ]

9/27/2008 1:02:16 AM

Quote :

"McCain came off as pretty crotchety, wouldn't even look at Obama, and I think Obama came out with a slight edge. But I think regardless of party affiliation, and regardless of who you think won, you would agree that no one won by much and its was close to being a draw."

This goes back to the difference between tactics and strategy. It is fair to state that the debate was tactically close, but strategically it was most certainly a defeat for McCain when considering the high stakes requirement of clearly winning the debate. However, these polls suggest that Obama obtained a tactical victory even despite that point, so either way, I’m forced to conclude that Obama won. The only real agreement is that the debate went well for both candidates, but I do not believe it was a real tie. Was it perceived as close by most people because McCain didn't lose his temper and strangle his opponent and Obama didn't accidentally claim to be a Muslim while bowling poorly on stage? Sure, I'll give you that.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 1:15 AM. Reason : -]

9/27/2008 1:08:17 AM

Quote :

"(McCain) wouldn't even look at Obama"

I think this was big. It made him looking like a sneering guy who couldn't filter out his feelings....and Obama addressed him directly and looked at him many times during the debate. I dont think once McCain ever looked at Obama.

9/27/2008 2:18:38 AM

Quote :

"What is one of his centrist stands?"

Doesn't believe we should nationalize our production and really, you can only get so far left without believing that.

9/27/2008 4:02:33 AM

Wow, i'm surprised at the poll results. I thought it was close w/ McCain ahead. While he did stumble and ramble a bit, he did come across w/ the experience card strong. I think the points he made about seeing and being in most of the places mentioned while Obama wasnt was effective. McCain basically said "you studied your history, i lived it".

9/27/2008 6:00:11 AM

http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/09/27/debate.poll/index.html

Quote :

"Round 1 in debates goes to Obama, poll says # Story Highlights # Post-debate CNN poll suggests Obama came out on top over McCain # Most debate watchers agreed McCain, Obama would be able to handle presidency # Male respondents split evenly among candidates; Women liked Obama over McCain"

9/27/2008 6:31:55 AM

http://www.fivethirtyeight.com/2008/09/why-voters-thought-obama-won.html

Quote :

"Specifically, by a 62-32 margin, voters thought that Obama was “more in touch with the needs and problems of people like you”. This is a gap that has no doubt grown because of the financial crisis of recent days. But it also grew because Obama was actually speaking to middle class voters. Per the transcript, McCain never once mentioned the phrase “middle class” (Obama did so three times)"

9/27/2008 7:48:37 AM

Quote :

"Per the transcript, McCain never once mentioned the phrase “middle class” (Obama did so three times)""

Well shit, consider me sold.


We are SO fucked if people are this stupid.

between mccains "the point is" and Obamas "last eight years" and "wall street... MAIN street" I shed a tear that one of these people will be president.

9/27/2008 8:10:25 AM

give me a break - either one of these guys will be an order of magnitude better than what we have now

9/27/2008 8:19:58 AM

more spending is exactly what we DONT need right now.

Tell me are you happy with how our govt handles things?

9/27/2008 8:26:22 AM

SPENDING ORGY!!!1

9/27/2008 10:09:56 AM

Spain!

Horseshit.

9/27/2008 10:18:43 AM

"I never objected to nuclear waste."

9/27/2008 10:22:51 AM

there were points made on both sides, but i agree with the polls that obama won the debate..

9/27/2008 10:24:43 AM

"The average South Korean is three inches taller than the average North Korean!"

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 10:35 AM. Reason : If your drinking game code words were "doesn't understand," please see a doctor. -Matt Welch]

9/27/2008 10:33:36 AM

Quote :

"{{{{DRUDGE POLL}}}} WHO WON THE FIRST PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE?... MCCAIN 68% 193,356 OBAMA 30% 86,291 NEITHER 2% 6,699 Total Votes: 286,346"

9/27/2008 10:42:53 AM

Well jeez, it's an internet poll....you don't think that sucker got freeped?

It's Drudge. Think about your audience here...

Wait a couple days and see if there is any bounce....I doubt there will be much either way.

9/27/2008 10:48:14 AM

Think of who reads the Drudge Report and that poll makes sense because of bias. I read Drudge all the time, but it's the same website that broke the Monica Lewinski/President Clinton story.

9/27/2008 10:50:19 AM

lollerskates

9/27/2008 10:58:29 AM

dude, the Drudge Sirens are basically [truth] [/truth] tags. Don't question it.

9/27/2008 12:10:12 PM

I like the ad McCain has about how Obama responded at the debate: It shows Senator Obama saying McCain is either "right" or "absolutely right" nine times.

9/27/2008 12:29:18 PM

hows that for partisanship lol

9/27/2008 12:32:42 PM

^^ What exactly is that supposed to say, though?

That they agree? Advantage: no one

That Obama can engage in civil debate? Advantage: Obama

That this is all McCain's camp could nitpick about? Advantage: Obama

9/27/2008 1:36:08 PM

9/27/2008 1:37:28 PM

Three cheers to McCain for breaking the solid red/solid blue tie rule.

9/27/2008 1:39:44 PM

McCain's stance won't work in the future debates. So when the middle class is hurting, the upper class promises trickle down economics for all of the lower classes, and when the upper class is hurting, the upper class is guaranteed huge direct deposits from all of the lower classes???

That seems fair. Shouldn't cause an increase in class warfare and a decrease in public support. Nope... good plan. I approve, stay the course McCain, you're right.



Barack just has to sit back and let John win the election for him.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 8:10 PM. Reason : -]

9/27/2008 8:03:43 PM

i thought they both did well, actually, but I'm not surprised that the undecideds are going for Obama now, he just comes off as cool and confident, like he will be very diplomatic and not take us into any new, stupid wars. He also seems like he genuinely cares about this country and the people...which is a vibe I do NOT get from McCain, but at least he doesn't come off as just another neocon.

i've heard a lot of predictions that Palin will drop out(or get kicked out) before the debates, and I will feel very cheated if she does because after enduring this ridiculous election circus, i think we deserve to see the main freakshow in its entirety.

9/27/2008 8:09:34 PM

Quote :

"He also seems like he genuinely cares about this country and the people...which is a vibe I do NOT get from McCain, but at least he doesn't come off as just another neocon."

That's completely ridiculous. I can't see how you could even remotely got that vibe from McCain.

[Edited on September 27, 2008 at 8:24 PM. Reason : silly northerners]

9/27/2008 8:23:40 PM

maybe I just hear him talk to much, but I cringe now every time I hear obama say "the failed policies of the last 8 years... which by the way my opponent mccain supported 90% of the time"

I don't know, maybe it's going to be effective for him. but I'd like it if he mixed it up a bit.

9/27/2008 8:46:42 PM

^I agree that's gotten old.

9/27/2008 10:01:59 PM

McCain did well in foreign affairs, but I got tired of too many stories like this:

"When I was in Iraq, Sgt. Mike Wallowitz came up to me and said, 'Don't let us lose John. Don't let all of my friends deaths be in vain.' And I made a promise to myself ..."

9/27/2008 10:14:07 PM

^I'll agree on that one. Like... wait, you're letting random people decide your foreign policy for you?

9/27/2008 10:16:23 PM

^^ I actually thought McCain's foreign affairs were his worst part. He doesn't seem to have a consistent methodology that determines how he deals with one country.

Why support the outright bombing of Iraq, without question, while seemingly pussy-footing around the issue of Pakistan? If Pakistan is going to be shooting at our guys, why NOT cut off aide? He seemed to me to be TOO emotional when dealing with other countries. Obama OTOH, for better or worse, seemed to have the underlying themes of making America a shining light in the world, while reducing American casualties, and his approach to other countries seems to reflect this. I would almost say that McCain, because of his war experience, is TOO bitter to be making those kind of decisions.

9/27/2008 10:29:49 PM

SPENDING ORGY!!!1

9/27/2008 10:49:59 PM

^ That came out of nowhere ...

9/27/2008 11:22:56 PM

Quote :

"He also seems like he genuinely cares about this country and the people...which is a vibe I do NOT get from McCain"

Dumbest thing ever.

9/27/2008 11:36:08 PM