6

9/25/2008 4:47:11 PM

It's definitely culturally important, particularly for males. Meat's been associated with masculinity for ages. The symbolism's obvious.

It's not for nutrition. You can argue against veganism, maybe, but countless studies show that vegetarians live as long and as well as meat-eaters.

9/25/2008 4:50:11 PM

Hi GoldenViper. Still fighting the machine? Good to see that buddy. Keep the faith.




On another note, why do models think I value their opinion? If anything, I'll continue to buy animal products so they'll be forced to wear less and less in an effort to make me stop. They're probably not bright enough to recognize the negative feedback cycle they'd be creating. In a few years we'll have them doing hardcore pornography with sex organs from vegetables.

9/25/2008 4:53:25 PM

^ That's a good illustration of why radical feminists dislike PETA's ads.

9/25/2008 4:55:10 PM

and why I dislike radical feminists.


c'mere Andrea D. Lemme lay a big one on them Ice Cream tittays.

9/25/2008 4:57:35 PM

Quote :

"It's not for nutrition."

okay, i may have missed something, but are you SERIOUSLY intimating that human beings ONLY developed to eat meat as mental compensation for the perception of tiny penises and/or to define their masculinity?

really?

9/25/2008 4:58:17 PM

post-modern thought has the great advantage of being able to detach itself from any slight basis in science. It is pretty marvelous really, you're judged by your ability to ever more radically distance yourself from the status quo, no matter how logical it may be.

9/25/2008 4:59:44 PM

^^ If you believe vegetarians suffer from worse health results, show me the data.

In theory, the ideal omnivorous diet would more healthful than the ideal vegetarian or vegan diet. More options for the win. In practice, this doesn't seem to matter. Few of us eat anything like an ideal diet.

[Edited on September 25, 2008 at 5:04 PM. Reason : ideal]

9/25/2008 5:01:10 PM

Quote :

"If you believe vegetarians suffer from worse health results, show me the data."

i don't recall saying that

Quote :

"In theory, the ideal omnivorous diet would more healthful than the ideal vegetarian or vegan diet. More options for the win. In practice, this doesn't seem to matter. Few of us eat anything like an ideal diet."

and talking about the "ideal" omnivorous diet is a far cry from the asinine assertion that humans developed to eat meat for the SOLE purpose of satisfying the male ego

9/25/2008 5:33:51 PM

No, I'm not saying that. Humans obviously ate meat for the same reason they ate anything else: energy and nutrients. Meat's an excellent protein source. In that sense, the age-old connection between meat and strength makes sense. I imagine the cultural importance we see today came as a result of this.

9/25/2008 5:38:02 PM

Quote :

"Meat's an excellent protein source. "

Needed to be quoted and put into record.

9/25/2008 5:40:52 PM

Why? It's not something anyone can contest with delving into conspiracy theories or hardcore skepticism.

9/25/2008 5:44:24 PM

Quote :

"I guess I didn't express myself well. That folks want to hurt their kids for a dietary choice suggests great cultural importance placed on consuming meat. I see an idol to be smashed."

So kids should eat whatever they want? Is it safe to assume macaroni and cheese and icecream are the only things you'll give your kids, since that is what the majority would choose to eat, if it wasn't for their parents dictating meals.

9/25/2008 5:46:59 PM

I would advise giving children as much freedom as possible, yes.

More to the point, a vegetarian diet doesn't reduce health outcomes. You could encourage a child to eat healthfully while respecting their wishes.

9/25/2008 5:50:15 PM

I'll "encourage" my kids to eat whatever the fuck I make them

9/25/2008 6:09:40 PM

^

9/25/2008 6:17:36 PM

^^amen

[Edited on September 25, 2008 at 6:18 PM. Reason : .]

9/25/2008 6:18:41 PM

Quote :

"^ That's a good illustration of why radical feminists dislike PETA's ads."

how so?

9/25/2008 6:39:07 PM

^ The generally negative and objectified view of the models involved.

9/25/2008 6:45:31 PM

Quote :

"I'm fairly certain being a vegetarian/vegan isn't what makes them that obnoxious..."

You're absolutely correct. Being a vegetarian or vegan isn't what makes them that obnoxious. Perhaps it's more of a case that more people who are abnormally obnoxious / self-righteous choose that sort of lifestyle than those who are not.

9/25/2008 8:06:39 PM

Quote :

"oh for the love of god....."

oh yeah and animals taste yummy

9/26/2008 12:04:10 AM

Nice thread. But there are many horrible and judgemental people in the thread, all of them omnivores.

FTR, I eat meat too. I LOVE it, especially lamb, fish, duck, and venison. But the stupidity needs to be dealt with:

Quote :

"I'm guessing that human breast milk does not have lactose. Anyone have any info on that?"

It does have lactose. All mammal milk does. But it contains less lactose than cow milk.

Quote :

"When PETA is doing their thing in the brickyard, I buy 3 chick-fil-a sandwichs everyday to eat in front of them. One is plenty, but that week I eat 15 sandwich just to show those bastards."

So you harm your own health tremendously just to make a stupid point? GG.

Quote :

"Today, I had: Breakfast- 3 egg omelet with sausage, cheese, and green peppers and 2 glasses of milk Lunch- tuna sandwich made with 2 cans of tuna fish (i was hungry, what can I say) Dinner- Pasta with italian sausage and mozzarella sticks and another 2 glasses of milk that has to be somewhere in the neighborhood of the 3:1 ratio. So you're a vegetarian. Good for you. More meat for me. So you're a vegan. Sucks for you. You've already started decomposing you smelly dirty hippie."

WTF does that last line mean? Oh BTW, you don't eat any veggies and fruits... you will die of cancer, diabetes, stroke, and/or heart disease. It is YOU who is decomposing, especially your bowels. GG.

Quote :

"getting eaten by a rhino"

Hahahaha... thanks for the laugh!

Quote :

"I have no respect for vegetarians and vegans. Your reasoning and logic is flawed, your diet is not nearly as diverse, and you spew your nonsense out loud and attempt to curtail my choice to eat meat."

You have no respect for the whole group?
You know the logic of every vegetarian/vegan?
The diet of an average American vegetarian is FAR more diverse than the diet of an average American omnivore.
All vegetarians/vegans are loud about their choice and try to stop you?

I hope all omnivores are not as stupid and judgemental as you.

Quote :

"This is America, I can eat whatever fucking animal I want to."

Quote :

"[Vegetarians/vegans] attempt to curtail my choice to eat meat."

Quote :

"we should try to end veganism"

So you are basically a hypocrite, wdprice3?

Quote :

"When I start dating a girl I make sure they're not a vegetarian. I find it pretty annoying and a sign of high maintenance."

I have dated a vegetarian, and am married to another one. High maintenance? Not in my experience. In fact, they were/are COMPLETE opposites. How do you suppose it is so? It doesn't make any sense, at least when talking directly about the cost of food. Meat is more expensive than almost every vegetable, fruit, bean, or grain. If you have a VARIED diet as an omnivore, it HAS to be more expensive than a vegetarian diet. It is just that omnivores usually have crappy diets (meat, potatoes, bread, snacks, junk food), and so, that is of course cheaper than a vegetarian diet involving grains, beans, nuts, fruits, veggies, etc.

Quote :

"If I ever have a kid and they become a vegetarian or vegan, I'd beat the shit out of him. They can do what ever they want with their lives, but I draw the line at vegetarian/veganism."

Wow. I hope that happens, and you go to jail, or your kid is like 16 and huge when that happens and beats the shit out of you back.

9/26/2008 1:12:11 AM

^ wow I didn't get to read the whole thread but wow some ignorant people in here. I eat meat but I don't have any problems with vegans or vegetarians. I wish I would be vegetarian one day but i'll admit I just like the taste of meat and don't think I could give it up. because of my financial situation i buy whats in the store but one day i'd like to buy more free range meat products.

as for the whole milk thing I don't think there is anything wrong with human milk its just we have grown up with the conception that milk comes from cows. I don't doubt its a lot healthier ( I like the coconut milk ice cream idea)

as for peta, they are a bit extreme and I have personally talked to someone who worked there and quit and its intense and the founder he said was a bit to crazy even for him. and btw PETA DOES KILL as well so I don't listen to anything peta says anymore.

[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 2:39 AM. Reason : s]

9/26/2008 2:37:01 AM

without reading this thread, i'm sure its full of conservative lametards and dumb demodouches

9/26/2008 2:49:47 AM

thank god that retard is never going to have a kid

9/26/2008 2:54:00 AM

^seriously, wtf yo

9/26/2008 3:01:43 AM

Quote :

"Meat is more expensive than almost every vegetable, fruit, bean, or grain."

This really depends on where you live.

9/26/2008 3:14:24 AM

^can you post a link or something? imo meat>grain etc when it comes to price

9/26/2008 3:19:26 AM

Well, for example where I live now:

1kg of cantelope = $75.89
1kg of rice = $47.40
1kg of peaches = $25.61
1kg shrimp = $ 23.72
1kg apples = $22.74
1kg of ground pork = $19.90
1kg of grapefruits = $14.23
1kg of barley = $11.38
1kg of chicken breast = $9.49
1kg of broccoli = $9.49
1kg of cabbage = $4.74

Anyway, you get the idea. That would actually be cool if there was a website that broke it down according to region.

9/26/2008 4:10:39 AM

^seriously dog...where the fuck do you live??

9/26/2008 4:12:32 AM

He lives in Japan

9/26/2008 4:15:42 AM

2.2 pounds of catelope is 75 bucks in japan? 2.2 pounds is like literally ONE cantelope

9/26/2008 4:16:34 AM

They go for as much as $500 a cantaloupe here depending on the "brand"

9/26/2008 4:19:07 AM

I don't like cantelope, but even if I did... $500?!?! Sheeiiiit... that thing better have a gold nugget in the middle.

9/26/2008 4:21:50 AM

^seriously...always been one of my lesser liked fruits...just too bland for me

9/26/2008 4:23:28 AM

Like a lot of people, I'm guilty of associating all vegans with that vocal majority that just won't shut up about how much better their choice is, morally and health-wise. These people grate on us omnivores, and cause us to lash out. And for that I apologize.

But any time anybody tells me I should eat healthier, especially when they tell me to tone down the meat, I have one response:

Everyone has to die of something. If refraining from large quantities of delicious meat products will buy me a few years, well, they're the shitty years anyway. For a lot of us, all we have to look forward to in extreme old age is cancer we're genetically predisposed to regardless of life choices, and alzheimers. I've spent enough time in in the "crazy" wards of old folks' homes to know that I'd much rather collapse in a bowl of lard at 60 than spend my entire life eating healthy and my last ten years telling my closest family members how happy I am that toaster is president, I'm a termite, and the weather is sausage. Ditto focusing on health my whole life only to go see the doctor one day and find out that my white blood cells have randomly decided to disintegrate my intestinal lining.

Nah. Fuck it. Seems to me that I can eat whatever seems delicious and probably make it a little past 60. Everything past that is just risking something way worse than death by heart attack or stroke.

9/26/2008 5:06:18 AM

Yeah I have seen the specialty melons and all that.

But how is rice gonna cost $47.40 in Japan?

9/26/2008 5:26:04 AM

if you already have a gun and some bullets, meat is free.

go out, shoot something, skin it, cook it, eat it.

or just go fishing.

need a vegetable? grow them.

9/26/2008 6:31:57 AM

Quote :

"as for the whole milk thing I don't think there is anything wrong with human milk its just we have grown up with the conception that milk comes from cows. I don't doubt its a lot healthier ( I like the coconut milk ice cream idea)"

yep. The idea of human milk is different because after a certain age we don't drink it and switch to that of another species, which if you think about it (and I'm even a "dairy" person) is rather odd.

Quote :

"Quote : "If I ever have a kid and they become a vegetarian or vegan, I'd beat the shit out of him. They can do what ever they want with their lives, but I draw the line at vegetarian/veganism." Wow. I hope that happens, and you go to jail, or your kid is like 16 and huge when that happens and beats the shit out of you back."

he's joking, btw. The thought of vegetarianism is not even going to cross this kid's mind, I'll make sure of that.

9/26/2008 10:47:02 AM

wow, what a good little mommy you're going to be, controlling your children's thoughts so nothing bad or different can get in to hurt them, and they can become the perfect machines you program them to be.






then they're gonna drop out of college the first semester after they simultaneously discovered every vice on the planet, and maybe go to jail or join an *ugh* hippie commune and EXPAND their EXISTENCE in ways mommy shielded them from for centuries.

9/26/2008 10:57:13 AM

Quote :

"If refraining from large quantities of delicious meat products will buy me a few years, well, they're the shitty years anyway."

That's not how it works. As you can likely imagine, this is a common misconception. A good diet increases both life expectancy and healthy life expectancy. Hell, some research has even associated red meat consumption with Alzheimer's, the very disease you'd like to avoid. Now, you're right that genetics significantly determine health anyway. Sickness can strike anybody, but eating well gives you better odds.

(As transhumanist, I think you're fine regardless. As long as the primitivists don't take over. By the time you're sixty, they should be able to reverse damage to human body with relative ease.)

9/26/2008 11:11:56 AM

I'm craving veal. anyone else??

9/26/2008 11:14:25 AM

Quote :

"I'll "encourage" my kids to eat whatever the fuck I make them"

i love this girl

9/26/2008 11:15:59 AM

Quote :

"if you already have a gun and some bullets, meat is free. go out, shoot something, skin it, cook it, eat it. or just go fishing. need a vegetable? grow them."

This isn't entirely true. Assuming you already have a gun, ammo, and a license to hunt, you can't just go anywhere and shoot a game animal. Hunting is time consuming and so is planting veggies. Your time is worth something and you've failed to mention how to efficiently use it.


Also, it wouldn't be cost effective to have a human dairy farm. Imagine women lined up hooked up to breast pumps just yackin' away to the person next to them. At least a cow has got more than two teats.

9/26/2008 11:18:42 AM

^ GTFO with your logic

it has no place here and is not welcome

9/26/2008 11:20:59 AM

0EPII1 you have won my heart.

thank you for proving not everyone makes snap judgements and generalizes EVERYONE

you too GoldenGirl

9/26/2008 11:22:23 AM

By the way, anyone who tells you go vegan or vegetarian strictly for health reasons would be wrong. A smart omnivorous diet does as well or better. Fish in particular are extremely healthful.

9/26/2008 11:26:16 AM

<3 Salmon

9/26/2008 11:28:05 AM

<3 Ahi Tuna (preferably raw or rare)

9/26/2008 11:41:17 AM

Quote :

"Fish in particular are extremely healthful."

9/26/2008 11:49:42 AM