^^now you are just mincing words. Do you ignore the poll that shows 51% of GOPers believe heathcare is a "right."

Also, here is another poll that finds 63% want universal healthcare even if it means higher taxes.

The study, the "Health Security Index," (PDF file: 12 pages / 280 KB. More about PDFs.) found that 72 percent of respondents agreed that "the time has come for universal health care," and 63 percent agreed the time has come "even if it means increasing taxes." Responses were gathered from 1,771 adults nationwide.


http://www.aafp.org/online/en/home/publications/news/news-now/health-of-the-public/20070627healthindex.html

[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 12:21 AM. Reason : .]

10/15/2008 12:16:21 AM

people who think that God is on "our side" are fucking crazy
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A5fdzji2C54

10/15/2008 12:27:48 AM

10/15/2008 12:56:31 AM

^^that pastor is funny...did anyone let him know that buddhists don't have a god?

10/15/2008 1:15:05 AM

At this point it's fair to say that McCain's best chance at hurting Obama would be to endorse him

10/15/2008 2:20:40 AM

i'm not mincing words. u must admit that "guaranteeing insurance coverage" is different than saying healthcare is a right

10/15/2008 6:53:34 AM

Guaranteeing health insurance is a way of respecting that right.

10/15/2008 8:33:44 AM

Quote :

"... is no where sacred?"

I never really looked to video games as a sanctuary from all things worldly... maybe I'm buying the wrong games.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bible_Adventures



[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 9:16 AM. Reason : b]

10/15/2008 9:01:53 AM

Quote :

"i'm not mincing words. u must admit that "guaranteeing insurance coverage" is different than saying healthcare is a right"

Are you also denying that 51% of Republicans view healthcare as a right?

10/15/2008 9:58:52 AM

Healthcare is NOT a right

Do I think in a country this rich that people should have access to basic healthcare? Yes
DO I think the govt should handle this? Hell no
Does this include viagra, hairpills, or acne meds? Fuck no, but that is where your tax dollars are being spent currently.


Ok, So the dems want ANOTHER stimulus check? You have to be fucking kidding me. Esp when it was announced today an update to our budget deficit. WTF, this is fucking madness. (hit the sparta gif)

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. budget deficit hit a record $455 billion in fiscal 2008 as a slowing economy sapped revenues while spending on wars, bank failures and unemployment-related benefits soared, the Treasury Department said on Tuesday.

The deficit for the year ended September 30 far outstripped the White House's most recent estimate of $389 billion, made in July, and nearly tripled the previous year's budget gap of $162 billion.


The fucking politicians do not have the countries best interest in hand, they are more concerned over thier own jobs than the solvency of this nation. People need to wake up, which wont happen as long as they are handing out free shit. We are SO fucked.

10/15/2008 10:15:39 AM

That is your opinion, and it isn't even the popular opinion.

10/15/2008 10:16:15 AM

It is lonely being well educated AND working in healthcare and hear some of the shit that comes out of peoples mouths. I hear it weekly in my office. Some days I ignore it, sometimes I give them my opinion. usually that ends with, "I never thought about it like that before." And me shaking my head.

But go poll some college kids or GAP workers and take thier input on healthcare and how to fix it. As long as it jives with your OPINION, then its probably alot more accurate than those who actually are in the industry.

Hey do you think healthcare should be free? wow, a majority of people on the streets think healthcare should be free. LOL

10/15/2008 10:23:25 AM

yes, you are the most educated person in the world and speak for all medical practioners.

You sure seem to have a lot of free time on your hands for being a doctor.

10/15/2008 10:26:12 AM

I also happen to work in the healthcare industry, albeit as a software developer, neither me nor any of my colleagues are terrified of government subsidized health insurance. My anecdotal evidence trumps yours.

10/15/2008 10:28:57 AM

Im am not the smartest person but I did work alot harder than most on my education. Im not saying Im the most educated person in the world you dick, but even a little shit like you would have to admit that I probably know a little more about healthcare than you do.

Why do you guys worry about my free time so much? Worried I wont provide enough tax revenue to support whatever BS programs you are for, but have no intention of contributing to? Or are you now wanting to control my free time as well as my income?

Shrike, as a software developer for healthcare, how are you employed now? Are you telling me that businesses are using your product without the govt forcing it? ALso, as a software developer, I would be happy when BO gets elected and forces everyone to move to EMRs. Thats good busniess for you. right

[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 10:35 AM. Reason : .]

10/15/2008 10:32:45 AM

you may know how to provide medical services, but I question you ability to speak for the entire healthcare system.

It must be hard to be smarter than everyone and work harder than everyone.

as for your freetime, I'm worried about your economic sustainability. I would hate for you to lose your practice from lack of work and have to go on the government dole

10/15/2008 10:35:52 AM

I actually work at a CRO, developing electronic tools used to administer clinical trials. We don't provide a product per say, but a service to pharmaceutical companies. Granted, government subsidized health insurance won't have a direct affect on our business since we're on the drug development end of it and that won't change much, but it may very well limit the amount of money flowing into the machine.

10/15/2008 10:40:24 AM

14 points

10/15/2008 10:43:36 AM

I think eyedrb should see Sicko.

10/15/2008 10:43:46 AM

I dont claim to speak for the whole medical profession. I can only speak on my experiences and those I hear from my colleagues, many of which work in different specialities. I dont claim to know more than them, just more than you nuts. Most of what I relay are problems outside of my speciality too, but what I hear from other physicians.

Does being a govt employee count as govt dole?

Yeah, you cant go wrong working on the Pharm end of things. Its kinda upside down. When our drug reps and surgical reps make more than the docs. However, it might not look like socialized medicine here will hurt your business, but we bascially subsidize the world drug market and create most of the new drugs here. I think you will see that dry up as price controls come in place under a universal system. long term I mean. Actually, your job sounds pretty cool. What trials/field do you work in?

10/15/2008 10:45:47 AM

Ive seen John Q, close enough.

10/15/2008 10:46:45 AM

So, being that you are a doctor, you are now an expert on health insurance?

10/15/2008 10:48:47 AM

this idiot is not a doctor

I know lots of doctors, none of then can spend the amount of time on TWW as he does

[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 10:51 AM. Reason : ]

10/15/2008 10:50:38 AM

I work for a company that writes software and handles call centers for nurse triage and other medical call center related stuff. Our parent company is one of the largest pharmacys in the world and one of our sister companies is a huge diabetic supply company.

We may a fuckload of bank off medicare. While it helps get me paid, im not sure its the best system in the world.

I mean this morning on NPR they were talking about how medicare pays for elective heart surgery that could be better served by cheaper medications. But most docs dont run the tests to check this because medicare doesn't care. And you know what medicare is thinking about doing to fix it? If they dont do the test, they'll pay 20% less. Hurrrr.

Insurance is an invisible black hole the way it is now. With the fed running it, it'll only get worse. The entire system and the concept of insurance needs to be overhauled. Having the fed pay for everyone is bullshit vote pandering.

10/15/2008 10:52:29 AM

Quote :

"What trials/field do you work in?"

I'm not gonna lie, I don't really pay much attention to what the company as a whole is involved on. We basically just create the tools, hand them off to the clinical/data management side of the company, and provide support for them when needed. We're almost like our own company within the company. I'm sure I could find out if I wanted to, but it's not really relevant to my job.

10/15/2008 10:56:49 AM

you know the one thing about the fed taking over insurance is that it would add a shitload of government jobs. God damn i'd love to not have to work all day.

10/15/2008 11:01:08 AM

Guys, health care is not a “right”, but rather a significant moral responsibility for any developed or industrialized country. "Rights" are too powerful a word I think, and the semantics are bogging down the root of what we are trying to hash out. This isn't a fundamental liberty bestowed at birth, or which no government is permitted to take away, freedoms.

However societies, ours included, from time to time decide that its citizens should be entitled to certain benefits, and we responsible to give to them. Sometimes justified by a common good -- e.g. well-educated populace serves society well, so we guarantee an education to all children.

Other times, this is derived from humanitarian principles....but either way, it is a significant moral responsibility we do and should take.


[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 11:04 AM. Reason : -]

10/15/2008 11:02:59 AM

Whether you agree or not with eyedrb on healthcare, you can not deny this is a major problem:

Quote :

"WASHINGTON (Reuters) - The U.S. budget deficit hit a record $455 billion in fiscal 2008 as a slowing economy sapped revenues while spending on wars, bank failures and unemployment-related benefits soared, the Treasury Department said on Tuesday. The deficit for the year ended September 30 far outstripped the White House's most recent estimate of $389 billion, made in July, and nearly tripled the previous year's budget gap of $162 billion."

Spending is completely out of control both on the federal and state level. This is something that neither the Republicans nor the Democrats will recognize.

10/15/2008 11:05:14 AM

do you have anything to back up your assertion about the state level?

10/15/2008 11:06:11 AM

Kainen, I agree with your statment. But I think that responsiblity falls on individuals, not the govt which has shown it does very little efficently. We volunteer at a free clinic. We rotate so we each do it once every 3-4 months. Our lawyer, told us to stop doing it bc the clinic didnt have a proper form to fill out that would leave us open for lawsuits.

I agree 100% shaggy.


hahah, nuts google CALIFORNIA

10/15/2008 11:11:01 AM

Quote :

"Having the fed pay for everyone is bullshit vote pandering."

No one is proposing such a system.

You people need to stop watching so much Fox News.

10/15/2008 11:14:31 AM

One state, when we are in North Carolina.

Plus, with California, they have constitutionally mandated spending that other states don't have.

10/15/2008 11:16:31 AM

10/15/2008 12:17:44 PM

Quote :

"No one is proposing such a system. "

How is a system where the fed pays for everyone's insurance not a system where the fed pays for everyones insurance?

10/15/2008 12:27:29 PM

^Obama is not proposing that. You guys need to read. I don't know how or why you think Obama is supporting free government healthcare.

10/15/2008 12:35:35 PM

so whats his plan?

10/15/2008 12:39:19 PM

I DUNNO BUT ITS NOT THAT QUIT WATCHING FOX NEWS, SHEESH

10/15/2008 12:40:05 PM

Go look on his site like everyone else. Why should we spoon-feed you? It's your obligation to inform yourself.

I've mentioned here before that Consumer Reports has a great breakdown of both the candidates plans.



[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 12:46 PM. Reason : .]

10/15/2008 12:44:40 PM

I didn't realize that Kumar liked NC:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=390eflTRnHY

10/15/2008 12:50:01 PM

i read it and while I agree its not a fed paid plan, the majority of it was "decrease healthcare costs through magic and hope!"

They somehow want to make the insurance companies cost less, but a the same time force them to cover more.

And hes still talking about spending 50billion more than we do now. Which im not a fan of.

10/15/2008 12:57:58 PM

ooo ooo i have another good plan!


We'll tax the oil companies and that will force them to invest in renewable energy!!!!!!!!!

10/15/2008 12:58:54 PM

good ideas in the obama plan:

publicly viewable prices for everything.

limiting malpractice insruance suits.

[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 1:13 PM. Reason : clarity]

10/15/2008 1:04:25 PM

10/15/2008 1:08:29 PM

Now pick up an issue of Consumer Reports.

10/15/2008 1:16:33 PM

gamecat, is that photoshopped?

10/15/2008 2:23:11 PM

10/15/2008 2:36:57 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zRqcfqiXCX0



...what?

10/15/2008 2:45:03 PM

^haha that's like an Onion fake news report.

How do people have the balls to say that in front of a camera?

[Edited on October 15, 2008 at 3:27 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2008 3:24:46 PM

hahah

fuck


just watch:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ViMuNGTufJA


Dodge, redirect, strawman!

10/15/2008 3:47:16 PM

^^^ wow, those are worst of breed responses. i think you can go to any country and find segments of the population that will have views that strong and that misguided, towards anything or anyone that's as different to said segement. as is Obama is to the "Joe Sixpack" segment of America.

10/15/2008 4:09:39 PM