if i was told we would have many 20 win seasons, never beat duke/unc, but win ACC titles and hit final fours I would be more than happy with it.

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 12:47 PM. Reason : *]

2/23/2006 12:47:32 PM

that would be great, maybe we can get one of those this year, then everyone would forget about everything else.

2/23/2006 12:49:44 PM

Quote :

"if i said we would have a 20 win season every year from here on out, but never: beat unc or duke, win a acc title (reg. or tourney), or make a final 4. would anyone take it."

no

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 12:55 PM. Reason : ]

2/23/2006 12:54:38 PM

yes

2/23/2006 12:55:25 PM

yes as long as we beat Florida State in football every year still

2/23/2006 12:56:54 PM

Quote :

"if i said we would have a 20 win season every year from here on out, but never: beat unc or duke, win a acc title (reg. or tourney), or make a final 4. would anyone take it."

Hell no

2/23/2006 12:59:35 PM

yeah....HELL NO

2/23/2006 1:25:21 PM

I'm not really anti-Herb but I think this quote pretty much says it all

Quote :

""They just whipped our tails," said N.C. State forward Ilian Evtimov, who returned after missing one game with a sprained foot. "They're a lot better than they were earlier in the season when we played them, and unfortunately for us, we haven't improved as much." "

2/23/2006 1:36:24 PM

Quote :

"1) We are CLEARLY improving as a program, steadily rising year by year 2) We continue to bring in great recruits year in and year out 3) 5 Straight NCAA tournament births 4) Herb's only lost in the first round of the ACC tournament once since he's been here 5) ACC Coach of the Year in 2003 6) Fastest Wolfpack team to 20 wins since the national championship season of 1974 7) We are currently alone in 2nd place in the ACC 8) Even with the loss tonight, we are a VERY respectable 21-6 on the season, with a 10-4 conference record 9) We've been ranked in both polls all season long 10) Sweet 16 appearance last season 11) We play a style of basketball which for most teams is difficult to prepare and play against 12) Herb is only 43 years old and has shown inprovement each and every year he has been here"

Needs to be stated again for its pure brilliance. This is the best Sports Talk post ever.

I love Herb prolly as much as anyone and I nearly always back him but a lot of last night falls on him.
It's great to see people that never post on here get on here when we lose and act like they know everything.

Quote :

"5) ACC Coach of the Year in 2003 <b> - so what?? Didn't chuck get one a couple years ago as well??</b>"

Wow. What ignorance. Chuck was rated as the worst in-game coach in the ACC by the Sporting News just this past fall. He got a 2 rating out of 5. Tied with Ted Roof from Duke. Chuck has NEVER got votes for coach of the year.

2/23/2006 2:20:05 PM

like it or not this thread, and general argument will go on and on......

until herb brings home a championship of some kind........or leaves.

2/23/2006 2:35:47 PM

idiot steelers fans did the same thing. "fire cowher, he'll never win the big one"

2/23/2006 2:38:12 PM

very true.

2/23/2006 2:39:14 PM

yes that's true. and i hate herb. he's helped our team but done all he can do.

but of course, when he wins a championship (haha) then i shall eat the crow.

2/23/2006 3:10:30 PM

i actually think that we could win the acc tourney this year.....if we get our shit together.

2/23/2006 3:13:34 PM

Quote :

"Chuck brings an attitude. This attitude is reflected in the team. The team comes out cocky, with a swagger. The fans EXPECT chuck's teams to be able to compete - even with the elite teams in the conference. We (99% of the time) look very well prepared against the top competition. We beat FSU at home, on the road, beat VT on the road and play them tight as hell at home. However, Herb brings no energy to his team. I heard Evtimov say that he thought the NCSU v. UNC was just like any other game. This mentality is the problem. I GUARANTEE you Roy had his team fired up and ready to go. He had the pumped up. Herb's laid-back style comes off as wimpy. And it reflects in the attitude of the team. They aren't physical, have no inside presence, and don't seem to care when bad stuff happens. The footbal program gives an attitude of toughness, swagger, and the expectation to compete hard EVERy game. The basketball team comes across as reserved and tenative. This is why the football team always has great expectations (even the media picks us to upset good teams) and the basketball team always has low expectations (i heard NO ONE in the media picking state to win against UNC)"

i agree about the bball team...

but why the fuck does this even matter for the football team? who the fuck cares what kind of expectations we have we we CANT FUCKING BEAT WAKE FOREST or UNC

attitude means jack shit when you dont win. give me a reserved team who wins over a confident, overrated team any day.

i mean, yes, we played like crap last night. but it is laughable to point to our football team as an example of anything positive that other teams should follow, other than how to be a bunch of overrated thugs who have to be threatened into winning like this past season.

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 3:29 PM. Reason : .]

2/23/2006 3:27:48 PM

http://northcarolinastate.scout.com/2/502130.html

2/23/2006 3:50:52 PM

^shit like that really makes me fume

our response to the loss to carolina pisses me off 10 times more than the fucking loss itself.

2/23/2006 3:55:36 PM

^^who the hell cares if hes not charismatic? there are plenty of coaches who arent that are good. there are tons of BAD charismatic coaches.

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 3:56 PM. Reason : .]

2/23/2006 3:56:06 PM

Quote :

"BAD charismatic coaches."

read: chuck amato

2/23/2006 3:58:12 PM

If they're talking about Rick Barnes, that article loses all credibility. Fuck that shit.

2/23/2006 4:05:40 PM

it doesn't have any to begin with. how many other schools would be bitching about 21 wins before march?

2/23/2006 4:07:20 PM

that article proves why most of the media has no idea what they are talking about

yeah we lost a game that all of us really wanted to win but it doesn't mean that the season is over. we are still having a very good year and can still do some great things in the postseason.

2/23/2006 4:10:23 PM

Quote :

"Already folks are talking about how great it would be to have a certain person with the initials. “R.B.” calling the RBC Center home. (And they’re not talking about Rod Brind’Amour.)"

If you love him so much, go fucking get a degree at Texas and start cheering for them.

If the time comes for a new coach, I don't want another asshole like the one we have on the fb field. Get Karl Hobbs from GW.

Not that I'm advocating firing anyone...

2/23/2006 4:10:57 PM

Quote :

"we CANT FUCKING BEAT WAKE FOREST or UNC"

Amato is 7-5 against Wake/uncch.

2/23/2006 4:24:35 PM

sorry for the short memory, all i remember is us rolling over the past 2 years to unc and getting clobbered by wf the last 2 times we played in W-S. these are BAD teams we've been losing to as well, much worse than anyone the bball team has lost to this year.

all im saying is its really, really stupid to use the fb team as a model for winning games, especially when the bball team is better at doing that anyway.

[Edited on February 23, 2006 at 4:28 PM. Reason : .]

2/23/2006 4:26:48 PM

Quote :

"Amato is 7-5 against Wake/uncch."

Those are 2 of the 3 weakest teams in the ACC.

Herb is prolly like 20-5 against Clemson and FSU.

2/23/2006 5:03:12 PM

Quote :

"Quote : "1) We are CLEARLY improving as a program, steadily rising year by year 2) We continue to bring in great recruits year in and year out 3) 5 Straight NCAA tournament births 4) Herb's only lost in the first round of the ACC tournament once since he's been here 5) ACC Coach of the Year in 2003 6) Fastest Wolfpack team to 20 wins since the national championship season of 1974 7) We are currently alone in 2nd place in the ACC 8) Even with the loss tonight, we are a VERY respectable 21-6 on the season, with a 10-4 conference record 9) We've been ranked in both polls all season long 10) Sweet 16 appearance last season 11) We play a style of basketball which for most teams is difficult to prepare and play against 12) Herb is only 43 years old and has shown inprovement each and every year he has been here""

Quote :

"Needs to be stated again for its pure brilliance. This is the best Sports Talk post ever. I love Herb prolly as much as anyone and I nearly always back him but a lot of last night falls on him. It's great to see people that never post on here get on here when we lose and act like they know everything. "

i cant tell if you're being sarcastic or not, because on this site you never know, but if you are being serious, thanks

2/23/2006 5:08:15 PM

How did this Rick Barnes shit start, anyway? The only justification I've ever seen is people on PackPride saying OMG MY BROTHER-IN-LAW'S COUSIN PLAYS GOLF WITH RICK AND SAYS HE WANTS THE NCSU JOB.

2/23/2006 5:08:24 PM

because rick barnes hates dean smith with a passion and let it be known while he was at clemson

2/23/2006 5:09:30 PM

I knew he hated Dean, but that's the only reason? So it's based on our fanbase's obsession with UNC?

2/23/2006 5:12:37 PM

Quote :

"i cant tell if you're being sarcastic or not, because on this site you never know, but if you are being serious, thanks"

Im being serious. And if Rick Barnes is so great of a coach, how come he couldn't end Clemson's 100000000 game losing streak at Chapel Hill?

2/23/2006 5:12:50 PM

two words:

it's Clemson

2/23/2006 5:22:06 PM

Quote :

"i agree about the bball team... but why the fuck does this even matter for the football team? who the fuck cares what kind of expectations we have we we CANT FUCKING BEAT WAKE FOREST or UNC attitude means jack shit when you dont win. give me a reserved team who wins over a confident, overrated team any day. i mean, yes, we played like crap last night. but it is laughable to point to our football team as an example of anything positive that other teams should follow, other than how to be a bunch of overrated thugs who have to be threatened into winning like this past season."

Specifically:

Quote :

"but it is laughable to point to our football team as an example of anything positive that other teams should follow"

Are you a moronic idiot? I assume this is the luigi of old, but maybe you are some new ass minded fuck.

He uses the football team as a readily apparent example of how a team takes on the persona of its coach. Nothing more, nothing less. To try and draw in other talking points out of that, such as "it doesn't matter if the team is fired up if they can't win" is assinine and straw mannish. It is another argument. It's been apparent for years that Herb can't get this team pumped up to play anyone. And we'd all be foolish to say that if we would have just been fired up we would have won. But it isn't foolish one bit to say if we would have been fired up we wouldn't have been blown out.

2/23/2006 5:30:59 PM

BUT HE IS RICK BARNES! THEY BEAT KANSAS STATE 65-64!!!

THEY ARE 23-4 EVEN THOUGH THEY HAVE 3 1ST ROUND NBA PICKS. PRESEASON FAVORITES TO WIN IT ALL BECAUSE OF RICK!!

FIRE HERB!!! HIRE RICK!!!

2/23/2006 5:43:00 PM

Quote :

"if i said we would have a 20 win season every year from here on out, but never: beat unc or duke, win a acc title (reg. or tourney), or make a final 4. would anyone take it."

Nope. plenty of fags up here are satisfied with that shit, though. They have to bring back banners and hardware.

2/23/2006 7:55:30 PM

I think the reason so many people are fed up with the fact that Herb cannot beat the marque programs like Duke and uncch is because those schools compete yearly for the ACC and NCAA titles. If we can only beat them 20 percent of the time (8-38 against uncch and Duke) then how in the heck can we expect to compete with other programs when it comes down to crunch time? It's nice beating teams that we're supposed to beat but we're still on the outside looking in when it comes to actually winning Titles and competing on a national level.

2/23/2006 8:04:18 PM

is there a single team at nc state that doesnt fit that description?

we should just get us some major ncaa violations, get the death penalty like SMU, and start over again with every sport.

2/23/2006 10:50:42 PM

Honestly folks...

Who the fuck has a winning record against UNC and Duke?

It's not like anyone else in the country is faring any better.

I hate our goddamn fans.

2/23/2006 11:00:13 PM

Quote :

"Honestly folks... Who the fuck has a winning record against UNC and Duke? It's not like anyone else in the country is faring any better. I hate our goddamn fans."

Sports Talk post of the year.

I guess fire Al Skinner, Oliver Purnell, Leonard Hamilton, Paul Hewitt, Gary Williams, Frank Haith, Dave Leitao, Seth Greenberg, Skip Prosser, Tubby Smith, Lute Olsen, amongst others since they all lost to them.

Oh I forget Mike Davis, wait too late.

2/24/2006 12:13:11 AM

being that roy and coach k are two of the elite coaches in the game (take the red goggles off for a second), how can you honestly justify not supporting a coach because he can't beat two of the premier teams in the country, who year in and year out compete for the national championship.

Hell, UNC should fire roy too, he can't beat Coach Queer over there at Duke

[Edited on February 24, 2006 at 12:21 AM. Reason : .]

2/24/2006 12:21:10 AM

second question....


Woudl you take a 7-10 win season Every year as long as we were garunteed a sweep of carolina and a win at duke atleast once every other year?

2/24/2006 12:54:23 AM

hell no

2/24/2006 8:15:52 AM

Quote :

"Nope. plenty of fags up here are satisfied with that shit, though. They have to bring back banners and hardware."

noone is satisfied with that you stupid mother fucker.

just some have the goddamn sense to see that we are making our way back to that level year in and year out, and some whinny bitches like you want everything now.

2/24/2006 8:32:50 AM

Quote :

"I knew he hated Dean, but that's the only reason? So it's based on our fanbase's obsession with UNC?"

He grew up in Hickory, as an NC State fan, and his family still lives there

He hates Dean Smiff and UNC more than you and I (And about beat the snot out of Dean Smith on various occasions during the game).

He said he'd love to return to the ACC one day after leaving Clemson

He wanted the job when we hired Sendek

Now, I'm sure I'll get flamed for simply answering your question by all of the psychotic Herb apologists, but hey, welcome to TWW

[Edited on February 24, 2006 at 8:40 AM. Reason : ]

2/24/2006 8:39:21 AM

for the record, barnes got brought up from the article, but the article wasn't saying "hire rick barnes!" it was saying "some people want rick barnes to be hired." learn the difference.

Quote :

"Woudl you take a 7-10 win season Every year as long as we were garunteed a sweep of carolina and a win at duke atleast once every other year?"

nope, but only because going 7-100 wouldn't guarantee us a sweep over either team every year. don't ask dumb fucking questions. Its stupid to say that overall record is unimportant, and its equally stupid to say its the only important thing. Just like its stupid to say that beating duke and/or UNC is unimportant or that beating them is the only important thing.

I'll admit that I didn't really know the les robinson days, as I started following state in 99 when I was a freshman here. However, I can say that I have routinely seen herb fail to have his players ready for games against Duke and UNC. The one that sticks in my mind was the the UNC game in 2000 @ UNC on the saturday before classes started in January. Everyone was basically like "dude, we are gonna win. UNC sucks." That year was Guthridge's last year, I think, or somewhere around there. Either way, UNC SUCKED that year, and we ended up losing that game. More importantly, that game established in my mind the "Herb trend" of getting up by 10-15 points and then blowing it.

I remember the clemson home game that year as well, with us being up by ~10 with 5 minutes left and me thinking to myself "ok, how will we fuck it up this time?" and sure enough, we fucked it up and lost. Those are two examples from 2000, but I can honestly say that pattern has continued since then. Every now and then we fuck up and actually beat duke or UNC, but most of the time we just do the same ol' same ol.

Yes, I've seen the overall winning percentage go up since then, but I've still seen the same pattern, and I can't honestly call the winning percentage an "improvement." The one thing we can always count on in big games is a meltdown, 5-10 minutes without scoring a basket. Shit like that happens to the best teams every now and then, but we seem to do it almost every game! At the very least, we do it almost every game against a real opponent.

Bitch all you want about the "princeton offense" or the backdoor cuts or the lack of rebounding or the assininely stupid "last plays." Many of those things come and go, but the one constant is the drought. The talent levels between the 2000 team and this year's team are obviously worlds apart, yet the droughts persist. Many people want to say "Herb's not the one missing baskets," and that is true, but I have to question who is to blame for something that has existed for almost 7 seasons now if its not the coach...

If Herb up and wins the NC this year will I love him? Probably not. Will I hate him? probably not. if herb gets rid of the drought consistently, will I love him? I'll be a hell of a lot closer to it, at the very least, because maybe then I will stop expecting us to fuck it up every game, no matter how much we are ahead. I'm a bit ambivalent towards Herb, because I do see the winning pct increase, and I do see the consecutive NCAA berths, but I also see that we usually have squeaked in to the NCAAs with last second runs through the ACC tournery (complete with a meltdown, of course) and I see us also performing relatively poorly in the NCAAs, even against sub-par teams. We beat UCONN last year, big fucking deal. What about Wisconsin? What about Vanderbilt? What about California?

For every "positive," there's always at least two negatives to go with it...

2/24/2006 2:22:58 PM

BTTT

you tell me he is helping us more than he's hurting us


i say this win or lose

im sick of this bullshit

2/25/2006 6:03:46 PM

HEY LETS RUN SOME MORE 1-3-1 OK GUYS

2/25/2006 6:12:03 PM

O GREAT HERB CALLS A TIMEOUT TO AGAIN PROVE TO US WHY HE ISNT A BIG GAME COACH BY RUNNING THE SAME SHITTY LAST SECOND SHOT PLAY


TOO FUCKING PREDICTABLE

2/25/2006 6:13:37 PM

joy

2/25/2006 6:15:42 PM

O MY GOD I MUST BE NOSTRAFUCKINGDAMUS

I CALLED IT

I WONDER FUCKING WHY

2/25/2006 6:16:31 PM