Quote :

"By the way, anyone who tells you go vegan or vegetarian strictly for health reasons would be wrong. A smart omnivorous diet does as well or better. Fish in particular are extremely healthful."

Very true.

The human body, heart, and brain needs long chain omega-3 fatty acids. They are found only in a couple or so sources. Omega-3 found in land plants, such as flax, hemp, chia, and walnuts, are short chain omega-3, and your body converts them into long chain omega-3 at a ratio of 10:1, and often even less. (as little as 50:1)

So that leaves us with the few sources of long chain omega-3:

Oily fish from cold waters
Krill (small shrimp-like zooplankton, 0.5 inch long)
Microalgae

So, as you can see, the only feasible source for humans (direct consumption) is fish, as long as the fishing is done sustainably.

For the benefits of omega-3, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Omega-3 is a good place to start.


[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 12:00 PM. Reason : ]

9/26/2008 11:58:36 AM

sustainably

9/26/2008 11:59:52 AM

systematically

9/26/2008 12:01:02 PM

darn it, hardly ever make spelling mistakes!

thanks!

for some reason sustenance popped into my head rather than sustain.

9/26/2008 12:02:25 PM

hey I'm sure English isn't your first language, so considering I don't know any other languages I can't really fault you

9/26/2008 12:03:13 PM

i`m pretty sure growing microalgae in vats would be a sustainable option. the trick is to keep toxic species out.

9/26/2008 12:06:13 PM

Plus, microalgae is delicious

9/26/2008 12:10:13 PM

it is not my first language, as in, spoken language, BUT,

it is the first language i learnt to write, along with another one
it is [by far] my best language (among the 5 i know), in all aspects; vocabulary, grammar, speaking, reading, listening, and writing, even though it is the 3rd one i learnt to speak.

i never use spell check, and i hardly ever make spelling mistakes which are true spelling mistakes, and not just typing mistakes!

9/26/2008 12:11:21 PM

You forgot breast milk as a source of omega 3. Breast milk and fish oil are pretty much the only two significant sources.

So the breast milk, brings this thread full circle.

9/26/2008 12:22:54 PM

yeah breast milk is a source of omega-3.

and i am a very vocal breast-feeding proponent.

but yeah, cool how the thread came full circle!

9/26/2008 12:30:48 PM

NBC-17 poll:
http://www.nbc17.com/midatlantic/ncn/news.apx.-content-articles-NCN-2008-09-26-0009.html

9/26/2008 12:32:09 PM

Quote :

"wow, what a good little mommy you're going to be, controlling your children's thoughts so nothing bad or different can get in to hurt them, and they can become the perfect machines you program them to be. then they're gonna drop out of college the first semester after they simultaneously discovered every vice on the planet, and maybe go to jail or join an *ugh* hippie commune and EXPAND their EXISTENCE in ways mommy shielded them from for centuries."

I'm against shielding/brainwashing/programing children, so that is not what I meant. My mom did not do that to me, so I would not do that to my child. (obviously, since I'm 95% different than my mom) I think you know what I meant, you are just trying to argue with me.

9/26/2008 12:47:37 PM

but if your child one day at the age of say, 10, or 15, decides to become a vegetarian/vegan/carnivore/insectivore/cannibal, there is nothing you will be able to do about it, as long s/he is not harming her/his own health, right?

we, TWW, just want to know that you won't be forcing your child, and your husband won't be beating it up.

9/26/2008 12:50:51 PM

Fish would be superior, but vegans can get by well enough with flax and such.

9/26/2008 12:53:24 PM

^^aside from a good talking to, no, there isn't much one can do.

Can we get back to talking about milk-filled titties now?

9/26/2008 12:55:59 PM

^ sure... if you have any, show them!

9/26/2008 12:59:33 PM

1) My kids can do whatever they want to, as long as it doesn't hurt others or themselves (too badly).

2) I buy the food, if they want to shell out $New York for some organic foods or tofu or whatever, fine. Until they move out, they eat what I cook. I've seen enough parents who given in and only feed hotdogs and macaroni 5 days a week.

3) If you took beating somebody till they shit themselves as a literal expression, you haven't hung around chitchat enough. Let me translate into the lounge version: "I will not approve, nor endorse behavior that is a result of peer pressure in which they only see 1/4 the picture" If you don't believe this go talk to some middle and high school girls, they are extremely influential and will believe what ever PETA tells them.

9/26/2008 1:03:43 PM

Quote :

"Until they move out, they eat what I cook."

Fair enough. But what if they refuse to eat animal flesh and just eat the plant-matter you cook? Would you then make sure to provide enough plant protein to ensure their health? (beans, whole grains, etc) As a good parent, you will have to, right?

Quote :

"I've seen enough parents who given in and only feed hotdogs and macaroni 5 days a week."

That's just fucked up, and is a product of bad parenting. And really, it is irrelevant here. The discussion here is vegatarian diet vs. omnivorous diet, assuming both are done healthily. With what I just quoted, it becomes proper diet vs. pure trash. Any parents who do that should be hauled away to jail for child neglect and endangerment. I am sure there are a heck of a lot more parents who do it out of ignorance and lack of time than those who do it because the child pressured them.

Quote :

"If you took beating somebody till they shit themselves as a literal expression, you haven't hung around chitchat enough."

TEH INTERNETZ IS CERIOSE BUZZNISS!!!

Quote :

"If you don't believe this go talk to some middle and high school girls, they are extremely influential and will believe what ever PETA tells them."

Yeah, I know that. We don't have that phenomenon in the [big] part of the world I live in, but I know all about it in the US.

BTW, influenceable (the girls), not influential (PETA).

9/26/2008 1:37:22 PM

Quote :

"Fair enough. But what if they refuse to eat animal flesh and just eat the plant-matter you cook? Would you then make sure to provide enough plant protein to ensure their health? (beans, whole grains, etc) As a good parent, you will have to, right?"

yes, of course.

9/26/2008 1:44:32 PM

If it wasn't for the internet, I wouldn't know how dumb people really are.

9/26/2008 1:47:12 PM

I chose not to eat meat starting when I was 11, and not because I was brainwashed by any organization. And my mother didn't flip out, and she didn't cook me special food that often. Instead, I learned how to cook some things on my own, and didn't eat whatever meat dishes she made otherwise, but I still ate all the vegetables and things she would cook- unlike many of my peers at that time, I`m sure. my mom didn't flip out because it just wasn't a big deal.

9/26/2008 2:03:54 PM

Quote :

"I chose not to eat meat starting when I was 11, and not because I was brainwashed by any organization"

of course, thats exactly what they'd tell you to say...

9/26/2008 2:05:11 PM

PETA wasn't super public then, and I doubt I seriously heard about them until I was 14 or 15. Instead, what got me going was reading Francis Moore Lappé's "Diet for a small planet." Of course that book has a lot of information that we now know to be untrue, like the myth that you must eat complete proteins at every meal. However, it does show that people have been thinking of vegetarianism as a more ecological way to support a ballooning human population for a long time.

I would say that my concerns were more humanitarian than about animals. I won't say that animal welfare never interested me, but it wasn't my primary motivation.

I have now moved to a place where eating plant based foods for the entire year is very expensive, and it used to be almost impossible, and I have begun including meats in my diet, after well over a decade of a plant based diet. Ironically, vegetarianism is rabidly popular here- but I don`t feel having vegetables flown in from 5,000 miles away is helping the planet either.

9/26/2008 2:17:06 PM

I ordered some kind of free vegetarian kit from them when I was around 14 because they made it sound like it would have health-based info in it, but it was pretty much all pictures of skinned animals and chickens with their beaks cut off and a baby cow looking "sad" standing next to a dead adult and crap like that. That was how I found out I didn't want to be associated with that organization. But they kept sending me address labels and stuff like that for ... pretty much until I moved.

9/26/2008 2:23:07 PM

Quote :

"But how is rice gonna cost $47.40 in Japan?"

It's kind of complicated but basically Japan taxes the hell out of rice.

9/28/2008 10:27:00 PM

That's downright weird. How do folks over there afford it?

9/28/2008 10:39:33 PM

Almost everyone lives at home until they're married. So they have most of their food costs paid for by their parents. And then once you marry, if you're a woman, you just move into your husband's household anyway so everyone is sharing the cost of food.

9/28/2008 10:46:20 PM

Still seems odd to me. I can't imagine paying $20+ per pound for a stable. There's some wild rice around that price where I shop. I always look at it and shake my head.

What do folks make in Japan? I know their PPP GDP per capita isn't that far behind ours, so they should be living fairly well.

9/28/2008 10:56:07 PM

That reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally depends on the job and what not. And people don't really start making decent money at their job until they've been working there for a decade or so.

What I can tell you is minimum wage is about $8/hour.

They pay that much for a staple because they don't know any better. I know that sounds kind of mean or condescending but when you talk to people here about "why the hell do you pay so much for rice!?!?!" you see how true it really is.

9/28/2008 11:17:23 PM