To be clear I'm not shitting on Gerrard. I'm shitting on Hodgson for being a boring douche with no plan to attack. And for England for having no true DMs. Too bad Rodwell committed career suicide.

6/8/2014 9:24:53 PM

Noone has any business ongoing out soccer for flopping after another Heat NBA Finals.

6/8/2014 9:44:29 PM

Damn, Marco Reus is out...

He is their best player.

6/9/2014 4:35:21 AM

best player? nah son

6/9/2014 7:15:34 AM

What German had a better season than Reus this year?

Götze? Özil?

Reus lead the Bundesliga in assists and was the top scoring German. He was definitely the breakout German to watch before the injury.



[Edited on June 9, 2014 at 7:50 AM. Reason : e]

6/9/2014 7:47:10 AM

Quote :

"http://games.espn.go.com/world-cup-bracket-predictor/2014/en/group?groupID=28429 Created a TWW group for the ESPN bracket predictor password is tww"

sign up for this, dudes. I think we had 40 people in 2010

6/9/2014 8:09:05 AM

yeah, Ribs, you trippin

Reus was far and away the best player on the German roster

6/9/2014 8:43:47 AM

You could probably argue Muller too but obviously had superior supporting cast.

If Kroos only played Arsenal he'd win every award..

6/9/2014 9:41:14 AM

Yeah, I am looking forward to watching Müller, too.

6/9/2014 9:47:38 AM

I'd argue Neuer is the best player on the German roster.

6/9/2014 11:52:02 AM

England has true DM's, Carrick and Barry. Hodgson refused to take them.

Also all this hate for England, boy would I love it if England went out and scored 4 on Italy on Saturday. NyM410 would shut right up for sure.

6/9/2014 1:00:49 PM

I think England wins the group.

6/9/2014 1:32:54 PM

I hope England wins the group. I don't think anything I'm saying as at all controversial though.

6/9/2014 1:46:01 PM

England winning the group would put me over the moon. If England beat Italy I say it happens but that's a big if. I will say I think England is in for one of their best tournaments in the last decade.

I won't give too much stock to the 0-0 draw against Honduras. I missed the match and from what I hear it was horrible viewing anyway. I do think England has enough young talent to at least put up an exciting display. This is also the first international tournament that Rooney is actually fit and ready since 2004. I think Rooney will have a huge role and he will show up to this one. If he doesn't, it will be the same old story I suppose.

I am hoping for a repeat of 1990.

Not going to happen but I want to see this against Italy:


--Hart--
Johnson - Jagielka - Cahill -Baines
--- Wilshere - Gerrard - Jones ---
-- Rooney - Lallana --
--- Sturridge ---

Tight formation, play narrow and use the pace in the team up front. Break on the counter. If this doesn't work, open it up and sub on Sterling/Welbeck.

Unfortunately England don't use a 4-3-3. Hodgson will settle for a 4-2-3-1 but without an effective DM it will most likely only cripple a weak midfield. Loading the midfield and attacking on the counter would work effectively against Italy if you ask me.

[Edited on June 9, 2014 at 1:52 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on June 9, 2014 at 2:00 PM. Reason : .]

6/9/2014 1:51:45 PM

The Honduras thing was meh because of the storm delay. For the first 20 mins England was doing great and kept the ball on the Honduran side with lots of pace. After the game was interrupted though, all momentum was lost and they couldn't get back in form so it was the same old boring game they play all the time.

6/9/2014 1:55:31 PM

Quote :

"I think Rooney will have a huge role and he will show up to this one. If he doesn't, it will be the same old story I suppose. "

I don't agree with that at all. Rooney on this team feels like what Donovan would have been if JK had selected him. The big star on the team that you try to fit in the starting XI when it's probably better if you didn't.

Sturridge is the key player for England because he's one of the most in-form and healthy strikers at the World Cup.

6/9/2014 1:58:34 PM

Quote :

"Rooney on this team feels like what Donovan would have been if JK had selected him."

That is an absolutely ridiculous statement. Rooney is England's best player and certainly the most creative player. Landon Donovan is so far past it, it would have been stupid to pick him for the USMNT. Not to mention, Donovan is an absolute entitled little shit who thought "taking a break" wouldn't hinder his place in the team. I love Klinsmann's no nonsense attitude and he made the absolute correct decision to get rid of Donovan.

I don't understand this sentiment people have about Rooney. The guy had 17 goals and 10 assists despite not playing striker and his team having an absolute shit year. He has been the most consistently good player in the EPL, compare that to any other British player and Rooney is definitely ahead of them.

6/9/2014 2:06:19 PM

Calm down. All I meant was there isn't a clear position for either player in their respective teams. Rooney cannot play the striker role with Sturridge there. If he drops back, he's taking away space for somebody clearly better suited for the position like Lallana.

LD cannot lead the line for the US and cannot contribute defensively enough in JK's preferred diamond midfield. He's not better than Dempsey at that second striker role.


And stop bringing up Rooney's stats for United. They're irrelevant here. The same reason Lampard/Gerrard's stats over their time together for England have proven completely irrelevant.

[Edited on June 9, 2014 at 2:11 PM. Reason : .]

6/9/2014 2:10:53 PM

Ok, how about this one then:

Rooney is the top goal scorer for England under Roy Hodgson 11 in 18.

Lallana is not better suited for the position behind the striker at all. Rooney is the better player and he has played in that role for a while now. I agree Sturridge should start given his year but Sturridge can't lead the line on his own, he needs a creative outlet and Rooney is the best creative player England has.

There is a reason why I think England is best suited for a 4-3-3 with Lallana and Rooney both playing right behind the striker. England has the personnel to play a narrow attack, yet the insistence is on a wider gameplan that leaves a frail midfield very very open.

In fact Rooney's best ability is his versatility. The guy is a workhorse and tracks back like no other striker I have seen since Tevez. His ability to roam and defend is the best asset England has, especially when you want to protect a 1 goal lead.

6/9/2014 2:21:08 PM

Quote :

"Rooney is the top goal scorer for England under Roy Hodgson 11 in 18."

Sure. That's fair. Sturridge wasn't the player he is now when Rooney was piling in goals against shitty teams like San Marino and Montenegro in WCQ games either though. We're talking about the England team as of right now and Sturridge is clearly the better striker and goalscorer.

Quote :

"There is a reason why I think England is best suited for a 4-3-3 with Lallana and Rooney both playing right behind the striker. England has the personnel to play a narrow attack, yet the insistence is on a wider gameplan that leaves a frail midfield very very open."

Maybe you're right. But I'm just trying to fit Rooney into Roy's formation. I wouldn't be starting Welbeck either but it looks like that's what Hodgson wants to do.

Bottom line is I think England can do well without a big WC from Rooney. It would certainly help but they have enough quality in attack to do well without him.

[Edited on June 9, 2014 at 2:39 PM. Reason : .]

6/9/2014 2:35:15 PM

Well a lot of teams have quality to do well without their best player.

I still don't think you can drop Rooney in any formation, he has the quality to play anywhere on the pitch. I can also understand why Hodgson wants to start Welbeck. You have to understand that Rooney & Welbeck won't be tasked with being strikers if that is the case.

Rooney will be the CAM and primary playmaker. Welbeck will be deployed as he was often been used by Sir Alex the year he retired and by David Moyes against Bayern. Welbeck has the ability to man mark the oppositions most creative player and do a very good job with it. Welbeck also has the ability and more importantly the pace to unlock a defense. Sterling and Chamberlain simply can't do that. In a tight game against a team like Italy Welbeck is exactly the kind of player you want if you insist on playing wide. Baines and Welbeck would be very useful in transition.

Hart
Johnson - Jagielka - Cahill - Baines
Gerrard - Henderson
Milner - Rooney - Welbeck
Sturridge

I can see Hodgson lining up like that against Italy. It will be a defensive performance and England's chances will squarely lie on Henderson/Rooney/Welbeck/and Sturridge linking up in transition. I am sure Wilshere, Sterling, and Lallana will likely play a role depending on the situation. I still don't think that is the best strategy or line up however.

6/9/2014 2:53:27 PM

Quote :

"Well a lot of teams have quality to do well without their best player. "

Okay but we are specifically talking about England. You said:

Quote :

"I think Rooney will have a huge role and he will show up to this one. If he doesn't, it will be the same old story I suppose. "

I guess we should clarify what you mean by "same old story." I personally think they don't need a crazy tournament from Rooney to get to the quarters. What are your expectations for England and how dependent on Rooney are they?

6/9/2014 2:59:51 PM

Finish top of the group and get in to the quarters. England haven't gotten past the first knockout stage for a while now (2006 world cup the last time).

Did not qualify for the Euro's in 2008
Finished second and went to first Knockout Round in 2010 and lost to Germany
Euro 2012 was better and went to the quarters here but that is the first knockout round for the euros
World cup 2014?

England is in the toughest group it has played since I can remember. Getting to a World Cup quarterfinal will require a good tournament from Rooney.

6/9/2014 3:09:15 PM

Quote :

"Rooney retains his place because theoretically he offers moments of magic, but there’s increasingly a sense he causes problems in terms of structure. He can play too high up in the number ten position – which, of course, risks turning the 4-2-3-1 into a 4-4-2, which was precisely what happened at World Cup 2010. The following tournament, Euro 2012, demonstrated Rooney’s lack of tactical discipline because he failed to mark Andrea Pirlo effectively, allowing Italy’s regista the run of the midfield. At England’s past two major tournaments, Rooney’s positional indiscipline has been the major tactical problem, and it will be amazing if Pirlo is allowed to go free in England’s opening game, especially considering the likes of Henderson, Welbeck and even Sterling are all extremely disciplined."

http://www.zonalmarking.net/2014/06/09/england-world-cup-2014/#more-10360

6/9/2014 6:05:56 PM

I absolutely disagree with that notion. A guy who has been the fulcrum for Man United's horrible midfield and only reason it is any effective isn't disciplined? Laughable. I would say he was very effective as the number 10 role under Sir Alex and even under Moyes. If Rooney isn't disciplined what the hell is Lallana? If Rooney can't mark Pirlo, Lallana certainly can't.

Its ridiculous the lengths people will go to to slight Wayne Rooney. Anyone that actually watch's him play can clearly tell he is a player of immense quality and the best creative outlet that England has. I personally hope Hodgson benches him. Just to show the rest of the world how laughably poor England would be without an effective number 10. England's fans don't deserve Rooney.

6/9/2014 10:00:49 PM

6/9/2014 10:12:07 PM

lol, not mad at all. On the contrary quiet enjoying the stupidity of the so called England fans. When Piers Morgan makes a sensible statement on Rooney you just know you are on the wrong side. I personally hope Rooney makes each and every one of them eat shit by having a great tournament. If Hodgson benches him then England won't get more than 3 points. Bank on it.

6/9/2014 10:26:28 PM

6/9/2014 11:37:50 PM

So.....I take it this is the part of our traditional tww world cup threads where we play up England's strength, only to wonder where it all went wrong after yet another early elimination?

6/10/2014 12:23:51 AM

It's basically one guy defending his United boys. You have to be obtuse to continue to want to trot out Welbeck over Ox/Sterling. For fucks sake, Ox has barely played and has as many England goals as Welbeck since end of 2012..

6/10/2014 7:14:44 AM

He thinks the Glazers are good owners too so this shouldn't be all that surprising.

6/10/2014 8:12:51 AM

There's way too much talk in here about a team that isn't even going to make it out of the group stage.

Let's turn our attention to Chile instead, who are going to top their group with 10 goals for and play the most exciting style (and about 100000x more exciting than England).

6/10/2014 8:39:01 AM

I would really love to see a south American team win it. Fuck Europe

6/10/2014 10:08:49 AM

^^agree! Assuming Vidal is ready for the Spain and Holland matches

6/10/2014 10:13:03 AM

^^ well, considering the euros record in tournaments held on American soil, that's very likely.

6/10/2014 12:06:39 PM

Quote :

"I'd argue Neuer is the best player on the German roster."

Since he is a keeper and can't score goals, I think that your point is moot.

You can argue that he is the best keeper around (and they have Boateng too who is a beast), but these guys are generally admitted under 'who is the best player' conversation.

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 12:13 PM. Reason : d]

6/10/2014 12:13:24 PM

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/06/10/sports/worldcup/goal-line-technology-in-place-for-world-cup.html?_r=0

I had forgotten about the implementation of goal-line technology for this world cup, it's about damn time.

6/10/2014 12:19:57 PM

^Awesome, I forgot about that too. After the shit show that happened in South Africa, it couldn't come sooner.

6/10/2014 1:41:19 PM

Pretty neat video: http://fansided.com/2014/06/09/nike-soccer-releases-5-minute-animated-ad-world-cup/

6/10/2014 2:51:22 PM

C'mon Tim, just give Cristiano a little push. It'd be so easy, and nobody would blame you.


Or just let him underperform like he usually does in international competitions.

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 3:08 PM. Reason : why is iniesta wearing his barca jersey? - ooohhhh, Spain must not be with Nike. Guess that explains the exclusion of Messi

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 3:12 PM. Reason : ]

6/10/2014 3:07:18 PM

I, for one, cannot wait to watch Ibrahimovic in the WC...

6/10/2014 3:11:00 PM

Quote :

"It's basically one guy defending his United boys. "

Yes I am defending my "united boys" so much that the only person I think should be a definite starter is Rooney and not Welbeck, Jones, or Smalling. Logic has no place here.

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 6:39 PM. Reason : .]

6/10/2014 6:39:17 PM

Quote :

"There's way too much talk in here about a team that isn't even going to make it out of the group stage."

6/10/2014 6:41:57 PM

Quote :

"He thinks the Glazers are good owners too so this shouldn't be all that surprising."

Putting words in my mouth I see. I love the revisionist arm chair pundits. I said the Glazers aren't bad owners, United could do much much worse without them. Its called playing devils advocate. Since your thick skin can't understand there is a reason United's commercial success has coincided with the Glazers reign, something they have to to be given credit for. Its not as black or white as bad and good.

6/10/2014 6:47:49 PM

Quote :

"The Glazers have been good owners who don't meddle with the team. Sir Alex gets what he wants and I would take the Glazers over someone like Mansoor or Abrhamovic. The only complain I have is the ticket prices. The debt is serviceable, I am not worried about that one bit (unless Sir Alex retires and we don't make top 4). Ticket prices would have gone up regardless. It would however be nice if the club were owned by fans but that would pose some other logistical challenges as well. We had owners that weren't squeezing millions out of our club and we still didn't spend ridiculous amounts on players. We spent more or less what they were worth. The return on investment for majority of United players has been terrific. [Edited on April 29, 2013 at 1:25 PM. Reason : .] 4/29/2013 1:24:35 PM"

- wazza31

message_topic.aspx?topic=628591&page=33#15802885

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 7:36 PM. Reason : link]

6/10/2014 7:33:25 PM

So....if Pirlo carves England again, England goes into the Uruguay match against a Uruguayan side that will likely see a win as the safest bet to advance out of the group....

England could very well have zero points going into their game against the ticos, with both teams already eliminated.....or even worse, with only Costa Rica having the possibility of advancing.


You have to think that both Italy and Uruguay are content to draw against one another, and they play last...So that pretty much leaves each side dependent on stomping out CR and draw/beating England...


Not only is their group difficult, but the schedule doesn't help them any either. Although, ultimately, it'll be their outdated style of play that does them in per usual.

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 7:53 PM. Reason : ]

6/10/2014 7:44:05 PM

Quote :

"Its a matter of opinion. The Glazers could do better, yes, but the grass isn't always greener on the other side."

from the same thread. Basically saying the Glazers aren't as bad as everyone is making them out to be and have been commercially successful. I certainly wouldn't expect a Liverpool fan to understand how well United are doing financially. Pretty sure I have a much better outlook on this than you.



So....if Pirlo doesn't carve up England this time, England goes into the Uruguay match needing a draw against a Uruguayan side that is very old and their best player coming into the tournament with injuries.

England could very well have four points going into their game against the ticos.

Fixed it for you. The game of if's and but's goes both ways.

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 7:56 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on June 10, 2014 at 7:57 PM. Reason : .]

6/10/2014 7:52:49 PM

No way England goes into the CR game with four points.

6/10/2014 7:59:24 PM

lol. So certain. Is England's group tough? Without a doubt, but Italy are notoriously slow starters and haven't exactly kicked on from the Euro's. There are question marks to be asked for all 3 teams, England, Italy, and Uruguay. The teams are very evenly matched if you ask me and all this hate for England's 'backwards' football, where is that hate for Italy? Italy's football is just as boring.

6/10/2014 8:04:59 PM

It is just as boring. But at least it's effective.

The three teams are not evenly matched. South American sides are not intimidated by England, because they can play the possession game around them.

Sorry, man, but four points is crazy optimistic. You're basically saying that a team that will likely finish third in the group could run away with it at the top. Italy and Uruguay are most likely planning to have 6 points in hand when they meet to avoid turning that game into win or go home situation. That means your getting their best performances each, which is ultimately just a function of the group schedule, which sucks for England supporters.

6/10/2014 8:10:45 PM