He's just not done a very good job so far this season. Underachieving by a lot

[Edited on December 4, 2012 at 11:52 PM. Reason : V that's an oxymoron]

12/4/2012 11:41:24 PM

I'm holding out hope that he can be a non-defense playing Izzo

12/4/2012 11:47:34 PM

Our players play like idiots

If it weren't for howell we lose by 20

12/4/2012 11:51:30 PM

why can't we win every late november / early december game by 40+?

god dammit!

dur!

[Edited on December 4, 2012 at 11:53 PM. Reason : why was he mad at bad fouls and stepping out of bounds! its all his fault!]

12/4/2012 11:52:46 PM

ill take that win any day

no moral victories

no bad wins

12/4/2012 11:54:50 PM

^^ Nobody's saying that, but you've got to admit the team's performance is troubling.

[Edited on December 4, 2012 at 11:55 PM. Reason : ...]

12/4/2012 11:54:55 PM

If he can get them diving on the floor and playing 40 mins of Gritty tough d. He will get plus a million.

I will never say a bad word against Howell (exception foul trouble)

12/4/2012 11:55:16 PM

Quote :

"He's just not done a very good job so far this season. Underachieving by a lot"

underachieving by what standard? the retarded media who clearly didn't watch our team play until march last year? Seemed like even most on this board were cautiously (emphasis on cautiously) optimistic about the team, but not many believed a 6 ranking was warranted.

By most reasonable people who follow the team's standard, we are about where we thought we would be. Yeah, we laid an egg against Ok St., but there weren't many who circled @ a legit Michigan team as a W.

This is the same team as last year with a bit more experience, less front court depth and a few new pieces that are talented but haven't totally figure out how to fit in yet.

[Edited on December 4, 2012 at 11:56 PM. Reason : x]

12/4/2012 11:56:21 PM

We beat an underrated team in December. We have room for improvement but I wasn't too troubled.

12/4/2012 11:56:57 PM

i will never get mad about a win outside of raleigh. this is no exception.

good win tonight, needed it.

12/4/2012 11:57:32 PM

Team is playing like a top 25 team, but not like a conference champion. I was really hoping to see that happen this year.

12/4/2012 11:57:57 PM

Idk about that.

For us to be good, brown has to be one of our 2 best players. Right now the way he's playing he's barely a top 5

12/5/2012 12:01:35 AM

Quote :

"Nobody's saying that, but you've got to admit the team's performance is troubling."

the game threads suggest otherwise

the performance was trouble in the ok state game, and the unc-a game (which we won)

other than that, i cant be too unhappy...did we struggle in the 1st half of some games like tonight, michigan, etc? sure...but my post you quoted referenced exactly that, people bitching about bad possessions in the first half of games we won or played well in

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:02 AM. Reason : ^did you watch the game or just the pointspread? brown had a nice game]

12/5/2012 12:01:59 AM

Quote :

"i will never get mad about a win outside of raleigh. this is no exception. good win tonight, needed it."

12/5/2012 12:02:12 AM

We are an incredibly dumb team at times, but we play hard. It starts with Howell and Purvis, but even CJL was grinding tonight. Maybe it was the DON'T EVER GIVE UP on the back of the jerseys, but it just felt like our guys were refusing to lose. They were gonna keep punching UCONN until they knocked them out. Been a long time since I've seen that from a State team.

Still playing ugly basketball at times, but we needed this one bad and got it. Credible.

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:05 AM. Reason : ]

12/5/2012 12:04:14 AM

^^^ i watched the game. Throwing up terrible shots, turnovers, getting destroyed by napier

12/5/2012 12:11:23 AM

why oh why did we get destroyed by one of the best guards in the big east in a win?

can you ever be happy with a win over a pretty good team? sheesh

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:13 AM. Reason : .]

12/5/2012 12:12:52 AM

fire gott, revoke all scholarships, blow up reynolds & sell all basketballs in carmichael

12/5/2012 12:14:04 AM

You guys are fucked in the head. All i said was that brown has to play better and you get all butthurt

40 assists to 29 turnovers

Shooting 10% from 3

Shooting 34% from the field

Has taken the most shots on the team

This is not a good formula for a starting PG

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:18 AM. Reason : I]

12/5/2012 12:15:53 AM

brown had a very good game, i'm not getting butthurt, you're confusing his performance tonight with his performance in previous games this year

you might as well bitch about "HOWELL NEEDS TO STOP FOULING OUT" cause thats just as relevant to TONIGHT'S GAME

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:17 AM. Reason : .]

12/5/2012 12:16:38 AM

He did not have a good game.

Did he have a better game? Yes. Is jt good enough for us to be a good team in ACC play? Fuck no

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:20 AM. Reason : H]

12/5/2012 12:19:16 AM

he had 4 assists and 6 turnovers which is not good

he also had 2 steals and 2 blocks and a lot of timely buckets

and he shared the team lead in points scored, with CJL who you also probably hate in favor of some 18 year olds who balled out against Miami of Bumfuck

why cant people just enjoy a win instead of getting hypercritical of every possession, especially 4 months before the NCAA tourney

12/5/2012 12:23:14 AM

Again, i did not say i was unhappy with the win, nor was i complaining about the coach etc

I simply said that zo brown needs to play better than he has if we are gonna do anything

12/5/2012 12:25:08 AM

and that i can agree with

but he played better, like you said, and it helped us get a win

i just dont get all the criticism (by anyone) after a nice win, do you think he's gonna read your or my posts and modify his practice habits accordingly?

college bball is won in conference play and postseason play, not WINS in early december

12/5/2012 12:26:32 AM

dude, brown did NOT have a good game.

12/5/2012 12:38:15 AM

he had a couple costly turnovers, but he hit some critical baskets when the team needed him

but i guess people will bitch if he doesn't go 15/15 with 0 turnovers

SIGH, STATE FANS

12/5/2012 12:40:10 AM

he played alright

put us up by one at the half and had 16 points.

TJ Warren had a BAD game

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:42 AM. Reason : I'm with Twista. Y'all need to STFU and be happy we won]

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 12:43 AM. Reason : .]

12/5/2012 12:42:23 AM

The average college PG turns the ball over 2.5 times a game. Brown averages 4.2 a game

He also has one of the worst Assist/TO ratios of all qualifying PGs in division 1 basketball

12/5/2012 12:47:50 AM

and yet, somehow, his performance tonight helped us win

12/5/2012 12:50:19 AM

Sandwich delivery for Mr Lorenzo Brown

12/5/2012 12:58:11 AM

Brown has to remember he's 6'5 sometimes. He can't casually dribble the ball into the lane against smaller, quicker guards. It'll get swiped every time. He's great when he's decisive and going to the basket, but he's got to stop getting stuck dribbling in the lane.

That said, I think he had a pretty good game. Not great, but we can win when he plays like that. He can definitely play better though.

I really think people are expecting him to be a player that he's not, including scouts. He's not Derrick Rose or Deron Williams or anything close to that. He's never been a great shooter, a great defender, or an incredible athlete ... and he probably won't ever be. He's a good ball-handler, a good distributor, and a crafty player in general, but he's not a world-beater. I just think people's expectations for what he SHOULD be (not what he is) are impossible to live up to most of the time.


[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 1:06 AM. Reason : ]

12/5/2012 1:00:25 AM

^ All people are expecting him to do is be like he was toward the end of last season, that's not so unreasonable.

12/5/2012 6:31:19 AM

Quote :

"ll i said was that brown has to play better and you get all butthurt"

Quote :

"Our players play like idiots"

So that's not all you said. But I do agree - Brown does have to play better for us to go far. He also has to be more consistent. He gives us a great plays followed by bad plays

12/5/2012 7:08:59 AM

The people who immediately jump on someone for reasonable criticism are as bad as those who are overly reactionary about doing badly. Everyone says this board is bipolar and reactionary, but there are also plenty of unreasonable apologists here

12/5/2012 7:18:52 AM

+7 for the number of letters in DEFENSE

12/5/2012 8:01:34 AM

Our half-court offense has little high-low movement. Maybe its just the system we use? We also do not swing the ball quick enough on the perimeter.

Perimeter defense is absolutely horrible to the point its painful to watch. This will cost us at least 3 games.

On the positive, good win, good effort for about 20 minutes (great effort by Howell and Leslie all game however), Scott Wood actually got some rebounds, Leslie is by far our best and most atheltic player. If he plays like this consistently, he'll be a 1st team AA and if Howell keeps up the effort, he could be close by.

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 8:28 AM. Reason : .]

12/5/2012 8:26:51 AM

Quote :

"Did he have a better game? Yes. Is jt good enough for us to be a good team in ACC play? Fuck no"

Depends. UConn is not great but with their guard play (Boatright had an uncharacteristically awful game) they probably be top five in this years ACC despite their showing against Wake. Remember they already beat Michigan State.

Playing them in MSG and winning is a decent to good win especially considering it was a big OOC game they were gunning for with no chance at postseason.

12/5/2012 8:33:14 AM

I missed the game, and I like to read the reaction on TWW before checking the score. So, how much did we lose by?

12/5/2012 8:37:08 AM

fear not hey now, we victored

12/5/2012 8:55:29 AM

Brown can't play defense. At this point in his career, it might be too late to expect him to develop that. He moves his feet about as well as wood. We just have to give purvis the tough cover and live with freshman mistakes.

12/5/2012 9:23:51 AM

Brown played great defense in the last few minutes.

12/5/2012 9:37:30 AM

You don't lead the ACC in steals by moving about as well as Wood.

Brown has a short wingspan for a guy 6'4", and he's definitely not as quick as the tiny guards like Burke and Napier that he's matched up against. That said, he isn't *that bad* on D. In the 2nd half, he was locked in and made a couple big defensive plays.

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 9:42 AM. Reason : 2]

12/5/2012 9:41:03 AM

This is what, our third game in a row where we didn't start playing great defense until the last 10 minutes of the game? At some point, you got to put that on scouting, coaching and preparation. It shouldn't take 30 minutes to figure out an effective defensive scheme for each team we play.

12/5/2012 9:45:28 AM

Individual d isn't really the issue, it's team d. Dealing with picks, switching, helping, etc.

12/5/2012 9:45:42 AM

I think that simply relinquishing the idea of playing our atrocious 2-3 zone would be a good start

12/5/2012 10:22:42 AM

We beat the #6 team in RPI on a neutral court, this was a big win.

Like simonn said, a win away from home is win no matter what.

Just like last year when the usual suspects were whining about the W at St Bonnie and they turned out to be a NCAA team.

12/5/2012 10:29:32 AM

Boozie can you make a post without trying to pick a fight

12/5/2012 10:30:45 AM

we need that in our game for when we get into foul trouble

they need to make it a match up zone or extended and work on ball pressure in general

and if another guy runs under a screen and leaves a wide open three to anybody but a 7 foot center i'm going to lose it.

example up 6 runs under a screen uconn hits a wide open 3.

12/5/2012 10:31:05 AM

^^

[Edited on December 5, 2012 at 10:33 AM. Reason : The zone isn't working, but at least Gott's trying something different]

12/5/2012 10:31:48 AM

During ACC play (read: ACC refs), we don't have the bodies to play tight man D all game. Foul-prone frontcourt plus shallow bench means that we'll have to play zone for long stretches.

Last season the zone looked good at the end of the year. If we can get back to that level, we'll be alright.

12/5/2012 10:32:17 AM