well jesus walks. kanye west told me.

3/22/2006 12:27:13 AM

What positive experiences do you have that I cannot have?

3/22/2006 12:30:21 AM

i have doubted gods existence, its an experience most good christians have

but you can't feel his love and forgiveness and the joy that comes with it. you cant ever know what it feels like to entrust him with your problems and be worry free. you cant ever know his salvation.

3/22/2006 12:38:18 AM

Some of us went down that route and felt all of those things you talked about.

It's really too bad they're just wishful thinking. Meditating has powerful effects, even if the subject of your focus is a lie.

3/22/2006 12:40:59 AM

doubted his existance is not the same as knowing he doesn't exist

and don't feed me that malarky

I was raised in an extemely conservative christian sect. I know all about these experiences you feel.

as I have already said

give me one positive experience you can have that I cannot have.

a real experience. Not something made up, like the belief in god.

3/22/2006 12:41:16 AM

“how do you know if God does or does not exsist?”

“We don't and can't. This is what makes it a meaningless question.”

The presumption might be that the burden of proof lies on the ones who want you to believe in the supernatural. But this is moot since we have both supernatural revelation and countless stories of natural interactions with the world on behalf of the gods such as Prometheus, benefactor of man, bringing us fire, or Zeus causing a great flood and wiping out man… all save 2 of the most holy who then repopulated the earth thousands of years before christ came onto the scene.

3/22/2006 12:52:19 AM

"went down that route"
"grew up in a church"

yeah sorry, you didnt have real experiences

and at the very best, you are saying there are no more experiences and not that it limits your experiences

3/22/2006 12:54:58 AM

Quote :

" give me one positive experience you can have that I cannot have. a real experience. Not something made up, like the belief in go"

i gave you real experiences
the experience is the very real feeling. even if its based on a false belief its something you cant have.

3/22/2006 12:56:06 AM

I've had them. I know exactly what you are talking about.

now please

give me a positive experience I cannot have as an atheist.

3/22/2006 12:57:51 AM

Quote :

"yeah sorry, you didnt have real experiences"

I would say you have a mild case of autism, but that would be insulting to an autistic friend of mine who is wildly more intelligent than you.

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 12:59 AM. Reason : .]

3/22/2006 12:58:58 AM

you cant have those experiences as an athiest
if you had them, you werent an athiest when you did
and since you are now an athiest i doubt you had the same experiences i am describing

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 12:59 AM. Reason : ^ah yes, insults when weak minded people cant debate]

3/22/2006 12:59:06 AM

I had those faith confirming experiences, where I believe Jesus was real and god answered my prayers.

3/22/2006 12:59:54 AM

and now you dont beleive that
and cant have those experiences

3/22/2006 1:01:14 AM

Are you going to form a real discussion or argument, or play this cutesy bullshit with us?
I choose not to have those experiences because they're false hope. I'd no sooner believe in any solution to "does God exist" than I'd start believing the sky is pink.

3/22/2006 1:01:26 AM

how is an overwhelming sense of joy false hope?
if my beliefs are wrong im not really losing out at all, but wrong or right i am gaining a life of joy

3/22/2006 1:02:54 AM

Because it is not joy. Delusion is not joy.

3/22/2006 1:04:07 AM

Looks like Helios is about at the end of his chariot ride for the day & Selene is going to take over.


Her chariot isn't as cool though.

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 1:10 AM. Reason : .]

3/22/2006 1:05:39 AM

even delusion can be joy
even if i am wrong, and its all just delusion, its ok with me because the joy is still there

3/22/2006 1:06:17 AM

Ah the famous argument from theists when all other arguments are shot down: wouldn't you rather believe in lies and lead a life of irrational exuberance?

No, I'd rather live life with the apparent truth in front of me. I'd rather man up and expand my life as much as I can -- I'd rather gain as much strength as I can, and live without the cage of guilt the religious craft.

Besides -- I don't know how you get off called me weak-minded. Your argument for the past 15 minutes or so has ridden on the fact that you held out on a miscommunication, allowing us to argue about two different things so that you could reveal your point in a pathetic attempt to appear smart. You're in the same intellectual bracket as Wolfpack2k.

3/22/2006 1:06:24 AM

Quote :

"even if i am wrong, and its all just delusion, its ok with me because the joy is still there "

The drug abuser's mentality -- is it any surprise this guy is a pill head

3/22/2006 1:06:57 AM

im not accepting a life of irrational exhuberance, i was just using his point that it was delusion to show that it is still a joyous experience

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 1:08 AM. Reason : haha, yeah right me a pill head]

3/22/2006 1:07:49 AM

you call it joy. I cannot call it joy. Furthermore, I am much happier and filled with joy now that I no longer believe in god.

3/22/2006 1:08:24 AM

good for you, so at the very worst the experiences are the same

3/22/2006 1:09:13 AM

To accept a delusional train of thought on the grounds that joy is justification in itself is perverse.

3/22/2006 1:10:03 AM

no they are not.

3/22/2006 1:10:47 AM

^^fine, but i am still not limited in my experiences

tell me one experience you can have that i can not

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 1:11 AM. Reason : .]

3/22/2006 1:11:00 AM

the knowledge that god does not exist.

3/22/2006 1:11:59 AM

thats not really an experience
and i can have that

3/22/2006 1:12:39 AM

You can technically have whatever experiences you want

However, you face the judgement of your god in your own mind. You'll have to repent and cage yourself with fear and guilt over what you've done.

3/22/2006 1:12:45 AM

Quote :

"thats not really an experience and i can have that"

ok, I'll reword it

the feeling knowing that god does not exist.

and as a believing christian, you cannot have it.

3/22/2006 1:13:43 AM

i dont know what religion you think i am, but i dont have to cage myself

and you can not have the feeling knowing that god does exist

as an athiest you cannot have it

3/22/2006 1:14:31 AM

that is where you are wrong my friend

i was a christian

now I'm not


and what religion are you then? The kind that teaches, eat, drinnk, be merry, for tomorrow we die? What type of religion is that? What is the point of having a god then?

3/22/2006 1:16:23 AM

Look

There are millions of bullshit personal religions where people clip out the parts they want to believe

Our argument here is one against reputable religions, not your specific personal adaptation (which is probably as half baked and stupid as the rest of your opinions)

I guess in your bizarro religion you can have a god that you interface with who lets you take all the glory, fuck all the bitches, abort your babies, and do generally whatever without fear or reprisal. Go for it.

3/22/2006 1:16:54 AM

that is where you are wrong my friend

i was an athiest

and now i am not


do you see how this just goes in circles?

3/22/2006 1:17:34 AM

nope you were never an athiest.

3/22/2006 1:18:16 AM

you have a really shitty understanding of christianity if you think you have to cage yourself. if there are things as a christian that i dont want to do its not because my experiences are limited, its because i dont want to do them.

3/22/2006 1:18:51 AM

Whatever dude

Swallow what's left in your most recently opened pill bottle and hit the sack

I've wasted enough time arguing with you -- your general lack of comprehension and critical thinking skills is astonishing. I wish there would be an easy, legal way to get you out of my alma mater and out of my fucking species.

3/22/2006 1:19:07 AM

nope you were never a christian

3/22/2006 1:19:13 AM

the internet said I should be a materialistic Buddhist

3/22/2006 1:20:29 AM

does your god allow unadulterated anal sex with multiple women at the same time?

obviously your god allows for drug abuse.

3/22/2006 1:20:49 AM

i could do that if i wanted

3/22/2006 1:21:36 AM

would you have to repent for it?

is it against the teachings of the bible?

[Edited on March 22, 2006 at 1:22 AM. Reason : .]

3/22/2006 1:21:53 AM

Misunderstanding previous religious experiences to be nonreligious I don't think would mean that he was never a Christian; simply that he isn't one any more. I think falls from grace would be commonly understood between Lucifer & his helpers and Adam & Eve.

3/22/2006 1:22:54 AM

i would have to ask for forgiveness, yes
thats all i would have to do, and be sincere in my heart

nothing limiting about that, especially since i dont want to do that

3/22/2006 1:22:58 AM

My god, who doesn't exist doesn't ask for forgiveness. Therefore I'm not limited. you are.

3/22/2006 1:23:53 AM

except i am not limited

3/22/2006 1:24:49 AM

Quote :

" From : JonHGuth To : McDanger Received : Wednesday March 22, 2006 at 1:20 AM Subject : internet SERIOUS BUSINESS haha OMG HE SAID HE TOOK PILLS ON THE INTERNET, IT MUST BE TRUE ahahahaha tool"

3/22/2006 1:26:03 AM

Does your church service go something like this?


Minister: Yo dude, we like totally smoke this bong last night and jesus came. and was like dude, i've got the munchies man.

interlude: Some Grateful dead song

sacrament: includes vicodine as the body of christ, and yage as the blood of christ

closing hym: some phish song

3/22/2006 1:26:28 AM

Quote :

" InboxDeletedSent » oh fuck From : McDanger To : Supplanter Received : Wednesday March 22, 2006 at 1:07 AM Subject : oh fuck i believe in zeus now "

3/22/2006 1:27:10 AM

mcdanger you realize i am trolling you right now cause you decided to get all pissy instead of debate

and you are playing into it perfectly

right?

3/22/2006 1:27:55 AM