Haven't heard the postgame. Did he criticize our fan turnout for away games yet?

10/15/2016 4:23:49 PM

10/15/2016 5:22:43 PM

He's regularly been said to make those kicks all day every day when there is no pressure and they don't count.

I think he's given Bambard enough tries, and he has a better kicker coming in next year.

The big takeaway from this game is that we went toe to toe with #3 Clemson.

10/15/2016 5:47:28 PM

i can't put this on Doeren, man. this is 100% unequivocally on the kicker.

10/15/2016 5:48:52 PM

Quote :

"he has a better kicker coming in next year"

Nope Dunn is a 2018

10/15/2016 5:52:32 PM

^^^ I mean... He hit the one right before the timeout easily.


Bambard is done. There's no way he'll regain his confidence after this. I had hope for him this season since his stats were up, but this game is going to wreck any chances of him recovering. GG to Doeren for trying to encourage the kid, but he's not going to turn a corner after having his confidence shook like that.

Sucks for Doeren, because this game could have really built some momentum for him and gotten some of his haters off his back.

[Edited on October 15, 2016 at 5:57 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2016 5:55:27 PM

as far as confidence goes i really thought him hitting that 48 yarder vs Wake was gonna be a turning point. and obviously drilling the game winner today would've been a great thing for confidence. instead i can totally see him never really gaining any confidence after this.

10/15/2016 5:57:18 PM

Quote :

"i can't put this on Doeren, man. this is 100% unequivocally on the kicker."

he chose to not give his kicker an easier kick

10/15/2016 6:06:43 PM

Nahhhhh.... a 30 yard kick dead center in the hashes should be good enough.

The play-action, although risky, was probably an attempt to get the TD so as to not rely on the kicker, especially if Clemson is expecting the run.

10/15/2016 6:08:47 PM

maybe for a competent kicker it would be

go for the win and don't put pressure on the kid who is struggling

if you do, make it as easy as possible for him

10/15/2016 6:12:16 PM

Quote :

"he chose to not give his kicker an easier kick "

33 Yards is firmly in "chip shot" range.

10/15/2016 6:12:55 PM

Quote :

"go for the win and don't put pressure on the kid who is struggling"

And that was EXACTLY what the play action was attempting to do. Clemson played that play well, give them credit. If they had overcommitted on the run, we would have had an open look in the endzone and Bambard is spared the pressure. Even if it doesn't work, you can still give your kicker a decent shot for the win. He just didn't convert. The only downside to that play is a pick-six. Even a fumble or INT gets you into overtime, as they likely can't get a play off after a turnover.

[Edited on October 15, 2016 at 6:18 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2016 6:13:24 PM

Quote :

"Nahhhhh.... a 30 yard kick dead center in the hashes should be good enough. The play-action, although risky, was probably an attempt to get the TD so as to not rely on the kicker, especially if Clemson is expecting the run."

"good enough" is determined by what you can get. he's made a 48 yarder, so was the 38 yard line "good enough"? For a kicker, closer is ALWAYS better.

As for the pass play, is that was the right call why not try again on 2nd down?

In general, why leave plays on the field. You could say running another play or two is risky, but Matt Dayes running is far less risky than Bambard kicking, IMO. Not to mention that the snap/hold connection and blocking havent been great on FG tries either.

At best, it was a very schizo last 40 seconds.

10/15/2016 6:16:12 PM

We played the last drive to have two shots to win with no time left on the clock. We didn't convert either chance.


I can't believe I'm defending Doeren, but I have ZERO beef with how we handled that drive.


We choked. That's not management. That's execution, full stop.

[Edited on October 15, 2016 at 6:22 PM. Reason : ]

10/15/2016 6:21:18 PM

i thought it was great until the last 40 seconds.


i also thought the overall game plan was great and the playcalling was mostly phenomenal on both sides of the ball. Did a great job neutralizing their D-line by utilizing the areas outside the hashes and moving the pocket.

Not sure how much of that is DD vs coordinators, but i'll give him the credit.

Quote :

"That's not management. That's execution, "

managements job is to give the workers the best possible chance to excecute. in this case, that means trying to get closer.

[Edited on October 15, 2016 at 6:25 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2016 6:24:23 PM

you should never forfeit plays and settle for a FG, especially with a shaky kicker

10/15/2016 6:28:35 PM

Quote :

"he chose to not give his kicker an easier kick"

a chip shot is a chip shot. kicker HAS to make it from 30 and the coaches have to have that confidence. i mean, if you don't have the confidence in that then you may as well just never kick a FG the rest of the year and go for it.

Quote :

"The play-action, although risky, was probably an attempt to get the TD so as to not rely on the kicker, especially if Clemson is expecting the run. "

which is basically exactly what DD said in postgame. one chance to the endzone...it wasn't there. finley made the right decision to go down and in the middle of the field. if you don't think the kicker can make it from 30 then you probably don't think he can make it from 25 either. it boils down to Bambard missing kicks. which fucking sucks to put it on a college sophomore like that...but that's what it is.

DD isn't Saban...you can nitpick play calls if you want and you can find some questionable stuff, that's legitimate. but the reality is we were in a position with 2 seconds left to beat the national runner up, #3 team, heisman candidate QB on the road and we fucked up the FG. nit pick play calls all you want, but DD put us in a nearly perfect situation and we shut the dang bed.

10/15/2016 6:31:42 PM

You guys are stretching.

The game was TIED.

We were trying to get the win and prevent Clemson from answering. We had two solid chances and blew them both.

10/15/2016 6:31:52 PM

^yeah i agree. i'm not trying to pump up DD like he's the savior we need or anything. there are plenty of things from past games we can question and he does have a track record of question game management in these situations. this isn't a great example of that, though. this was the kicker fucking up a chip shot.

we can talk about the penalties and how DD maybe could've done a better job preparing the guys to avoid the dumbass false starts, but on the whole I don't think you can make this game an indictment on DD.

10/15/2016 6:34:55 PM

^^^
1) If DD was that confident in Bambard from 30, why run the risky pass play at all??
2) that pass play was a good finley evasion away from being an 8 yard loss instead of just 3
3) if the pass play was worth the risk on first down, why not on 2nd down?
4) i'm not sure your definition of "chip shot" but a 33 yarder isnt a gimme at any level.
5) its fine to be confident in your kicker, i'm asking to not be overly confident. 10 out of 10 kickers will prefer to be as close as they can get. its hubris to leave yards on the field. Coaches do this all the time, they get into the kickers "range" and then go super conservative b/c they know if the kicker misses people will blame the kicker but if something goes wrong trying for more yards, people blame the coach.


^an i dont think this is an "indictment" just more evidence that DD is bad at conservative/aggressive decsision making

[Edited on October 15, 2016 at 6:45 PM. Reason : a]

10/15/2016 6:44:13 PM

Quote :

"4) i'm not sure your definition of "chip shot" but a 33 yarder isnt a gimme at any level. "

10/15/2016 6:45:24 PM

fuck this one is probably going to hurt more than any of them and we've had some tough ones but none like this. Just like the ECU game, we just make one kick count and we win but we find a way to screwup 3.

regardless, this is probably the best football team we've had in my lifetime. We're a kicker away from being in the national title race.

Fuck clemson too. They didn't deserve to win. The refs tried to sway the outcome with uneven penalties. The facemask on Samuels was as costly as any of Bambard's mistakes. They have no shot against us in the future without watson. He's too clutch and his groundball throws are impossible to defend.

10/15/2016 7:02:43 PM

We're basically like if Bama didn't have a kicker

10/15/2016 7:19:18 PM

God Damn when will this dude turn our program around

10/15/2016 7:29:05 PM

he just did. did you watch the game today?

10/15/2016 7:30:23 PM

He did a complete 360 today

10/15/2016 7:50:55 PM

Except he made exceptionally stupid play calls, like calling a passing play when your RB has been gaining 5 yards per play like clockwork the whole drive... That's an inexcusable call. Then, refusing to use that same running back after the sack when you have two time outs to work with with a kicker who has proven that he can't kick for shit? Fire his ass right now.

10/15/2016 11:21:37 PM

in 3 years this man has taken us from cellar dwellers to being a kick away from being on top

10/16/2016 1:38:37 AM

We lost to a 2-4 AAC team

10/16/2016 1:42:12 AM

Ah, armchair coaches looking at only one play. Gotta love it.

If you think coaching was anything but less than amazing against Clemson, then you're a dumbass.

10/16/2016 6:45:16 AM

Quote :

"Except he made exceptionally stupid play calls, like calling a passing play when your RB has been gaining 5 yards per play like clockwork the whole drive... That's an inexcusable call. Then, refusing to use that same running back after the sack when you have two time outs to work with with a kicker who has proven that he can't kick for shit? Fire his ass right now."

I think you are looking for the Drinkwitz thread.

10/16/2016 7:15:51 AM

Run run run run run run...

You suck in the defense you leave them susceptible to the endzone strike. Drinkwitz made a sound decision that happened not to work out.

Kickers should be as to make 33 yard fuckin field goals.

10/16/2016 9:27:42 AM

^^drink is gonna run that play past coach in that situation, and the decision to quit at that point is 100% doeren

^WTF NOT ONE FAN WAS CONFIDENT BAMBARD WOULD MAKE THAT. I feel like I'm taking crazy pills. Bambard is clearly not a very good college kicker.

10/16/2016 11:56:27 AM

he hadnt missed on like this before

10/16/2016 12:00:09 PM

Takeaways:

Coordinators coached that game really well

Doeren is a better coach than I have given him credit for, and I don't think we should fire him now. However, two things are his responsibility in this loss: 1) failing to get a decent kicker in his 4 years to replace Sade, 2) the colossal screw-up with having 2 time-outs with 40+ seconds on the clock at the 14 yard line (the kick was a good option, but he could have easily tried two run plays to get a touchdown).

We should be undefeated. Both our loses were on the kicker.

Kicking is still going to kill us next year, because our top kicking recruit is coming in 2018.

We killed the turnover battle and didn't get many points out of it.

10/16/2016 3:20:22 PM

When our team fumbles: The coach wasn't out there fumbling the ball, it was the players
When the opposition team fumbles: *crickets*


This was a beatdown(a possible repeat of the 41-0) without all the Clem turnovers. Jus saying. This game was gift wrapped and our coaches screwed it up. Prgram is in good shape, but the in game management is killing us yo

[Edited on October 16, 2016 at 3:26 PM. Reason : ]

10/16/2016 3:25:47 PM

The "Doeren should Have gotten a replacement kicker" is dumb IMO. For one, he did. And that kicker was 0/2 this year. Bambard won the job. And second, y'all really think Bambard is just trash in practice? Ultimately the coach is always responsible for what the players do or don't do. But Bambard was a well thought of recruit. And he's obviously got problems with the mental side of things. He drilled a 48 yarder vs Wake. Kid has some skill. Just no confidence.

Quote :

"This was a beatdown(a possible repeat of the 41-0) without all the Clem turnovers. "

We get no credit for forcing turnovers, making big stops, and playing fairly well on defense vs a high powered offense?
This was not a beat down, and in fact you could argue we outplayed them. Penalties and missed kicks (and a few missed calls) ultimately were our downfall.

[s

[Edited on October 16, 2016 at 4:17 PM. Reason : S]

10/16/2016 4:14:56 PM

Quote :

"Biggest moral victory of his career?"

Clemson dropped one spot in the polls. Give this man a raise!

10/17/2016 11:17:40 AM

Quote :

"This was not a beat down, and in fact you could argue we outplayed them. Penalties and missed kicks (and a few missed calls) ultimately were our downfall. "

We 100% outplayed Clemson in this game.

10/17/2016 11:41:06 AM

Quote :

"But Bambard was a well thought of recruit."

not really. he was just a run of the mill recruit. i mean we beat out air force for his services, so i guess that's a win.

goddammit. i never really paid attention to this, but he was a damn QB in high school. no wonder he's shitty. he didn't start practicing full time as a kicker until he got to state.

10/17/2016 12:07:18 PM

Yeah but think of his potential for running fake FGs. My guess is that will help us win more games in the long run than his missed kicks will cost us.

10/17/2016 12:17:36 PM

has any of doeren's gimmick plays worked yet?

10/17/2016 12:27:12 PM

That back screen to forward pass worked Saturday

10/17/2016 12:36:34 PM

^^^^well then i stand corrected. i really thought he was well thought of, not necessarily highly ranked since rankings for kickers are hardly too reliable.

^^we ran a fake punt to JaySam vs Cuse a couple years ago that worked, but mostly it seems like nope

[Edited on October 17, 2016 at 12:38 PM. Reason : f]

10/17/2016 12:38:00 PM

We are on the right track.

10/17/2016 12:53:14 PM

Gavin Locklear throwing a pass has worked twice this year. He's our best QB.

10/17/2016 1:00:54 PM

According to this site, he was the 9th rated kicker in the 2014 class

http://kohlskicking.com/profile/kyle-bambard/2943/

I was just listening to David Glenn and heard there was a bunch of people on twitter telling him to kill himself. terrible people.

10/17/2016 1:31:28 PM

im still wtf about the flea flicker to start the game in a hurricane. that is literally thebworst possible call in that situation.

10/17/2016 3:38:01 PM

I mean I enjoyed the game dont get me wrong but let's not act like we went toe to toe with Clemson they did everything they could to lose that game we just didn't take advantage.

10/17/2016 3:45:50 PM

At the same time their offense remembered us when they woke up the next morning. We went toe to toe with them physically forcing some of those errors.

10/17/2016 3:59:49 PM