I was talking about this w/ Gamecat the other day, but the LadyWolff / Hankypank hijinx prompted me to ask it here (that and I'm tired of working on this @#$%ing CSC116 due at 11:45pm tonight ):


Do you really take this political shit seriously? To the point where it runs your life?


Consider some perfectly rational people: Gamecat, Kay_Yow and MathFreak routinely vie with pryderi and Kris for Resident TWW Communist (MathFreak obviously having the edge since he was actually born in Soviet Russia, but I digress).

Yet I've been able to have several rational and friendly conversations with the 3 of them, in person and on teh intarw3b. I even pushed some political business Gamecat's way when the opportunity presented itself, and once bought him a pizza b/c I respect his bleeding heart and didn't want him to compromise his principles by genuflecting to Teh Evil Capitalist Bourgeois.


On the other hand, I've already met at least one kid this semester who was cool w/ me until he found out I was "one of them"...and now can't even hold a conversation on football / women / computers / etc before turning it into a "OMF KARL ROVE = TEH DEB1L!!1" debate. And then of course we've got the TWWers who hyperventilate when someone wastes some free time fucking around w/ teh L3ft.


I'll be the first to admit I'm a political junkie, I pay attention to the news and I care what's going on...but not that much. Seriously, get a grip people. See a therapist. Go bwn someone if you have to. There's more to life than politics...


[Edited on October 9, 2005 at 2:36 AM. Reason : (like, sadly, CSC116 programs...back to work )]

10/9/2005 2:33:11 AM

You're one of them?




OMG

10/9/2005 2:36:42 AM

(btw to Gamecat / Kay_Yow / MathFreak: I'm just using y'all for illustrative purposes, you know I've got nothing but love for you )

10/9/2005 2:38:20 AM

Not really. I argue it here, but I am far to pragmatic to allow my views to effect my daily life. Hell I was going out with and had regular intercourse with a preacher's daughter who was almost a 700 clubish republican. I wouldnt bring up my political views if my life depended on it.

10/9/2005 3:18:08 AM

Maybe I just like a good fight, but I find myself bringing up politics a good bit. Especially to rattle the cages of the Republicans around me (mom, boss, coworker, future mother-in-law).

I honestly don't think I'd care as much if I wasn't so avidly against the King George the W and our guy was in the White House.

10/9/2005 3:27:51 AM

Gamecat is a communist?

I care about politics as much as the person i'm talking with. Some of my friends claim to be Republicans, but they don't care about politics in the least (they don't follow politics, they don't vote, or look at things from a political perspective), so it doesn't really bother me.

If however I met someone in real life who really got worked up about politics, as long as they weren't completely dumb, we'd have some interesting conversations, or not speak to each other. Generally, unless I suspect someone can hold their own, I stay away from politics IRL.

10/9/2005 3:38:26 AM

I'll agree with that, I do get in political discussions if I feel comfortable in that situation doing so, and if some one kind of eggs me on for a political debate, I will occasionally jump in and rip them to shreds (generally an easy task compared to most of the people I debate with here). But I rarely state my political views, the closest I really get to that is wearing my fidel or hammer+sickle shirts.

10/9/2005 3:54:49 AM

I have never seen a shred of evidence that MathFreak is capable of having a friendly conversation, and only a few shreds that he can have a rational one.

As it is, I don't normally bring politics up first. Often the pattern is sex getting brought up, someone asking me about my experience with it or pointing out my silence about it, my pointing out that I don't have sex, everyone accusing me of being a member of the Religious Right/Baptist Taliban, and then me throwing down in some sort of religious/moral/political/soap box-esque argument.

So yeah, titty talk is usually what drags me into the fray, unless someone (usually a conservative, sadly) says something so stupid that I feel morally obligated to correct them (ex, "If you don't like it, you can leave," or "They're taking our jobs")

[Edited on October 9, 2005 at 5:42 AM. Reason : Gamecat was cool in person, if a little worked up]

10/9/2005 5:41:53 AM

I think it's more like a sporting event, and a lot of people are like Carolina fans on here. Seriously.

Well, a sporting event mixed with reality TV. Not to mention people seem to like to make deep psychological interpretations on a person's character based on stupid stuff like the "YEEEAAHHHH".

10/9/2005 10:18:31 AM

Quote :

"Consider some perfectly rational people: Gamecat, Kay_Yow and MathFreak routinely vie with pryderi and Kris for Resident TWW Communist (MathFreak obviously having the edge since he was actually born in Soviet Russia, but I digress)."

Link?

10/9/2005 10:43:07 AM

its something i think about alot, but i really dont care what others on here think about my opinions, doesnt affect me either way.

tho if ggmon really is who i think he is, then i really dont have much respect for him as a real person (and not just some internet loser) anyway. based on his sports talk posts and his posts in here, i think its this asshole i had a class with last year that was really disrespectful to the professor's fairly even handed arguments b/c they werent in line with whatever karl rove was putting forth that week.

10/9/2005 5:19:13 PM

namedropper

10/9/2005 5:30:19 PM

As much as I like to say that I avoid/dislike politics, I find myself reading up on it on a daily basis. I do like to read some of the posts here in the soap box concerning politics, although I rarely join in, because most of the time, I know I'd be over my head. I do find people that are way too political (regardless of political affiliation) extremely boring. A lot of them take it way too seriously, like they think everyone has some sort of political motive behind the way they do things.

If I'm in a situation with a group of people where the conversation turns political, I either remain silent and keep my opinions to myself, excuse myself and return later (i.e., when all the shouting dies down), or I'll venture to where the life of the party is at.

10/9/2005 5:37:57 PM

I just pull out a firearm and yell "So, how's the job working out!?!?" That usually sufficiently ends any political arguments.

10/9/2005 5:42:06 PM

Some of my best friends are conservative!

It has more to do with severety than orientation. I have no problem chilling with people with whacko beliefs, so long as I don't have to hear about it everytime I talk to them.

10/9/2005 6:06:11 PM

In order to preserve the normal day to day, I find myself telling the more crazy liberals that I'm not pretentious enough to think I know everything about everyone and then ask them how drunk they got last night.

10/9/2005 8:19:30 PM

Quote :

"Do you really take this political shit seriously? To the point where it runs your life?"

No

What pisses me off is blind belief, support, and following of a party or person. "Just because I'm a conservative and I like GWB means I have to support everything he does." I know people like this, that is irritating.

I'm somewhere between a moderate-libertarian-liberal. I would have much more respect for an ultra-conservative who supports Bush but questions his actions than an ultra-liberal (or anyone for that matter) who supports every left wing group and politician out there without questioning what they really stand for.

At the same time, I couldn't give a shit less what most of you believe and just like to argue on here to either a) play devil's advocate and/or b) kill time at work.

10/9/2005 8:49:13 PM

Really now, TGD, me...communist? You must've missed some of the other, bigger details in our conversation.

Quote :

"Do you really take this political shit seriously?"

It'd be foolish of me to answer yes or no.

Sometimes, when it deserves to be taken seriously (as determined by my passions), I do so. But that's rare these days.

Most of the time, I don't take political news or debate seriously because of how absurd it is.

Political principle is another matter.

Quote :

"To the point where it runs your life?"

I have to admit that I have gone this far before. What can I say? Attempting to live as a man of principle in this world involves "running your life" according to that principle.

Never in the sense that I avoid people whose political tastes conflict with my own, though.

10/9/2005 9:13:52 PM

Quote :

"MathFreak: Link?"

Quote :

"Gamecat: Really now, TGD, me...communist?"

Come on guys, you know me better than this. You know that I know that you both secretly worship George W Bush and have secret shrines to Karl Rove in your bedroom closets...

Quote :

"TGD: I'm just using y'all for illustrative purposes"

10/9/2005 9:25:41 PM

politics? its all bullshit. However, what the politicians claim to care about isn't. I'll happily discuss what the politicians claim to care about any day, but usually I don't bring it up with people I don't know, at least not outside of the soap box...

10/9/2005 9:31:14 PM

I just speak what I believe in. If it offends anyone, so be it. I think if you take a good look at the maps from the last election, a good portion of the country at least has something in common with me. now if the government would just WAKE UP and attack some of these problems (stricter security at all borders, right to life, eliminate needless programs the benefit "minority interest") then we will really start to get somewhere.

10/9/2005 11:16:31 PM

Quote :

"I think if you take a good look at the maps from the last election, a good portion of the country at least has something in common with me."

^ when did we have an election on being batshit crazy?

10/10/2005 10:26:26 AM

Unfortunately, several of us have lives to attend too. TWW should not be the only political discourse you have in your life, besides yelling at NPR while driving in the car. I, by principle, try to leave politics, religion, and business out of everyday conversation. You should too.

10/10/2005 10:40:40 AM

NPR is a good source for news

someone please talk about its "liberal bias"
please

10/10/2005 2:39:08 PM

Quote :

"I think if you take a good look at the maps from the last election, a good portion of the country at least has something in common with me."

If by "good portion" you mean 51% of the population, then by all means proceed.

However, you probably don't mean that, since on the map the color red shows up more than blue.

Yes, all those tons of people out west in that really large red area cast a lot more votes than those tiny blue dots that make up, say, Long Island.

OH WAIT, NO ONE LIVES IN MOST OF THOSE RED COUNTIES.

Weird how you claim to have some kind of huge, like-minded following in this country when Bush won by a mere 2.5% of the popular vote, the smallest margin of victory for a sitting president in U.S. history.

10/10/2005 3:15:05 PM

This crap again? Fuck!
More people voted for Bush in the last election than have voted for any other President in election history.

We have a higher population now, and more voted than usual, and Bushy won a majority of a larger share of a larger population. So what is your point? That a slim majority of American voters didn't vote for the guy?

No matter how much of a disaster it was, lets not deny the facts.

[Edited on October 10, 2005 at 3:19 PM. Reason : .]

10/10/2005 3:18:56 PM

some of the trolls suck pretty bad

if I ever met MacGyver I'd probably punch him in the throat

10/10/2005 3:26:59 PM

hahah I'm not denying any facts. I can see you are tempted to peg me as the typical whining crybaby liberal. Feel free to do so, I'll just laugh some more...


But let's not get crazy here

It's a stretch to say that, just based on looking at a map (which Tha Big Girl said to do), Bush has big support. He received less than 51% of the vote, 2.5% more than Kerry, yet 83% of the land area of the US. What does that tell you about most of the US? It's not very populated. Therefore, a map of poll results by county is far from an accurate portrayal of American support for Bush.

And I won't even get into current approval ratings...

[Edited on October 10, 2005 at 5:54 PM. Reason : 39% approval / 58% disapproval last week, if you care]

10/10/2005 5:53:47 PM

It depends. I often care more about whether or not Thanos could beat Doom 6/10 or 7/10 without prep.

Every once in a while I get worked up about politics, though.

10/10/2005 8:39:25 PM

I'm not that big I think (and hope) into politics. I try to be as apolitical as I can being part of ROTC. I admit I don't know that much - I try to stick by the facts I know. I'm a conservative and a Republican, but I'm not that proud of my party right now, or with any of the leadership today. Frankly, I'd feel more at home as a Democrat of the New Deal era. Some of these political discussions are interesting, but some of you need to grow some balls and not follow other's opinions to a T (myself included if I do that).

10/10/2005 9:27:45 PM

Quote :

"TGD: Do you really take this political shit seriously? To the point where it runs your life?"

I suppose it depends on what you mean by [taking] this political shit seriously or it runs your life.

If, by the former, you mean to ask if I take conversations on TWW (or any Internet Message Board, for that matter) about politics seriously, then the answer's invariably no....primarily because there are far too many antagonists for the sake of being antagonists, but also because when you have the Internet at your disposal to fill arguments with vacuous statistics and "facts," there's no real ability to determine how much another person really knows.

But, if you mean to ask if I take political shit seriously outside of the confines of the Internet, then TGD, you know that the answer to that is yes. I admit to taking it too seriously in fact. Ultimately, it's all based on the notion that I truly believe that political decisions are good cues to the type of person you are and what you believe in...

As to the it runs your life thing...if you mean to ask if I can hold a conversation without bringing up politics, then the answer's yes...but, it's definitely a big part of my life that encompasses more than just reading a newspaper. Politics runs my life to the extent that I devoted a considerable amount of time, money and energy into learning about it and practicing it...and hopefully will continue to do so.

10/11/2005 10:34:33 AM

politics r dumb

10/11/2005 11:26:18 AM

Quote :

"Kay_Yow: As to the it runs your life thing...if you mean to ask if I can hold a conversation without bringing up politics, then the answer's yes"

That too, but it's more of a "Are you capable of being friends with a Republican?" thing. Could you bwn a Republican? Marry a Republican? etc

I guess I was just always raised on that whole Jeffersonian "blood thicker than water" ideal, just with the blood getting replaced by "people" and "politics" substituting for water. Some of my closest friends are raging fringe lefties...

10/11/2005 1:06:21 PM

Quote :

"TGD: That too, but it's more of a "Are you capable of being friends with a Republican?" thing. Could you bwn a Republican? Marry a Republican? etc I guess I was just always raised on that whole Jeffersonian "blood thicker than water" ideal, just with the blood getting replaced by "people" and "politics" substituting for water. Some of my closest friends are raging fringe lefties.."

To answer your questions, simply: Yes. Yes. No.

I have had and hopefully will continue to have friendships with Republicans, though, admittedly, they have been moderates on issues which I'm most passionate about (namely education). One has promised to appeal to my "sense of duty" to recruit me as his COS when he runs for Congress.

Most recently, though, I've found myself living with a Republican of the Jim Demint variety...staunch fiscal and religious conservative, who hates W for being "too liberal," whose dream ticket in '08 includes Rick Santorum and who has an unhealthy infatuation with Condi Rice. While I think we'll do a better vetting of roommates next time, it's been an incredible learning experience for me and we've found common ground on some issues.

That said, though, my political principles are so intrinsically linked that I can't imagine being a long-term relationship with a man who didn't share those convictions.

10/11/2005 1:54:58 PM

I don't bring politics up very much at work. People do bring it to me though, especially one particular bandwagon liberal (by that I mean he never bases anything on his personal beliefs, just the currently accepted talking points).

I hate talking politics because too many people have no particular reason why they believe/support certain things, usually a "Just because" sort of answer. Knowing why you believe in something is important but few take the time to think about it.

I also hate that people can't handle light-hearted tongue-in-cheek banter about politics. If something is funny, ironic, etc. I can laugh at it even if its at the stake of my side fo the fence.

Also, people get so damn defensive if you throw the slightest bit of doubt on their views. People need to lighten up and quit being so set in their ways. Heck, I've been from Atheist to Christian and Fascist to Libertarian... self-questioning makes you learn more about what you believe and probably results in a stronger foundation.

There are several people on here who I tremendously respect and often reference in general conversations. Wish there was a more select forum for discussion because its too damn hard to wade through the bullshit on here to find the decent posts. Its probably the biggest reason I rarely post in here anymore.

10/11/2005 2:57:00 PM

I highly doubt I'd have a successful marriage with about 90% of Republicans I've met.

10/11/2005 3:14:30 PM

Yeah, I don't think it would work between us either.

10/11/2005 3:15:50 PM

Quote :

"I just speak what I believe in. If it offends anyone, so be it. I think if you take a good look at the maps from the last election, a good portion of the country at least has something in common with me."

It doesn't offend anyone, at least not most of us. I think I speak for most of us on here when I say we are embarrassed for you. I could say that I want a Lay's potato chip to be president one day, but then how stupid would I look? However, if this potato chip was a neocon, I'm sure you would actually want to vote for it.

10/12/2005 11:00:50 PM

I enjoy bantering with friends about politics - its like arguing over which football team had the better game or chances at winning the superbowl etc.

10/12/2005 11:39:34 PM

I don't talk about politics, I don't care about politics.

America is the best nation in the world, and will be as long as I live, and so if I can't get any better and I don't have the time to make things dramatically better, I just don't bother caring.

I support our troops and enjoy capitalism, if that counts.

10/13/2005 3:06:27 AM

n/m

[Edited on October 13, 2005 at 9:50 AM. Reason : n/m]

10/13/2005 9:50:01 AM

I can be friends with a republican, easy. I have much more of a problem being friends with a racist/classist/sexist person. Someone like that will usually say something that pisses me off. That said, I have managed to be somewhat friends with people who fit that category, they just knew not to say anything racist/classist/sexist around me. Of course I would have to refrain from explaining to them how their SUV was killing the earth and that they should at least pay for it themselves instead of having their parents buy it. Usually this sort of compromise doesn't work.

10/13/2005 10:18:35 AM

Quote :

"racist/classist/sexist person"

I am a republican, and I approve this sentiment.

Of course, how classist of you to presume to tell others what they should allow their parents to spend their money on. If they want to buy something nice for their child, or for a complete stranger for that matter, it is their business.

10/13/2005 12:45:09 PM

When I say classist, I only mean rich people that are classist. I have no problem with poor people disliking wealthy people.

10/13/2005 2:14:42 PM

Quoth SouthPaW12

Quote :

" America is the best nation in the world, and will be as long as I live"

Heavy burden you bear, mate! Does that mean that when you die your country becomes a bankrupt shell of its former superpower self?

10/13/2005 3:31:44 PM

I try not to

I just don't understand how people can pick one side blindly over another.

it seroiusly underminds the whole idea of THOUGHT

10/13/2005 3:44:34 PM

my real friends are mostly left-leaning with a few exceptions that are right-leaning. i only use the word friend for someone close to me, not acquaintances. my right-winged friends and i don't discuss political or social issues mainly to avoid debates. but when we do, at least one of them knows what he is talking about, which is a pleasant surprise.

most of my acquaintances are republicans or right-leaning because they feel their religion mandates it. i know a lot of christians. they usually do not actually think about politics, but rather spout off whatever their parents or pastors have said before. whenever i bring up politics, they usually have a canned response that is easy to defeat, but mostly they don't try to understand my point of view.

do i let politics keep me from having a good time with my friends? hell no. but they do know my politics because we ARE friends, and can have civil discussions over politics.

10/13/2005 5:27:58 PM