they're not comparable. Stop comparing the lies of Clinton to the lies of Bush.

TIA

11/10/2005 9:43:28 PM

Okay how 'bout these:
Lyndon Johnson to Bush
Lincoln to Bush
Roosevelt to Bush
Nixon to Bush
Mcnamara to Bush
Liddy to Bush
North to Bush
Bush to Bush

You pick it!

11/10/2005 9:50:42 PM

pryderi didnt you make a thread (or maybe just a post) criticizing a republican for making a comment that perjury was just a technicality?

11/10/2005 9:53:14 PM

^^Bush has def cost this country A LOT MORE FUCKING MONEY than any of those other presidents

11/11/2005 2:46:54 AM

^^i doubt he's just referring to perjury

11/11/2005 4:16:34 AM

well what sin of clinton is he referring too?

11/11/2005 12:30:27 PM

Clinton's sins still kept our wallets fat.

11/11/2005 12:52:47 PM

^ My wallet is far fatter today than it was six years ago. Stop blaming bush for your own financial failures.

11/11/2005 1:09:10 PM

mine is too, but mostly b/c i like to save money. its a hobby.

and thanks for speaking for everyone. i dont know a single person i worked w/ in retail that didnt say they did better in the 90s, and thats alot of fucking people.

[Edited on November 11, 2005 at 1:38 PM. Reason : .]

11/11/2005 1:37:27 PM

Quote :

"^ My wallet is far fatter today than it was six years ago. Stop blaming bush for your own financial failures."

Most 17 year olds I know don't have a fat wallet....unless mom and dad filled it.

11/11/2005 2:50:28 PM

Uhh LoneSnark, please to notice the current massive deficit.

Kthnx.

11/11/2005 3:42:36 PM

^ You are really so stupid as to not realize a difference between the gubmnt's wallet and your own?
It has been half a decade! We should all be older and wiser now with more financial resources, not less!

If your friends working in retail are worse off today then I'm sorry, it isn't much of a stretch to be suffering while on average everyone is better off. Examples are common: had the stomach flu on V-J Day, a piece of the Berlin Wall landed on my foot, TV was busted for the moon landing, owned the best damn buggy-whip manufacturer in the world, etc. etc.

It has nothing to do with Bushy and everything to do with the passage of time. Americans today are wealthier and healthier than at any point in human history (productivity is STILL increasing at 4% a year). You personally filling bankruptcy doesn't change the statistics.

[Edited on November 11, 2005 at 4:38 PM. Reason : .,.]

11/11/2005 4:37:01 PM

do you really think most people are better off now then they were 6 years ago?
you dont have to agree that it was because of bush, but do you actually think that most people are better off?
have you been paying attention?

11/11/2005 4:54:54 PM

Honestly I don't even know how to respond to that.


I'm just going to file it under "Sea Walls".

11/11/2005 4:56:20 PM

^^ Well, maybe not now, the whole Katrina thing...

But on average, yes, I believe that people are better off being alive today than they were 6 years ago. And they will be better off again in six years hence, barring world war III.

They may not "feel" better, but feelings are subjective. We can all become millionaires and feel just awful for it, that wouldn't change the fact that we would all be better off as unhappy millionaires than jolly paupers. Money can buy many things, one of which is heroin.

At the very least you must recognize all the Chinese that have been lifted out of poverty

11/11/2005 5:23:24 PM

United States - World Factbook entry from 1998

GDP: purchasing power parity-$8.083 trillion (1997 est.)
GDP-real growth rate: 3.8% (1997)
GDP-per capita: purchasing power parity-$30,200 (1997 est.)
GDP-composition by sector:
agriculture: 2%
industry: 23%
services: 75% (1997 est.)
Inflation rate-consumer price index: 2% (1997)
Labor force:
total: 136.3 million (includes unemployed) (1997)
by occupation: managerial and professional 29.1%, technical, sales and administrative support 29.6%, services 13.5%, manufacturing, mining, transportation, and crafts 25.1%, farming, forestry, and fishing 2.7%
Unemployment rate: 4.9% (1997)

United States - World Factbook entry from 2005

GDP (purchasing power parity): $11.75 trillion (2004 est.)
GDP - real growth rate: 4.4% (2004 est.)
GDP - per capita: purchasing power parity - $40,100 (2004 est.)
GDP - composition by sector:
agriculture: 0.9%
industry: 19.7%
services: 79.4% (2004 est.)
Inflation rate (consumer prices): 2.5% (2004 est.)
Labor force: 147.4 million (includes unemployed) (2004 est.)
Labor force - by occupation:
managerial, professional, and technical 34.9%, sales and office 25.5%, other services 16.3%, manufacturing, extraction, transportation, and crafts 22.7%, farming, forestry, and fishing 0.7%
note: figures exclude the unemployed (2004)
Unemployment rate: 5.0% (2005 est.) <--- extracted from http://www.bls.gov/

[Edited on November 11, 2005 at 5:39 PM. Reason : bls]

11/11/2005 5:35:27 PM

Is that GDP per capita figure adjusted for inflation? I know the GDP real growth rate is.

11/11/2005 6:38:47 PM

^ Probably not, the statistics were pulled from project gutenburg.

11/11/2005 6:41:18 PM

basically you just illustrated the point that all of our jobs just went over seas.


THANKS!!

11/11/2005 6:41:23 PM

^^ So, what would GDP per capita be if we did adjust for inflation?

11/11/2005 6:44:40 PM

Quote :

"basically you just illustrated the point that all of our jobs just went over seas."

How do you figure? Unemployment is about the same, and incomes are far higher!
In 1997, GDP / workforce = $59,303
In 2004, GDP / workforce = $79,715

for an increase of 34.4% over seven years!

^ Cumulative inflation, using one of the internets numerous inflation calculators, appears to be about 14.75%. As such, I suspect the real average worker productivity has only increased about 19.65%.
http://www.westegg.com/inflation/

What cost $100 in 1800 would cost $48.89 in 1850.
What cost $100 in 1850 would cost $100.10 in 1900.
What cost $100 in 1900 would cost $1995.03 in 2000.

[Edited on November 11, 2005 at 7:36 PM. Reason : neat historical inflation]

11/11/2005 7:29:49 PM

Bush and the rest of the Republicans (save a few, Ron Paul comes to mind) are failures and so are the Democrats. The only conservative thing he has done has been to institute tax cuts. If he and the rest of the Republicans were a true conservatives then they would have abolished (or cut funds serverly) to Medicare/Medicaid, SS, and every other welfare program out there. Instead all he has done is pandered to corporations and instituted acts which will turn the US into a survillence police state. Everyone keeps talking about the Patriot Act when there is something even worse on the horizon: The Real ID Act. Noone says anything about this, yet IMO this is the worse piece of fascist legislation out of all of them. Below is an article about it.

http://www.cnn.com/2005/LAW/08/12/ramasastry.ids/index.html

Quote :

"Many commentators predict that radio frequency identification (RFID) tags will be placed in our licenses. (Other alternatives include a magnetic strip or enhanced bar code). In the past, the Department of Homeland Security has indicated it likes the concept of RFID chips. RFID tags emit radio frequency signals. Significantly, those signals would allow the government to track the movement of our cards and us."

Read that carefully folks. The government will know where you are AT ALL TIMES! Some scary shit.And what's worse, the Feds are forcing the states to foot the bill for this bulls**t. Identity theft will go up because the licenses will be stored in a national database, so there will only be one target. Thats not all.

http://www.ombwatch.org/article/articleview/2843/1/315?TopicID=1

Quote :

"This provision will instead give the secretary of homeland security unprecedented power to waive any and all law, environmental or otherwise, anywhere in the vicinity of the borders, in order to expedite construction of fences and barriers and remove obstacles to the detection of illegal immigration."

That's just great. Fucking great. The Dept of Homeland Security now has the power to waive ANY law. But you can't take it court right? WRONG!

Quote :

"A part of the measure stripping the courts of any power to hear cases arising from the decisions to waive law still denies access to the courts but was revised to permit court review of constitutional claims."

The only way it can get court review is if the claim has to do with Constitutional law. What does everyone think of our new and improved, uber secure US of A? Isn't it grand?

[Edited on November 11, 2005 at 7:47 PM. Reason : ..]

11/11/2005 7:46:05 PM

Quote :

". The government will know where you are AT ALL TIMES! "

im hoping they do it so i can patent a aluminum foil wallet and cash in

11/11/2005 8:00:46 PM

Im still trying to figure out who exactly Bush has "murdered".

11/11/2005 8:47:37 PM

bush to bush, now that is how I like it

11/11/2005 9:04:24 PM

how can you people stand there and seriously claim that clinton was responsible for the economic prosperity of the 90's? Jesus Christ y'all ought to be smarter than that.

11/12/2005 5:25:57 AM

Absolutely. If any honestly believes Clinton was responsible for the prosperity then they must believe Bush is responsible for the current prosperity, dispite every conceivable effort to sabotage said prosperity by both presidents... the only difference is Clinton had a Republican congress to deal with, Bush is stuck with the pork party.

11/12/2005 10:24:21 AM