Quote :

"Wal-Mart takes aim at Democratic critics No. 1 retailer sends 'voter guides' to its 18,000 Iowa employees, criticizing presidential hopefuls who have joined company's critics. August 16 2006: 8:05 AM EDT NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Wal-Mart Stores is hitting back at some leading Democratic presidential hopefuls who have joined with the company's critics recently. The world's largest retailer announced it is sending out what it terms a "voter education guide" to its 18,000 Iowa employees, criticizing politicians who have recently joined with the union-backed group "Wake Up Wal-Mart" for a series of rallies. Iowa holds the nation's first presidential caucus, and potential candidates are already visiting the state. "We believe it's wrong for these political candidates to attack Wal-Mart and the transformation under way at our company," the letter said. "We would never suggest to you how to vote, but we have an obligation to tell you when politicians are saying something about your company that isn't true." The company's critics charge that Wal-Mart fails to provide health care for more than half its workers, pays what it calls "poverty" wages, and helps to shift U.S. jobs overseas by selling low-priced imports. The Wake-Up Wal-Mart group issued its own release in response to the Wal-Mart voter efforts. "We welcome Wal-Mart's attempts to try and defend itself with its employees, political leaders and the American people," the group's statement said. "The debate over Wal-Mart is of critical importance to the future of our country. Sadly, not one single employee or any citizen will ever hear the truth from Wal-Mart about the negative impact it has on its workers or working families because Wal-Mart does everything it can to hide its real record." Wal-Mart said it would invite the candidates to come to its Iowa stores and meet its employees. It released a letter it sent to one of the hopefuls, Sen. Evan Bayh, D-Indiana, from its regional manager in Iowa in which it said it wanted Bayh to visit "without the fanfare of media or staff or supporters. "We don't want this to be about politics - the union-funded groups are already doing enough of that for the both of us," the letter said. The company's letter to its Iowa employees said it is important that they help it respond to criticism. "We want you to know that your voice matters when these political candidates attack your company. We urge you to talk with your friends, your family and your neighbors about the good Wal-Mart does," the letter said. The company's press release said that polling data shows voters do not agree with attacks on Wal-Mart by candidates. According to the release, 62 percent of those surveyed by Democratic pollster Thomas Riehle for the Cook Political Report disapprove of "Democratic candidates making Wal-Mart an issue in November's elections," while only 21 percent approve. Even a majority of union households opposed this strategy, according to the company. Overall, 40 percent of registered voters would vote against an anti-Wal-Mart Democratic candidate, while just 18 percent would vote for such a candidate, the company's statement said. Wal-Mart's letter to its employees says that published schedules show U.S. Sens. Evan Bayh of Indiana and Joseph Biden of Delaware, and Govs. Bill Richardson of New Mexico and Tom Vilsack of Iowa are taking part in the rallies against the company. The company's letter does not mention Sen. Hillary Clinton of New York, another prospective candidate who the Wake-Up Wal-Mart site said has also joined the group in criticism of the company."

http://money.cnn.com/2006/08/16/news/companies/walmart_politics/index.htm?cnn=yes

Can anyone track down a link to the letter? I'd like to hear how they defended themselves.

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 9:32 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 9:31:10 AM

Those evil corporatists. How dare they question what we all know to be the truth!

8/16/2006 9:35:27 AM

Good for wal-mart. As i see it, they're the only ones who can save the environment now.

8/16/2006 9:37:09 AM

oh man, they're acting all corporationy

8/16/2006 9:37:11 AM

Yeah, my main problem with Walmart is how they structure their business

CORPORATIONS ARE EVIL, LLC FTW.

8/16/2006 9:41:11 AM

and the CORPORATIONS go and do all CORPORATIONY type things... and that's when the CORPORATIONS sell things... and they make money! Hmmph.

8/16/2006 9:41:48 AM

You sure have me pegged.

8/16/2006 9:46:07 AM

It's your typical unions versus corporations battle to influence politics.

8/16/2006 10:38:06 AM

^ Ayn Rand called them political gangs.

8/16/2006 10:50:53 AM

Liberals on the attack against a corporation which helps millions of americans obtain the things they want. This baffles me. Why do liberals want to send us into some kind of economic spiral? Is that the excuse you plan on using to bring in the more-powerful welfare state you desire? I'm glad wal-mart did this, its only protecting all of us from danger.

8/16/2006 10:53:44 AM

liberals hate wal-mart because it further emphasizes the difference between the haves and the have nots in this country. Wal Mart is a rich company that pries on poorer people, both patron and employee. However, I applaud "rich Wal Mart." They are providing services to both patron and employee that would not be there otherwise.

8/16/2006 11:00:39 AM

wal-mart is successful for a reason - why are people mad at that? people aren't forced to work there

8/16/2006 11:02:00 AM

Boo hoo, the "have nots" are only the have nots because conservatives hate them so much! they only care about their rich friends.

Never mind that its the rich friends that GIVE them this opportunity in the first place!

Liberals have to be the dumbest people alive. They want to put us on a road to self destruction.

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:03 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:02:09 AM

If they hand out paper, its no big deal, whatever.

But if they pressure employees into voting against certain candidates w/ threats to their job or pay(something they arent above im sure), then thats just plain wrong.

8/16/2006 11:07:01 AM

Pink, you're more likely to see that in unions than in corporations

8/16/2006 11:12:39 AM

Quote :

"^ Ayn Rand called them political gangs."

Yeah, but Ayn Rand was a cunt.

8/16/2006 11:14:00 AM

Ayn Rand was a cunt if you aren't a big fan of personal responsibility and/or if you believe in your "duty to the greater good"

8/16/2006 11:17:00 AM

its cute that you think one of these organizations is working for pure good and the other is out to destroy capitalism, as most conservatives seem to believe.

i mean, heaven forbid someone organize for a decent wage and better conditions, we all know only one party here knows whats best, and the other is just a bunch of thugs.

^^^im sure youve actually had experice with this, and arent just going on hearsay and stereotypes, right? do unions have thugs? yes, but wal-mart has shown through its union-busting techniques that they arent above doing such things. but if you want to be naive and believe theyre just misunderstood by the stupid liberals, then fine. dont do your research and just believe that.

^yeah, screw society. its only my morals and beliefs fostered through religion that make me want to look out for the good of others.

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:22 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:20:49 AM

you got pwnt here:

Quote :

"Pink, you're more likely to see that in unions than in corporations"

8/16/2006 11:22:00 AM

yeah, if you believe every conservative "truth" about the relationship b/w unions and corporations w/o looking at all sides.

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:24 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:24:06 AM

or pure evidence showing how leaders of unions use their pulpit to threaten members' jobs if they don't vote a certain way.

8/16/2006 11:24:56 AM

It would be in the best interest of free markets that union busting continue, if at all possible. Look at growing free markets where such influences arent a hindrance. im glad wal-mart is fighting for a free market!

8/16/2006 11:25:32 AM

^^or evidence where wal-mart has done the same thing to employees who consider their right to unionize their job

but what am i talking about, we should abolish them all. fuck a universal human right, thats just UN, commie, international bs.


Here's a question: how is costco able to stay competitive w/ wal-mart while offering its employees health care and greater benefits if the wal-mart model is set up to be the dominating force in the industry?

Also, why can't wal-mart ever use that model?

read: http://www.laborresearch.org/print.php?id=391

Quote :

"Costco CEO Jim Senegal has said: “We pay much better than Wal-Mart. That’s not altruism. It’s good business.”"

Quote :

"A 2004 Business Week study ran the numbers to test Costco’s business model against that of Wal-Mart. The study confirmed that Costco’s well-compensated employees are more productive. The study shows that Costco’s employees sell more: $795 of sales per square foot, versus only $516 at Sam’s Club, a division of Wal-Mart (which, like Costco, operates as a members-only warehouse club). Consequently Costco pulls in more revenue per employee; U.S. operating profit per hourly employee was $13,647 at Costco versus $11,039 at Sam’s Club. The study also revealed that Costco’s labor costs are actually lower than Wal-Mart’s as a percentage of sales. Its labor and overhead costs (classed as SG&A, or selling, general and administrative expenses) are 9.8% of revenues, compared to Wal-Mart’s 17%. "

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:38 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:26:32 AM

yeah, good call... we should abolish unions

8/16/2006 11:37:00 AM

why do those employees not work at costco?

probably because there isn't a better job available.


free market man. it's simple stuff.

8/16/2006 11:44:04 AM

Quote :

"PinkandBlack: Here's a question: how is costco able to stay competitive w/ wal-mart while offering its employees health care and greater benefits if the wal-mart model is set up to be the dominating force in the industry?"

Because in a free market, multiple companies can all make a profit?

It's gotta be tough being a liberal, having to deal with the logical incoherence of your worldview.

"omg Wal-Mart is the devil, they're pushing everyone out of business and driving down wages!!1"...

"Here's a question -- how can Costco compete while offering higher wages? huh? huh?"...

rofl...  

8/16/2006 11:45:09 AM

And can you believe it? Wal-mart shareholders want better responsibility in response to the companies legal woes? Guess not all is hunky-dory.

http://www.marketwatch.com/News/Story/Story.aspx?guid=%7B77C22DA2-AEF9-4205-BE2D-7FEDEC848E1F%7D

^i imagine that you sit around all day patting yourself on the back for "owning" on people on message boards. sad, really. guess it makes sense that youre actually involved with politics, because you act like a well-spoken troll. i look forward to more emoticons from you.

your points are obvious and expected. whats wrong with desiring that the retailers that are driving out economy not only compete for customers, but also compete to have better employees and compete to help raise the labor standards here, since it is possible? is that too "ethical"? what does ayn rand have to say about that?



[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:54 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:45:26 AM

HOORAY AYN RAND!!!! TOLL ROADS EVERYWHERE!!!!! LET THE POOR DIE IN A GUTTER!!!! WOOOHOOOO

8/16/2006 11:47:24 AM

YAY, MORE LIBERAL CORPORATION HATING AND OTHER ASSORTED BS. WE WANT A SOCIALIST WELFARE STATE, NO COMPETITION!

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 11:53 AM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 11:53:42 AM

i don't hate corporations, i really don't like ayn rand and there are plenty of things about wal-mart that i don't like.

8/16/2006 11:55:48 AM

Quote :

"YAY, MORE LIBERAL CORPORATION HATING AND OTHER ASSORTED BS. WE WANT A SOCIALIST WELFARE STATE, NO COMPETITION! "

It is nothing like that. The American worker can compete and win against any worker on the face of the earth. Not that there is something special about the worker (there is though) but there is something special about America. We have superior education system, road system, and health care system to China that gives us a hundred mile head start.

The problem is that our government is not working for us. They negotiate very, very, very poor trade agreements with other countries. They let China impose a huge tariff on our goods and impose almost no restriction on their goods. We are simply exporting our wealth to China for a few good years here in the U.S.

It is not sustainable. An American worker is hard pressed to compete against countries that have no environmental restrictions, minimum wage or really any labor laws to begin with. We are fighting with one hand tied behind our back and it needs to stop.

We need equal trade tariffs for China to create a market for what goods we do produce here in the U.S. We need to demand that they stop artificially depressing the value of their currency. We need to demand that they extend the basic human rights to their people that we receive here.

Until we are given a chance to compete on a level playing field, we are simply exporting America's wealth for no good.

8/16/2006 12:17:48 PM

Quote :

"yeah, screw society. its only my morals and beliefs fostered through religion that make me want to look out for the good of others. "

Exactly the wrong way to look at this type of philosophy. You're totally allowed to look out for the good of others. That's commendable that your religion has led you to want to work towards the common good.

Do so with your own money and effort. Not mine. I'll choose whom to help with my resources...you choose to help with yours.

That is the philosophy. Ayn Rand probably wouldn't help anyone (except those willing to work hard by giving them a job, of course).

I on the other hand, will help some of the less fortunate. Myself, without your help, get the fuck out of my bank account.

8/16/2006 12:22:44 PM

hey, look, you disagree on your philosophies of life.

8/16/2006 12:24:25 PM

Quote :

"PinkandBlack: ^i imagine that you sit around all day patting yourself on the back for "owning" on people on message boards."

Not really, only if it involves someone coherent like OEPII1 or Gamecat. But of course in their cases there's actually well-informed debate that takes place, so it's rare that either side "wins".

People like you, on the other hand, aren't really worth the effort at all (much less self-congratulation for being pwnt). Hence why you get those assorted emoticons you love so much instead

---

Quote :

"PinkandBlack: whats wrong with desiring that the retailers that are driving out economy not only compete for customers, but also compete to have better employees and compete to help raise the labor standards here, since it is possible? is that too "ethical"? what does ayn rand have to say about that?"

Your changing of the subject is obvious and expected... 

8/16/2006 12:25:45 PM

lol, deflection

obviously, there is only one way when it comes to what makes a strong society

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 12:28 PM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 12:27:33 PM

Quote :

"It is nothing like that. The American worker can compete and win against any worker on the face of the earth. Not that there is something special about the worker (there is though) but there is something special about America. We have superior education system, road system, and health care system to China that gives us a hundred mile head start. The problem is that our government is not working for us. They negotiate very, very, very poor trade agreements with other countries. They let China impose a huge tariff on our goods and impose almost no restriction on their goods. We are simply exporting our wealth to China for a few good years here in the U.S. It is not sustainable. An American worker is hard pressed to compete against countries that have no environmental restrictions, minimum wage or really any labor laws to begin with. We are fighting with one hand tied behind our back and it needs to stop. We need equal trade tariffs for China to create a market for what goods we do produce here in the U.S. We need to demand that they stop artificially depressing the value of their currency. We need to demand that they extend the basic human rights to their people that we receive here. Until we are given a chance to compete on a level playing field, we are simply exporting America's wealth for no good."

Please take EC 348 or 448 immediately. You speak with conviction, but without semblance of actual truth. Also please read "The Choice" by Russell Roberts (takes 25 minutes)
1st fundamental mistake - We're exporting our wealth. Big news in the world of economics...they have to spend those dollars here. Either through investment, which helps us...or consumption, which helps us. You may not see it that way, but the foreign exchange market doesn't work like a monopoly set. There isn't a banker just making changes in currency for fun. They will only do it if there is demand for the currency. Thus, the dollars Chinese entreprenuers take when we buy things will eventually come back to us in investment or consumption spending.
2nd fundamental mistake - Devalued Chinese currency is a bain on the U.S. You're simply looking at the nominal exchange rate, not the real one. The difference is made up in inflation in the Chinese economy.
3rd fundamental mistake - We need equal tariffs. Tariffs are a bad thing. They cause you to pay more for goods than they are fairly valued at. Its a lot like shooting yourself in the foot. If they want to shoot themselves while we don't, fine. Its good for us
4th fundamental mistake- Chinese people are somehow less deserving of wealth and prosperity than we are. Do you complain when someone in Texas starts a business and gets wealthy? How is that any different than people in other countries. Some arbitrarily defined line is the only difference, and to think its okay for Texans to get wealthy, but not some other nation's people is simply racist.

8/16/2006 12:30:16 PM

Quote :

"bgmims: Please take EC 348 or 448 or any other course on basic economics immediately."

Corrected it for you

8/16/2006 12:32:18 PM

Quote :

"hey, look, you disagree on your philosophies of life."

Sure, but mine doesn't involve stealing from her. She can have her philosophy, but its not okay to use it to trounce my property.

8/16/2006 12:33:02 PM

EVERYONE IS OUT TO STEAL YOUR MAGIC BAG

8/16/2006 12:34:49 PM

Quote :

"whats wrong with desiring that the retailers that are driving out economy not only compete for customers, but also compete to have better employees and compete to help raise the labor standards here, since it is possible? is that too "ethical"? what does ayn rand have to say about that?"

My God the idiocy drips from this statement. Wal Mart is competing for better workers, evidently, because they have a steady flow of employees WILLING to work for them. If wal mart was fucking over their employees so badly, they wouldn't have anyone to employ. Jobs are available here, but you also get paid what you're worth. I'm not going to pay my greeter over $7/hour either. If you were to come in and mandate that a greeter get $10 an hour with benefits, guess what I'll do to the greeter position? Eliminate it. So what good does that do? Now 70 year old Grandpa doesn't have insurance or an income. GG government price floors. G fucking G.

It's really not that fucking hard.

8/16/2006 12:35:27 PM

why do only conservative understand how the world really works?

8/16/2006 12:37:41 PM

Huh, and because of the new commitment to ethanol I thought the Republicans would be the first to include some form of Wal-Mart bashing in their campaigning

8/16/2006 12:40:20 PM

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 12:41 PM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 12:41:25 PM

Randy, here's the problem

A lot of liberals understand how the world works - they just don't like it and are aiming to fix it. Problem is, they cause even more fundamental problems when they try to fix it (most of the time)

Second, a lot of conservatives don't understand how the world works - they think they do, but they're really only interested in specific issues and economics isn't one of them.

We get confused by the first group for the second group.

8/16/2006 12:42:34 PM

Because we're not so wrapped up in "feelings" that overshadow our sense of justice.

8/16/2006 12:42:38 PM

Quote :

"Huh, and because of the new commitment to ethanol I thought the Republicans would be the first to include some form of Wal-Mart bashing in their campaigning"

For me, I have no problem with a commitment to ethanol on the part of Wal-Mart. If it turns out to be a good business investment, then gg to WM. If not, oh well, try again.

I think it will be, over time, already ethanol producing factories are so profitable, they pay for themselves in a year or two.

8/16/2006 12:44:06 PM

and sense of personal responsibility

and sense of how the world works

and sense of history and what has constantly FAILED

and our sense of protecting ourselves

and our sense of not putting everyone into poverty



[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 12:45 PM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 12:44:17 PM

Quote :

"st fundamental mistake - We're exporting our wealth. Big news in the world of economics...they have to spend those dollars here. Either through investment, which helps us...or consumption, which helps us. You may not see it that way, but the foreign exchange market doesn't work like a monopoly set. There isn't a banker just making changes in currency for fun. They will only do it if there is demand for the currency. Thus, the dollars Chinese entreprenuers take when we buy things will eventually come back to us in investment or consumption spending."

Take my business for example. Wal-Mart pays us around 20 million per year to make toys. We pay pretty much all of that, except for the worker salaries to our HK subsidiary (tax shelter). The money is used to make the toys and they are shipped to the U.S. Most of the money is never repatriated.

We have a negative trade balance, there is more money going out than there is coming in. How can you not see the results of this all around you?

Quote :

"3rd fundamental mistake - We need equal tariffs. Tariffs are a bad thing. They cause you to pay more for goods than they are fairly valued at. Its a lot like shooting yourself in the foot. If they want to shoot themselves while we don't, fine. Its good for us"

No tariffs are fine, if there is a somewhat level playing field. Goods from China are not so cheap just because the labor, its also because of the environmental standards. I am not talking about global warming prevention. I am talking about not dumping toxic chemicals into the water, however, they are doing it every day.

Look at Hong Kong. A great area making a lot of money facilitating the China trade. However most people walk around the city wearing masks, because of all the polution wafting over from China. That polution is starting to reach the U.S. from as far away from China and also from Mexico.

Quote :

"4th fundamental mistake- Chinese people are somehow less deserving of wealth and prosperity than we are. Do you complain when someone in Texas starts a business and gets wealthy? How is that any different than people in other countries. Some arbitrarily defined line is the only difference, and to think its okay for Texans to get wealthy, but not some other nation's people is simply racist."

I don't think you believe this. A small group of people are getting rich in Mexico and China off the work of cheap labor. However, you are doing it at the cost of the lives of the labor that live in those countries, and you are destroying the lives of the workers at our factories here that make a decent wage.

8/16/2006 12:46:00 PM

Quote :

"and sense of personal responsibility"

bingo there.


And about ethanol: it won't be the liberal hippies that save the world with their tree hugging... it'll be hard cold economic sense.

Wal Mart wants to sell ethanol. Why? Not because it gives a damn about the environment. Wal Mart isn't an environmental protection company. It's a retailer. It wants to make money. It will sell ethanol because it is economically attractive to do so. And through that bitter, cold "selfishness" that is walmart wanting to make another dollar... it will distribute environmentally safe fuels all across America and accomplish in a single day what 50 years of hippy protests have failed to accomplish: a solution.

[Edited on August 16, 2006 at 12:48 PM. Reason : .]

8/16/2006 12:46:57 PM

Quote :

"and sense of personal responsibility and sense of how the world works and sense of history and what has constantly FAILED and our sense of protecting ourselves and our sense of not putting everyone into poverty"

Randy, I go to China three times a year because I am the primary customer to 18 OEM factories there (on behalf of my employer and WM). I really think you should go with me.

In fact, if you buy your plane ticket, I will take you to these factories so that you can see the great conditions that these people live and work in. I will be glad to show you the factories that are walled in with guards because the workers aren't allowed to leave the grounds.

I will show you the dorms where these people live where they sleep head to toe, six people to a room.

These people made a choice to work at these factories, initially but they can't improve their conditions. They breathe toxic fumes everyday that will probably give them cancer. The workers cannot improve their situation because there are a billion other people stupid enough to want this job.

8/16/2006 12:54:58 PM