the number one question that I have been asked (besides name, age, etc.) by people of all ages and nationalities is "you don't really like/agree with George Bush, do you?" And it's not just this trip, when I travelled southern Africa last year for four months it was the same thing. To all the people that have lived in their shells of the USA and/or NC for their entire lives that think that the USA's international reputation has not suffered greatly due to the Bush administration, I would just like to say that you need to open your fucking eyes because I'm embarassed to be an American now when I leave my country. No this doesn't mean that I am going to renounce my citizenship and move elsewhere (and nor should I, not unless Bush re-writes the laws and goes for a third term), because the fact of the matter is that there isn't another country whose culture makes me feel more comfortable where I can live how I choose on a good salary. It seems to me more than ever, whereas I used to be angry with Bush and his decisions, now it just makes me sad.

9/14/2006 5:41:05 PM

People are going to respond that our country shouldn't care what other countries think or say about us and that we should do whats in our best interest. I think thats a very obvious contradiction.

Either way, just say you are from Canada. I've had friends go abroad and they get along with the locals or whatever just fine until they mention they are from America. It most definetly is sad.

9/14/2006 5:46:42 PM

at least clinton wouldnt get your assed raped and robbed while on your european vacation

9/14/2006 5:50:50 PM

same thing happened to me all over Europe last year

great. at home people think i'm "one of those people", and abroad i get ostracized

wtf mates?

9/14/2006 5:55:36 PM

haha, i've told several europeans i've met that i'm american and so far i'm pretty sure they don't think less of me. although some have told me i'm not the "typical american".

9/14/2006 6:09:17 PM

Quote :

"People are going to respond that our country shouldn't care what other countries think or say about us and that we should do whats in our best interest. I think thats a very obvious contradiction."

Yet, to a very great extent, it is true. The interests of the United States be what our government works for and it should not be subject to how other countries feel or what they think of us. Our President should not be elected based solely on his popularity with foreign governments and the actions our country takes should not be subject to veto by the UN, or Iran, or South Africa, or whoever else.

That being said, "Fuck 'em all" is definitely poor foreign policy and you can often get what you want by playing nicely with others. And if they hate us that much, they can start returning our foreign aid checks.

9/14/2006 6:11:13 PM

Even if another republican is elected in 2008 I still think it'll get better abroad.

9/14/2006 6:14:07 PM

Randy: It's them UN-brainwashed libnazis who hate our freedom's man. They weren't hit on 9/11 so they don't get it. All they do is sit back and eat cheese and point fingers at the marvel that is George W. Bush okay. Tell those Eurotrash to fix their own communist states before they start to judge ours. We saved their ungrateful asses in WWI and II. They hate our freedoms and God. America rulez!

9/14/2006 6:18:59 PM

America

FUCK YEAH

comin' in here to save the mothafuckin day YEAH

9/14/2006 6:30:43 PM

Quote :

"They weren't hit on 9/11 so they don't get it."

right becuase spain and england were hit on different dates, they must be fools

9/14/2006 6:31:32 PM

The lesson here is to not go abroad.

9/14/2006 6:36:03 PM

i had basically the same thing while living in Germany for a year, just returning about 2 months ago. I never had any problems, really - like no agression or disrespect towards me just beause I'm american. But most people really were very interested basically in what the hell is going on in America.
I told people that for my own part, I voted twice against George W Bush and I never supported the war in Iraq to begin with, WMD or not. I also reitterated that 1) technically Bush got less overall votes in 2000 and 2) in 2004 the vote was very close, so even if overseas it looks and sounds like there is a united front and idealogy coming from the US, it is very diverse and divided inside the country. Also I told them that I was quite confident that had the election been run again during the past year, W would easily lose.

My view points caused confusion for some germans, and I heard more than once "every american i've talked to says the same thing you do - that they didn't vote for and don't support bush. If that's so, how is it possible he's been elected twice?". To that, basically all i could say that, in general, Americans who are willing to spend time overseas, especially those who go and interact with native populations (as opposed to going to the Riviera for a week and never leaving the resort), are more likely to be left and liberal thinking.

I had some of my best interactions with French people, but not because of why you think. I wrote about one conversation I had with a Frenchman in Munich a few months ago here - http://joelion.com/archives/56
as a hint:

Quote :

"I was completely taken off guard, then, when the father challenged my positions on American policies and politics more severely than anyone else in Europe has."

9/14/2006 7:29:01 PM

my favorite comment i received while in brazil was "oh you're an american? do you have any missles?" it's sad, there were a lot of people who thought we all backed bush.

9/14/2006 7:34:37 PM

Quote :

"right becuase spain and england were hit on different dates, they must be fools"

ostensibly

9/14/2006 7:40:05 PM

Frankly, any person from any country who judges me because I'm from America (or even because I vote Republican) is every bit as much an ignorant tool as the people they describe us as being.

9/14/2006 7:42:04 PM

Kinda builds on the same point.

But why can't they judge you?

People do have to judge you in order to like you, you realize.

9/14/2006 7:44:08 PM

Sigh...I know that, Gamecat, but in common use "judge me" has a negative connotation implying that the judgment is negative. It's not how the language is supposed to work, but it's how it does.

9/14/2006 7:49:16 PM

oh yeah, regarding the missle comment. Here's an excellent blog from a black american man who lives as an English teacher in Japan
http://www.gaijinsmash.net/
It's funny as hell - most of the posts are concerning what Japanese kids are like and their weird facination with trying to grab his dick or stick their fingers up his ass, but he gets into some funny things of how they view americans.
for example, from
http://www.gaijinsmash.net/archives/japaense_people_say_the_darndest_things.phtml

Quote :

"I was at the gym with a female Japanese friend. We were watching the news on TV when suddenly she turned to me and asked, "So, you're American, right? How many guns do you have?" Notice the word usage here. Not "if" I have guns, no! "How many" guns do I have. Because surely, as a red-blooded American, I own guns. Yee-haw, when I'm not drinkin' my root beer and eating myself damn to death, I sure love me to shoot some stuff! *thumbs up* Clearly, I needed to set her straight. I pointed my first finger at her in the classic, "Now let me tell you something..." pose, but before words could escape my mouth, she innocently said, "Oh, only one gun?" Somewhere in the world, I imagine Charlton Heston is quite pleased with himself."

9/14/2006 7:52:28 PM

I'd submit that national borders weren't meant to be the way we were supposed to differentiate between one another, but I don't see complaints about such ridiculous matters arise very often in wartime. Why is that?

9/14/2006 7:53:29 PM

Horrible comparison. Language is something we construct and, therefore, we have some say in what it is and is not meant to do. How "we were supposed to differentiate between one another" is very, very different.

9/14/2006 7:58:24 PM

We didn't construct those borders. People before us did. They were nonetheless constructed. Language, I'd argue, is demonstrably far less consciously constructed.

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 8:02 PM. Reason : ...]

9/14/2006 8:01:28 PM

I'm not saying that the borders weren't constructed, I'm saying that this "how we were meant to differentiate" business is a bunch of flighty crap that stems from no human control or construction.

9/14/2006 8:19:17 PM

I agree. Why then does it dominate our perception of the value of the lives of others?

9/14/2006 8:19:56 PM

Firstly, basic evolutionary psychology that we tend to value the well-being of people in our own group, however that is defined, over those of other groups.

If it weren't borders that defined those groups, it's just be something else, and probably not anything that made a hell of a lot more sense.

Secondly, because something's being out of the pale of our construction or control does not leave us unconcerned with that something.

And thirdly, quit straying from the original point of disagreement.

9/14/2006 8:31:26 PM

Quote :

"GrumpyGOP: Firstly, basic evolutionary psychology that we tend to value the well-being of people in our own group, however that is defined, over those of other groups."

I agree with the premise.

Quote :

"GrumpyGOP: If it weren't borders that defined those groups, it's just be something else, and probably not anything that made a hell of a lot more sense."

I disagree with the induction.

How's "human inhabitants of Earth" sound as far as a group? Or even, "biophysically equal inhabitants of Earth" and let the presence of genetically human DNA be the judge?

Quote :

"GrumpyGOP: Secondly, because something's being out of the pale of our construction or control does not leave us unconcerned with that something."

I agree. About that human society thing...

Quote :

"GrumpyGOP: And thirdly, quit straying from the original point of disagreement."

Quit obscuring what the original point of disagreement was.

You said mine was a "horrible comparison." Your claim was based on the fact that we construct language, and therefore have some say in what it is and is not meant to do. Your claim is based on a false premise from the start. We didn't construct language. Other people who lived before us did.

We have very little say in what it is meant to do. Linguistic philosophy is a better avenue for trying to put a finger on that one. None of us really know. Or at least, none of us have shown any believable evidence that we do. What we do know is that national borders were constructed as a means of defining the territory occupied in history by alpha males, and agreed upon so that it would be clear where a tribe of humans could go without being killed by the other tribe.

The deliberateness with which borders were constructed and traceable evolutionary origins thereof reinforce my point.

I'll even agree that I worded my point poorly and will take this opportunity to restate more clearly:

National borders weren't meant to be the permanent method by which we were supposed to differentiate between the value of one another's lives, but I do not see complaints about such ridiculous matters arise very often in wartime.

My question is why does "a bunch of flighty crap that stems from no human control or construction" dominate our perceptions of the value of the lives of biophysically equivalent others who are simply living within different borders?

Certainly, there was human control and construction involved in the establishment of borders and you're just dicking around. Obviously there aren't really lines on the ground that are visible from above. Google Earth could tell you that much. They had to be constructed, imaginably by humans, at some point in our history.

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 8:55 PM. Reason : ...]

9/14/2006 8:46:48 PM

Quote :

"Even if another republican is elected in 2008 I still think it'll get better abroad."

9/14/2006 9:23:10 PM

You'll be fine as long as you don't act like a stereotypical american overseas. Basically don't talk at the top of your lungs about how the states are better, don't flip on shopkeepers when they refuse to take dollars, and don't piss all over their cultures.

My roommate was telling me how easy it is to pick up girls in London if you are nice to people and don't act like a stereotypical american (obviously having good teeth wins you some easy points in the UK).

I was in india last fall and had a class full of indian kids chase me down the street because they had never seen an american before. I had to shake all of their hands before they would let me go.

9/14/2006 9:32:13 PM

yeah, no one hated us before Bush was elected

what the fuck ever

and yeah... I don't like Bush, but I don't really give a fuck what some tool living in France or wherever thinks of me either

America is the in thing to hate... but yet foreigners come here every day for opportunities they can't find elsewhere... we are sooo horrible


god damn I'm beginning to hate liberals with a passion, not just dislike, but despise

all you fucking do is bitch and moan about shit but yet can't fix shit or put anyone up for election that can fix a fucking thing

until you tools all realize that politicians in general are the problem and you need to do whats best for you regardless of political affiliation this country is going to continue it's course

ps.. I'm tired of the bible beating conservatives almost as much as the whiny pick and choose rights and freedoms liberals

this country needs a whole new overhaul

this country is no longer about what it was founded upon and it's depressing

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 9:45 PM. Reason : .]

9/14/2006 9:43:27 PM

Kissinger shyly suggested that at the end of an op-ed recently. I posted it in the thread about Pakistan's dictator blaming us for extremism (or terrorism).

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 9:46 PM. Reason : .]

9/14/2006 9:46:37 PM

Quote :

"You'll be fine as long as you don't act like a stereotypical american overseas. Basically don't talk at the top of your lungs about how the states are better, don't flip on shopkeepers when they refuse to take dollars, and don't piss all over their cultures."

so whats good for one isn't good for the other is what you are saying?

because I'm not going to be shocked when McDonalds starts accepting Pesos

and oh yeah... it's ok for other people to come over here and step all over American culture but we can't go overseas and say we're American?

I guess it is ok because no one here wants to stand up for who we are anymore

9/14/2006 9:56:31 PM

Who are we?

9/14/2006 9:57:48 PM

^ You're aware that there are other nationalities than mexican, right?

9/14/2006 9:58:38 PM

"we" being the people whom are citizens here

and those that were born here


and those that like this place

9/14/2006 10:00:51 PM

And how are "we" not standing up then, for who "we" are?

9/14/2006 10:01:26 PM

this whole thread is talking about how if Americans go overseas they should "say they're from Canada" and "not step on others cultures"


but people come here every day and step on American culture and trash it

and that seems to be ok with people here... but oh yeah, don't go overseas and tell people you're from America

9/14/2006 10:04:38 PM

You can go overseas and say you're American, you just can't go overseas and say you support Bush, or be a jackass.

Also, other cultures don't come over here and step on our culture. That's a ridiculous assertion. World-wide, the US, BY FAR, has the most pervasive culture. By our nature, we assimilate and adapt other cultures.

This is the first though that i've heard that Americans are pissed at the illegal immigrants (which is what I assume you're referring to) because it's a threat to our culture. That's blatant racism, and it's nothing short of stupidity to base policy on that. I thought we didn't like the illegal immigrants because of the financial strain on our social systems, as well as the security threat?

Quote :

"should "say they're from Canada" "

I think they were being facetious.

Quote :

"and "not step on others cultures""

You shouldn't do that, because it pisses people off, and it's what the stereotypical American is expected to do.

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 10:06 PM. Reason : ]

9/14/2006 10:04:59 PM

wtf, I never said I have problems with immigrants

I don't have a problem with people coming here at all... as long as people go through the proper routes they should be more than welcome to come here and experience the opportunities that many of us are ungrateful for...

I honestly feel like most immigrants are happier to be here than many people born here


I do have a problem with having to suppress the fact that I am an American while people blatantly bash us and our culture with no remorse

I don't support Bush, but if I were to, people shouldn't hate me for it... they can't help that he is a jackass and didn't deliver on his promises

^ but people blatantly bash our culture on our own shores and liberals applaud them

[Edited on September 14, 2006 at 10:12 PM. Reason : yall don't get it and never will]

9/14/2006 10:09:26 PM

Oh.

This thread though doesn't talk about people bashing America without remorse. It mostly is people bashing Bush without remorse.

If you notice, the people are saying that the foreigners are surprised that the Americans are they way they are, when they perceive us all to be Bush lovers.

9/14/2006 10:11:28 PM

i spent quite a bit of time overseas this past summer, throughout europe.


not one rude comment, and everyone was very nice to us. it was quite obvious that i'm an American, and I refused to lie to someone when they asked where i was from. They were very friendly, and several of them talked to me about times they'd visited here, and how much they enjoyed it.

The italians were rude, but they're rude to everyone. If the turks are the mexicans of europe, then then italians are the puerto ricans.

at any rate, i don't know where you're coming from here... nobody really asked me about Bush... then again, I didn't ask them about Schroeder or Chirac either.

But at no point was I sad to be from this country, nor embarassed, nor ashamed. You've obviously got issues, or you were hanging around with the wrong people.

also let me say, if I didn't live in the US and love it, I'd live in Dublin or in Ghent, Belgium. Wonderful places, wonderful people.

9/14/2006 10:15:06 PM

yeah I understand, but this thread, like many other TWW soapbox threads, denegrated into a "OMG BUSH SUCKS, AMERICA IS HORRIBLE BLAH BLAH BLAH" thread.

it gets kinda old

like I said earlier... this country is no longer about what it was founded upon and it will eventually lead to downfall or a major internal conflict costing many lives

which is sad... I love this place and love the fact that we do have opportunities and a life which no other place has.. we're truly blessed to be citizens here

9/14/2006 10:16:53 PM

Quote :

""OMG BUSH SUCKS, AMERICA IS HORRIBLE BLAH BLAH BLAH" thread."

I'll give you the Bush sucks part (c'mon he does though...), but no one says America is horrible.

We could stand to be better, as could anyone, but as the most powerful country on Earth, we're specially obligated to be better.

9/14/2006 10:20:39 PM

I agree, but partisan politics always seems to drive a spike in the middle of anything good

9/14/2006 10:22:57 PM

Didn't read past the OP.

That being said, I had the opposite experience going abroad. I guess this means anecdotal evidence doesn't mean much. Hooray.

This is the best part about people who might judge you just on the fact that you're American alone:
they fucking suck. Reasonable people deal with you on the level of an individual. Why give a shit what irrational people think, do you really expect to positively affect their opinion in any rational way?

9/14/2006 10:49:12 PM

Quote :

"How's "human inhabitants of Earth" sound as far as a group?"

It sounds lovely and utopian and all, which is to say, it sounds utterly absurd. It isn't a group. It's the absence of a group, and in almost every respect counter to human evolutionary programming.

Quote :

"We didn't construct language. Other people who lived before us did. "

The irony here is killing me.

You know exactly what "we" meant there, and why you keep insisting on taking things literally and not in the sense they were intended is beyond me.

Quote :

"Certainly, there was human control and construction involved in the establishment of borders and you're just dicking around."

How am I dicking around? I agree with you that humans meticulously designed and established borders. What I disagree with is this:

Quote :

"National borders weren't meant to be the permanent method by which we were supposed to differentiate between the value of one another's lives"

Meant by who? Do you think those first tribes were saying, "OK, guys, this whole border situation is really just kind of a temporary thing," or "Even though we're all split up by tribes and borders now, let's all agree that each of us is of equal value"?

Quote :

"My question is why does "a bunch of flighty crap that stems from no human control or construction" dominate our perceptions of the value of the lives of biophysically equivalent others who are simply living within different borders?"

The "bunch of flighty crap" is this concept of us being meant to do something, not the concept of borders. But, having said that, I've already explained why it dominates us. Humans are programmed to favor their own group within humanity, however they chose to define that group -- but they will define one.

And let me say I'm a little disappointed for the forced implication that "alpha males" are basically responsible for all the world's problems, or at least empires.

[Edited on September 15, 2006 at 11:37 AM. Reason : ]

9/15/2006 11:28:58 AM

Quote :

"pwrstrkdf250: this whole thread is talking about how if Americans go overseas they should "say they're from Canada" and "not step on others cultures" but people come here every day and step on American culture and trash it and that seems to be ok with people here... but oh yeah, don't go overseas and tell people you're from America"

Your frustration is noted, but I think your anger is misplaced. Our nation was founded on free expression, among other wonderful ideals. If others are choosing, for whatever reason, to designate themselves Canadian while abroad they are simply exercising that freedom. Hopefully it isn't this part you disagree with.

I ultimately agree with you that the phenomena may still represent a problem, however. Whether the problem is really solved by "saying you're from Canada" is probably a better question to counter people who support such ridiculous ideas.

Clearly identifying, or feeling pressure to identify as a member of another country is a problem worth understanding. And I'm not so sure it's a problem inherent to the United States so much as the cowardice of those who go abroad. I don't see why they aren't "standing up for who we are" either. We, unlike many countries in the world, permit the freedom of personal expression and belief. While we make mistakes, they are usually the consequences of those freedoms, which our nation should ultimately defend to its bitterest conceivable end.

Why Americans abroad are refusing to stand up for the good that our nation actually has and does would be a problem worth scientifically investigating. Psychological studies could probably tell you an answer. So could historians. I certainly don't know of an objective hypothesis I've heard, or formed, yet.

moron's point still holds, though. Being respectful of other cultures while abroad is still hugely important, not only altruistically, but for our credibility in the world. Why else would the U.S. State Department have so recently issued its own guidebook for those travelling abroad about how to act? Obviously, the guide wasn't a mandate or a law, but it was definitely a recognition of the diplomatic importance of the behavior of tourists.

I want to be clear about this. I don't think being respectful of other cultures while abroad means denying where you're from, what you believe, or even who you voted for. All of those are important values for you to be able to express while abroad. I just don't understand why so many people lack the conviction to explain any of these things to foreigners when they ask us questions that make us uncomfortable. Honest answers that are reasonable and reflect a fair understanding of our government's history usually satisfy them.

Being respectful to other cultures overseas is a totally different matter, independent of whether people identify as American while abroad or not. AxlBonBach can verify that. So can I. I'm sure others who've been abroad can as well.

Then you have the truth in ChknMcFaggot's anecdote. Out in the world, you've also got irrational people who don't judge on the level of the individual. They definitely exist in this country as well. Abroad, however, the fact is as Lincoln observed so many years ago: we can't please all the people all the time.

It's irrational to be able to expect to be able to do this in the first place. It's irrelevant whether you identify as an American who voted for George W. Bush and want to flatten the Middle East for coherent reasons, or a Canadian who's really an American who voted for John Kerry and want to solve the Middle East's problems by hand-delivering an apology note for invading Iraq to every house in the region for coherent reasons. Why? Because there are irrational people in every culture.

9/15/2006 12:09:51 PM

Nobody is stepping on our shitty Idol-loving, Bic-Mac scarfing, Hummer-driving, grill-wearing, I.D. arguing culture. We are culture exporters. You couldnt find a country on this planet that hasnt been drammatically affected by our politics, philanthropy, pop-culture, tourism or pollution.

9/15/2006 12:44:57 PM

agentlion:

Quote :

"i had basically the same thing while living in Germany for a year, just returning about 2 months ago. I never had any problems, really - like no agression or disrespect towards me just beause I'm american. But most people really were very interested basically in what the hell is going on in America. I told people that for my own part, I voted twice against George W Bush and I never supported the war in Iraq to begin with, WMD or not. I also reitterated that 1) technically Bush got less overall votes in 2000 and 2) in 2004 the vote was very close, so even if overseas it looks and sounds like there is a united front and idealogy coming from the US, it is very diverse and divided inside the country."

I could not have summed up my experiences better. People haven't been hostile to me in the least bit. To best explain the thing about Bush losing the popular vote and getting the presedency I tell people about the electoral college and then just when they get even more confused and inevitably ask me "well why doesn't it change then?" all I say is, would you change the laws and technicalities of what got you elected as president? Because ultimately, they are the only ones that will allow those laws to be changed. People usually look blankly at me for a moment and say oh, well now it all makes sense.

Quote :

"concerning what Japanese kids are like and their weird facination with trying to grab his dick or stick their fingers up his ass, but he gets into some funny things of how they view americans"

So true, my cousin taught primary school in Japan for 4 years and I always heard the same stories. Sick little fucks, lol.

Armabond1:

Quote :

"Even if another republican is elected in 2008 I still think it'll get better abroad."

I concur, although in my mind it would be hard to become worse.

pwrstrkdf250:

Quote :

"America is the in thing to hate... but yet foreigners come here every day for opportunities they can't find elsewhere"

Why do you think America is currently the in thing to hate? Surely you don't just think cause we got bombed first (in terms of recent terrorist attacks) that the rest of the world has decided yeah America deserved it and jumped on a "fuck them" bandwagon? And regarding the second part of your statement, most foreigners that come here nowadays are hispanics, correct? Where is the nearest and most accessible country for poor people from latin america? The USA. I argue that you should not think so narrowly that America is so great because gee whiz look at all these poor people coming here we must be the bomb. They come here because much of the time they have nothing to lose by trying. And I think that is simply a function of an impovershed or third-world inhabitant coming to the only place where they can logistically and financially afford to make it to and possibly become a resident, legal or otherwise. Not simply cause we are so awesome. In my mind, these are exactly the type of statements that continue the feedback cycle making America "the in thing to hate" as you put it.

Quote :

"I don't have a problem with people coming here at all... as long as people go through the proper routes I honestly feel like most immigrants are happier to be here than many people born here"

I think the fact that people can so easily come here going through improper routes should speak volumes for the fact that America isn't the superpower that you think it is. And secondly, well obviously they are happier here, why the hell else would they have come here? Those born here are simply just going to take it for granted. Again this more of a function of simple sociology and and psychology than it is America being so great.

Quote :

"god damn I'm beginning to hate liberals with a passion, not just dislike, but despise all you fucking do is bitch and moan about shit but yet can't fix shit or put anyone up for election that can fix a fucking thing this country needs a whole new overhaul"

You do realize that you just completely shot down your argument for hating left-wing liberals right? I mean I read your qualifying statement on being tired of conservatives as well, but your feelings of dislike are obviously much stronger for the left wing. Since the exact thing can be said for both sides, how are you going to say that you despise liberals when the fact of the matter is, only liberals are the one pushing for the changes that you seek (or whatever you are looking for when you say you just want somebody to fix a fucking thing)? And the country no longer being what it was founded upon, again this is certainly not a new issue.

moron

Quote :

"[Americans going abroad] should say they're from Canada I think they were being facetious."

No they weren't being facetious, hence the whole point of this thread.


So...


I'm surprised no one noticed this and pointed it out to me, although granted not everyone may know this, but... One thing I have reflected on however, thanks to this thread, is that most if not all of the countries I have visited in the last few years, have been second or third-world countries, and that perhaps that is the reason why I have gotten the impression that I have of how America perceives the world. The list of visited countries since 2004 to which this thread initially applied is Costa Rica, South Africa, Zimbabwe, Botswana, Namibia, Brazil, Argentina, and Chile. However, a lot of what I have said still goes for more than 50% of the numerous Europeans I have met abroad, but now that I think about it, more of the "you don't really like/agree with George Bush, do you?" has come from local peoples than Europeans that I have met. Thoughts?

9/17/2006 2:37:06 AM

Quote :

"only liberals are the one pushing for the changes that you seek (or whatever you are looking for when you say you just want somebody to fix a fucking thing)? And the country no longer being what it was founded upon, again this is certainly not a new issue."

but liberals aren't

if they were I'd vote for them

9/17/2006 8:30:49 AM

Quote :

"You'll be fine as long as you don't act like a stereotypical american overseas. Basically don't talk at the top of your lungs about how the states are better, don't flip on shopkeepers when they refuse to take dollars, and don't piss all over their cultures."

Absoultely true. I've seen the anti-American/Gringo sentiment occasionally, but it's really people looking for an outlet for their own frustration more than anything else. There was a teacher's riot (violent one, too) recently and some of the teachers kept taking it out on American/European people entering hotels, as if US policy has anything to do with what teachers get paid in foreign countries.

Plus, you'd be surprised at how quickly people ditch ideology in favor of American dollars. Or better yet, medical treatment for people who botch making moonshine.

[Edited on September 18, 2006 at 1:02 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on September 18, 2006 at 1:08 PM. Reason : .]

9/18/2006 12:59:42 PM

Muslim activists in Karachi burn an effigy of President Clinton

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/155917.stm

i thought people loved us before Bush was elected?

9/18/2006 1:05:11 PM