ok, as a spinoff from another thread i'm starting this. discussion was whether or not modular homes contain the quality of other contruction methods. lets divide this into 3 catagories:

1. traditional stick built (completely custom built. any pre fabbed panels built from stock on site.)

2. use of some pre fabbed panels (walls/roof trusses assembled in a factory, majority of construction on site. partial use of stick construction.)

3. modular (majority of assembly in a factory, transported to site in just a few pieces. virtually no stick construction.)

ok... go. i have a feeling this is going to get out of hand/clouded with cost comparison, human error, etc... but we'll see.

10/4/2006 10:53:11 PM

http://www.re4a.com/modern-modular/

http://www.fabprefab.com/fabfiles/fablisthome.htm

http://www.floatinghomes.de/

http://www.m-house.org/

the last two are pretty direct. the second you can just scroll down and get the jist. the first needs some time to navigate.


My point is that prefab housing has come a long way. Its no longer bland boring cheap homes. There is extensive design being put into these now to make well designed, quality housing. These links show a more design oriented modern version of prefab housing. There is still a lot of bland generic prefab housing, but they are are of high quality (well may be not finish materials, but structurally.)



Traditionally built homes are becoming more adn more expensive to offer quality at affordable prices. Many have turned to cookie cutter subdivisions --you can see what that has done for cities. Prefab or modular or however you want to phrase it are primarily the same idea taken to different production levels. It is possible design from a kit of parts a quality house in terms of stucture, experience, and materials that can be affordable. This becomes more affordable due to the efficiency of factory construction with on site erection (to whatever degree.) This mode of construction has been used in bridges, towers and other large scale buildings. It is done to some degree in steel construction.

What I fear and see is that portions of this industry (and traditional housing) that produce a small number of designs, mass produce them and erect them shittily (new word ).

[Edited on October 4, 2006 at 11:14 PM. Reason : ]

10/4/2006 10:57:14 PM

Modular != Mobile

Waiting in a docs office there was an article on this. Some of the high end modular builders were more expensive then 1 or 2. The largest downside it pointed out was the max room size. In order to get the pieces down the road with enough integrity to make the trip you became limited with floorplans.

1 and 2 depend a lot on the builder too. 7 or 8 years ago, builders randomly approached my sister when she was in high school to help build the houses in our neighborhood.

10/4/2006 11:09:39 PM

They all depend on the builder. 1 puts the responsiblity mostly on site. Things like cabinetry, doors, windows, fixtures, etc are already produced else where and depend on the contractor (or subs) to place. 2 more is done in a factory setting and 3 even more. The finish product still depends upon the contractor/erector/builder --but the percentage of construction on site changes.

modular doesn't equal mobile or trailer. They differ in zoning and appraisal (sp?). Saying this is like saying, "prefabed prestressed concrete sections are trailers." It is more like "the sections arrived by trailer."



[Edited on October 4, 2006 at 11:44 PM. Reason : modular are zoned the same as traditional built homes--also appraised the same]

10/4/2006 11:20:14 PM

^ that is correct.

I have first hand knowledge of a big modular with 2x6 studs, 2x12 floor joists and high line windows. It all depends on what you spec out. it arrived in four parts and had light bulbs already in the fixtures. modular is more like stickbuilt and then put on a chassis than mobile where the chassis stays with the house.

10/4/2006 11:39:02 PM

My house is somewhere b/n 1&2. All of my walls are stick built but floor joists and roof trusses are all pre fabbed. Construction is pretty solid, my problem is I hate my 8' popcorn ceiling and my cheap carpet.

As long as modular uses at least standard "2x4" for the wall studs and 3/8" gypsum for sheet rock and not the crap they use in mobile homes they're probably alright.

There is a modular home a couple miles from my house. It was really wierd because literally one day it was an empty lot, and the next there was a ~2000 sqft 2 story house sitting there.

10/5/2006 5:57:55 AM

Quote :

"All of my walls are stick built but floor joists and roof trusses are all pre fabbed"

roof trusses pre-fabbed yes, but if im right your floor joists are i-beams(i forget the 3 letter short form of what theyre called) and thats not so much a pre-fabrication deal so much as an engineered floor system that has to have a stamp of approval and whatnot over the normal 2x10 floor system.

10/5/2006 7:17:51 AM

pretty much the shell of a modular is an off-site stick built home. the stuff inside is how you want it. if you want the house to look cheap, then it will. i've seen modulars that were down right impressive.

10/5/2006 9:09:38 AM

personally, i am going to build a post and beam house when i finally settle down somwhere, 30 ft ceilings and a lofted second floor with a wide open first floor, that shit is incredible

10/5/2006 12:19:35 PM

In terms of structural quality (the actual building, not the shit in it), getting a prefab is going to get you the best house for the money.

They build to tighter tolerances and you don't risk the corner cutting that most developers will do (or at least try to do) on a stick build.

Pretty much any stick built, unless you have it completely custom designed (which you are talking like 400-500k minimum), is going to use a lot of prefabbed panels these days. Once again, it's actually better for you the consumer, you get less variance in the pieces and overall better build quality.

As for everything actually in the house, cabinets, closets et al, if you want good stuff it's going to cost good money. If you skimp it will show in the quality of materials and construction.

10/5/2006 1:12:46 PM

or you could just build it yourself

10/5/2006 1:15:38 PM

you can take the girl out of the trailer park but you can't take the trailer park out of the girl.

10/5/2006 1:17:11 PM

The posts in this thread are way more informed and intelligent than I expected.

10/5/2006 1:24:55 PM

except for this one^^

10/5/2006 1:35:13 PM

you can even buy modular units that are just the shell of the building and unfinished inside so you can finish it yourself if you so choose.

10/5/2006 1:56:12 PM

so many words... i dont want to read all of it..

but, i work at a company that manufacturers wood roof/floor trusses and wall panels, and sells i-joists, lvl beams, and other engineered wood products.

i can tell you that they had a competition ("framing the american dream") at a home builders expo where they built two identical houses (mirrored floor plans) next to each other, one with panels/trusses and one stick built.

quality control in the factory is gonna be better than at the site, and the panels/trusses have less wasted lumber and are installed/erected a lot faster. sure they cost a little more up front, but saved labor & waste will costs less in the end.

Quote :

"roof trusses pre-fabbed yes, but if im right your floor joists are i-beams(i forget the 3 letter short form of what theyre called) and thats not so much a pre-fabrication deal so much as an engineered floor system that has to have a stamp of approval and whatnot over the normal 2x10 floor system."

either way the structural design is going to have to be approved/sealed by a registered structural engineer.... this is *before* you even get a permit to build. (as you need them to get the permit)... most i-joist and engineered floor systems have been analyzed by their engineer and the company produces a sealed span/spacing chart

[Edited on October 5, 2006 at 2:24 PM. Reason : ingfo]

10/5/2006 2:22:03 PM

Quote :

"i can tell you that they had a competition ("framing the american dream") at a home builders expo where they built two identical houses (mirrored floor plans) next to each other, one with panels/trusses and one stick built."

don't you think it would be good to say the result of said competition?

10/5/2006 2:26:07 PM

Quote :

"In this demonstration, builders spent 148 hours framing the home with components. In contrast it took 401 hours to construct the conventional home, 67% longer than framing with components. In the same way, 15,100 board feet were used to frame the component home, while 20,400 board feet of lumber were used to frame the conventional home, or 26% more lumber than in the component house. Scrap generated was 4 yards for the component home, and 17 yards for the conventional home. "

http://www.sbcindustry.com/projects/woodtruss/fad.php

components:
148 hours
15,100 board feet
4 yards of scrap

stick built
401 hours
20,400 board feet
17 yards of scrap

[Edited on October 5, 2006 at 2:30 PM. Reason : cubic yards, that is]

10/5/2006 2:27:30 PM

another advantage of a modular is that its dryed in when it gets there, so you dont have to worry about losing time for weather or your subfloors warping from getting rained on. you are less likely to have stuff stolen since the doors and locks are already installed.

10/5/2006 4:32:09 PM

we dont install windows/doors here.. just the framing and osb sheathing...

theft is lower, tho, b/c the pieces are custom and pretty much worthless for anything other than that building...

[Edited on October 5, 2006 at 5:23 PM. Reason : ..]

10/5/2006 5:23:06 PM

Quote :

"The posts in this thread are way more informed and intelligent than I expected."

not much confidence in us garage croonies, eh?

Quote :

"personally, i am going to build a post and beam house when i finally settle down somwhere, 30 ft ceilings and a lofted second floor with a wide open first floor, that shit is incredible"

i guess if you can afford to build a house like that you can afford to heat/cool it 'cause it'll be expensive.

Quote :

"you can even buy modular units that are just the shell of the building and unfinished inside so you can finish it yourself if you so choose."

this is true but any home can be "modded" to buyer's specs. ex: if i want a bigger master bedroom, they can either extend the side of the house or just expand the interior walls which of course will take away from a different room. the possibilities are amazing with the new modular home designs.

10/5/2006 6:44:35 PM

Quote :

"i guess if you can afford to build a house like that you can afford to heat/cool it 'cause it'll be expensive."

not with modern hvac technology

10/6/2006 9:39:46 AM

yeah, ok.

10/6/2006 9:40:59 AM

^ so how long have you been a licensed hvac tech again? i forget

10/6/2006 12:16:42 PM

i'm going with option 1 right now with my house. damn i'm sure that really contributes to this thread... but basically from what I can tell so far, having a good friend as a contractor who's building a very similar house to the one I'm building right across the street from me is saving us both an assload of money because all the subs are charging less to do two.. hopefully i can have something like

Quote :

"personally, i am going to build a post and beam house when i finally settle down somwhere, 30 ft ceilings and a lofted second floor with a wide open first floor, that shit is incredible""

will be possible with my second house...

10/6/2006 1:47:36 PM

^^actually, i have had my universal certification since '97.

now what?

10/6/2006 5:14:51 PM

well then you sir are an idiot if you dont understand zone control and the kind of things you can do with it, they have affordable control boards now that can accept up to 12 temperature inputs and control up to 30 actuators, with programmable logic. the days of heat shooting straight up to a 30 ft ceiling are gone

as a matter of fact i am installing a 3 zone system to split up one heat pump between some new additions that wont be used all the time and is a waste to heat/cool with the rest of the house next week, if you want to come take notes or anything

[Edited on October 7, 2006 at 11:55 AM. Reason : asshat]

10/7/2006 11:53:20 AM

I haven't seen anything in this thread about completely off-grid 5000 square foot geodesic domes sitting on top of a mountain???

Cutting/fitting all those damn angled roof panels, whilest hanging off the roof structure with rappelling gear, standing on snow covered lumber, is a bit of a pain in the ass.

10/7/2006 12:16:11 PM

Quote :

"the days of heat shooting straight up to a 30 ft ceiling are gone"

ok. you're right. zone control and all that new technology shit about blowing air when and where has defied the laws of physics that heat rises and cool air falls.

10/8/2006 10:59:13 AM

My parents live on the Albemarle sound in a 50+ year old home in a very rural area. A developer has contacted my family (grandma, parents and aunt combined own ~40 acres in this area) and wants to pay them nicely for the land and pretty much build a small city where they are and give them houses in the new community. Apparently the new houses will be almost completely built in a factory right down to the faucets and flooring. I was pretty apprehensive about these kind of homes, thinking that they were pretty much large trailers, but it sounds like this might not be a bad way to go. The plans that we've seen look really nice and the community is supposed to have houses from the 250s to 500s. Thanks, garage, for soothing my concerns.

10/9/2006 11:36:06 AM

^modulars in many cases are built more sturdily than stick built stuff.

I don't know if I'd sell anything waterfront on the sound just yet. The market is cooling down.

10/9/2006 11:45:56 AM

Quote :

"ok. you're right. zone control and all that new technology shit about blowing air when and where has defied the laws of physics that heat rises and cool air falls."

Are you going to actually form a rebuttal other than this red herring bullshit you threw out, or are you going to just let the domination that 69 just put on you stand?

10/9/2006 12:00:15 PM

Quote :

"ok. you're right. zone control and all that new technology shit about blowing air when and where has defied the laws of physics that heat rises and cool air falls."

so you think its a better idea to heat a cathedral room by pumping hot air in at floor level, and letting the temperature near the ceiling reach 10-15 degrees more than the living space temp due to convection, rather than recirculating the hot air from the ceiling level in the winter to the living space, so the heat pump only cycles as needed for makeup from actual heat loss to the outside?

i don't understand what the fuck you are argueing about and i dont think you do either

10/9/2006 12:46:40 PM

Quote :

"Cutting/fitting all those damn angled roof panels, whilest hanging off the roof structure with rappelling gear, standing on snow covered lumber, is a bit of a pain in the ass."

I worked on a subdivision project in Chatham County just on the other side of Lake Jordan...had a builder in there putting up a geodesic. It is quite a bit more complicated, but all his triangle framing was prefabbed from 2x4 stud stock. I thought it was pretty interesting, but I'm not convinced I would choose such a structure.

10/9/2006 1:03:33 PM

Quote :

"so you think its a better idea to heat a cathedral room by pumping hot air in at floor level, and letting the temperature near the ceiling reach 10-15 degrees more than the living space temp due to convection, rather than recirculating the hot air from the ceiling level in the winter to the living space, so the heat pump only cycles as needed for makeup from actual heat loss to the outside?"

I don't think that is what he was saying at all. He was saying that you couldn't just heat the living space and not worry about the higher up air. No matter what you do . . . you have a higher volume of air to heat.

10/9/2006 8:51:05 PM