I know I didn't spell out all the names except the one that matters but I don't get why McCauley doesn't get any press. Hansbrough is very, very good at the college level. We all know that. McBob has potential to be good in the NBA. We all get that. But their numbers aren't much better as a whole than McCauley's are and he gets no pub. Here's a quick rundown of the most important stats for a big man IMO order from best to worst for each.

Minutes per game: McCauley: 35.2; McBob: 34.9 Hansbrough: 29.2
Points per game: Hansbrough: 18.5; McCauley: 16.1; McBob: 13.1
Points per minute: Hansbrough: 0.64; McCauley: 0.46; McBob: 0.38
Rebounds per game: McBob: 7.9; Hansbrough: 7.7; McCauley: 6.6
Assists per game: McBob: 3.7; McCauley: 3.6; Hansbrough: 1.3
Blocks per game: McBob: 2.5; Hansbrough: .5; McCauley: .4
FG%: McCauley: 60.1%; Hansbrough: 52.4%; McBob: 50.8%
Turnovers per game: McBob: 2.3; McCauley: 2.1; Hansbrough: 1.9

So when the hype machine is taken away who is the best? Well it's hard to say. I'd lean towards Tyler offensively personally because his numbers are all in 5-6 minutes less per game on a team where he can be the 4th option SOME games. However, the argument can also be made that he is made better by the team around him (though last year seems to prove otherwise?).

Defensively McBob is probably the best. He gets far more blocked shots per game and is right there with Hansbrough for rebounds. However, McBob doesn't score enough for the minutes he plays.

And when you really look at the assist numbers they aren't what Vitale/Patrick seem to say they are. McCauley has virtually the same assist numbers as McBob. When you consider that Big Ben plays primarily in the post and at the top of the key and not as a ballhandler (as McBob does on many occasions) you can very easily make the argument that he is the best passer of the three.

As for efficiency. I don't think you can argue against the fact that McCauley is the most efficient offensive player. Third best FG% in the ACC and he doesn't get the benefit of the calls as the NC State big man like the other two (yes, that is subjective)

Aside from the usual retarded UNC is gay and Fuck Duke stuff, thoughts?

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:37 AM. Reason : turnovers added. travels missed is pure conjecture...]

2/19/2007 11:32:08 AM

carolina and duke are winning games

we aren't

2/19/2007 11:32:48 AM

stats on turnovers? and travels per game plz?

2/19/2007 11:33:45 AM

^^ Point?

I think Tyler is probably best right now, but he and McBob have more experience than McCauley

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:36 AM. Reason : ]

2/19/2007 11:35:29 AM

good players on good teams get a lot more press than good players on bad teams

2/19/2007 11:35:52 AM

haha

I had no clue who mcbob was until I read the last line.

McCauley is asked to do more and has better postmoves than hansbrough and mcroberts. I dont really see any of them doing much in the NBA.

2/19/2007 11:35:57 AM

I don't think McCauley is asked to do more than McRoberts, who at times is one of Duke's primary ballhandlers. Now they both certainly are asked to do more for their team (as a %) as Hansbrough...

2/19/2007 11:40:27 AM

its the tempo

2/19/2007 11:40:45 AM

Quote :

"and has better postmoves than hansbrough and mcroberts"

wow, pass it on down to me so I can take a drink

2/19/2007 11:41:34 AM

McRoberts won't have to use post moves in the NBA, he just has to here because college teams usually don't have true centers.

If he can sharpen up his offensive game a bit he could be a player like Andrei Kirilenko.

2/19/2007 11:42:05 AM

Quote :

"I don't think McCauley is asked to do more than McRoberts, who at times is one of Duke's primary ballhandlers. Now they both certainly are asked to do more for their team (as a %) as Hansbrough..."

yeah maybe not mcroberts, but yea, definately relied on more than hansbrough

2/19/2007 11:42:36 AM

^^^What?

He does has good post moves. Better than McRoberts and debatable with Hansbro.

It's not a ridiculous statement.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:42 AM. Reason : ]

2/19/2007 11:42:39 AM

yes, he does have better POST moves,,, mcroberts I would say just doesnt have shit for post moves and hansbrough just does that shoulder drop and shot over his head thats unblockable,,, its a great technique, unblockable, and he makes 80% of them probably, but not really a post style move

2/19/2007 11:44:14 AM

i've already ended this thread

unless this is supposed to be a discussion of who the 'better' player is

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:44 AM. Reason : ]

2/19/2007 11:44:35 AM

Quote :

"If he can sharpen up his offensive game a bit he could be a player like Andrei Kirilenko."

i sure hope so, that means he will be hurt all the time like AK or another dook pro, grant hill

2/19/2007 11:46:14 AM

Quote :

"yes, he does have better POST moves,,, mcroberts I would say just doesnt have shit for post moves and hansbrough just does that shoulder drop and shot over his head thats unblockable,,, its a great technique, unblockable, and he makes 80% of them probably, but not really a post style move"

actually he makes 52.4% of them

2/19/2007 11:47:51 AM

haha... you know what i meant right? jump shots and any other shit probably brings it down to 52.4

2/19/2007 11:50:21 AM

McCauley is good, the footwork needs a little work, but i think he could have better moves than Hansblow... but if he would put in the time to lifting and working out like the shit they had tyler doing in the offseason he really would take that next step up...

mcfag cant play in the post when hes up against stronger players because it agitates his vagina

2/19/2007 11:50:26 AM

I personally think McRoberts has the best post moves he just isn't strong enough to finish yet. He gets his shots across the lane pretty much whenever he wants but sucks at finishing.

Personally I think Hansbrough is the least gifted of the three in the post. Yeah, I know that sounds strange and I'll probably get killed for it but he is the most hardworking (on the court) of the three. He pretty much says "I'm going to score here and no one is going to stop me" and most of the time he does. Plus, he is VERY good at drawing contact.

If McCauley can refine his game a bit more I think he can be second team All-ACC next year... When he gets the ball at the correct time he can score in bunches. However, the lack of a true 1 for us this year has hampered him a bit in a few games..

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:56 AM. Reason : x]

2/19/2007 11:55:34 AM

Don't forget that Hansbrough shoots more FT than anyone in the ACC, and makes almost 80% of them.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:56 AM. Reason : That accounts for like 5-6 points a game average]

2/19/2007 11:55:59 AM

I love this thread. Very thought provoking.

My only additions are this:
-Handsborg gets away with traveling more than any big man in college bball. He's famous for it. His footwork is so good that it fools refs into letting him travel.
-McBobs has way more potential than he is currently playing up to. He is by far the most attractive of the three in the long run because of this.
-Both the Borg and McBobs having already been heavy contributers to good teams for more than one full year, McCauley has not had that distinction. We know less about Big Ben than we do about the Borg or McBobs because he just literally came out of nowhere with crazy intensity that outdoes either of the other two in that aspect at least.

Bottomline: its too early to really tell if McCauley will be the next Guggliotta or the next Brackman. McBobs and the Borg are already definite NBA players and thats something McCauley hasnt proven just yet. Plus to Big Ben is that because of his lack of hype we will have him longer and he has more years to prove himself.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 11:58 AM. Reason : sp]

2/19/2007 11:56:51 AM

Quote :

"Personally I think Hansbrough is the least gifted of the three in the post. Yeah, I know that sounds strange and I'll probably get killed for it but he is the most hardworking (on the court) of the three. He pretty much says "I'm going to score here and no one is going to stop me" and most of the time he does. Plus, he is VERY good at drawing contact."

i agree with this 100%

i cant knock a guy for working hard to make up for areas he is weak in

2/19/2007 11:57:28 AM

heaven save you if you try to double team his will

2/19/2007 11:59:17 AM

well for starters, isn't McRobert's a natural 4 than a 5? Also, Hansblow was an all american as a freshman for those who have forgotten, this isn't about NBA potential, which Hansblow doesn't have as much as McRoberts IMO, but about post moves in college here and now. Hansblow wins this easily. I realize McCauley has developed a few good moves over the summer, but in no way is he a consistent game changer like Hansblow is game in and game out in the low block. When Hansblow doesn't play well, they usually don't play well, we can play around McCauley if necessary.

2/19/2007 12:00:39 PM

none of what you just said has anything to do with post moves.

Hanbrough is great at shouldering down and throwing the same shot up every time.

He has no post moves outside from that. McCauley makes some sweet moves and has consistent left or right handed shots.

McRoberts, like Ny said, has everything but the finish.

2/19/2007 12:03:57 PM

I PERSONALLY THINK ALL THREE OF THEM WILL GET DRAFTED.....MCBOB PROBABLY HAS THE MOST POTENTIAL TO MAKE IT AS A ROLL PLAYER DUE TO HIS BALL HANLDING SKILLS BUT TO BE HONEST I DON'T THINK ANY OF THEM WILL SUCEED IN THE NBA....I KNOW ALL THREE OF THEM ARE SOPHMORES BUT ISN'T HANSBROUGH LIKE 25 YEARS OLD? HOW OLD ARE THE OTHER TWO?

2/19/2007 12:04:33 PM

the better question is,

Who is better at guarding the other guys post moves

based on the only game against unc this year

McCauley guarding Tyler > Tyler guarding McCauley

and its even worse when lazy ass Wright guards him

2/19/2007 12:04:56 PM

All 3 are sub 7-foot white guys who can't shoot. I personally don't think any of them will make in the NBA. McRoberts will get drafted high just cuz he plays for Duke.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 12:09 PM. Reason : :]

2/19/2007 12:09:12 PM

Quote :

"He has no post moves outside from that"

If it ain't broke don't fix it. He's shown he can consistently score in the low block for a 1 3/4 seasons, what more proof do you need? Neither Mcroberts nor McCauley has. If his one move is stronger than another's 4 moves, then it doesn't matter. McCauley played great against Hansblow in Raleigh, but I think you all forgot Hansblow still had like 24 and 8, so how is giving up 24 and 8 < 17 and 4??? He also got McCauley in foul trouble which is just as valuable. Wednesday should be interesting and could be an even bigger breakout for Ben.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 12:17 PM. Reason : .]

2/19/2007 12:16:16 PM

Andrew Tyler Hansbrough (born November 3, 1985 in Columbia, Missouri)
Joshua Scott McRoberts (born February 28, 1987, in Carmel, Indiana)
Ben McCauley - Born September 6, 1986 (No wiki entry)

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 12:18 PM. Reason : Tyler is old for his grade, McRoberts is young for his grade]

2/19/2007 12:16:41 PM

i remember, trust me

they are actually a lot alike

2/19/2007 12:17:28 PM

Quote :

"If it ain't broke don't fix it. He's shown he can consistently score in the low block for a 1 3/4 seasons, what more proof do you need? Neither Mcroberts nor McCauley has. If his one move is stronger than another's 4 moves, then it doesn't matter. McCauley played great against Hansblow in Raleigh, but I think you all forgot Hansblow still had like 24 and 8, so how is giving up 24 and 8 < 17 and 4??? He also got McCauley in foul trouble which is just as valuable. Wednesday should be interesting."

Who are you arguing with? Seriously. Noone is sitting here saying that McCauley >>>> Hansbrough.

Im talking about post moves. McCauleys are better.

2/19/2007 12:19:44 PM

Quote :

"Andrew Tyler Hansbrough (born November 3, 1985 in Columbia, Missouri) Joshua Scott McRoberts (born February 28, 1987, in Carmel, Indiana) Ben McCauley - Born September 6, 1986 (No wiki entry) "

THAT MAKES ME FEEL REALLY OLD

2/19/2007 12:22:08 PM

Quote :

"Who are you arguing with? Seriously. Noone is sitting here saying that McCauley >>>> Hansbrough."

==>

Quote :

"McCauley guarding Tyler > Tyler guarding McCauley"

Quote :

"McCauleys are better."

Try starting a sports conversation with this claim with a non die hard NCSU fan in the ACC and see if you don't get laughed at for a few minutes, that's all I'm saying, ask a neutral fan.

2/19/2007 12:23:46 PM

Well, having went to a HS right down the road from where Ben went in PA, I can say that Ben has phenomenal talent that most people don't give him credit for because he didn't hale from one of the Prep schools, academies, or traditional HS powerhouses.

Yough HS is actually kinda a bumfuck small school, which is I believe AA in our league. He was however very respected in the Pittsburgh area newspapers, and garnered POY from the one paper as I recall. Give credit to Herb for finding him (likely from his Pittsburgh ties) because IMHO he was very underrated, Im not sure of his *star* rating though coming out of HS. I guess all I'm trying to say is that if he was McD AA (as with the other 2 in this comparison), which he probably would have been if he attended a different HS...

I think people's preconceptions of him would be quite different and he would get respect on par w/ McBob and Tyler in the media. He's a great player though and if he keeps workin at it by next yr and his 4th yr he will be included in All-ACC discussions, even w/ our additions to our bigs coming in.

2/19/2007 1:11:39 PM

Quote :

"Try starting a sports conversation with this claim with a non die hard NCSU fan in the ACC and see if you don't get laughed at for a few minutes, that's all I'm saying, ask a neutral fan. "

I never said anything about McCaulley being a better defender.

Also, ask anyone competent in the game who has the better post moves. Just watch the two of them.

2/19/2007 1:35:08 PM

If Hans. didn't have so many other weapons on his team, he'd be averaging at least 21-22 ppg

2/19/2007 2:19:00 PM

^Well that could go the other way too.

If Hansborough played for NCSU would he average more points? Probably not because teams would double team him.

2/19/2007 2:28:06 PM

^ teams do double team him, and pretty often

2/19/2007 2:28:57 PM

He still gets doubled at UNC

2/19/2007 2:29:08 PM

Quote :

"If Hansborough played for NCSU would he average more points? Probably not because teams would double team him."

That's how he gets all of his points.

Teams double team him, since they know he never passes it back out to the open man, So he just jumps into them while throwing the ball at the basket. Since the ACC is a finesse oriented league, and called very tightly most of the time, he gets 2 foul shots or an and 1.

He wouldn't be half as good in the big 10, where they don't call fouls like that.

2/19/2007 2:30:53 PM

More focus would be on him though.....he gets help from all of the talent on the UNC team.

There are more weapons at their hands.....

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 2:32 PM. Reason : ^ Or the NCAA Tournament ]

2/19/2007 2:32:12 PM

from 850 the blog:

Quote :

"Ben McCauley is as good a low post player as there is in this league and without question has the best post moves in the conference. It has nothing to do with numbers, but McCauley is their best player not named Atsur and he’s a lock for at least a 2nd team all league spot."

http://www.850thebuzz.com/blog/?p=2435#more-2435

kind of funny that the the day this thread was made adam gold wrote that

2/19/2007 3:08:22 PM

^ Well over the last decade in the ACC, the player with the best post game has traditionally been a lottery pick

2/19/2007 3:16:16 PM

NCSUMEB...is there really a neutral sports person to ask this? The media tends to play a bias role. What I mean by that is this: UNC is winning games, Hansblow gets the most credit for being the best post player in the league, which means that he gets the most compliments about his post game; NCSU is occasionally winning games, ergo McCauley occasionally gets credit for being a good post player. I'm not saying one is better than the other. I'm just saying there isn't a "neutral" person out there to ask. Someone in California is going to say Hansblow, someone in PA might say McCauley (if they have kept up with him, otherwise is going to say Hansblow), and everyone in NC is going to say something different. It's all about the media coverage.

2/19/2007 4:07:23 PM

Another difference is McCauley will still be dominating the ACC next year.

While the other 2 will be sitting on the bench in the NBA.

2/19/2007 5:35:56 PM

^^ nail hit on head

2/19/2007 5:45:18 PM

McCauley has the best post moves of all of them, McRoberts I think is a horrible player but I think he's been ruined by d00k's coaching staff...wojo coaches the big men...wtf? He's incredibly athletic and has forgotten how to play basketball. He'll come around though.


and...

Quote :

"All 3 are sub 7-foot white guys who can't shoot. "

McCauley has consistently shown that he can step out and shoot the 10-15 foot jumper. Hansblow probably shoots more of them, but I bet he hits a lower percentage. I'd be willing to bet that McCauley has a better midrange game than Shelden Williams ever had in his 4 years at d00k. I'm not saying that makes him a better player, but if you're basing NBA potential on the ability to shoot, McCauley will be fine.

2/19/2007 8:27:13 PM

McCauley does have better post moves than mcroberts and hans. Hans just gets position and pushes 4 people out of the way (and travels). McRoberts sucks in the post. He never backs a guy down and makes a move. Always passes out without even trying.


Hansbrough has the edge over McCauley, right now. Someone put costner up on that list. I think he has more points and rebounds than mccauley.

[Edited on February 19, 2007 at 8:40 PM. Reason : sdf]

2/19/2007 8:38:54 PM

I think Costner is a little sloppy in the post, although he scores a lot also. McCauley is just polished and smooth.

2/19/2007 8:42:04 PM