what are your experiences?

i went to public schools all my life. so did my wife. we both think that our public schools sucked. we are inclined to think that our kid will go to a private school at least through the elementary grades.

when i went to public schools there were basically 4 major division of cliques: preps, jocks, hoods, and nerds. obviously there were subgroups within each major group. But I'm out of date now, its been a long time since I was in high school. also my high school was overwhelmingly suburban upper middle class and about 95% white.

Anyhow, my wife thinks that the kids at private schools are going to be more academically oriented, that there won't be the groups with the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude that is common at public schools. She gives the NC School of Science and Math as an example.

I say that the NCSSM is hardly representative of most private schools, even the "academically oriented" ones, and that most private schools are still going to have the reject clique... call them hoods, heads, goths, druggies, whatever... they're still going to be there. just like theres going to be the jocks and gearheads who just want to lift weights or race cars.

but ... my experience comes from my singular, homogenous public school experience, and I never went to private school or really had any friends who went to private schools.

and to be honest I'm really out of touch of what even the public high schools are like today, especially the ones in urban areas and/or high minority populations

so maybe some of you guys can fill me in?







[Edited on March 23, 2007 at 11:04 PM. Reason : ]

3/23/2007 11:00:58 PM

Quote :

"my wife thinks that the kids at private schools are going to be more academically oriented, that there wont be the groups who play the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude that is common at public schools. She gives the NC School of Science and Math as an example. "

1) She's completely wrong.

2) NCSSM is public.

3/23/2007 11:05:22 PM

Quote :

"NCSSM is public"

ok, good point. she may have not actually said it was private. i just assumed it was. my bad.

but anyhow, NCSSM is unique, and you cant compare it to the average public or private school. I'm not making *any* plans that my kid is going to that kind of school .... so forget anything about NCSSM.

my real issue here is about private school cliques comparted to public schools.

so when you say

Quote :

"She's completely wrong."

what are you basing this on? did you go to private schools? give me somethign to work with here.

3/23/2007 11:13:39 PM

You're concerned about cliques? Seriously?

Where did you go to public school? North Carolina? Because if so, that's about 90% of the problem right there.

3/23/2007 11:14:11 PM

I went to public school (Enloe), my brother went to private school.

Anyone that thinks private schools are full of nice, overachieving kids is very naive--quite a few kids end up there because they're in constant trouble in public school and their parents think they need more discipline (which may or may not make a difference in their behavior).

3/23/2007 11:19:01 PM

^^ no im not "concerned" about cliques. at least not in a retarded sense you seem to imply. I know that obviously there are cliques everyhwere you go. your entire life. its inescapable.

really this boils down to me having an argument with my wife. she seems to think the "cool to be stupid" cliques are not going to have a presence at the private schools. I think shes wrong. but she wont listen to what i say, because i dont know anything.

so i said, "Ima go research this"... and so thats when i came here and posted.

obviously its all about teaching your kid to have self worth and make their own judgements that they respect themselves and dont feel the need to hang out with dopehead crowds.

because for middle and high school, peer pressure is a big thing, and who you choose as your friends can have a positive or a negative3 impact the direction you take in life. face it, the people who hang out behind the school smoking cigarettes with the dopers and scoffing at everyone and everything, generally are not going to be as successful in life as a kid who cares about academics and extracurricular activities.

so in that sense i am "concerned" about cliques. I just dont think youre going to avoid the problem of cliques by going to a private school.

Quote :

"Where did you go to public school? North Carolina? "

actually, no. I did for elementary, but for my middle and high school (the suburban 95% white school i described earlier), we had actually moved to the Midwest. a suburb outside a large city. I moved back to NC on my own after I got out of the military.





[Edited on March 23, 2007 at 11:27 PM. Reason : ^^]

3/23/2007 11:23:42 PM

Quote :

"I went to public school (Enloe), my brother went to private school."

so what kind of private school was it? academic? arts? social? and why did he go there and you not? do you think he had a "better" high-school experience? do you think he would reccommend it?

3/23/2007 11:31:41 PM

Quote :

"I just dont think youre going to avoid the problem of cliques by going to a private school."

I doubt you are either. Like you said, it's going to come down to parenting more than anything else. If you fail as a parent, your kid is going to find trouble whether in a prestigious private school or a common public school.

Quote :

"actually, no. I did for elementary, but for my middle and high school (the suburban 95% white school i described earlier), we had actually moved to the Midwest. a suburb outside a large city. I moved back to NC on my own after I got out of the military."

You should see how those schools rank nationally. Where you live should be of more concern than public or private. For example, I've attended public schools in both NJ and NC and one of the main concerns in both places for my parents was the school district that they'd move into, (just about) regardless of the commute they'd have to make for work. While NJ schools are a lot better than NC schools, they still went out of their way to make sure that we lived near one of the best schools down here.

[Edited on March 23, 2007 at 11:34 PM. Reason : .]

3/23/2007 11:32:27 PM

There's always going to be cliques. There were in the private and public schools I went to.

The "it's cool to be stupid" aspect is key, though.

Given the selective nature of private schools and the high socioeconomic statuses of private school students, the chances of any of the cliques having the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude is slim.


I'm very thankful that I went to a private middle school. Public schools breed mediocrity. It's good to have responsibility and ambition drilled into kids at some point.

3/23/2007 11:32:38 PM

Quote :

"Given the selective nature of private schools and the high socioeconomic statuses of private school students, the chances of any of the cliques having the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude is slim."

so, are you saying that there's "reject" cliques in private schools (newschool hippy ravers? angst ridden disaffected goths? pot smoking emo kids?) and they're like rejecting society and all that, but still maintaining a high level of academic initiative?

3/23/2007 11:40:58 PM

No, and from my experience private schools are even more clique-y.

The thing is, all the cliques are still interested in achievement. If they weren't, they wouldn't be in a mildly selective private school.


I was in the grunge clique at catholic school. We were such a bunch of wanna-be stoners it wasn't even funny. But we still realized how important education was, and any one of us would've destroyed the typical public school student academically.

[Edited on March 23, 2007 at 11:49 PM. Reason : .]

3/23/2007 11:46:51 PM

lemme take a pause here, and just ask, what are the basic cliques these days anyhow? im old as fuck. i graduated high school in '90.

when i went to HS, we had 4 basic groups. Preps, Jocks, Hoods, and Nerds. of course there were subgroups.

jocks had the real sport players and weight lifters, but there were also the more country bumpkins who were more into cars and mechanics but sports only somewhat.

the so-called Hoods had like a "Led Zeppelin" group, a "Metal" group, a "Punk" group, and a few true delinquents but mostly just a bunch of drug users.

the Nerd group had like "art nerds" (cool) and "band nerds" (not cool) and "nerd nerds" (way not cool) and "special ed nerds" (actually dorks, off the map not cool).

preps had subgroups, like "christian preps" and "cheerleader/student council preps" and "secret druggie crash my dad's BMW preps" ... but since i couldnt afford expensive clothes so i was largely excluded from inner secrets of preppie groups.

all of this seems like totally antiquated and quaint to me now. I only imagine that the cliques have gotten more complicated... or have they?

3/23/2007 11:52:41 PM

Quote :

"Given the selective nature of private schools and the high socioeconomic statuses of private school students, the chances of any of the cliques having the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude is slim. "

Not all private schools are selective, and not all of them necessitate high socioeconomic backgrounds.

I would say the 2 main factors in the "it's cool to be stupid" clique is either having dumb parents or being rebellious against overbearing parents. Public schools are going to have a good mix of both types of parents, where as a private school is going to have an over-represented set of the latter type of parents. Considering this, I would surmise that private schools as well as public schools both have this issue, in functionally equal amounts.

Good parenting can always overcome the issue in any situation though, and if you're thinking about private/public school, this problem shouldn't be a factor, it's normalized out essentially.

3/23/2007 11:56:43 PM

Quote :

"I was in the grunge clique at catholic school. "

so you were kind of in the "reject" clique, then, am i right?

because if you guys were pretending to be some major stoners, im imagine the rest of the school kind of looked at you like social lepers.

(at least that's my experience, cause i was in the "metalhead" clique. which, unlike your group, also had an "it's cool to be stupid" attitude )


what was funny to me, was there were some serious drug using preppies who were cool in the preppie crowds, but because they didnt dress like homeless bums and loiter behind school smoking cigarettes, it was cool for them to smoke pot, snort coke, drop acid, whatever.






[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 12:05 AM. Reason : ]

3/24/2007 12:02:26 AM

Quote :

"Anyhow, my wife thinks that the kids at private schools are going to be more academically oriented, that there won't be the groups with the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude that is common at public schools. She gives the NC School of Science and Math as an example. "

It was quite the opposite at my high school.

The cool kids at my school were the really well rounded ones. The ones that were smart and played sports.
Most of them were in the honors classes, a few were in the regular classes, and even less were in the sub-par classes.



Even the "dorky" or "nerd" kids at my high school were liked. One guy that I graduated with was in chess club and pretty damn smart. He went to the beat of his own drum for the most part. However we still liked him.

The kids we didn't want to hang out with were the ones that smelled bad, or were going to get us arrested if we hung out with them.

But now that I think of it, we didn't even really have "cliques" at my school.

I guess it just depends on the school and the area. I know it was different at the other high schools in the area that I lived in. I would just do research and talk to parents of the kids that already go to the school.

[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 12:07 AM. Reason : ]

3/24/2007 12:02:45 AM

Quote :

"the rest of the school kind of looked at you like social lepers"

Yeah.

The thing is, all the kids were nerds by public school standards. We just liked to pretend otherwise.

3/24/2007 12:07:17 AM

Quote :

"The cool kids at my school were the really well rounded ones. The ones that were smart and played sports. Most of them were in the honors classes, a few were in the regular classes, and even less were in the sub-par classes. "

you're right. thats the way it *should* be.

but did the "reject" clique (stoners, hoods, whatever) think these kids were "cool"? of course not. didn't they (the rejects) just try to redefine cool to fit their own group?

obviously kids who hang with the losers, underachievers, druggies... dont go around saying "yeah, im totally uncool. you people who get good grades and participate are the cool ones". (i mean its true, and maybe they secretly know it, but they'll never say so)

there still was -- i would bet -- an element in your school that defined "cool" as getting into trouble, and rejecting academics. apparently you didnt associate or identify with that crowd which probably explains a lot of your own life successes

...

Quote :

"But now that I think of it, we didn't even really have "cliques" at my school."

wait, are you serious? are you saying you didnt have *any* of the stoner-hood-whatever type clique in your school at all? did you go to a private school? or did you go to some like really small rural school?







[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 12:18 AM. Reason : ]

3/24/2007 12:10:23 AM

Quote :

"The thing is, all the kids were nerds by public school standards. We just liked to pretend otherwise"

haha. arent we all just doing that? really?

3/24/2007 12:15:48 AM

Well really we had a small class...less than 150 that graduated. We all knew one another.

There was kinda a competition to be high up in the class.

I guess we did have the cliques, but not as well defined. More of a you were either "cool" or you weren't. A lot of my class were the social butterflies that would associate with everyone.

My roommate and I went to high school together and we were talking about how we thought the "cool" kids in our class started off.
Basically in middle school it was the boy that all the girls thought was cute that turned into the coolest guy at our school. Then the girl that the boy liked was the coolest girl.
Then once we got to high school it was the girls who dated the older boys who were the cool girls, and it was the boys that had all the girls having a crush on them.

So really I think it pretty much had to do with looks.




Well now that I think of it, just disregard anything I just said...I'm drunk

3/24/2007 12:29:28 AM

Coddling your kid is worse than sending them through the gauntlet of public schools. Furthermore, it won't make a damn bit of difference if your child is raised correctly with decent judgment. You make it sound like cliques are fiefdoms in epic struggles.

In reality, cliques are only a problem for the weak-willed who can't look out for themselves, anyway. Similar people seek out similar people. Otherwise, they are something that normal people easily handled/ignored/not even a problem (some people like sports/computers/socializing/fashion more than others. big damn deal).

[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 12:40 AM. Reason : sdf]

3/24/2007 12:29:51 AM

I went to public school all my life till 10th grade and I went to private school for the rest of the 2 years. Private school was a LOT more cliquey then public. We had a lot of kids in my hs that were a bit crazy. I would stick with public

3/24/2007 12:32:15 AM

^^^ lol. ok. i think i get your point. we'll make sure our kid looks good

^^ part of me agrees with you 100%. the other part of me remembers how much my public school sucked.

^ interesting comment. do you think maybe because you transferred into a new school halfway thru highschool that you had a hard time fitting into established groups, just for the simple fact that you were "that new kid"

3/24/2007 12:39:52 AM

nope the friends i made in private school were amazing and i'm still friends with them. It took me about 6 months to become good friends with them but I would never forget/talk to them at all. I still talk to 3 of my best friends in hs.

The education is wonderful but its hard to start over in the middle of school (like I did in high school)

3/24/2007 12:42:37 AM

The biggest problem with public schools are lack of opportunities, such as enough AP classes, electives, or extracurriculars. However, private schools are usually in a worse position wrt resources. Resources are school-system dependent, not necessarily private-public.

3/24/2007 12:43:22 AM

Quote :

"The biggest problem with public schools are lack of opportunities, such as enough AP classes, electives, or extracurriculars."

True in general, but all of that's offset if you go to a good magnet school.

3/24/2007 12:47:01 AM

Not all public schools blow ass, my friend. I'd have a really hard time spending so much money on private school when I knew there were, in fact, places where my kid could get a good education for the cost of my tax dollars.

I mean, I was in the International Baccalaureate program at several public schools from the time I was in elementary school (think magnet school) through 10th grade. And I honestly would not have traded the majority of my teachers- they were great. The program was challenging enough that it didn't hold me back (they even let me continue a year ahead in math). I was mainly, therefore, in the IB clique- the smart kids stuck together, since the high school I went to was actually rather large (about 3000 people). I honestly didn't give a shit about the high school as a whole- IB made it feel a lot more intimate than it would've been otherwise. I'm just saying, don't knock public schools entirely.

3/24/2007 12:48:36 AM

Quote :

"However, private schools are usually in a worse position wrt resources. Resources are school-system dependent, not necessarily private-public. "

if i'm paying $12K+ / yr tuition, they damn well better not have "resource problems"

im not talking about sending a kid to some bible thumping jesus-freak school where they sit in trailers and learn that dinosaur bones were put in the ground 6000 years ago by Satan.




[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 12:50 AM. Reason : ]

3/24/2007 12:48:44 AM

Quote :

"I'm just saying, don't knock public schools entirely. "

word. im down with that. there are some really good magnet type high schools in seattle. i mean, my kid is only 2 yrs old, so who really knows where the hell he'll go to kindergarten, much less high school.

but there are also some shit hole public schools too. i mean, obviously ill have to judge the field as it exists when the time comes.

but i am thinking that a solidly academic private school is probably the best bet for the elementary years... middle school, i dont know. high school, im pretty inclined towards public.

3/24/2007 12:55:47 AM

if you dont want your kid to deal with cliques you have to find a hippy nature school

3/24/2007 1:01:51 AM

Quote :

"so what kind of private school was it? academic? arts? social?"

Catholic and Episcopalian schools with a pretty good academic reputation.

Quote :

"and why did he go there and you not?"

He went because of discipline issues.

Quote :

"do you think he had a "better" high-school experience? do you think he would reccommend it?"

I'd say I had by far the better educational experience. My public high school offered tons of AP courses (I entered State with ~30 hours of credit), ridiculous amounts of electives to choose from, clubs for virtually anything you could think of...and I don't think any of that could be replicated in a smaller school because there wouldn't be enough people interested in a particular subject to justify having the extra courses available.

3/24/2007 1:02:11 AM

Quote :

"word. im down with that. there are some really good magnet type high schools in seattle. i mean, my kid is only 2 yrs old, so who really knows where the hell he'll go to kindergarten, much less high school. but there are also some shit hole public schools too. i mean, obviously ill have to judge the field as it exists when the time comes."

Yeah, my mom did a bunch of research right after we moved here. She created this plan to help me avoid the IB lottery (since there are only so many seats, basically). I had to get bussed into inner-city Charlotte for an hour and a half every morning to go to that magnet elementary school (which, to be honest, was a good eye-opener for me at a young age). But since I did that, I automatically got in to the IB middle school and later on, IB high school. It just takes research and planning based on the district and its school board/planning.

[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 1:04 AM. Reason : .]

3/24/2007 1:04:01 AM

Those NCSSM fuckers are weird

I applied back in HS cause I thought maybe it would be better off than my ghetto HS, got in but when I went to the open house I was like wooooah, this ain't for me, damn I thought I was awkward and nerdy, not to mention durham and not being able to really have a car or anything.

Then again I might have ended up going if they were doing that college tuition thing when I was applying.


And for the love of god don't home school, every home schooler I've met is just flat out crazy

3/24/2007 1:10:20 AM

Quote :

"My public high school offered tons of AP courses (I entered State with ~30 hours of credit), ridiculous amounts of electives to choose from, clubs for virtually anything you could think of...and I don't think any of that could be replicated in a smaller school because there wouldn't be enough people interested in a particular subject to justify having the extra courses available."

yeah Enloe is a good school. theres a public high school in seattle i really like, its alot like that. it even has an 'engineering' curriculum.... not technology either, but true engineering thats coordinated with U of Washington. so id be really down with that HS.

i just think maybe he ought to go private during the early years so he gets a good foundation. i really remember pretty solidly hating my public school as early as 2nd Grade. and it didnt get any better. i mean, is that normal? should kids *hate* school by the time they're in 2nd Grade for chrissakes?

3/24/2007 1:22:22 AM

Quote :

"And for the love of god don't home school, every home schooler I've met is just flat out crazy"

i think i'd agree.

although where i live theres like an organization that kind of gets multiple parents to work together in a cooperative, and they hire outside experts for the older students like for Biology, or Physics, etc... and somehow they coordinate with public schools for extracurriclars or something.... sounds kind of interesting...

but nah... fuck that, im not down with homeschooling. i think social skills are part of the whole development package.

3/24/2007 1:26:00 AM

Quote :

"if you dont want your kid to deal with cliques you have to find a hippy nature school"

no, id rather he get brutalized by cliques than to go to some hippy nature school and then find that he's crippled as an adult because he doesn't have skills to deal with the real world.

3/24/2007 1:29:51 AM

Private schools have a much higher grade of pussy.

3/24/2007 1:30:31 AM

I went to public school all my life. Happened that the public schools I went to were the schools every kid went to AFTER private school. So during my entire education I got to see every batch of kids moving from private to public education.

The BIGGEST difference overall is that private schools seem to breed better average students. That is, pretty much everyone comes out not stupid, pretty literate and competent. Public schools tend to breen more polar students. The private kids probably overall did better, but seemed much less ambitious and much more "fit the system and do well in it", while my public school peers either mostly went "I'm going to sell drugs and drink" or "I can take all AP classes my last two years here".

Also to note, while many more public school kids either dropped out or ended up into drugs, jail or babies, a MUCH higher percentage of the private school kids were in to drugs, experimentation, DWI, et al. If you looked at my graduating class, a good percentage of the most intelligent and well-respected ones were closet cokeheads or potheads or both. Quite a few have already completely fucked their lives.

3/24/2007 1:41:56 AM

i went to a college preparatory private high school and I really enjoyed it. The socioeconomic status was very high and they also required entrance exams and interviews before they selected people to join the school (there was actually a huge waiting list). The class sizes were small, roughly 100 people graduated with me.

I never had problems with cliques and there really were none in general. Academic excellence was a requirement otherwise you could be tossed from school so there was no nerd mentality. For the most part we were all friends but some of us had tighter groups of friends than others. Even still some of the kids would have parties and invite the whole class.

I'll admit some of the kids used drugs and such especially since they had the money to get whatever they wanted, but it was a small segment and much less worse than public school. And of course it was a pretty sheltered existance since everyone is rich and the campus is pretty much seperated from the rest of the city.

Overall I really enjoyed it and the opportunities it provided. Every single class I took was considered AP and I did great on all the AP tests I took. But at the same time I knew a lot of people who went through magnet school and did great as well. I think the important thing is researching the schools in the area and if a public school gets high marks then go for it.

http://www.norfacad.pvt.k12.va.us/

[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 7:54 AM. Reason : link]

3/24/2007 7:53:38 AM

Quote :

"Given the selective nature of private schools and the high socioeconomic statuses of private school students, the chances of any of the cliques having the "it's cool to be stupid" attitude is slim."

Mostly true. I went to a selective Catholic high school in Northern VA. In that area, most households have 2 degreed parents, and often at least 1 has a master's. So, most of your kid's peers will also be raised in families that value educational achievement.

We did have a few of the idiots with the "learning sucks, don't do it" attitude. A few of them were the discipline-problem kids that got kicked out of multiple public schools. And freshman year, nobody cares that much. But, we had a fantastic honors and AP program; since there were only so many sections of each, even in my non-honors courses I had the better students in there with me. Then there was the seismic shift from sophomore "eh, I don't wanna do my homework" to junior year "omfg the SAT! I must get into college!!!"

Once people realized colleges would turn them down for subpar grades & test scores, peer respect for the high-achievers quadrupled.

I hated the cliques (mostly money-based in private school) but I am grateful for the sacrifices my parents made to give me a rock-solid educational foundation.

3/24/2007 8:32:32 AM

i went to public school up until 10th grade - we moved and i went to private for my last 2 years of HS

there were a few differences - my experience was at an all guy's private catholic school (2 all guy school with 1600 each in the area - 4 all girl schools in the area that added up to about 3000 students)
in the two was in the private school drug use was much more prevalent - and the more expensive drugs (cocaine being the most popular) were the ones used

there were still cliques of all types - there weren't as much stupid kids because you had to take a test to get in but there were still 3 tracks that took different levels of classes - dumb - average - smart (not named that of course) - everyone wore a shirt and tie (although no specific shirt or tie) but you could still tell who was in what group usually by just looking at them as you could in a public school with no dress code

you had the insanely rich and the very poor on scholarships - the average income household stuck out as somewhat poor

as far as connections/network - the private school wins hands down - there are plenty of kids that graduated with me that would have never amounted to anything without the rich connections they met through HS - about 1/6 of the school goes to ivy leagues in general - to stand out there though you had to do better than at a public school (i was in the top 10 at my public school and barely in the top 100 at the private school - same class size)

_______

i'm sending my kids to public school unless the district i'm in really sucks and i'm not able to move to a better district

3/24/2007 8:53:54 AM

I'll break it down.

In Public Schools kids smoke weed.

In Private Schools kids snort coke.

3/24/2007 8:56:05 AM

My public school didn’t seem to have strongly defined cliques. I think that was in part due to attending a public school in the county school system, while living in Mt Airy aka Mayberry, where the economic status amongst the students wasn’t very diverse.

The new manager where I work in the Carrboro/Chapel Hill area moved to this area from Florida in part due to the public schools here.

From my own experience and from what I’ve heard from my mother, a public school teacher who has taught in several NC schools, I believe that any decent public school can compete with private schools as long as the parents help shape their kid to be engaged in learning.

You can try to surround your kid by people who you think will make good friends and positive role models, but your kid will still choose their own friends so even if the “bad cliques” are fewer in number your kid may still choose them. Shaping a child to choose the right kinds of friends will make public school just as valuable and help more later in life, rather than just trying to stack the deck with good cliques.

3/24/2007 9:19:29 AM

Quote :

"Those NCSSM fuckers are weird I applied back in HS cause I thought maybe it would be better off than my ghetto HS, got in but when I went to the open house I was like wooooah, this ain't for me, damn I thought I was awkward and nerdy, not to mention durham and not being able to really have a car or anything."

Yeah, we're all super nerds!!
NCSSM was a really great place to meet like-minded people. It was really hard to find anyone in the general population of my high school (rather than the program I was in where 90% of my friends were, also) that I wanted to hang out with. And I graduated the year before they were doing that "free in-state tuition" thing. In any case, the people at NCSSM at least all knew how it was to be considered "different" at their home schools. I also really liked that they never ranked students and didn't have any special honors for graduation- everyone was treated the same in those two respects.

And Durham isn't the shithole everyone makes it out to be. Just fyi.

3/24/2007 10:07:49 AM

Quote :

"I would say the 2 main factors in the "it's cool to be stupid" clique is either having dumb parents or being rebellious against overbearing parents."

I went to private school, and this group definitely still existed. I think a lot of parents were dumb and overbearing at the same time. Most kids had a ton of pressure to succeed academically, but a lot of the parents were so convinced that their kids were wonderful that they would applaud them for being C students.

Then there were the trophy wives who only cared if their kids were popular instead of actually being successful in any way. I would say the kids in the "cool to be stupid" group had a mix of both kinds of parents.

Quote :

"a MUCH higher percentage of the private school kids were in to drugs, experimentation, DWI, et al. If you looked at my graduating class, a good percentage of the most intelligent and well-respected ones were closet cokeheads or potheads or both. Quite a few have already completely fucked their lives."

I don't know that there was a higher percentage of people using illegal drugs at my school, which was a small, Judeo-Christian private school with 70 people in my graduating class. However, a ton of kids were buying legal drugs like adderall through other students because of the amount of work we had and the pressure the school and their parents put on them. A lot of their parents knew about and encouraged the practice, even giving them money to buy the drugs.

3/24/2007 10:23:49 AM

Private schools in Atlanta have way more fucked up kids and drug use.

3/24/2007 10:42:08 AM

Ok I only read a lil bit of the thread and even though I really don't like people that do that I am going to in this case because I am not really disputing anything anyone else has said...I am just sharing my experience for joe_schmoe. I went to both private and public schools. I was at a Catholic private school in Charlotte, NC from K-6 the school went up to 8th however my Mom remarried and we moved to the other side of town and she gave me the choice to stay in private school or switch to public. I switched mainly because having to wear a uniform everyday was gay. My 7th grade year in public school also in Charlotte, NC was a complete REPEAT of what I had in 6th grade private school...needless to say I was a straight A student that year easy...LOL But I always did well in school. As for the "it's cool to be stupid" clique in public vs. private...I am going to have to agree with your wife. In my experience none of the kids at my private school thought it was cool to be stupid. In each grade we had like 2 classes for everything math, english, history, etc... because we had like 50-60 kids in each grade. Neither class was labelled but you knew which class was not as smart or fast as the other and everyone thrived to not be in that class for the most part. Kids who didn't really didn't stay at the private school long. One post I did read was that alot of "problem" kids end up in private schools. That was not the case for me. All of the kids were very well behaved and polite. The cliques were still there though. Jocks, nerds, etc... were all still present. We didn't have a druggie or slacker cliques though. If I could do it over again I would have stayed in private school for the pure fact that the education was much better. One of those things were if I knew then what I know now...LOL The class sizes are fairly small and help was readily available. I also think that even though the cliques were still present in the private school they weren't nearly as defined and people could cross the cliques lines very easily and no one was like completely shunned. As for the NCSSM I really don't dig this idea. One of my exes was a NCSSMer and to me it was just kinda creepy to send your 16 year old off to some school to live in a dorm especially in a not so good part of Durham. To me a 16 year old kid isn't mature enough to handle this. I do think that NCSSM is an awesome school but the only way I would do that is if I lived very close to the school which will never happen...LOL. Good luck with your decision and if ya have any questions feel free to pm me And for all the grammar/spelling nazis I bet there are some typos and grammar errors in there somewhere

Added note my senior class at my high school was over 600 people. I think 623 at the beginning of the year and we graduated like 605 of them. The #s are off by a lil but not much...been awhile for me to remember exactly. If I would have stayed in private school my graduating class would have been way smaller...less than 200!

[Edited on March 24, 2007 at 10:53 AM. Reason : added note ]

3/24/2007 10:51:10 AM

i went to public hs and had a relatively positive exp. it really has more to do with the area and type of people in the school. we had cliques, but not strongly defined. i did however go to a nice school in PA, so shrug.

a few comments:

Quote :

"also my high school was overwhelmingly suburban upper middle class and about 95% white."

as was mine and we didnt have as many issues as your school.

Quote :

"The biggest problem with public schools are lack of opportunities, such as enough AP classes, electives, or extracurriculars."

yeah, if you go to a shitty one. we had tons of AP opps and clubs. i chose to half ass my AP's in junior/senior year cuz i didnt like the topics and still came in with 18 hours.

Quote :

"wait, are you serious? are you saying you didnt have *any* of the stoner-hood-whatever type clique in your school at all? did you go to a private school? or did you go to some like really small rural school?"

i had a graduating class of 500. you do realize that there are different types of ppl, but that doesnt necessarily mean there has to be cliques. groups intermingle. we had some ppl that were poor and/or wanted to seem ghetto, but they intermingled wth other groups.

i enjoyed some nerdy activities, but had friends that were preppy, played sports, were a bit "hood", did a lot of drugs, or were nerdy. never once did i experience a movie style HS where kids get beat up every day and ppl sit around before school in extremely segregated groups. people have groups of friends that they hang out with more than others and naturally like people find each other. that doesnt have to mean factions duking it out, that is just natural.

3/24/2007 10:53:21 AM

if you want to ruin your kid and help contribute to ruining society, send em to private school

3/24/2007 11:42:04 AM

Cliques aren't exclusive to schools. In fact, they are everywhere in life.

3/24/2007 12:13:46 PM

I think we've determined that the OP doesn't have a problem with cliques.

He's concerned with destructive cliques.

3/24/2007 12:17:39 PM