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Aficionado
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7

the amount of ~ is probably right for this car is nissan is sending more powerful units to the magazines than they will deliver to buyers

8/25/2008 12:11:33 PM

TKE-Teg
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^^^GT-R's looking good in that photo.

8/25/2008 12:53:42 PM

xvang
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Saw one on top of a trailer today. Heading east towards Raleigh. Wonder which dealership it's going to...

Have cell phone picture of it, but really blurry...

[Edited on September 18, 2008 at 8:59 PM. Reason : ...]

9/18/2008 8:56:17 PM

benXJ
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saw a silver one in Asheville a few weeks ago, tried to catch up to it, but he was gettin on it

9/19/2008 1:35:47 PM

0EPII1
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http://www.autoblog.com/2008/09/24/florida-man-cancels-nissan-gt-r-order-due-to-black-box/

Quote :
"A Florida man named Scott Weires has canceled the order for his long-awaited Nissan GT-R. Why? It's not that he was disappointed in the car's performance credentials, far from it. The problem is that the GT-R is equipped with a 'black box', similar in theory to the kind found on airplanes to help determine what went wrong in case of an accident or breakdown. By the end of 2012, car buyers won't have a choice as to whether their new car is equipped with a 'black box,' or Electronic Data Recorder -- they will be federally mandated to carry one. These devices track information that could be useful to the manufacturer in determining exactly what is, or has been, going on with a car. There are a few worries, though, that warranty claims could be denied if the automaker, Nissan in this case, deems that the car was being raced or abused in some way or by police or lawyers to determine culpability. Nissan's GT-R carries an on-board recorder that keeps track of the past few day's worth of driving and cannot be disabled. In the case of Scott Weires, an attorney no less, that was enough to look elsewhere. Would it be for you?"

9/26/2008 2:06:24 AM

sumfoo1
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thats cool by then i'll have a 60s car with modern engine etc.

9/26/2008 6:45:59 AM

TKE-Teg
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Fuck that noise. This is why I won't be buying new cars.

9/26/2008 9:11:07 AM

arghx
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actually, I can see these black boxes

1) easily defeated by aftermarket ECU programmers for anybody who is concerned about that. There has to be a table inside the ECU which switches on datalogging that could be easily manipulated. You just have to locate it among all the hexadecimal and figure out how it works, like any other ECU programming. In fact, Haltech and Cobb have already cracked the R35 GT-R ecu, so they may already know about ways around it or they're at least working on it.

and

2) It could possibly be useable as an onboard datalogger without even needing a laptop hooked up, similar to the onboard memory on some Motec, Hondata, etc systems. This would be pretty useful for people taking their car to the track... Furthermore, the sample rate requirements of a block box will result in increasingly efficient processor and CAN bus speed. The OBDII standard sample rate is 6hz (although most ECU's exceed this and/or simulataneously use their own reporting protocol). So six samples per second if you are logging one PID/reporting parameter, or 1 sample per second if you are logging 6 PIDs, etc on any OBD II car. This is frustratingly slow when I use my Actron OBDII scanner just to see what engine sensors are reading. The needs of datalogging sensors in a car accident will only improve the hardware.

So there is a bright side to this, and that is harnessing the black box technology for performance purposes, although I can understand people being uneasy about the civil liberties implications. Imagine if you unexpectedly blew your motor for some reason... you can crack open the black box and find out that intake temps and knock readings were too high, or boost had spiked uncontrollably. Or imagine going to the track and having back-to-back logs of your wheelspin sensors to evaluate your driving style (of course nobody knows how many seconds the black boxes can record, but over time they will be able to store more and more). It's like having pseudo race equipment in your car.

[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 9:27 AM. Reason : .]

9/26/2008 9:20:46 AM

TKE-Teg
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^thats all well and good until it becomes government mandated. Just wait

9/26/2008 10:22:36 AM

nacstate
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as long as it doesn't track actual location, just vehicle dynamics, I could give two shits.

though I have heard that it can "sense" or whatever if you're at a racetrack, but maybe thats just in japan....or just a lie.

9/26/2008 10:39:19 AM

sumfoo1
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no its true... its tied into the gps and disables the limited when you are no longer on a public road.

9/26/2008 10:50:14 AM

TKE-Teg
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^and also voids the warranty

9/26/2008 11:42:36 AM

SaabTurbo
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That's a bunch of bullshit. That pretty much means there's absolutely no point in buying a new one. You know that if anything breaks they WILL find a way to not cover it under warranty. I can imagine that if you took the car over the speed limit or dared to go WOT in the days before whatever failure occurred, they'd just say you were abusing the car and therefore the warranty is void. It's so stupid to make a car that's designed for performance and then fuck you over when you use it the way it was intended. It's a smart thing to do though, they'll get out of ever having to cover anything. I bet only a small percentage of people would bother to get a lawyer to try force them to cover it and they'll profit big time by never having to fix problems. In some ways it's worse than Mitsu and Scooby going to the local tracks and auto-x's to catch owners using the cars the way they were intended.

No point in buying one until the "warranty" is expired.

[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 1:23 PM. Reason : ]

9/26/2008 1:22:40 PM

arghx
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http://www.cobbtuning.com/products/?id=3853

"(R35) GT-R AccessPORT features are as follows:

» Improve horsepower, torque, and fuel economy at the touch of a button

» Comes with maps for stock cars, catback exhaust, high flow cats, or deleted cats as well as Anti Theft (engine will not start), Valet Mode (reduced rev limit and power), Stock Style (speed limiter deleted only), and Fuel Economy mode. Additional maps may be downloaded from our website as they become available.

» Easy installation, no need to remove and ship off your ECU, no mechanical or computer skills necessary (built in recovery mode fail safe)

» Takes only a few minutes to install

» Connects to your vehicle via the OBD-II port conveniently located under your dash

» Pre-calibrated to maximize performance of stock or modified vehicles

» Easy-to-read color display

» Update over the Internet to stay up-to-date with the latest features

» Read and clear engine trouble codes (DTC) yourself, eliminating trips to the dealership

» Ability to clear dash lights (stored DTC codes) from ECU, BCM, Multi-AV, IPDM, Pre-crash Seat Belt, Meter/M&A, and Adaptive HL computers

» Ability to turn off the dreaded "Bonnet Light"

» Not a "piggyback" - once vehicle's computer has been programmed by the AccessPORT, it can be removed and the settings will stay on your computer.

» Not just an "ECU reflash" - AccessPORT features enhancements such as map switching, reading DTCs, performance monitors and more

» May be uninstalled at any time, reverting your ECU with the data stored on it prior to installation"

It's been cracked gentlemen, it's been cracked. As soon as it came out lots of shops started working on it. Now granted that's for an Aus-spec GTR I think, but I'm sure they'll have a US spec reprogrammer. And eventually Cobb will release the tuning software so you can edit your own maps instead of just installing their one-size-fits-all tune. But either way, DTC's are cleared. Most recent OBDII performance cars have been cracked like this. LS1Edit for example give you fine control over I believe every DTC in the whole ECU.

9/26/2008 6:05:02 PM

Ragged
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cool only $1000

9/26/2008 6:22:23 PM

arghx
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$1000 is not a lot of money for tuning, unless you have a Mustang or some other dime-a-dozen car with a gazillion engine management options and shared corporate ECU architecture.

9/26/2008 6:26:49 PM

Ragged
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im glad you think a grand isnt a lot of money. let me get some. i know that tuning and shit cost money its just that 1000 bux is 1000 bux ya know

9/26/2008 6:31:34 PM

arghx
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$1000 bux isn't a big deal if you can afford a GTR

9/26/2008 6:32:30 PM

BigBlueRam
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^^just stfu, we all know the only thing you can afford is a barbie bike from walmart and a 12 pack of bush light. $1k isn't shit for that level of tuning when you're talking about a REAL car. this isn't some clapped out white trash fox body.

^^^^^eh, not everything has been so easy. take some of the mopar stuff for example.

the bottom line is this shit is going to far. sure, there might be some advantages but the end result is a bunch of big brother bullshit. if i want this kind of stuff on my car, it should be my choice to get it from the aftermarket. NOT fucking government mandated.

i've been saying this day was coming for a long time, when stuff like on star first came out. it's advertised as "safety" and "luxery" to sugar coat what's really going on. as usual, stupid people continue to let big corporations and the government get away with it.

[Edited on September 26, 2008 at 6:44 PM. Reason : .]

9/26/2008 6:43:29 PM

Ragged
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ill i see is blah blah blah nigger

9/26/2008 11:28:46 PM

occamsrezr
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Wow, you sure showed him.

9/27/2008 12:17:39 AM

0EPII1
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http://www.autoblog.com/2008/09/30/porsche-accuses-nissan-gt-r-of-cheating-the-ring/

Quote :
"Sour grapes or legitimate complaint? That's the question we're left pondering after reading that Porsche believes Nissan must have cheated to record its 7:29:03 lap time of the famed Nürburgring race circuit. Porsche claims that it had been suspicious of the Nissan's lap times, so it acquired a U.S.-spec GT-R for testing back-to-back with its own 911 Turbo and GT2. The result? The mighty Godzilla was toppled by the Teutonic German duo, with the GT-R posting times a good 25-seconds slower than Nissan's claim.

How can Porsche explain the discrepancy? "This wonder car with 7:29 could not have been a regular series production car. For us, it's not clear how this time is possible. What we can imagine with this Nissan is they used other tires," says August Achleitner, the man in charge of the 911 program. There is footage of the GT-R lapping the 'Ring at high speed, but it's taken from inside the car where the tires cannot be seen.

Considering the fact that Nissan saw fit to issue a press release commemorating the car's fast-lap, we doubt this is something that will be taken lightly. There's a big can 'o worms here, and Porsche's in the corner holding the opener."


Porsche is pissed, and they hope to get answers (by having made an accusation against the GT-R))

9/30/2008 6:43:57 PM

DoubleDown
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OMG TIRES

9/30/2008 7:21:25 PM

BigBlueRam
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^^this is OLD news. i've been saying/posting the exact same thing for months.

[Edited on September 30, 2008 at 10:10 PM. Reason : .]

9/30/2008 10:10:48 PM

SaabTurbo
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All of the GTR fanboys are comparing the GTR's ROLLING START, RACE CAR DRIVER DRIVEN, BOOST CRANKED UP, CUT RACING SLICK SHOD time to the Z06's BONE STOCK, GM TEST ENGINEER DRIVEN, STANDING START time. None of them will accept the truth about it.

One guy keeps messaging me about how the 'Ring "wouldn't have released the Z06's time if it had run a standing start." I don't know where he got that shit from, but the ZR1 is the first car Chevy has run with a rolling start from what the article the Corvette Cheif Engineer wrote was saying.

[Edited on September 30, 2008 at 10:16 PM. Reason : ]

9/30/2008 10:15:31 PM

BigBlueRam
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^yep. it really breaks down to common sense. it's just physically impossible for a stock gtr to have cut that time, even with some tweaking within the factory parameters. the only thing that's debatable is how the car differed from a stock unit. personally, the theory that makes the most sense to me from reading in between the lines of interviews and the specs is that what they used was actually a prototype/pre production spec v. if not that, i think it was a gtr with significant power gains. i'm doubting much was done in the way of suspension work or tires.

the really stupid thing is why would they lie about it? obviously, the truth is coming out now. also, it's not like ring times are any kind of standardized test. it's just bragging rights. you don't get in trouble for doing things differently, there's no sae standard to meet like their is for horsepower ratings, or anything.

Quote :
"One guy keeps messaging me about how the 'Ring "wouldn't have released the Z06's time if it had run a standing start." "

lmao, asking him since when is "the 'ring" a sanctioning body...?

[Edited on September 30, 2008 at 10:37 PM. Reason : .]

9/30/2008 10:36:39 PM

SaabTurbo
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The car either had significantly increased grip or significantly increased power (Or a bit of both) over production spec GTR, that's for sure.

A car that weighs 3800lbs, is using the standard tires and that has what they claim the power output at the crank is just isn't going to run times like that. I find it very hard to believe that it can take a car that weighs 500+lbs less and that has more power by such a massive amount of time. When Porsche finds it hard to believe, you know something is wrong. They've been using the 'Ring for a long, long time.

And yes, I tried to explain that Chevy released the time, not "The 'Ring" and that there's no rule that says "WE, THE MANAGEMENT OF THE NURBURGRING, REFUSE TO ALLOW YOU TO TIME YOUR LAP FROM A STANDING START."

9/30/2008 10:48:31 PM

SaabTurbo
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AND I QUOTE:

Quote :
"chevy cannot say it is an official time. without n'ring track officials approval. otherwise it just becomes another run."


10/1/2008 6:41:02 AM

0EPII1
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Nissan responds to Porsche's allegations:

Quote :
"As expected, Nissan has responded to Porsche's claims that the GT-R isn't quite as fast as they say it is. In fact, representatives for the German automaker suggested that Nissan may have used racing slicks to achieve the 7:29:03 lap time of the Nürburgring. Says Nissan, "The final word from us is that it was done on absolutely standard tires which are available to customers in the showroom. They're not trick tires – absolutely standard tires, normal road tires."

Despite the allegations, Nissan is remaining calm about the issue, adding that the fast time was set by its racing driver, Tochio Suzuki, and achieved using the GT-R's optional Dunlop tires. Could it be that Porsche purchased a model with the slightly slower Bridgestones? Maybe, but can having the right tires could account for a 25-second lap time difference? In any case, Nissan's taking the high-road, falling short of suggesting that Porsche's drivers are slow."

10/3/2008 6:08:35 PM

0EPII1
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http://www.autoblog.com/2008/10/09/nissan-to-porsche-put-the-gt-r-down-before-you-hurt-yourself/

Nissan releases very detailed press release about the GT-R's Nurbugring time. Click above to read all, but here is basically what you need to know:

Quote :
"On September 24, 2007 the Nissan GT-R recorded a lap time of the Nordschleife circuit at Germany's Nurburgring of seven minutes and 38 seconds. This lap time was completed in weather conditions that the Nissan test team knew would not show the full potential of the car."
Quote :
"On April 17, 2008 the Nissan test team was back at the Nurburgring and recorded a new lap time of seven minutes and 29 seconds, several times."
Quote :
"The GT-R is a world-class supercar developed to be sold in multiple global markets. While specifications can differ across the various markets, the cars used to record both Nurburgring lap times were identical to the Japanese market production specification cars. "
Quote :
"For the April 2008 test, the GT-R carried an additional 50kg of weight due to the Marelli data recorder and video camera equipment. In addition, the test was witnessed by 'Best Motoring' magazine from Japan who reported the test in their July 2008 issue, which included a DVD program of the session."
Quote :
"For the tests conducted at the Nurburgring where the lap times of 7:38 and 7:29 were recorded, the Dunlop tires were used. The tires – which are designed for high performance driving in the dry and wet - used in the tests were identical to the production specification tires available to GT-R customers."
Quote :
"In June, 2008 Dunlop Japan issued a press release announcing that their tires had been used by Nissan to record the 7:29 lap time. The release can be accessed at:

http://www3.srigroup.co.jp/CACHE/news_news_e_newsobj144_2008.cfm "
Quote :
"Consistent with industry benchmarking practices, we are aware that several auto makers have purchased the GT-R for their own testing and evaluation. Like all GT-R customers, we recommend that any auto maker buying a GT-R should follow the recommended run-in procedures, service schedules and maintenance to ensure the maximum performance from their car. "
Quote :
"In addition, we offer performance driving courses for prospective and current GT-R owners to help them get the best performance from their car. We would welcome the opportunity to help any auto manufacturer with understanding the full capabilities of the GT-R."
Quote :
"Remarks

From Kazutoshi Mizuno, Chief Vehicle Engineer and Chief Product Specialist for GT-R:

"We have used circuits like the Nurburgring and Sendai extensively during the development of the GT-R. The fastest lap-time was never the objective but a simple parameter for us to measure the GT-R in a consistent way against other world class supercars."

"Testing a car with specialized parts such as unique tires or suspension has no meaning for us. The GT-R was designed from the start to be a supercar that could be driven anywhere, anytime and by anyone. For us, testing the car in standard production specification is far more relevant than creating a one-off vehicle that our customers cannot buy." "

10/9/2008 9:12:25 PM

BigBlueRam
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congratulations for regurgitating more old and irrelevant info that has already been covered in previous interviews and press releases, not to mention this very thread. the driver, suzuki, specifically covered all of that in an interview months ago for one. you whine and complain about other people shitting on your threads, but you do a pretty damn good job of doing it to yourself.

the only thing we NEED to know from that press release is they still failed to address the implications (basically FACT when you consider the evidence) of the car having significant power gains. whether that was in the form of a pre production spec v or simply a tweaked/modified regular gtr is the only relevant issue. why is this do damn hard to understand? it's semantics, plain and simple.

10/9/2008 10:15:57 PM

0EPII1
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It doesn't matter if it has been covered before or not. Nissan obviously saw it as important enough to release that press release ANEW, just yesterday, so STFU.

As for the increased power, you need to stop trolling for a minute and read this:

Quote :
"the cars used to record both Nurburgring lap times were identical to the Japanese market production specification cars."
Quote :
"For us, testing the car in standard production specification is far more relevant than creating a one-off vehicle that our customers cannot buy."


Whether you believe Nissan or not, that's your business. Call them liars if you wish, but don't say this:

Quote :
"they still failed to address the implications (basically FACT when you consider the evidence) of the car having significant power gains."


THEY ADDRESSED IT (by denying it had any mods, and that it was a JDM spec'd car). why is this do damn hard to understand? it's semantics, plain and simple.

10/9/2008 10:45:00 PM

BigBlueRam
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Quote :
"the cars used to record both Nurburgring lap times were identical to the Japanese market production specification cars."
Quote :
"For us, testing the car in standard production specification is far more relevant than creating a one-off vehicle that our customers cannot buy."

WHICH IS EXACTLY WHAT A PRE PRODUCTION V SPEC WOULD BE, DURRRR.

Quote :
"THEY ADDRESSED IT (by denying it had any mods, and that it was a JDM spec'd car)"

WRONG. they have only denied it having suspension and tire mods, power levels or which model it is wasn't.

you need to quit being a tard for a minute and learn some basic physics and reading comprehension. maybe formulate some independent thought and reasoning processes while you're at it instead of cutting and pasting ever stupid ass article and picture you come across and accept at face value.

10/9/2008 10:59:04 PM

DoubleDown
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Japanese market production specification cars

seems pretty straightforward to me

10/9/2008 11:00:24 PM

0EPII1
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^^ You pathetic excuse for a human, it couldn't get any more clear than this:

Quote :
"For all testing at the Nurburgring and other circuits such as Sendai Highlands in Japan, the GT-R development team used production specification vehicles with production specification tires. These tests are part of the extensive performance and durability program undertaken before, during and after the commercial introduction of the GT-R."


It CANNOT be the fuckin Spec V as that is NOT A PRODUCTION VEHICLE YET, has no PRODUCTION SPECS YET, and has of course NOT BEEN COMMERICALLY INTRODUCED.

You tell me to learn reading comprehension, but you can't fucking read a simple paragraph.

Quote :
"learn some basic physics"


As I said, YOU CAN CALL THEM LIARS, but don't fucking say they haven't addressed the issue.

Quote :
"accept at face value."


By posting NISSAN'S press release, how does it necessarily fucking mean that I believe them? I can see both sides of the argument and haven't made up my mind about their official statement, as I have [Physics, DUH ] reservations as well, but you are the one who is fucking going to another EXTREME and saying it MUST have had extra power.

Believe it or leave it. Nissan has addressed the issue. End of the [official] story (speculations will go on forever).

10/9/2008 11:14:29 PM

BigBlueRam
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your ignorance is beyond belief. just because a vehicle isn't available to the general public yet doesn't mean it can't be considered to have "production [ready] specs". i'm not going to bother to repost the FACTS that have been posted on this site and hundreds of others that the 7:29 gtr as well as numerous other test and media vehicles produce WELL in excess of the actual true production gtr you get off the showroom floor. someone so good at googling/cutting/pasting ought to know that by now.

the main point is you keep posting OLD shit in here that has already been discussed. nissan isn't saying anything new in this press release that hasn't already on the record with before. this particular subject has already been beat to fucking death on here and everywhere else.

on an unrelated and NEWer note, some of the first warranties are starting to be denied based on data collected from the dreaded "black box". some transmissions are failing as a result of using the highly advertised/publicized launch control. which, btw, according to the owners manual turning vdc off is to be used ONLY for rocking the car to get out of deep snow, mud, or other slick surface. guess who makes the transmission? the same company that produced the piece of junk that was put into the first batch of veyrons. replacement cost? ~$20k.

10/9/2008 11:41:19 PM

sumfoo1
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I'm not trying to be an ass here but where did you hear this? You always fuck with me for posting stuff off other forums or off automotive news sites.... But where the heck do you hear this stuff do you have you're own automotive CIA that delivers you secrets from all the manufacturers that is in-disputable cause as long as I've been on here you call bullshit on a lot of stuff we say... when we have sources to back it up. But i cannot recall a single time that you've backed your shit up with.... well anything.... other than large paragraphs of pissed off toned text following quoted portions of our text.

Honestly I'm not saying you're full of it i just wanna know where you hear this stuff cause you certainly do not own one so its not insider knowledge...

10/10/2008 6:41:01 AM

ahali2
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Its a crappy pic but i saw one in Cary last week.





[Edited on October 10, 2008 at 7:23 AM. Reason : .]

[Edited on October 10, 2008 at 7:24 AM. Reason : ..]

10/10/2008 7:22:59 AM

0EPII1
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BRWXBai6QwA

Dude doing donuts in the GT-R.

10/16/2008 12:11:06 PM

0EPII1
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Wow... friggin awesome.

Hennessey Introduces 600hp Godzilla Package for Nissan GT-R

Quote :
"Hennessey Performance Engineering has just made us even bigger fans of the Nissan GT-R. The Texas-based tuner released a 600 hp (441 kW) upgrade to the car just in time for the holidays.

Called the Godzilla 600, the tuning package also provides up to 570 ft-lb (773 Nm) of torque.

This is not the first GT-R specific upgrade from the company. They have a tweak to the on-board computer software that adds 65 hp (48 kW) and 75 lb-ft (102 Nm) of torque after only 10 minutes. <--- THAT'S SO AWESOME!

The Godzilla 600 is not as simple. This package includes an upgrade to the air induction system, electronic boost control, an improved wastegate actuator, and front-mount intercooler system. Also included are turbo down pipes, mid-pipe exhaust, and rear section exhaust all in stainless steel.

Hennessey will install the package for $14,500, or ship the items to you for $11,500."

12/16/2008 4:21:12 PM

underPSI
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bttt per request

5/23/2009 2:08:15 PM

BigBlueRam
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let the pwning of this junk continue... 2010 vettes are getting launch control, and gm is ENCOURAGING its use.

5/23/2009 4:59:34 PM

RSXTypeS
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^lol someone is really bitter about the GTR.

5/23/2009 5:55:05 PM

H8R
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Nissan really does make some junk

5/23/2009 5:57:02 PM

Specter
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yeah this gt-r, like the veyron, has been largely unimpressive

[Edited on May 24, 2009 at 3:23 AM. Reason : ]

5/24/2009 3:13:26 AM

BigBlueRam
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^^^lol, yeah, you got me... i'm sooo bitter about a car that's been such a FAIL at nearly everything it was supposed to be. what am i ever to do...

5/24/2009 10:36:13 PM

DoubleDown
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why are you so bitter about a car?

5/24/2009 11:52:30 PM

BigBlueRam
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u don reed gud

[Edited on May 25, 2009 at 12:17 AM. Reason : if anything, we're talking about amusement/gloating]

5/25/2009 12:13:59 AM

0EPII1
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Quote :
"i'm sooo bitter about a car that's been such a FAIL at nearly everything it was supposed to be."


I am curious... what was it "supposed to be"? I am serious here.

Anyway, I would post here that Nissan claims that the 2010 GT-R has lapped Nurburgring in a new record time just a month ago shaving 2.3 seconds off their time from last year. The new time is just 0.3 seconds behind the ZR1, but the all-knowing chest-thumping macho in here would say that I am stupid and Nissan are liars and that they must have used a modified car and equipment, so I am not going to bother to give any details.

BTW, I didn't ask for this to be bttt'ed, so don't accuse me of it, O all-knowing chest-thumping macho. I do wonder who requested the bttt.

5/25/2009 5:41:59 AM

BigBlueRam
All American
16852 Posts
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i requested it just for you, you stupid fuck.

Quote :
"I am curious... what was it "supposed to be"? I am serious here."

i don't know, you tell us... you're the one that's been fellating this thing so hard. what claims has it lived up to? performance data? factory/dealer support? anything?

Quote :
"Anyway, I would post here that Nissan claims that the 2010 GT-R has lapped Nurburgring in a new record time just a month ago shaving 2.3 seconds off their time from last year. The new time is just 0.3 seconds behind the ZR1, but the all-knowing chest-thumping macho in here would say that I am stupid and Nissan are liars and that they must have used a modified car and equipment, so I am not going to bother to give any details."

haha, that's hilarious on so many levels. lets see...

- i thought the current gt-r was going to be the fastest production car ever around the ring?? what's this? they're still "only" three tenths behind the zr1? i won't even mention the viper.

- nissan has had such a great track record so far with this car and honesty. you know, like their last "best" times at the ring, honoring warranties, and all that. i'm sure this time we're getting the truth!

thanks for coming in this thread and sticking your foot in your mouth yet again. i knew you wouldn't let me down OEP111.

5/25/2009 4:47:12 PM

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