Thinking of moving to get a larger lot. Tired of .25 acre lots.
If you were me and had to choose between Holly Springs or Wake Forest, which place is better.
I want to be close to RTP, NC State, and Downtown Raleigh.

6/22/2007 12:36:32 AM

morrisville

6/22/2007 1:08:18 AM

i live on the fuquay- holly springs border, it takes me 20 minutes to get to downtown raleigh and the same to state. im not sure about rtp but it takes 35 min. to get to the airport.

6/22/2007 1:17:44 AM

Wake Forest.

6/22/2007 2:13:36 AM

WF.

6/22/2007 2:19:50 AM

WF is extremely stuck up, go to HS

6/22/2007 7:11:10 AM

WF isn't stuck up at all. I am not sure where you are seeing this. Everyone we know are very laid back and easy going. We love living there are have no plans of leaving. Wakefield is stuck up but that is considered Raleigh.

If you want land you may want to look at WF or in the county (Wake or Granville). We have lived here the past 5 years and have no complaints.

6/22/2007 7:16:31 AM

Isn't the traffic coming down Capital Blvd. (from WF to 540) really bad though?

6/22/2007 7:19:26 AM

^ At peak times yes, primarily because the brilliant DOT made 4 lanes go into one onto 40. They're supposed to remedy that "soon," but don't count on it.

I chose Holly Springs, but live on a lot smaller than you want. It's expensive here too. Before you know it the next wave of RTP employees will be buying up Smithfield thinking the commute is okay.

It takes me a SOLID 35 minutes door-to-door if I leave before 6:30am. Leave at 7:15am or later, and it has most certainly taken 1 hour before. The one lane of 55 through Apex is pathetic.

Don't move here unless you're 100% okay with at LEAST a 35 minute drive to RTP, and that is at weird hours (which I work to avoid the ~40 mins. - 1 hour each way). Also, I'd reckon that from my place to the Blue Ridge Cinema is actually closer to a half hour, too. I'm about 5 miles from the F-V border, so I'm not wayyy at the back of H-S or anything.

WF is no better commute wise. It just sucks.

6/22/2007 7:49:48 AM

Quote :

"Tired of .25 acre lots. ... I want to be close to RTP, NC State, and Downtown Raleigh."

DOES NOT COMPUTE

6/22/2007 8:54:00 AM

I am not sure of the commute to RTP from WF, I work at Duke so I take 98 to Durham.

If I did work in the Park, I would take HWY 98 to HWY 50 and get on 540. I would avoid Capital and Falls of the Neuse during the morning commute.

6/22/2007 9:03:25 AM

if you work in durham then WF is what you want

6/22/2007 9:45:28 AM

If you work in Durham and want land, Hillsborough is what you want. Of course that's nowhere close to NC State, but it would be an easy commute and you could have a nice size lot...like 3+ acres.

6/22/2007 10:05:26 AM

Holly Springs.

My husband and I live right down the road from Holly Springs in Cary. The area has grown and changed a great deal in the past 5 years. We really like the look and feel of Holly Springs. There are a lot of young families, new houses, new businesses, new schools. . .it's just a really nice area. And I don't think that it will put you any farther from the areas that you mentioned than WF would. And you certainly will not have the traffic issues in Holly Springs that you would in WF.

6/22/2007 10:07:50 AM

The commute from Holly Springs to RDU certainly isn't great, though. If you're coming up 55, it backs up at US 1, but now that the construction around Crossroads is done I doubt it would back up as much there as it used to. Also, taking Holly Springs Rd through Cary to get to Raleigh is an alternative route but can also be a bitch depending on time.

If I were you, I'd look around in the RTP area itself. There are neighborhoods in south Durham/west Morrisville and the airport area that aren't too expensive yet also aren't far from 40-E and a 30 minute drive to Raleigh. Look at it more like this: you will be driving to and from work EVERY DAY. You will be driving to downtown Raleigh ONCE, maybe twice, a week (if you're like most people). Make the work commute as short as possible and you'll be happier, plus there's very few things you can't get out at Briar Creek which would require a trip to downtown Raleigh.

[Edited on June 22, 2007 at 10:15 AM. Reason : ]

6/22/2007 10:15:30 AM

i think you should broaden your search from holly springs and wake forest - much like a lot of the other posters

6/22/2007 10:32:54 AM

lets be honest, the commute around these parts is not going to get any better ..., just worse.

So, RTP ftw even though you cant get as much bang for your buck, the appreciation will be better, and you will have that advertised 5 hours of extra free time every week from the easy trip between work and home.

If we sell our condo, Ill def move to morrisville/ n. cary /apex area.

6/22/2007 10:38:07 AM

btw, our condo is for sale for 68k, firm ... near melbourne and 440. 2 bed plus office, 120 per month in HOA, 1140 sq ft., new carpet, crown molding, laminate flooring in kitchen and dining, elegantly painted, wooded neighborhood, and very quiet.

6/22/2007 11:25:44 AM

Quote :

"if you work in durham then WF is what you want"

that is the truth. i work right near the airport and it takes me ~1 hour to get to hs/fuquay border in afternoon rush hour. other times it takes ~30 minutes

6/22/2007 4:24:20 PM

WF has 540. HS doesn't yet. Therefore, WF is much better.

6/22/2007 4:56:47 PM

Quote :

"WF is extremely stuck up, go to HS"

only cos all the fuckers and goddamn carpetbaggers moving here. I wish I had them all in a free fire zone in my sights. it didn't always seem like that. I grew up in the wake forest rolesville area. used to know lots of folks in these parts. now hardly a soul.

6/22/2007 5:02:44 PM

I like Wake Forest as a town better, but the commute is horrible, absolutely horrible. Capital Blvd is the most terrible road in Raleigh to drive on.

I would go to Holly Springs or even down lake wheeler somewhere that you can get to Raleigh and downtown fast.

6/22/2007 8:18:29 PM

Why just wf and hs?

For going to rtp and durham Wake forest is the best bet.~ten minutes no traffic via 98/the back way. For RTP you could take creedmore. Probably about 20 minutes. You don't take capital so don't listen to the people on here.

Why is Holly Springs in your picture? Not a good choice based on what you've told me so far.

For downtown Raleigh Knightdale is best. ~10 minutes via 264 and 40 and its also on 540 so RTP is ~25.

I think the area between wake forest and durham is the most beautiful geography in all of central north carolina.

[Edited on June 22, 2007 at 8:33 PM. Reason : eh creedmore down to glenwood]

6/22/2007 8:31:59 PM

neither one is a winner

since you "want to be close to RTP, NC State, and Downtown Raleigh" why not buy in that area instead

there's a nice development going in off ebenezer church in the 700s as well as some homes for sale on it with an acre or so under 400



[Edited on June 23, 2007 at 12:41 PM. Reason : land]

6/23/2007 12:38:54 PM

wake forest will be "north raleigh" within the next 5 years


just as western johnston county will be south and east raleigh within 10 years


holly springs will be south raleigh within the next 10 also

6/23/2007 1:45:48 PM

Well no because of the way growth has shaped Raleigh it has already grown far out to the north. Distance wise extreme North Raleigh is just as far from downtown as apex. I wouldn't go too far outside of 540. Wake Forest and Holly Springs are just as far out as Clayton or Rolesville. From a downtown perspective Clayton would be the best of those three.

Highways and future highways are the best indicator for picking where growth will be and where you should live.The best bets are places closer to 540. Obviously Cary was the best non Raleigh town but after that places like Knightdale and Garner are very close to Raleigh (because the raleigh city limits don't go south much after downtown. 540 isn't round either and is much closer to 440 in the east (will also be in the south and west.

540 is already near rolesville and through knightdale (as well as 264 through knightdale so its very accessable.

http://tinyurl.com/27khaz
the map doesn't show some things like 540 is now down to 264 around hodge road and clayton and knightdale are not just hte markers. right over the wake border is clayton and everything between new hope, wake crossroads, wendell and johnsoncounty is knightdale

Take a look at the map and where theese towns are in relation to downtown raleigh and highways. Wake forest is maxed out and probably the worst bet. Knightdale and Clayton are the fastest growing areas and probably the best bet. Knightdale if you want to be close and very accessible. Clayton if you want to be Wake forest-far but have LOADS of land. Johnson county is the place to go if you want LOADS of land.

[Edited on June 25, 2007 at 10:50 AM. Reason : i'm an idiot and don't know how to use tinyurl.com]

6/23/2007 2:21:37 PM

I've lived in the HSP since Aug 04, so I think I am as qualified as anyone here to speak about the place.

Quote :

"Thinking of moving to get a larger lot. Tired of .25 acre lots. If you were me and had to choose between Holly Springs or Wake Forest, which place is better. I want to be close to RTP, NC State, and Downtown Raleigh."

Why do you need a larger lot? Even some of the McMansions in the area aren't built on lots much larger than this. To get this, you are going to have to find land a developer hasn't snatched yet, and then if it is anywhere near Raleigh you are going to have to pay a premium for it as the owner is most likely sitting on it as it will keep appreciating more and more as all the land in the area disappears to the sprawl.

In general, as drtaylor mentioned, you are going to have to pay big bucks to be close to RTP, and Downtown at the same time, relatively speaking. If you can't pay the big bucks to be inner beltline, then you have to really ask yourself, how much is your time worth, and is it worth less than having the bigger lot.

I live off of Sunset Lake Rd where HSP bumps up against Apex. When I moved there in August of 04, during rush-hour the traffic on 55 near US 1 would delay me maybe 1-2 minutes. The traffic on US1 near Crossroads was terrible and frequently backed up, sometimes all the way down to 55, and it was probably a once every other week thing that it would get back to Tryon/TenTen. I'd take Kildaire to where I work in Cary, and the average commute would be around 27 minutes where-as, with no traffic from my house to work via US1/40 would be about 20-21 minutes.

Since then, more and more people have moved into the HSP and FV and traffic is getting drastically worse, and fairly quickly in my opinion. Now, during the school year (seems to be a little better in the past weeks since school has been out) during rush hour, it has become common that traffic will back up from US1 all the way to where EWilliams/55 splits from the bypass back to Sunset Lake Rd. This is worth anywhere from a 10-15 minute delay for me. My theory is, people in HSP and FV that were modifying their routes and time to leave for work + population growth are now taking 55/1 because they widened 55 north of Apex and they widened US1. I had a feeling that widening US1 would just shift the problem from there onto 40 and the beltline, and that is exactly what happened. During rush hour, it's pretty common for 40 to be worth an additional 5-10 minute delay thanks to US1 dumping more traffic on it faster. All total, if i try to leave from my house anywhere from 7-8:30, it's a 30 minute commute to my office on Weston Pkwy. To RTP? hahahahahah

The commute home is always worse for some reason, with my average commute during rush hour (5-6) taking 30 minutes and sometimes 40 is usual if traffic is bottlenecked somewhere.

For me to get to Cameron Village, I timed it last week (after an argument with a coworker about how long it should take from my place to downtown) and it was 24 minutes.

As others have mentioned, the situation from HSP isn't going to get better any time soon. In classic NCDOT fashion, they are playing catchup to the population growth and they are WAAAAYYY behind. 540 is slated to connect to 55 just below where it does to US1 now. That won't happen earliest until 2011 IF they make it a toll road, I think it is 2016 otherwise. I've seen the growth over the past 3 years, and it seems to actually be increasing in pace a little, so even 2011 isn't soon enough to alleviate the problems. Secondly, the 2-3 mile stretch of 40 between Crossroads and Wade that should have been widened when sections on each side of that were widened was until recently not even at the funding stage. Some citizens were able to get it's priority moved up to be brought into the discussion for funding sooner, but here again, the earliest they'd start that construction will be 2011...IF it gets the funding in the next round of fund allocation.

The bottom line for me (and yours will definitely vary) rising gas prices and a desire to reclaim this wasted time has me moving to Cary in the very near future where I am closer to everything I use frequently (work, Umstead, bike shop store rides, occasionally downtown, friends). What good is a bigger yard if anytime you have to go somewhere you waste tons of time trying to get there such that you don't get to enjoy your place.

[Edited on June 25, 2007 at 9:14 AM. Reason : ^ Can a mod tinyurl that link above plz?]

6/25/2007 9:12:06 AM

I'm pretty content knowing that I have 40 acres less than 3 minutes from I40, 5 minutes from I95, about 30 miles from here

6/25/2007 9:41:27 AM

Get in HS asap...it is gonna go through a little growth boom soon.

[Edited on June 25, 2007 at 10:08 AM. Reason : g]

6/25/2007 10:04:36 AM

Yea, but there is still plenty of land to be developed in the HSP, so it isn't like the home values are going to go up more relative to other parts of the Raleigh. Why would someone moving to the HSP pay considerably more for a used house when they can get a brand new one for a similar price. The only thing that is going to make my house more valuable than a newer one in the HSP is I have a little bit better access to US1/Apex/Cary than if you keep going deeper into the HSP.

Not to mention, once the construction/use of the landfill gets going, who knows what that will do to the growth.

6/25/2007 10:20:38 AM

Wake Forest is pretty and everything, but it's getting pretty expensive to live here...I've lived here my entire life. Luckily everything we have has been paid off for 50 years...

You can buy land and a house double the size in Fuqay Varina for your money's worth...

6/25/2007 10:37:28 AM

Out of those two I choose Holly Springs!

6/25/2007 1:58:00 PM

wake forest...i just pick them cause i think they are nicer

6/25/2007 2:00:05 PM

a lot of great feedback here.....let me provide some more background

i currently live in Apex around 64/55, shopping is close, RTP is not bad, downtown is close
my parents will be moving here and likely moving in with us due to their age
i currently have a typical .25 lot and the thought of a wooded backyard with 1 acre appeals to all

of course my parents love that even more since they are retired and don't have to worry about RTP, but anyways like everyone says, 1 acre is a premium close to 540 that's where HP and WF came in

we've been house hunting for two weeks all the way up to Heritage in WF down to Sunset Ridge in HS and everywhere in between

having lived in Apex and putting up with RTP traffic has been a drag until recently when they widened Davis and 55 and built Beaver Creek nearby. Before all this I wanted to move to North Raleigh where 540 was convenient as well as Triangle Mall. So the thought of moving farther down into HS and reliving the inconvenience for another 4 years is a drag, but for the same builder/floorplan down in HS is about $100,000 cheaper. HS will be a good future investment if you can have patience. 540 will enventually come through, whenever that is. And they'll probably build another mall, so HS will eventually be like WF.

Now WF is nice as well, and it's growing quicker due to more ppl moving there due to 540. But I also keep hearing traffic wise it's still a nightmare to get to RTP.

The other alternative is to pay top dollar and look around West Cary (Cary Park, Amberly) area or North Raleigh (Bedford).

So it's coming down to:
1) pay top dollar for infrastructure/convenience now, less traffic (Cary, Raleigh)
2) pay middle for infrastructure, little less convenient but still traffic (Wake Forest)
3) pay low for no infrastructure, no convenience and bad traffic but potential upside in the future (Holly Springs)

keep them coming I need to make a decision within 2 weeks

6/26/2007 11:50:49 AM

^see sounds like what you're looking for is exactly knightdale. Many people are and don't realize it because its not on the map and neither is 540. I think 264 may be on most maps but not 540 down to it. You're talking 2 exits from ttc on 540 (~5mins). Drive out there you'll be surprised at all the development.

In 2005 just before their big boom started i was looking at houses in the 250s and now they are selling in the 360s and they keep building new stuff. 4 more proposed shopping centers and another branch of rex hospital. I'm not sure if its lower than holly springs but its definitely lower than cary raleigh apex and like i said, closer to downtown than north raleigh.

Theres a difference between being on 540 having it run through your town and being near 540. Wake forest is not really close to 540. You have to drive into raleigh down capital to get there.

Also most people overlook clayton because its in another county but it is just as close to downtown as wake or holly springs.

In general, people are very miseducated about the growth in this area.

6/26/2007 12:06:05 PM

Quote :

"acre is a premium close to 540 that's where HP and WF came in"

I am very sure projected 540 will not come anywhere close to Holly Springs. Unless you count driving into Apex as "close". If your goal is to stay close to NCSU and have a decent drive to RTP then Holly Springs and Wake Forest are NOT your ideal places to live. I would choose somewhere like Apex or Morrisville. I540 is supposed to cut around Apex by 2013 so you will have a easy little drive up to RTP and not have to bullshit with NC 55 anymore. I would maybe even consider Garner too. Property prices in Garner are a lot cheaper then Cary or those complexes near RTP. Garner as well is located on the Projected 540 route so you would probably make good off your investment in the long run.

http://ncdot.org

do a search for I-540. I actually looked into this for myself last week. Holly Springs is No Go.

[Edited on June 26, 2007 at 2:23 PM. Reason : l]

6/26/2007 2:19:29 PM

I know quite a few Holly Springs folks. Here are a few of my thoughts...

The RTP commute sucks. I hate to say it, but I've tried everything from 55 to Davis Dr. to 40/64 with tons of shortcut attempts mixed in. I wouldn't buy out there simply because my time and stress levels are worth too much for me to deal with the traffic. Not to mention that it sucks going anywhere except Holly Springs. There is a Mexican restaurant, an Ale House, and a handful of other joints, but I'd get bored living there and having to drive 20 minutes for everything. Besides, when people say it is a 20 minute drive to Raleigh they mean it is a 20 minute drive to Raleigh under ideal conditions. When the 64 construction was going on it was not uncommon for that to turn into a 45 minute ordeal. I get pissy when I have to drive 4.5 miles to Crossroads.

Most of the new developments were designed to squeeze the maximum number of homes in the smallest amount of space. The yards tend to be pretty small by comparison to older developments.

Their homes have appreciated pretty well, but it's really not that great when you break it out over a period of years. One person I know bought a house about 5 years ago for $108k and recently sold for $145k. It made for a nice downpayment on their new home, but they probably could have seen the same appreciation in a lot of more convenient areas.

6/26/2007 2:53:00 PM

ok, we have a pow-wow with the family and holly springs is out of the question....sorry but although there is potential in the future, we aren't willing to downgrade to a less convenient place and put up with the traffic

we're going to check out bedford and wakefield plantation tomorrow....how is the drive there to say RTP, NCSU, Downtown....it seems a little closer than Wake Forest, not sure how much

6/26/2007 3:05:14 PM

It's basically just Wake Forest or Six Forks with the occassional jaunt down Crapital Blvd if you're feeling crazy. Just take the drive a couple of times to see what you think. Tons of traffic lights to annoy the crap out of you, but the traffic is usually flowing pretty well.

N. Raleigh has done well to distinguish itself as a place where you don't have to leave for shopping, dining, or entertainment. If you want to be a part of that then I think it's a great spot. Proximity to Falls Lake is awesome if you're into boating or hiking by the way.

Is there a reason you're ruling out the downtown/NC State areas though? Seems like you could cover both of those easily for the price of a Bedford or Wakefield home. Inside the Beltline homes appreciate like crazy too. They can always build more homes the further out they go, but there will also be a strong market for people who want the most convenience as well as an older neighborhood with established trees and history.

[Edited on June 26, 2007 at 3:36 PM. Reason : s]

6/26/2007 3:30:02 PM

Quote :

"sorry but although there is potential in the future"

Unless it is for retirement or you must have a house on the lake there is no future for Holly Springs. I540 is not running anywhere close to it.

6/26/2007 5:54:12 PM

^ Wrong. The "Southern Wake Freeway" section of I-540 runs right across the northern part of Holly Springs right at the border of Apex.

6/26/2007 6:37:36 PM

I live off of Timber in Garner (just south of US 70), and it is 13 minutes (with good traffic) from my driveway to the venture parking deck on Centennial. There's almost anything around here and its real convenient to 70/401/40.

I have a .63 acre lot (not wooded), so there is decent lots with nice houses semi close to Raleigh.

6/26/2007 9:14:44 PM

yeah garner is actually a very ideal location. The transportation infrastructure is already pretty well established given its size and I-540 is already being projected to transverse into it giving the area easy access to RTP.

They really need to work on 440. The Beltline from exit 1 to exit 4 is really fucked up. Melbourne exit anyone???

You gotta run a drag race to make it up to speed to be able to merge on the highway before the on-ramp ends. What really pisses me off when grandma is in front of me slow poking it down the ramp. I am on the ramp trying to eye a spot to merge but i have to beware that soccer mom sally is about to slam on her brakes since she is going so slow that she isn't able to merge on. At that point it usually takes about 5 minutes to wait for a break in traffic to get going from a full stop. then there is always the niggers that speed up to prevent you from gettin in front of them. I have almost run off the road a few times b.c of that one.

6/26/2007 9:21:51 PM

how far is garner (say your place) to RTP.......

Quote :

"Is there a reason you're ruling out the downtown/NC State areas though? Seems like you could cover both of those easily for the price of a Bedford or Wakefield home. Inside the Beltline homes appreciate like crazy too."

well, we'll looking for a newer built home, and all the new homes ITB cost twice as much as Bedford or Wakefield for the same sq footage.....plus parents would be living with us......i'm not so sure they want the hustle and bustle of being ITB...just feels claustraphobic with all the streets, cars, young drunks like us LOL

6/26/2007 9:52:21 PM

Quote :

"less convenient place and put up with the traffic"

Got news for ya. Wake Forest, along with Holly Springs, is the very definition of this.

Moving to WF will not solve your traffic woes. I promise.

^ Garner to RTP is at LEAST half an hour - 45 mins. as it stands. There's just no "good way" to get from there to RTP.

Trust me, I've fought this battle. I looked at every single possible option. Garner, Clayton, Willow Springs, WF, N. Raleigh, Apex, Cary, Holly Springs -- you name it. The only ones within ~20 mins. or less to RTP are far too expensive for your needs (and mine). All of the quasi-affordable ones are 30+ minutes. You'll run yourself crazy trying to make it work -- eventually, you just choose a decent sized home far away from RTP or suck it up and buy a pricey condo/rent a place near RTP. There's no in-between.

[Edited on June 26, 2007 at 11:30 PM. Reason : .]

6/26/2007 11:28:30 PM

Quote :

"I540 is not running anywhere close to it."

Did you not read what I posted? It is 'the' next section they'll start on as soon as the funds are available. As it stands now, if they get funds from the general transportation bucket, they won't start that section until 2016. If they make it a toll road, they'll start in 2011. I can't imagine just how utterly terrible traffic from here to RTP will be in the morning in 2011, or worse, 2016. Mayor Sears wasted years of his life fighting against the landfill, when he should have been posturing for better roads out of here. I guess he doesn't have to sit in the shit every morning on his way to work, so he doesn't know about it.

6/26/2007 11:38:03 PM

southwest wake county is a mess. i used to work for sunset ridge (also glen laurel in clayton and southern village in chapel hill. same people, different thread. just fyi)

at any rate, ive spent my share of time at town hall in holly springs getting shit approved, seeing the council get seeds planted in it, all that bullshit. wanna develop 500000 acres faster than nature will allow? run for mayor... ive also seen that whole town get bought out, house by house to remove all the black people. it was systematic and almost sickening anyways, i saw HS go from nothing (i moved to fuquay when i was like 12) to what it is today, almost overnight while i was working for SR. its all their "fault" if you wanna call it that. but like i said, its a clusterfuck out there.. and i think with the way prices are now (i havent looked at the wake real estate market since about december), you'd be better off to hit SE wake, or even clayton if youre willing to commute to raleigh, and check out granville county if youre going to durham

basically get the fuck out of wake county im so thankful to get what i got in greensboro, 2 miles from downtown, for what HAS to be less than the avg 2 bedroom 20 miles from raleigh

6/26/2007 11:52:32 PM

Quote :

"The only ones within ~20 mins. or less to RTP are far too expensive for your needs "

what areas of town are you referring to, any subdivisions? since my parents will be moving in, they may be able to loan me some money.

but...no i don't want to pay for overpriced homes in Brier Creek, so any other subdivisions i'm all game

6/27/2007 12:23:31 AM

Quote :

"or less to RTP are far too expensive for your needs"

If you are working for a good name in RTP you should not have any money woes anyway

6/27/2007 2:47:18 AM

^ Sure, making $50k a year you could get a loan that would still be unsettled three generations from now, but I'm not down with spending 75% of my paycheck on a dwelling. To each his own, I guess.

6/27/2007 8:32:09 AM