I am looking for experiences from people who have sued a car dealership (specifically service dept) in small claims court.

(Yes, I have talked to lawyers already - I am looking for local experiences.)

Thanks

7/26/2008 8:28:23 PM

Did you buy a Volkswagen?

7/26/2008 8:30:23 PM

no.

7/26/2008 8:43:03 PM

usually the serios threat of a suit is enough to get them to pay up, i would try contacting wral too, it would help if you were black and it was a hate thing and all too

7/26/2008 8:45:27 PM

Jiffy Lube probably get sued about once a week maybe Google their cases too.

7/26/2008 8:58:09 PM

gonna need to give more details here.

7/26/2008 9:44:07 PM

Short version of the story:

I take my truck (diesel) in to a dealership and they clean the fuel tank and replace a part that bolts to the injection pump. They have it a week and act like total dicks so I start recording phone conversations and on the last day I demand that they give me my truck. They do so, charging me nearly $1,000 and saying that "well, the check engine light is on" (even though it was NOT on before it went into the dealership).

I immediately take it to another shop and they find out that the part the dealership replaced was never even plugged in(!!!) The truck was fine for a couple of days and then it started having some serious problems. I end up dropping it back off at a shop and spending thousands to replace pretty much everything in the fuel system. After weeks of replacing things and having everything fail we discover that there was some kind of solvent in the fuel lines. Apparently when the dealership dropped and cleaned the fuel tank they used some form of solvent (like acetone) to clean out the tank but did not fully get rid of all of the solvent. The tank had to be dropped again and be flushed of all of the solvent and now that untainted fuel is i the truck it is running again although we believe that other parts in the fuel system have also been damaged.

The tech that performed the work was obviously in a rush and performed substandard work. When I tried to talk to the dealership service dept all I get is attitude and lies.

So basically I am looking at suing the dealership for damages.

[Edited on July 26, 2008 at 10:07 PM. Reason : +]

7/26/2008 10:05:20 PM

Talk to a lawyer. While you don't HAVE to have one in small court, it can sure as hell help . . . . and with as much as you've dropped already I'd say its well worth the extra charge to give you a better chance of getting it all back. You can include their fee in the list of damages you're trying to recover. If nothing else you can tell the people at the dealership that if they don't make good and pay for the repairs that you're retaining a lawyer and will be pursuing legal action.

Make sure you get signed statements by the guys at the second shop, which state that in their professional opinion the damage was caused solely and entirely by negligence on the part of the dealership's mechanics. That it was a simple job that was botched by rushing and not following proper procedures. Have as much documentation as possible, and keep itemized bills of everything.

7/26/2008 10:27:53 PM

maybe i'm missing something, but i'm seeing a couple of things wrong here:

-you demanded your truck back, possibly before the repair was completed and are upset about the job not being finished/rushed?

-diesels will burn just about any kind of remotely flammable liquid you can think of, especially dilluted remnants of something. i'm not saying they didn't somehow create more problems, but that's not the cause.

-poor or a complete lack of customer service is not grounds for a suit. it sounds like you may have grounds for taking your issues to the area rep for the company, but even that's going to be a tough fight since you took the truck back.

-repairs and maintenance on a modern diesel might come less frequently than a gas engine, but when they do come it's almost always much more exspensive. especially when you start talking about certain injection/lift pumps, injectors, and other fuel system parts. dealership pricing obviously compounds that. most dealerships have dedicated diesel techs that are generally well trained and are constantly exposed to your make/model of vehicle.

what kind of year/make/model truck are we talking about here anyway? i've got to say this initially sounds like just another customer not understanding how things work, but i'll reserve judgement until we get more info/details.

[Edited on July 26, 2008 at 10:40 PM. Reason : i'll put away my jump to conclusions mat...]

7/26/2008 10:32:50 PM

Quote :

"maybe i'm missing something, but i'm seeing a couple of things wrong here: -you demanded your truck back, possibly before the repair was completed and are upset about the job not being finished/rushed? "

Saved me the typing.........there is no need for anyone to further reply.

/thread

7/26/2008 11:28:08 PM

Quote :

"maybe i'm missing something, but i'm seeing a couple of things wrong here:"

There is actually quite a bit more to it (as I pointed out, that was the summarized version). I have already been dealing with this for the last few weeks and talking to a number of diesel mechanics, it is really too long of a story to go into much depth here. I wanted to stick to the topic at hand rather than go into every event that took place to get to where I am now.

If I get to the lawsuit point I have recorded phone calls with the dealership that summarize why I decided to pull it out (service manager was hostile and it turned into a confrontation) and will have documents from mechanics who worked on the truck indicating what they found. During a "status update" they also lied to me about certain things.

I am trying to avoid going into much detail because this is still a pending issue and I don't wish to post my entire "case" on the internet because that would be detrimental to me and might limit my options.

[Edited on July 27, 2008 at 12:51 AM. Reason : sigh]

7/27/2008 12:44:28 AM

this is why i work on my own shit

when i fuck up its my own fault

7/27/2008 1:15:24 AM

While asking for it back before it was "done" is an issue, in his defense I'd be pretty pissed if they'd had my truck for a week for a simple repair too.

7/27/2008 1:59:41 AM

^we have no way of knowing how simple the repair was since he's not disclosing any more info. diesel injection pumps and their parts can be very expensive and involved replacements. we also have no idea what time frame he was given or how busy the shop was. possibly they hadn't exceeded the indicated time frame, or maybe they had but by a reasonable amount for reasonable reasons. automotive repair is far from and exact science and your car isn't the only one there. not saying it is or isn't the case here, but 9 times out of 10 the problem rises from the customer not understanding that. they think as soon as their vehicle is pulled in the door it should be worked on from start to finish, regardless of anything else. they also don't understand that repairs frequently get further delayed by stuck bolts, discovery of other failed parts, and a whole horde of other reasons.

^^^fair enough, i understand that and it's probably the smart thing to do. however, i don't know how you really expect honest advice from experienced people without telling the story so we know how to aim our reply. there ARE other easier options you have besides a lawsuit, but i have no way of knowing if they'd be helpful. see my point? it may not matter though, from the little bit you have posted "the rest of the story" is going to have to be VERY compelling for you to have a leg to stand on.

one thing i can tell you is you've really shot yourself in the foot by paying for the repair and taking the truck. from a legal standpoint, that's saying you were satisfied with the work completed. satisfied enough that you willingly paid $1000. they'll just argue that if you weren't pleased, you would have refused to accept the truck until it was fixed right and refused payment. point 1 for the dealership.

next, they'll say you took the truck before the tech had time to fully complete the repair and road test the vehicle. you should have had it towed, but you took the truck and knowlingly drove it with the repair not fully completed and the CEL on. you've contaminated the evidence, it's like tromping through the blood and putting your fingerprints all over everything at a murder scene. the burden of any future failures lies on you now, and rightly it should. they have no way to control what goes on once the truck leaves their posession, therefore can easily displace any responsibility for the repairs required by the other shop. point 2 for the dealership.

finally, they'll bring up the fact that you've already had another shop (which is not a "certified brand X repair facility" like the dealership is). they'll present the very possible scenario that it was in fact this new shop that caused all of the new problems, not them. which, btw, how do you know for sure that's not really the truth? this business about solvents being the cause of the problems does not compute. either way, that's point 3 for the dealership and the judge is now screaming at you for wasting the courts time if he wasn't already doing it after point 1.

without knowing more, i see only a slim chance of any recovery. first step, you better hope you paid with a credit/debit card or a check. if so, dispute the charges or cancel the check asap. this is something you should have done right afterwards in hopes of establishing that you didn't get what you paid for, but it's better late than never. you need to make damn sure you're 100% commited to this though, because they just might kick you in the nuts back and place a lien on your vehicle until the issue is resolved.

you also need to exhaust any and all resources going up the chain of command. start with the head service department manager, or wherever it is you left off. depending on the size of the place, there may be one more person over their head that oversees service, collision, parts, accessories, etc. after that, it's usually the big cheese general manager, owner, or whatever. then, you can contact the area arbitrator or factory rep. this is the person that oversees the operations of all the dealerships in a given area and makes sure they are kept up to the standards of the manufacturer. this includes handling any warranty issues or other repair issues such as yours that can't be resolved at the dealership in question. usually, but not always, these people are fair and reasonable. they could order a refund, they could send you to another dealership to have anything else repaired free of charge, or any number of things to smooth the situation over and please you. or, they might tell you to kiss their ass, you're wrong, call your lawyer, we don't give a shit, because we have gangs of lawyers on retainer just sitting around waiting to go to court and handle this kind of stuff.

if you have a good relationship with a lawyer or can otherwise find one willing to do it, a well placed letter detailing your intentions of a suit, filing with the bbb, calling the media, etc. if your demands aren't met has a slim chance of working just to get you off their backs. they'll probably just call your bluff though, because like i said they already have lawyers at their disposal in most cases and your case is already full of holes with only the limited info here. it doesn't cost them a dime to fight you in court. why pay you now when they can take the chance of not paying anything first. plus, if they win they've established some precedent for any similar cases in the future. that's if they don't already have a bundle of them they'll be using against you. worst case scenario, they lose on an off chance, and pay you the money plus a little extra for legal fees/court costs. it's just a drop in the bucket, and worth the risk when they're still carrying a 90% rate of favorable judgements.

now, here is the point where you need to do a little "soul searching" or whatever, remove yourself from your emotions, and analyze the situation logically. did they really screw you over on the physical repairs? was the price you paid fair or at close to it for what had been done so far? is it at all possible that further damage occurred from you driving the truck or some level of incompetence by the new shop (fyi, any statements by them amount to jack shit, even if they're true)? how was the disagreement with the service manager allowed to get to the point of being a hostile confrontation without one of you being the bigger man and taking the issue over his head and him out of the equation? certainly doesn't excuse his actions, but wouldn't it show that you played at least some role in instigating things to that level? don't forget that while the customer might always be right, you still have some basic responsibility of staying civil and not stooping to their level even if attacked. not to mention you always catch more flies with sugar than vinegar. principal of things aside, is it really worth your time and possibly more money to fight it? i don't expect you to answer all that, they're just rhetorical questions that you need to be certain of the answers to and is exactly what any lawyer is going to ask up front.

if you go through all of this, and it turns out your only real valid and provable issue is with how you were treated, even your slim chances at a recovery are out the window. i would still actively pursue the customer service issue though, just because you don't have any grounds to a financial recovery you still have the right to ensure that yourself and other customers are given the level of respect and service deserved.

okay, well that's my novel having spent time on both sides. good luck, hope it helps.

7/27/2008 4:00:15 AM

Quote :

"it is really too long of a story to go into much depth here"

then why did you start then?


if you walk into a pizza place and they take longer than you are willing to wait for a pizza, and you tell them to pull it out of the oven and you take it home half cooked - then tried to sue them cause it wasnt cooked- see where I am going here? this is how a judge will see your case so forget it. YOU FUCKED UP.

7/27/2008 11:18:06 AM

small claims court handles matters less than 5k, so if you really did spend THOUSANDS more replacing the rest of your fuel system, small claims court is probably not going to be the route to go.

then you've got to factor in your attorney's fees. a good attny may be anywhere from $200 up per HOUR and getting all this information together is going to take a long time. are you willing to pay all of his fees with the possibility that you may not be able to recover them?

i know this is something our firm would not take.

7/27/2008 11:41:06 AM

Another poor soul learns his lesson about d[st]ealerships.

[Edited on July 27, 2008 at 2:55 PM. Reason : psi]

7/27/2008 1:57:17 PM

I'm intrigued to hear the rest of the story.

7/27/2008 6:13:42 PM

I'm gonna go out on a limb here and say its a ford.

7/27/2008 9:00:45 PM

dude is getting good response to his thread and won't post more because he is going to look like a bigger jack ass than when he started. i love the interweb.

7/28/2008 7:42:12 AM

fyi: recording a phone conversation without someone's knowledge is illegal and probably won't be admissible in court

7/28/2008 8:13:03 AM

Quote :

"fyi: recording a phone conversation without someone's knowledge is illegal and probably won't be admissible in court"

7/28/2008 8:23:07 AM

^ although wouldn't it technically be legal since in most cases, when you call the dealership, they play the message "for quality assurance, this phone call may be recorded." While only the customer hears it when they call, the employees at the dealership should know this. I don't see anything wrong if there's already a message saying that the conversation may be recorded and the caller wants to makes sure they have a copy too... This is, of course, assuming the dealership was called directly...

7/28/2008 8:26:47 AM

nah, nc is a single party state. as long as one person knows the conversation is being recorded (you), it's perfectly legal and admissible as evidence in a court of law. i think roughly half of the states follow this. any two or more party notification/consent in nc is simply a courtesy or to further stregnthen the evidence.

[Edited on July 28, 2008 at 8:30 AM. Reason : or if the call is taking place across state lines with differing statutes]

7/28/2008 8:27:45 AM

In small claims even if you win you do not get lawyer fees back. In fact, I don't believe your lawyer will be allowed to speak for you during the trial (he wasn't there, after-all). North Carolina may be different, but I doubt it.

That said, I also believe you do not have a leg to stand on. You took your truck back early and then did not give them a chance to fix whatever was wrong. A lot of small claims cases end on this note: impatience very quickly becomes legally indefensible.

7/28/2008 10:24:06 AM

^ Is that the same even if there was a written contract to complete work by such and such date?

7/28/2008 10:39:11 AM

Quote :

"They have it a week and act like total dicks so I start recording phone conversations and on the last day I demand that they give me my truck. They do so, charging me nearly $1,000 and saying that "well, the check engine light is on" (even though it was NOT on before it went into the dealership)."

He didnt give the facility the chance to finish the repair, he was made aware it wasnt properly done when he picked it up- yet he took it anyway. He does not have a leg to stand on.

7/28/2008 10:46:45 AM

he paid. end of story.

7/28/2008 11:01:45 AM