http://finance.yahoo.com/news/Obama-says-US-must-solve-apf-14554045.html

Quote :

"WASHINGTON (AP) -- The nation can't afford to wait for the economy to recover before tackling out-of-control medical costs, President Barack Obama is telling some of the most powerful players in the health care reform debate. "If we want to create jobs and rebuild our economy, then we must address the crushing cost of health care this year, in this administration," Obama says in remarks prepared for delivery to a White House forum on the issue Thursday. Excerpts were released by the White House. "Making investments in reform now, investments that will dramatically lower costs, won't add to our budget deficits in the long term -- rather, it is one of the best ways to reduce them," Obama said. Obama has invited to the forum more than 120 people who hold a wide range of views on how to fix the world's costliest health care system, one that still leaves an estimated 48 million people uninsured. Doctors, patients, business owners, insurers and drug industry representatives were to gather in hopes of building support for big changes. Republicans are invited, and they're expected to speak up. "The president wants to engage with Congress in a transparent and bipartisan fashion," said Melody Barnes, who heads White House domestic policy. Among the invitees are some who helped kill the Clinton administration's health care overhaul in the 1990s. Everyone is supposed to be on his best behavior, but will that last? "This is a different day, " said Chip Kahn, a hospital lobbyist who opposed President Bill Clinton's plan and was to attend Thursday's gathering. "I think among most of the stakeholders, everyone wants to see this work. There is a tremendous feeling that it's time." Now president of the Federation of American Hospitals, Kahn worked for the insurance industry in the Clinton years. The difference this time, Obama argues, is that health care costs have become unsustainable, particularly in a sinking economy. The U.S. spends $2.4 trillion a year on health care, yet an estimated 48 million Americans lack coverage. Obama's goal is health coverage for everyone. Barnes said Obama is determined to pass health care legislation this year, and while he wants it to be bipartisan, he will not be deterred by obstruction from interest groups or ideological partisans. "The president will make clear this has to be a bipartisan effort," Barnes said. "As for people who are there to set up hurdles, from his perspective that isn't tolerable. It's crucial to families, businesses and our nation's budget that we address the issue of exploding costs." Senate Republican leader Mitch McConnell of Kentucky released a letter to Obama, saying his party is ready to work with the administration on health care, but warning that reforms should not lead to a government-run system, and must balance coverage expansions with curbs on costs. Barnes said that Obama "walks into this conversation being pragmatic, being open. He knows that the American people are hurting" and are seeing their premiums rise. But Barnes, interviewed Thursday on NBC's"Today" show, also said that "we have to be transparent about it. ... We will also hear the voices of the American people ... to make sure that health care reform gets before the president for his signature before the end of the year." In support of Obama's efforts, liberal activists have mobilized to keep the pressure on Congress to pass legislation this year. "It would be a mistake to dismiss this as a gabfest," Drew Altman, president of the Kaiser Family Foundation, said about Obama's meeting. "It's an effort to keep the momentum going. The details are not going to be worked in two or three hours at a White House summit." There were concerns Wednesday about some of those details. Senate Finance Committee Chairman Max Baucus, D-Mont., who will play a leading role in writing health care legislation, raised questions about the proposed $634 billion "down payment" for expanded coverage that Obama included in the 2010 budget he released last week. White House: http://www.whitehouse.gov/agenda/health--care/"

When is this going to end? He is going all out in his first few months to completely screw over the economy. Change we can believe in! USA #1

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 12:14 PM. Reason : ]

3/5/2009 12:13:25 PM

soap box trash bin wants its thread back

maybe if you hadn't made this thread with a snarky attitude. clearly you have no interest in having a serious dialogue so yeah, this thread is [fail]

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 12:16 PM. Reason : .]

3/5/2009 12:14:45 PM

typical obama supporter response next attempt please

3/5/2009 12:20:00 PM

typical obama detractor response next attempt please

thanks for proving my point though

3/5/2009 12:21:35 PM

what if he had a snorky attitude?

3/5/2009 12:23:28 PM

I will say he could've waited a little longer than a month and a couple weeks into his presidency to go and push even more programs that will require massive tax hikes to support them.

Watching the news about government spending makes me sick.

3/5/2009 12:24:33 PM

nah there is a special place for threads like this

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 12:26 PM. Reason : chit chat]

3/5/2009 12:26:12 PM

if there's anything we should be spending money on, it's health care reform. and for somebody with diabetes mindstorm, i would think you would recognize that

i mean, at least he's spending the money on national priorities. the economy, health care, energy and education. and at least he's trying something. i'm not sure what good it would do to wait 2 years into his administration to start doing something. i'm not saying his stuff will work. i have no idea. but at least he's doing something. an imperfect plan today is better than a perfect plan tomorrow

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 12:29 PM. Reason : .]

3/5/2009 12:27:27 PM

YES WE HE CAN

just because someone has diabetes he should be down for everything medically related

he has no other mindset and becomes defined only by his condition, why even bring that up?

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 12:28 PM. Reason : f]

3/5/2009 12:27:47 PM

3/5/2009 12:29:09 PM

Quote :

"just because someone has diabetes he should be down for everything medically related"

be down for it, no. but be able to recognize the necessity of trying to fix the steaming pile of mess that is currently the US health care system, yeah. whether it benefits him or not, we need to at least address the system itself

3/5/2009 12:31:26 PM

maybe he feels its just fine

3/5/2009 12:32:06 PM

I pay for my own damn health insurance at $400/mo and will do everything in my power to keep paying for it until I can find a job somewhere that'll help me pay for it (hopefully that's in the works soon). I'd like it if there were some attempt at properly researching the why behind skyrocketing medical costs and if they took some action off of that. Some massive government-funded health insurance subsidy program (which is all I could see coming out of this office) is not what I had in mind.

I suspect there's some sketchy collusion going on somewhere, as I don't see how my insulin pump company can justify raising the sales price of an insulin pump from $5000 to $7000 in just four years. It's the same pump I had four years ago, just they put a rigid plastic cover on the touch bolus button and updated the software on it. This thing can not cost more than $500 to make, and it's been out for years (so development costs should be covered by now). I can only see this price increase as a "we're doing it because we can, and fuck you" to patients who rely on these things to stay alive.

I cannot agree that the government has to spend at least six hundred billion dollars of debt (because they aren't creating a tax base to do any of this goddamn bullshit these days, they're just expecting some future generation to pay it off) to determine why health insurance premiums are rising and to determine how to fix them and to take appropriate action based on their findings. Changing laws to make it easier for people to get health insurance (all pre-existing conditions covered and with only a 3 month waiting period before they can use their insurance for that condition) and, say, letting those same people whose income falls under a certain tax bracket write off their premiums entirely should mean that everybody in this country can get the health insurance they need.

If they want to fix some of the reason for the rising costs they need to offer greater legal protection for hospitals and doctors who throw out patients that are clearly taking advantage of the system or abusing it and wasting the ER's money on a problem that could be handled at an urgent care clinic. Every time I've been sitting in an ER bed (three times, each for diabetic complications due to a stomach virus/flu) I have had at least one person in the room with me or down the hall with something that could be handled by a regular doctor or by an urgent care clinic (or, to be perfectly honest, that didn't need to be handled at all because it was bullshit). The whiney middle aged man with his wife complaining that something must be wrong because he was a little lightheaded that day and he wants to be checked for diabetes, anemia, arrhythmia, or kidney problems in the fucking emergency room (because he got a little fucking DIZZY) is the very reason why we have skyrocketing healthcare costs. That and the people who show up there with a fucking COLD who don't have insurance and can't afford to pay a doctor just so they can be told to drink some fucking fluids and get some bed rest.

If there was a greater focus in this country on not being a goddamn lardass and on having children responsibly and if they made it mandatory for people to have health insurance, then maybe things could start to turn around a bit. If they could find some way to properly deal with people who go to ER when they have the fucking sniffles or stood up too fast and feinted (or are just hypochondriacs) then maybe we could turn things around a bit (and reduce waiting room times for people who are actually sick). If people would just bite the moderately-priced $75 bullet and see an urgent care doctor, or get a regular doctor and get an annual checkup and follow their doctor's advice then maybe things could start to turn around a bit. As it is I don't see that much of a problem with the system as much as I do with the people who are being allowed to use it and the ways in which they are allowed to use it. All I see that the government is planning on doing here is throwing money at the problem so more people can afford health insurance (or be given health insurance) without making any initiative to deal with the root of the problem. In my opinion the problem is that so many people in this country don't take care of themselves, don't act responsibly in their lives or in their family planning, don't listen to their doctor's advice when they tell them to lose weight and exercise or they're going to die (I know many of the problems my parents have are expensive and could've been avoided with exercise and diet), and that we don't have different levels of care in most emergency rooms for people with real life-threatening emergencies, people with non-life threatening injuries, and people with a fucking cold that should've gone to a $75/pop urgent care clinic (which is $7.50-15/pop with even some of the most basic health insurance plans, versus the hundreds it costs to sit in an ER bed for a few hours).

I don't agree with any of the excessive spending this government is doing in its first hundred days in office because I feel it's going to be an engine for making inflation worse and for making it so my kids get to enjoy a tax rate of 40% and get to watch the great united states fall to goddamn pieces as all these programs being railroaded through just end up wasting taxpayer money and causing more problems than they were supposed to fix. Yes, I'm cynical and I believe in limited government, because I feel the fallout from the private industry fucking up is much much smaller than the fallout from the government fucking up.

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 2:10 PM. Reason : ^ Maybe he's goddamn tired of people feeling entitled to something that they refuse to pay for.]

3/5/2009 2:10:25 PM

Quote :

"Obama's goal is health coverage for everyone. "

Health care for everyone?

Who is going to pay for this?

3/5/2009 2:13:29 PM

i sure as fuck am not

3/5/2009 2:15:30 PM

I'd just like for us to hold off a bit longer on messing with something that makes up 1/6th of our economy. Maybe wait until the other 5/6ths is somewhat stabilized before we start messin' with sasquatch.

3/5/2009 2:15:53 PM

^^^ Well, nobody wants to, they just expect it to happen. This is why the system is in such a bind in the first place.

Besides the fact that people are lazy and fat and don't live their lives responsibly because they don't see any reason to do so. Makes life a hell of a lot fucking harder for the rest of us.

3/5/2009 2:19:06 PM

You can't fix what is broken by not spending money to improve it. Quit being so damn short sighted.

3/5/2009 2:19:08 PM

You can't fix what is broken simply by throwing a bunch of goddamn money at it that you don't have in the first place.

They need to completely rework insurance laws and ER laws and they need to implement better legal protection so it's not so goddamn easy for people to sue a doctor or a hospital for millions of dollars because somebody thinks they were wronged in some way (or that the 10% chance that a surgery might fail was actually not the doctor's fault and due to the fact that medicine isn't perfect and that sick people don't always get better).

If we don't make any effort to make people (to force people) to live their lives responsibly we're not going to see this problem get any better. I mean, how many Americans do you think exercise every day, make some moderate attempt at eating well at least four days a week, and follow their doctor's advice at least 70% of the time? We're a nation of aging fat slobs that has become overly reliant on meds and some sort of "magic bullet" to fix our problems. Providing health insurance for those that can't afford it will not deal with the underlying problem of people going to the ER when they don't need to, of asking for a pill to fix the problem instead of a lifestyle change, and of people irresponsibly living their lives (by smoking, drinking excessively, eating too goddamn much, having tons of kids when they can't afford to even take care of themselves, etc).

I admit a lot of my ideas are bordering on some of the shit you'd read in a Ray Bradbury or a Robert Heinlein novel (to some extent), but I can not believe that people think that by just providing health insurance for everybody the problem is going to fix itself in the slightest. If anything costs will go up more because the burden on the system will go up 20% with sixty million more people added to the system who haven't had healthcare coverage.

3/5/2009 2:29:31 PM

Before I can take any of you serious who are complain about 'paying for insurance for other people', I would like you to return any and all aide provided by the government for college. This includes tax credits given when you file your taxes. Give back any federal loans.

Once you do this I will listen to you bitch about how terrible it is to 'pay for other's insurance'.

3/5/2009 2:38:52 PM

Obama will not be able to address the healthcare system when his popularity and approval ratings start to slide. He has huge amounts of political capital right now, and there is no telling how much longer that will last. If he really wants to re-work the system, now is the time to act. If he waits until the economy recovers, he may not have the pull he once did. Granted, I'm only commenting on the why behind his political strategy.

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 2:41 PM. Reason : -]

3/5/2009 2:40:02 PM

Why do you assume he is going to do a bad job? If he makes progress toward reform why won't his approval rating go up? He has about 2 years before the next set of elections before he has to worry about any potential shifts in power.

Now, I agree, his approval rating will go down among a lot of the black people who will come to realize they don't all get new rims and cushy jobs because he was elected.

3/5/2009 2:43:37 PM

It's inevitable that his approval ratings will slip. It's just the nature of the job and the process. I don't think he will do a bad job, in fact, I think he is one of the most competent leaders in recent memory. However, the burdens that he is taking upon himself are of epic proportions. How much can one man really do? We all know Obama has a huge ego, but can he really be that versatile without making any mistakes? Time will tell.

3/5/2009 2:53:27 PM

Quote :

"They need to completely rework insurance laws and ER laws and they need to implement better legal protection so it's not so goddamn easy for people to sue a doctor or a hospital for millions of dollars because somebody thinks they were wronged in some way (or that the 10% chance that a surgery might fail was actually not the doctor's fault and due to the fact that medicine isn't perfect and that sick people don't always get better)."

signed

AAAAAAAAAAAAmen

3/5/2009 2:57:25 PM

Quote :

"The whiney middle aged man with his wife complaining that something must be wrong because he was a little lightheaded that day and he wants to be checked for diabetes, anemia, arrhythmia, or kidney problems in the fucking emergency room (because he got a little fucking DIZZY) is the very reason why we have skyrocketing healthcare costs."

signed

It would help a lot if they just got rid of the EMTALA.

3/5/2009 2:59:58 PM

I think Obama is going in the right direction. There are some obvious flaws, but there are a lot of good things being proposed too.

For example, Medicare funding and reimbursement plummeted during the Bush Administration and Obama's budget proposal rejected the planned 40% Medicare physician payment cuts over the next decade. It was reasons like this why we developed such a shortage of general practitioners, because physicians couldn't afford to see Medicare patients. Also, since hospitals were getting such shitty reimbursement from Medicare, they had to jack up costs for other procedures to compensate, hence it was a big contributor to rising healthcare costs.

But it's still going to be awhile before we see any major changes in healthcare I think. Healthcare lobbyists have a huge influence in Washington and everybody is going to want to have their input.

3/5/2009 3:41:44 PM

Quote :

"I'd like it if there were some attempt at properly researching the why behind skyrocketing medical costs and if they took some action off of that. "

Two items that need to be changed to lower healthcare costs.
1. Medical malpractice insurance
2. The cost of healthcare is not controlled by the consumer


Proposal to get change in items 1 and 2.
1. Tort reform (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tort_reform),. in essence, means that if you're suing your doc for 10 million and loose, you pay him 10 million. Nowadays, most cases are settled out of court as to avoid high settlements.
2. The market or consumers needs to control healthcare costs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Consumer_driven_health_care

Quote :

"I think Obama is going in the right direction. "

No he is not.

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 4:12 PM. Reason : -]

3/5/2009 4:12:32 PM

I think it's cute how people think there's going to be a national health care system. In other words others have tried but failed, like no one else has been able to figure it out but wait Obama is the man with the plan. There's WAY too much money involved and if there's one thing I know about politics, money reigns supreme.

3/5/2009 4:46:39 PM

picking a president because he looks different than bush is such a solid basis for election

lay in your beds faggots, this is gonna be one hell of a nightmare ride

3/5/2009 5:00:43 PM

we are so screwed

3/5/2009 5:01:28 PM

Quote :

"No he is not."

That's just, like, your opinion man.

Quote :

"picking a president because he looks different than bush is such a solid basis for election "

Well McCain's ideas for healthcare 'reform' were fucking retarded. But that's neither here nor there since he's not president.

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 7:30 PM. Reason : .]

3/5/2009 7:29:33 PM

NIGS BE GITTIN HEALTHY

3/5/2009 7:30:10 PM

Quote :

"They need to completely rework insurance laws and ER laws and they need to implement better legal protection so it's not so goddamn easy for people to sue a doctor or a hospital for millions of dollars because somebody thinks they were wronged in some way (or that the 10% chance that a surgery might fail was actually not the doctor's fault and due to the fact that medicine isn't perfect and that sick people don't always get better)."

yeah, they should do away with lawsuits all together. the Captains of Industry in the hospital know what's best for you.

It's all just a part of the free market whether you like it or not.

3/5/2009 7:33:46 PM

you know what i like about our health care system? the fact that it costs far more per citizen than any country on earth and our health as a nation is considerably worse than most western nations.

hooray for capitalism!

3/5/2009 7:39:19 PM

dammit

chit chat is not soap box #2

3/5/2009 7:39:44 PM

meh, we're a bigger more complex nation than sweden so it's damn near impossible.

not to mention, the cost per person is never going to be lowered here because we eat shitty diets.

3/5/2009 7:40:50 PM

I decided for the longest time not to carry insurance. It wasn't until my current job that I even considered it. I got sick I paid for it. Most of the time I got samples and never had to buy the actual drug.

There were several instances when they asked how I wanted to pay and I would reply cash and they sliced the bill. I believe this is the flaw in the system. They need to charge the insurance company and the "cash" individual the same price for every procedure. They jack up the price because they know the insurance company will pay for it and in turn pass the cost back to the consumer.

My brother had an accident playing ultimate Frisbee on the IM fields and had an MRI. They charged him 2k for it. He said he was paying cash they dropped it to 600.

In general my yearly medical expenses were around 500-600 dollars. Strep/sickness once a year, one teeth cleaning, and a girly visit. This included the associated medicine. Now I pay 20 a month and my company pays about 440 a month for my insurance and I still go to the doctor the same amount of time. Upon closer inspection of my policy, should I have something catastrophic I am still responsible for a lot of the cost with my deductible minimums and coinsurance. I needed my wisdom teeth out and they denied it. I still had to pay the 1300 dollars for it even with my insurance.

3/5/2009 7:46:50 PM

Quote :

"They jack up the price because they know the insurance company will pay for it and in turn pass the cost back to the consumer."

that's actually the opposite of how it often works.

insurance can work out deals with health care providers because of the bulk. and thus the uninsured (typically poor) are paying the most for health care.

3/5/2009 7:50:28 PM

Obama sure is a fucking idiot.

3/5/2009 7:53:11 PM

I hear he is a secret Muslim

3/5/2009 8:04:13 PM

Obama sure is a fucking idiot. politician. Same difference I guess.

3/5/2009 8:09:08 PM

it's funny what people think causes high health care costs and what actually causes high health care costs...you people watch too much fox news

3/5/2009 8:12:52 PM

I talked to Joe the Plumber he said that sounded like socialism

3/5/2009 8:13:30 PM

joe heard heard it from ronald reagan

[Edited on March 5, 2009 at 8:17 PM. Reason : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fRdLpem-AAs]

3/5/2009 8:16:16 PM

Quote :

"an imperfect plan today is better than a perfect imperfect plan tomorrow "

We all know no government in the world can come up with a perfect plan for health care

3/5/2009 8:19:32 PM

thanks but no thanks for that bridge to nowhere

3/5/2009 8:21:30 PM

so he wants to spend more money that he doesn't have?

I thought that the people needed money to spend to turn this economy around.... I guess that's just not right. We should give all our money to the government and that will fix things!

3/5/2009 10:05:57 PM

not everyone in this country deserves health care. It's a privelege, not a right.

3/5/2009 11:20:14 PM

set the set em up

3/5/2009 11:22:11 PM

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3/5/2009 11:24:54 PM