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Bullet
All American
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Vice!!1!

https://www.vice.com/en/article/v7vz8d/michigan-matthew-deperno-plan-b-banI

Quote :
"When he was asked about the state’s abortion laws and whether Plan B can be banned in Michigan, DePerno responded, “What’s Plan B?” After he was informed that it’s the morning-after pill, DePerno said “gotta figure out how to ban the pill from the state,”
...
“You have to stop it at the border. It would be no different than fentanyl,” DePerno said. “The state has to ban it, and it should be banned. But it’s just an issue of how do you enforce it. How do you make sure that it stops? That’s your problem.”"


These people.... how, as a grown adult who is obsessed with banning abortion, not know what Plan B is?

9/21/2022 12:01:22 PM

rjrumfel
All American
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Heads in the sand.

9/21/2022 2:23:10 PM

The Coz
Tempus Fugitive
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I don't know what it is, but it should definitely be banned until we can figure out what it is and then ban it.

9/21/2022 8:46:35 PM

aaronburro
Sup, B
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You know, I'm not a fan of abortion in general, but this shit in Texas is downright cruel. Forcing a woman who wants a child to carry a more or less dead one to term to the detriment of her ability to have another child? That's fucking barbaric. Nothing about that is "pro-life."

12/9/2023 8:57:26 PM

The Coz
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But they cannot give an inch or otherwise the terrorists have won.

12/10/2023 7:57:37 AM

aaronburro
Sup, B
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I wonder how many of them even have an inch to give

12/10/2023 10:05:02 AM

HaLo
All American
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Jesus Christ

12/11/2023 10:23:57 PM

thegoodlife3
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https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/4355865-kentucky-woman-suing-for-abortion-learned-her-embryo-has-no-cardiac-activity/amp/

it was always about control

fuck these ghouls

hopefully stories like these will radicalize some who were anti-choice

12/12/2023 12:16:00 PM

aaronburro
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I wouldn't say I've been radicalized, but it's sure as fuck making me feel a shit ton more sympathy towards the pro-choice side. I'm not sure how much of this is due to the original shitty decision (yes, it was bad) galvanizing the two sides into ever-more extreme positions as opposed to just the current hyper-partisan environment, but it's hard to justify the outright cruelty of these laws at this point. What good is a "medical emergency exception" if you've basically got to wait for the woman to die before it kicks in?

12/13/2023 12:09:27 AM

thegoodlife3
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there is no “extreme position” from the left/pro-choice side

12/13/2023 12:16:44 AM

aaronburro
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Yeah, there kind of is. Most European abortion laws are fairly to the right of what we had pre-dobbs, and much to the right of what many on the left here have argued for at times.
Granted, now the Overton Window has been pushed so damned far to the right, that is dragging the left back, out of mere necessity. Yet, at least 5 states allow abortion at any time, for any reason, which is quite extreme compared to anywhere in Europe

[Edited on December 13, 2023 at 12:50 AM. Reason : ]

12/13/2023 12:37:03 AM

emnsk
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My position has always been that it is generally morally wrong, and that it is definitely distinct from other situations of personal choice... there is another entity involved. I get why pro-choice activists say it, but I find the "clump of cells" argument distasteful and disingenuous.

But... As is evident in what we're seeing now, having the state control this matter is in itself too much of a danger. When it extends to the very inner self of a woman, especially when a woman may be in poor conditions, unable to stand up for herself. It makes it easy to cage her down.
I do think that abortion should be legal and accessible up to at least a bit after the first trimester with clear exceptions for afterwards in cases of the mother's health and other complications. The law should be tilted to give the benefit of the doubt.

I have not studied this to any significant depth, but I do wonder if Roe v Wade was in a way a setback. Had the issue not become national and develop such polarization, would individual states have eventually developed common sense laws on their own over time? I don't know, but I do wonder.

But regardless, with the politicization of the issue, what I really do feel is pity for the woman and the child. I also would like to mention how men need to be more responsible. Often, be it by threatening to leave if they do or don't abort, whatever it may be, the innocent woman is ensnared. Society, family, her own body - no one spares her.

[Edited on December 13, 2023 at 8:03 AM. Reason : =]

12/13/2023 7:55:34 AM

thegoodlife3
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Quote :
"Yet, at least 5 states allow abortion at any time, for any reason, which is quite extreme compared to anywhere in Europe"


that still isn’t extreme, and nobody mentioned anything about Europe.

12/13/2023 10:50:13 AM

emnsk
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^



It is a comparatively extreme position. But if you're trying to make some ideological implication like "the idea that a woman should not be able to have control over her body cannot be extreme" - that's a different story.

Please do elaborate.

12/13/2023 12:49:58 PM

aaronburro
Sup, B
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If killing a fully viable child 2 days before birth for any reason or no reason isn't an extreme position, I don't know what is. I only reference Europe because they are generally considered to be too the left of the US on most social issues; it's a reasonable barometer in that regard. The fact that their laws are almost all 12-14 weeks suggests that the US was quite to the left of that, especially in areas that allowed full term abortions.

[Edited on December 13, 2023 at 8:32 PM. Reason : ]

12/13/2023 8:30:48 PM

thegoodlife3
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Quote :
" If killing a fully viable child 2 days before birth for any reason or no reason isn't an extreme position, I don't know what is"


cite your source

12/13/2023 9:21:35 PM

The Coz
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You can't cite a source on an opinion. But I agree (with the opinion).

12/14/2023 1:36:25 AM

emnsk
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The chart I sent above says only 13% of Americans support it.
I think that is evidence enough.
37% of Americans described their political views as moderate, 36% as conservative and 25% as liberal.
So if not even all the self identified liberals are on ya with this, not to mention, not even 1/5 of women, you can that it's extreme.

That's why I asked him if he's trying to say something like "the idea that a woman should not be able to have control over her body cannot be extreme", to clarify, because that would give some sense to his statement.
But to no avail, as a reply was not awarded.

12/14/2023 9:49:19 AM

thegoodlife3
All American
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^^

asking for evidence of abortions 2 days before birth

12/14/2023 10:07:14 AM

emnsk
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What do you guys think of abortion due to disabilities (non-lethal insane super super rare stuff), sex selection? Especially as prenatal testing for things like even autism start to become more common?

And, not abortion, but a somewhat related thing... Sex-selective IVF? It's legal in America.

12/14/2023 10:25:46 AM

thegoodlife3
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https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/university-alabama-pauses-ivf-services-court-rules-embryos-are-childre-rcna139846

fucking infuriating

2/21/2024 6:35:56 PM

emnsk
All American
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Not sure how I feel about IVF (not legally, like in general, I'm not speaking to this issue)

what do you guys think about surrogacy

2/21/2024 8:35:09 PM

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