http://www.cnn.com/2010/POLITICS/02/03/tea.party/index.html?hpt=C1

Quote :

"(CNN) -- As the Tea Party's first national convention gets under way, members are united in their anger but divided over the future of the movement. The convention is marketed as an opportunity to bring Tea Party leaders from across the country together to network and support the movement's goals. But some see the high-ticket convention, organized by a for-profit organization, as contradictory to the group's bottom-up, grass-roots beginnings. Tennessee Rep. Marsha Blackburn and Minnesota Rep. Michele Bachmann were supposed to speak at the convention, but both dropped out, citing problems with the for-profit status of the Tea Party Nation, the group behind the event. Former Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin is the convention's keynote speaker."

If Palin is the queen of the Tea Party, and the only one willing to associate with it, will they be stronger or weaker after a national convention?

Quote :

"But as it expanded, the protests became more partisan in nature, and the Tea Party established itself as an uprising to the right of the Republican Party. While independent voters were reacting against the polarization of the two major parties, the Tea Partiers wanted Republicans and Democrats to become more polarized, Avlon said. "What happened over the course of the summer as the town hall [meetings] got hijacked, you started to see a new kind of activist taking over the Tea Party movement," Avlon said. "As the fringe has blurred with the base, you've seen more unhinged attacks proliferate, and there still hasn't been a transition to a positive agenda." Some Tea Party members began directing their anger at Obama, calling him a socialist and carrying posters with his face altered to resemble Hitler or The Joker."

I think a viable third party in the US would be great, especially one that appeals to independents, but I don't think those methods are what attract independents.

Quote :

"In November, Tea Party groups received credit for affecting the outcome of a special election for New York's 23rd Congressional District. Local Republican leaders backed state Assemblywoman Dede Scozzafava because they thought she would appeal to centrists and independents. But more conservative party members revolted and instead backed Doug Hoffman, who ran on the Conservative Party line. Scozzafava dropped out days before the race and endorsed Bill Owens, the Democratic candidate and eventual winner. The split among Republicans contributed to Owens' win. Curtis Gans, director of the Committee for the Study of the American Electorate at American University, pointed to that election as an example of how the Tea Party's support for more conservative candidates could hurt Republicans in the upcoming elections. "If the 'birthers' [those who say Obama wasn't born in the U.S.] and the Tea Party people win most of the primaries in the Republican Party, that may not yield as much of a Republican victory in the general election as if their more moderate elements win," he said. As the primary season begins, Tea Partiers disagree about where the movement is heading. Rival factions are battling over who will carry the Tea Party banner. Some members worry powerful groups are "astroturfing" what they think should remain a grass-roots group. "I don't think the Tea Party knows what's happening to the Tea Party," Sacramento party activist Jim Knapp said. "I don't think there's any question the GOP has their tentacles into the Tea Party." Mark Meckler and Jenny Beth Martin, founders of the Tea Party Patriots, say they are proud of what the movement has accomplished, but they are frustrated that other Tea Party groups are being run by Republican political consultants forking over lots of cash for recruitment. The Tea Party Express, a conservative bus tour that crisscrossed the country last year, was run from inside a Republican political consulting firm. This week's convention has also been dogged by infighting, with some protesting its $549 entrance fee and its hierarchical organization."

I wonder if they will function more as a party that energizes the right, or if they will be the Nader to the republican party?


Either way, they get props as a new party holding a national convention (even if it is for profit).

2/4/2010 3:34:29 PM

1. I don't think the "Tea Party" movement knows who it is yet.
2. I hate the term "Tea Party".
3. For an ostensibly "libertarian" and pro-market movement, I think going for-profit should me a mark for, rather than against, them.
4. No matter what happens, CNN and MSNBC will never take them seriously.
5. No one is saying it, but in the Illinoi6s primaries, the establishment candidates all won.
6. I hate the term "Tea Party".

2/4/2010 3:51:59 PM

^It is definitely a name improvement on the early Tea Bag movement

2/4/2010 3:56:33 PM

I think they'll serve to siphon off the religious conservatives from the Republican party, forcing the Republicans to drift more towards the center (ie a leftwards direction), which is good for us all.

2/4/2010 3:59:20 PM

Seriously they make "Joe the Plumber" look intelligent and "with it"

2/4/2010 4:05:50 PM

This is good. I am glad the Tea Party movement exists.

Anyone ever take a good look at the '92 and '96 elections? If not for a couple personal gaffes, Perot would have won.

2/4/2010 4:12:54 PM

Quote :

"It is definitely a name improvement on the early Tea Bag movement"

That was an unfortunate moniker for "Tea Party" members which was beat mercilessly by MSNBC, but never the "name" of the movement.

2/4/2010 4:58:55 PM

keeeeeeeitthh olbeerrmmannn

man i was watching him back and forth flipping between oreilly. olbermann is a complete joke. i was shocked at the difference. no wonder he has around 1/90th the viewers. olbermann is some breed of hoops malone on steroids.

[Edited on February 4, 2010 at 5:13 PM. Reason : 3]

2/4/2010 5:10:54 PM

keith is way too partisan, as bad as hannity, but way smarter & hilarious
if you havent watched a full show of olberman you should, but then i'd have a hard time sitting through one show of glenn beck, i dont think there are any redeeming qualities there

2/4/2010 5:37:31 PM

i cant sit through beck, hannity or olberman.

2/4/2010 8:15:43 PM

Quote :

"I think going for-profit should me a mark for, rather than against, them."

Did it end up costing $459 to go to this thing, or was that mis reported somewhere?

I'm not really sure why this should be a mark for the movement. What are you thinking?

2/4/2010 8:28:10 PM

I flip over to Beck during the commercial breaks while watching Rachel but rarely is he even talking about anything relevant. He's just playing Six Degrees of Kevin Bacon on his little chalkboards.

I made sure to tease my ex who currently resides in Nashville for this "convention" taking place there.

[Edited on February 4, 2010 at 8:31 PM. Reason : .]

2/4/2010 8:29:43 PM

You know you've gone too far off the deep end when you scare away Michele Bachmann.

2/4/2010 8:34:16 PM

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2010-02-04-tea-party_N.htm
Infighting threatens to ice hot 'Tea Party'

2/4/2010 9:31:46 PM

oh, durr, there it was, right in the text

Quote :

"This week's convention has also been dogged by infighting, with some protesting its $549 entrance fee and its hierarchical organization.""

They aren't really trying to include people in the movement are they?

2/4/2010 10:04:16 PM

A couple of things:

Quote :

""If you take 1,000 so-called tea partiers and ask them what this movement is, you'll get 1,000 different interpretations, but they're all waving American flags and speaking out against the galloping socialist agenda." -- Mark Williams, a talk-radio host and chairman of the Tea Party Express"

Indeed.

Quote :

"The Tea Party movement in the US is an open source political protest. It emerged due to a substantial loss of government legitimacy (primarily from the mishandling of the global financial crisis) and continues to percolate as legitimacy continues to drain away from the government (health care, banking reform, unemployment, foreclosures, bankruptcy, deficit, etc.). Here's what open source means in this context: * Lots of small local groups (and individuals), with a plethora of different motivations for action. * No barriers to entry. Anybody can label themselves or their actions as part of the Tea Party. * Lots of networked activity and cross movement communication. As a movement, it is very similar to open source warfare and therefore shares many of the same dynamics. Here are a few of them: * Its main value is systems disruption. It can slow political processes. It can say no (the name, "Tea Party" is derived from an act of disruptive, albeit non-violent, domestic terrorism directed at the government). * There are lots of people trying to control it (grab the baton to lead the parade) and form it into a cohesive whole. All of these efforts will fail. Every attempt at control will be attacked and defeated by a majority of Tea Party groups/members. * Swarms. Groups will rapidly converge on attractive protest targets (typically signaled by media coverage via stigmergy)."

http://globalguerrillas.typepad.com/globalguerrillas/2010/02/the-tea-party.html

2/5/2010 9:23:14 AM

As a party focused around protest, I never really get why they didn't form up under a president spending money on unjust war & torture, but rather waited for president trying to focus on domestic improvements.

2/5/2010 1:40:54 PM

Because taxpayers didn't want socialized healthcare.

2/5/2010 1:46:40 PM

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/02/05/tancredo-opens-tea-party-convention-with-a-bang/?fbid=_uZnLbrB2TV

Quote :

"Tancredo opens Tea Party Convention with a bang[/] Nashville, Tennessee (CNN) – Tom Tancredo opened what's being billed as the first Tea Party Convention with a bang. The former congressman from Colorado and 2008 Republican presidential candidate blasted President Obama, saying "people who could not even spell the word 'vote', or [b]say it in English, put a committed socialist ideologue in the White House. His name is Barack Hussein Obama."

These scare tactics that the GOP run towards during election season are a big part of why McCain, once a moderate/bipartisan kind of guy, lost so much of the middle ground. And the closer the election gets I think the more we are going to hear about scary foreigners with scary names.

2/5/2010 2:05:45 PM

Quote :

"Tancredo's speech received polite applause among the 600 attendees at the convention."

[Edited on February 5, 2010 at 2:39 PM. Reason : ]

2/5/2010 2:39:36 PM

Quote :

"I think a viable third party in the US would be great, especially one that appeals to independents, but I don't think those methods are what attract independents."

the green party has more appeal than this.

Quote :

"No barriers to entry. Anybody can label themselves or their actions as part of the Tea Party."

as soon as one of them murders a Democrat leader and proclaims it an action on behalf of the Tea Party, we will see how long it stands.

2/5/2010 2:41:17 PM

Supplanter, War is actually the job of the federal govt.

I think it is safe to say that many people, myself included, were pissed at the spending under bush. What were his approval ratings? So you cannot be upset when those people get more upset when obama doubles down.

2/5/2010 2:48:49 PM

The GOP was against time tables for ending an indefinite, unjustified war. President Obama is going to have us out of Iraq next year. I can see how this would upset them.

2/5/2010 2:57:43 PM

Quote :

"I never really get why they didn't form up under a president spending money on unjust war & torture"

The core (or original core) of what is now the "Tea Party" movement did. The Ron Paul movement could be considered the ancestral heir of the TPM until Obama was elected. The current manifestation of the TPM is a reaction against both Obama and a congress which has the outward appearance of being utterly indifferent to public opinion. It had already started before the 2008 election, but picked up steam with the Health Care debate.

Quote :

"as soon as one of them murders a Democrat leader and proclaims it an action on behalf of the Tea Party, we will see how long it stands."

Seriously, just stop. I've been over this in a number of other threads but the vast majority of assassinations conducted in the 20th century were conducted by leftists and radicals, not by the right. Conservatives inherently want to preserve the status quo and are typically loathe to do something as radical as assassination. (Lynching and war are more prototypically "conservative" means of violence, but I digress)

Quote :

"Supplanter, War is actually the job of the federal govt."

Interesting you capitalize war, because you are correct the common defense is a function of the Federal Government. We also haven't declared "War" since December 8th 1941. The abdication of control of the activation of the military by Congress which started the Vietnam War is dubiously constitutional, even if it is widely accepted.

2/5/2010 3:52:20 PM

The Top Tea-bagger is apparently both a racist and a bad speller:

http://www.pensitoreview.com/2010/01/04/photo-shows-top-tea-bagger-holding-sign-with-n-word-which-he-misspelled/

2/5/2010 6:38:52 PM

You are right Cash, despite the responsiblity of the federal govt to protect its citizens, they have been running around ignoring the consitution for too long. Both parties.

2/5/2010 6:40:42 PM

^^ It is a shame that that has become the face of the movement, but it is asinine for any one person to claim to be the head of something so nebulous. That being said, whatever legitimate claim to true reform many "members" of the movement may have will likely be co-opted by the Sarah Palin crowd who is looking for a home after the Christian Right disappeared from the GOP's love-list.


Sadly, those who truly love liberty and the classical liberal view of the world will be drowned out by people, "all waving American flags and speaking out against the galloping socialist agenda."

2/5/2010 10:22:19 PM

2/6/2010 9:31:18 PM

when explaining what the "palin plan" is, palin said that it is about the government staying out of the way and letting the market do what it needs to do. then, when asked what the first things are that she would do if she were president she talked about the new government energy program that she talked about before as her primary concern. how are these things not contradictory?

2/6/2010 10:10:20 PM

^I think this equation can solve that for you.

Government = evil*



*except when the GOP is spending the money

2/6/2010 10:23:45 PM

I will not support a "tea party " movement as long as they consider such mind-numbing spoke-people like Sarah Palin to be their "voice." What a joke...

2/7/2010 1:09:32 AM

2/7/2010 4:12:35 AM

Quote :

"Government = evil*"

So if this is how you translate every valid criticism of gov't...them we'll just slap this stupid axiom onto you..

Government= Our Salvation.

2/7/2010 10:22:56 AM

Palin's Speech:




She's reacquired some of the confidence she lost after resigning the governorship but it was a pretty predictable speech.

2/7/2010 12:52:03 PM

The cartoonish nature of the teabaggers will set back the cause of fiscal conservatism for many years. Complete collapse is inevitable now.

2/7/2010 2:54:11 PM

Real Americans don't use prompters...they write on their hands.

2/7/2010 3:07:33 PM

The neocons have pretty much taken over the "movement." I don't know that control can be ripped out of their hands, now that they have it.

2/7/2010 3:09:48 PM

lol oh man

not that she had to make notes of talking points

but that she wrote them in a VERY, very obvious place

2/7/2010 3:12:50 PM

if the teaparty wants to win, they should bring in guys like ron paul

2/7/2010 5:01:30 PM

when i see stuff like this it makes me remember the times of Ross Perot.

2/7/2010 5:11:21 PM

Too much talk about sarah's hand, not enough about curtailing government spending.

[Edited on February 7, 2010 at 5:23 PM. Reason : Though she does have lovely hands. ]

2/7/2010 5:22:45 PM

Quote :

" if the teaparty wants to win, they should bring in guys like ron paul"

I thought he was one of the original creators of this. Then somewhere along the line it was hijacked by the obese borrow and spend republican types.

2/7/2010 5:35:14 PM

Ron Paul already had his shot, and has proven himself to be unsuccessful on the national stage.

he comes off as too unconcerned about ordinary americans, not to mention the unsavory things in his past (like the racist newsletter published in his name).

2/7/2010 5:57:16 PM

Quote :

"Mark Meckler and Jenny Beth Martin, founders of the Tea Party Patriots, say they are proud of what the movement has accomplished, but they are frustrated that other Tea Party groups are being run by Republican political consultants forking over lots of cash for recruitment. The Tea Party Express, a conservative bus tour that crisscrossed the country last year, was run from inside a Republican political consulting firm. This week's convention has also been dogged by infighting, with some protesting its $549 entrance fee and its hierarchical organization. Meckler and Martin are not going to attend. "It wasn't the kind of grass-roots organization that we are, so we declined to participate," Meckler said. "

Quote :

"It’s going to be a lot harder for Tea Baggers to claim they’re not racists now that a photo has emerged of Dale Robertson, who calls himself the “president and founder of the Tea Party,” holding a sign that reads,”Congress = Slave Owner; Taxpayer = Niggar."

From the different articles in this thread, I'm not seeing Ron Paul's name come up as a leader of this at all.

Whatever it started as, its now Neocon-GOP funded bus tours, Sarah Palin speeches, and for profit conventions riling up the radical right & social conservatives. They aren't Ron Paul's crowd and he'll keep his distance if he wants to keep his credibility which is something I think he actually cares about.

2/7/2010 6:03:46 PM

^ pretty much

2/7/2010 8:29:19 PM

With the Neo-con/Tea Party, Ron Paul Libertarians, and rest of the GOP engaging in so much factionalism, this seems about right:

2/8/2010 3:46:15 AM

^
Funny.
But the GOP did not create the Tea Party Movement. In fact the group has expressed contempt for some squishy repubs like McCain.

2/8/2010 10:59:50 AM

didn't create it but are running it now

2/8/2010 11:03:41 AM

so is this a real "Party" in the sense that candidates will be running as its representation?

if so, its going to fragment the vote on the right, the way the Green party does on the left.

2/8/2010 11:31:24 AM

Quote :

"But the GOP did not create the Tea Party Movement. In fact the group has expressed contempt for some squishy repubs like McCain."

lol, yes, instead they are getting behind rational souls like joseph farah, noted birther, publisher, and child molester.

http://washingtonindependent.com/75944/joseph-farahs-big-birther-speech

2/8/2010 11:38:20 AM