11th Suspect Arrested in Alleged Russian Spy Ring
June 29, 2010

Quote :

"U.S. authorities say they sometimes worked in pairs and pretended to be married so they could blend into American society as the couple next door. Aside from fake identities, authorities say, they used Cold War spycraft -- invisible ink, coded radio transmissions, encrypted data -- to avoid detection."

http://tinyurl.com/33ldfot

What are we to make of this situation? I'm not quite sure--I admit it did set off some old Cold War alarm bells in me.

Russia, of course, is all "SO WHAT?!"

Russia plays down US spy arrests
June 30, 2010

Quote :

"Russia had said on Tuesday that the US charges were baseless and a throwback to the Cold War. PM Vladimir Putin said US police had 'let themselves go'."

Quote :

"Assistant US Attorney Michael Farbiarz told Associated Press that Ms Chapman was 'someone who has extraordinary training, who is a sophisticated agent of Russia'. He said the arrests were 'the tip of the iceberg' of the workings of Russia's SVR intelligence agency."

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/us_and_canada/10458719.stm

One of the spies:



[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 7:25 AM. Reason : Preemptive edit: In Soviet Russia, spy arrests you. ]

6/30/2010 7:16:40 AM

she can infiltrate me anytime!

Quote :

""

6/30/2010 7:45:51 AM

Quote :

"The Murphys lived as husband and wife in suburban New Jersey, first Hoboken, then Montclair, with Richard Murphy carrying a fake birth certificate saying he was born in Philadelphia, authorities said."

SkiSalomon exposed?

6/30/2010 8:02:49 AM

LOL @ both!

6/30/2010 8:04:33 AM

^^^ infiltrate you? shouldn't you be the one probing her borders, instead?

6/30/2010 8:07:56 AM

Ha-ha! This thread could turn out to be fun.

6/30/2010 8:20:12 AM

It's a shame she's going to be tortured.

6/30/2010 8:30:32 AM

^ Incorrect.

6/30/2010 8:39:52 AM

I'm sorry, "executed".

6/30/2010 8:42:47 AM

^ In Soviet Russia, sorry executes you.

6/30/2010 8:48:22 AM

According to Brad & Britt this morning they have not been charged with espionage but rather something far less so this is pretty much a non-issue except the older more seasoned folks amongst us. Hell, I'm of a generation that views Russia as alright because they brought us Tetris!

6/30/2010 9:01:41 AM

Putin sees you typing in your boxer shorts and bunny slippers.

6/30/2010 9:18:03 AM

Lol, I love how our government is so nonchalant about spies these days. It's pretty embarassing as well as alarming.

6/30/2010 9:26:24 AM

^ That made my brain hurt.

6/30/2010 9:29:20 AM

^^^^ Shot across the bow? You're raining on my "triumphant return"!

6/30/2010 9:51:08 AM

They're nonchalant because a) these guys weren't able to extract anything useful and b) everyone spies on everyone (of significance). Everyone spies on everyone: even our own NATO allies spy on us let alone the Russians, Chinese, Iranians, Israelis, etc. I wouldn't be surprised either if we were spying on all the mentioned countries as well; if anything, as a major country, I would almost be insulted if we weren't being spied on as it means we're not important enough to merit monitoring. Therefore, it's not really a problem unless they actually infiltrate the government.

Now, what IS interesting is the timing of the arrests which came off the heels of a very successful summit with President Medvedev. Why bust them now? Were they about to flee the country? It doesn't sound like there was some imminent threat that required the need to immediately arrest these guys, so why do something like this that clearly hurt well-planned efforts to improve relations with the Russians? Why such a public bust instead of a discreet deportation?

[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 12:13 PM. Reason : more thoughts...]

6/30/2010 12:12:38 PM

Oh, and in the spirit of fun in the OP:

Quote :

"Alleged Russian spy posts photos online Alleged Russian spy, Anna Chapman, became an instant Web sensation following the release of photos posted on the Russian social-networking Web site "Odnoklassniki," or Classmates. http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/gallery/2010/06/29/GA2010062904907.html"

And of course the NY Post article with plenty of photos...

Quote :

"NY 'spy' life was double-o heaven She came from Russia, with love. The sexy suspected spy who the feds say was sent to New York to gather intel on the United States adored the American way of life and took full advantage of it -- for business and pleasure. "Anna Chapman" sidled up to power players while hobnobbing at society functions, charity events and book openings in slinky designer outfits. It was her apparent way of collecting information to send back to her native Russia -- but she also enjoyed going out clubbing, blogging and seeing the sights. http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/ny_spy_life_was_BMpOkSexEMcgIIJTY1YaIL"

[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 12:24 PM. Reason : .]

6/30/2010 12:21:48 PM

Somewhere out there is a guy who can tell his friends the story about Anna Chapman, the spy who shagged me.

6/30/2010 12:23:25 PM

Quote :

"SkiSalomon exposed?"

Its funny you should mention that. That couple shares the same names as both my father and mother.

6/30/2010 12:52:10 PM

damn, that's crazy!

6/30/2010 1:02:01 PM

man she is so hot

6/30/2010 1:07:09 PM

man she is a fire-breathing vixen!

with jeans so tight, she ain't go no secrets!

6/30/2010 1:17:10 PM

Quote :

"They're nonchalant because a) these guys weren't able to extract anything useful and b) everyone spies on everyone (of significance). Everyone spies on everyone: even our own NATO allies spy on us let alone the Russians, Chinese, Iranians, Israelis, etc. I wouldn't be surprised either if we were spying on all the mentioned countries as well; if anything, as a major country, I would almost be insulted if we weren't being spied on as it means we're not important enough to merit monitoring. Therefore, it's not really a problem unless they actually infiltrate the government."

Of course we're spying on all those countries and more, are you really that naive? That doesn't make the consequences any less serious? And it doesn't matter if they didn't get their hands on anything extremely valuable. If you give them a slap on the wrist since they "just tried" all that does is tell them that they should try again since the repercussions are so light.

6/30/2010 1:20:01 PM

I gotta be honest: some pictures good, some pictures meh.

6/30/2010 1:37:40 PM

only a couple of them studio/model shots... the rest are as she goes about her daily activities. only pro models look good in all pics.

obligatory: what are you ****ing

6/30/2010 1:50:10 PM

6/30/2010 2:19:24 PM

Quote :

"If you give them a slap on the wrist since they "just tried" all that does is tell them that they should try again since the repercussions are so light."

What do you recommend we do?

We could draw and quarter these guys, and it wouldn't stop Russia (and everybody else) from sending spies -- just not these particular spies, since we'll know their appearance and patterns. This is one situation where no punishment is going to be a deterrent.

Quote :

"What are we to make of this situation? I'm not quite sure--I admit it did set off some old Cold War alarm bells in me. "

Not much, I suspect. Like RedGuard said, everybody spies on us, friend and foe alike. It's the price you pay for being a Big Swinging Dick of a country. And it would be ludicrous to act too upset -- it isn't as though we've got plenty of spies in Russia.

I would be curious as to know why we nabbed them now instead of stringing them along, feeding them false info, monitoring them to see if we could bust a bigger ring, something like that. Maybe they actually got a little too close to something important, or maybe they were planning to move.

6/30/2010 2:47:02 PM

Quote :

"If you give them a slap on the wrist since they "just tried" all that does is tell them that they should try again since the repercussions are so light"

The problem with this logic is you assume that a harsh punishment will in some way deter/prevent Russia from spying in the future. They most certainly have other spies in place currently and will insert more in the future, our punishment will not change this.

Additionally, you have to consider what repercussions a harsh punishment will have on our spies who are unfortunate enough to get caught in Russia at some point. Make a spectacle of these guys and you can be sure that they will nab some of our guys in the not so distant future and crucify them.

6/30/2010 2:59:25 PM

^Yeah I'm pretty sure if you're a spy and get caught in Russia you just "disappear", regardless of how dandy we treat their spies if we catch them.

6/30/2010 3:28:35 PM

Incorrect. Even during the Cold War, spies rarely disappeared and when caught they were usually just swapped. Everyone knows what happens when you go all heavy handed with the ones you catch.

6/30/2010 3:32:47 PM

And I'm pretty sure you're wrong:

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/europe/russia/1508684/British-agents-caught-red-handed-by-Russia.html

The Russkis caught these guys and did not "disappear" them.

That's on top of DeltaBeta's excellent point -- we swapped a lot of really high-level Russians we caught for various Americans. In fact, that's how we got Gary Powers back.

Mind you, both sides come down pretty hard on their own people who provide information to these spies, and although the Russians are probably a bit harsher than us on this point we'll still throw your ass in jail forever.

6/30/2010 3:36:59 PM

Do you think we'd hear about it if any spies disappeared?

Of course not! Hush hush stuff, don't you guys ever watch movies?

6/30/2010 4:39:25 PM

I just find it damned peculiar that so many here and elsewhere are so cavalier about the fact that nearly a dozen clandestine Russian agents were gathering intelligence of some sort on our homeland. Maybe the spies in question are not a big deal, but who really knows?

The fact of the matter is that we don't really know the full extent of the spies' purpose(s) here--they could even be a sleeper cell with a more significant mission. I mean, the fact that these agents were using Cold War-style spycraft, including invisible ink, coded radio transmissions, and encrypted data to avoid detection just doesn't sound like amateurs getting in touch with the yokels' feelings about Obama at cocktail parties. Furthermore, an assistant U.S. attorney said that these spies are just the "tip of the iceberg."

BREAKING: The 11th spy suspect has gone missing! Yeah, I'm sure he's just out getting a latte--no big deal.

6/30/2010 5:37:05 PM

Maybe they were just looking for the nuclear wessels.

6/30/2010 5:39:11 PM

^ Thanks, Pavel.

6/30/2010 5:43:16 PM

Quote :

"I just find it damned peculiar that so many here and elsewhere are so cavalier about the fact that nearly a dozen clandestine Russian agents were gathering intelligence of some sort on our homeland."

It's because we already knew. Sure, we didn't know their identities or anything, but at any given time if you ask me, "Do you think there are at least a dozen clandestine Russian agents gathering intelligence of some sort on our homeland?" I'm going to say, "Of course there are. Probably many more than that."

It's also because, right now, we've got at least a dozen clandestine American agents gathering intelligence of some sort in Russia. I can't shake the feeling that if they get caught you'll be outraged at the Russians.

Spying is just something that states do. It can't be stopped, it can just be frustrated.

[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 6:16 PM. Reason : You might as well get upset at the weather.]

6/30/2010 6:12:02 PM

^ Murders happen all the time, too. Is it okay with you if I don't like them?

And did you catch the part that one of the spies is apparently on the loose now? I mean, could I get a list of what would shake you out of your state of apathy?

6/30/2010 6:23:09 PM

All 10 were on the loose a few days ago, they didn't quite bring america to it's knees.

6/30/2010 6:27:28 PM

Um. . .look, folks, I never said we should go to DEFCON 1. In fact, this is what I actually posted:

Quote :

"What are we to make of this situation? I'm not quite sure--I admit it did set off some old Cold War alarm bells in me."

If some of you are cool with Russian spies running around on the loose inside the United States doing who knows what--minor or significant--then fine. I would prefer that they be discovered sooner rather than later and prosecuted and/or deported. This seems to be a perfectly rational--and not particularly alarmist--position to me.

6/30/2010 6:36:02 PM

Before I start, let me clarify -- I'm not accusing you of being alarmist, I'm just explaining why none of us seem to be as worked up as you want us to be.

Quote :

"Murders happen all the time, too. Is it okay with you if I don't like them? "

Well, if you are a murderer yourself it'd make you kind of a hypocrite. You don't seem to want to acknowledge that this is something we do, too. We do it to friend and foe alike, and they do it to us.

Although murders are fairly appropriate. I don't like murder, and I'm glad when we stop murders or punish murderers. But I also don't flip out every time one happens.

And I don't give a damn whether you like murder/espionage or not. I'm just explaining to you why the rest of us aren't shitting bricks.

Quote :

"And did you catch the part that one of the spies is apparently on the loose now?"

Yeah. And hey, I'd like us to catch the guy. I hope we're putting every reasonable effort into catching him, and everyone else involved. No doubt we are -- although it's unlikely to be enough, seeing as how he's not in this country.

Quote :

"I mean, could I get a list of what would shake you out of your state of apathy?"

If they were here with some sort of aggressive purpose, like sabotage or assassination, that would perk my ears up a bit. But so far it sounds like they were mostly gathering information. And I guess maybe I could get a little less "apathetic" if I found out that they had stolen some really incredibly vital piece of information, though to be fair I'd be more angry at our guys for not doing their job than at the Russians for desiring things that are desirable.

[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 6:50 PM. Reason : ]

6/30/2010 6:49:09 PM

^ Fair enough, but I'm a bit troubled by this:

Quote :

"If they were here with some sort of aggressive purpose. . . ."

How do you know the spies' full purpose(s) here? As I indicated, "invisible ink, coded radio transmissions, encrypted data" seem rather extreme for simply gathering cocktail party gossip.



[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 7:37 PM. Reason : I hope I'm wrong.]

6/30/2010 7:30:48 PM

Quote :

"including invisible ink, coded radio transmissions, and encrypted data to avoid detection just doesn't sound like amateurs getting in touch with the yokels' feelings about Obama at cocktail parties. "

Except for the invisible ink (which i hear can be defeated with lemon juice...) everyone here uses the rest of those things on a daily basis.

I'm sure the FBI or whoever has good reason for picking up these spies, but as far as i've heard, they haven't listed those reasons yet.

6/30/2010 7:42:53 PM

Quote :

"How do you know the spies' full purpose(s) here?"

I don't know it, but from what has come out so far -- including the encrypted instructions from Moscow -- their purpose seems to be gathering information. You need to cover that up through various means so you aren't immediately found out and cut off from real information, so I'm not surprised they were sneaky. Plus, given the current climate, I have absolutely no reason to believe that Moscow wants to reignite a war, cold or otherwise, with us.

No doubt they were looking for something more than "cocktail party gossip." Again, that's no surprise. You don't need spies for that -- regular foreign service/ministry agents will suffice. Hell, it's the job I want: policy analyst for the U.S. Department of State, which to at least some degree involves making contacts in social environments and then writing reports based on what you hear. Everyone knows what these people do. It's not hidden or secretive.

But there is a difference between an aggressive purpose, which directly harms individuals or institutions in the U.S., and intelligence purposes. In an extremely simplified analogy, me finding out your credit card number so I can track your purchases is not the same thing as me ruining your credit or shooting you in the face.

What does surprise me is that either:

1) Spy technology hasn't gotten beyond invisible ink (which a child can buy or make), coded radio transmissions (which every government agency from the RPD to the Secret Service uses), and encrypted data (which the Wolfweb uses, I hope, for premie credit card information).

2) Or, the Russians are so hard up for cash that they're having to resort to thirty year old techniques for their spies.

---

The "aggressive purpose" thing is key. Remember, everyone -- including our "special friend," England -- spies on us, and vice versa. I think it's safe to assume that Her Majesty isn't spying on us to fuck up all our shit, she just wants to know what we're up to...keep us honest, to some extent. I can't fault them for that.

[Edited on June 30, 2010 at 11:54 PM. Reason : ]

6/30/2010 11:50:05 PM

Told ya!

7/1/2010 12:13:04 PM

Quote :

"It's a shame she's going to be tortured."

That only happens to the brown spies.

7/1/2010 12:22:30 PM

Quote :

"^ Murders happen all the time, too. Is it okay with you if I don't like them? And did you catch the part that one of the spies is apparently on the loose now? I mean, could I get a list of what would shake you out of your state of apathy?"

Dude, you are going high & right over something that is not a crisis and not even remotely surprising.

The only reason it's really even news is just because of the interesting timing.

7/1/2010 12:47:05 PM

The US faces more malicious threats from Chinese hackers on a daily basis.

7/1/2010 12:51:31 PM

ZOMG RUSSIA HAS SPIES IN THE US WHAT A SURPRISE!

7/2/2010 8:14:05 AM

^^^ Just wow. Once again, here's what I've actually been posting:

Quote :

"What are we to make of this situation? I'm not quite sure--I admit it did set off some old Cold War alarm bells in me."

Quote :

"Maybe the spies in question are not a big deal, but who really knows?"

Quote :

"If some of you are cool with Russian spies running around on the loose inside the United States doing who knows what--minor or significant--then fine. I would prefer that they be discovered sooner rather than later and prosecuted and/or deported. This seems to be a perfectly rational--and not particularly alarmist--position to me."

Are some of you responding to my real-life posts or to the caricature of me that exists only in your mind? I think the answer is clear.

Oh, and now there's this:

Feds found $80,000 in cash in accused Montclair spies' safe deposit box
Thursday, July 1, 2010

http://tinyurl.com/2cg9cpw

I'm sure those well-meaning Russian spies were planning on donating that money to charity.

7/2/2010 9:59:19 AM

For someone alleged to have been operating in the country for more than a decade, $80k is hardly a king's ransom. Even if it is petty/discretionary cash, its a relatively small sum. It is certainly cause for concern but I think that figuring out how that money was to be directed is more important than the sum itself.

7/2/2010 10:06:37 AM