About the Commission

http://www.fiscalcommission.gov/about/

Co-Chairs Erskine Bowles and Alan Simpson's recent comments about entitlements:

Deficit commission almost done deciding to slash Social Security
July 12, 2010

Quote :

"The commission leaders said that, at present, federal revenue is fully consumed by three programs: Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid. 'The rest of the federal government, including fighting two wars, homeland security, education, art, culture, you name it, veterans -- the whole rest of the discretionary budget is being financed by China and other countries,' Simpson said. [...] Bowles pointed to steps taken recently by the new coalition government in Britain, which also faces an acute budgetary problem, as a guide to what the commission might use in its recommendations. That would mean about three-quarters of the deficit reduction would be accomplished through spending cuts, and the remainder with additional revenue."

http://tinyurl.com/36bobfs

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QuK1z-7epFk

Is Erskine Bowles right about "fiscal sanity" and the United States going "broke"? What, if anything, should be done about entitlements? Is this commission even a good idea? Will it accomplish anything?

7/14/2010 5:15:17 AM

Quote :

"Is this commission even a good idea? Will it accomplish anything?"

It's pretty much impossible to say if it will actually accomplish anything, at this point, but I'm willing to get behind almost anything that wants to start cutting social security... Even if it just means raising the age of retirement to reflect modern life expectancy (http://washingtonindependent.com/91042/raising-the-social-security-retirement-age, one of the links in the article you posted). It even seems like a better way to introduce a gradual phase-out of the program than many other ideas I've seen on the subject.

Even if they can't manage to get anything accomplished on that front, they are at least raising the question of what must be done about social security and giving the issue some more prominence.

[Edited on July 14, 2010 at 5:37 AM. Reason : .]

7/14/2010 5:31:23 AM

Fair enough. But you know some folks are going to start screaming bloody murder about the possibility of entitlements being taken away.

I'm just sayin'.

7/14/2010 5:42:05 AM

Eh, I can't recall off-hand any TSBers with a particular love for Social Security, but there's usually at least one person here willing to defend almost anything.

What's your take on the whole thing?

7/14/2010 5:46:52 AM

To be honest, I don't see how we can avoid cutting entitlements in some significant way and raising the retirement age. Furthermore, I am convinced that after the 2010 elections, Obama and friends will try to raise taxes in some way (VAT and/or other ways).

And I can't help but think--and I'm seriously not even trying to be partisan--that this strikes me also as just another Obama flip-flop:

Quote :

"Senator McCain's big solution to the crisis we're facing is--put on your seatbelts--a commission, a commission. Y'all, that's Washington-speak for 'We'll get back to you later.'"

--Then-Candidate Barack Obama

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UEhIZEUebew

But keep in mind, I'm not saying that things would be so great if McCain were president. I'm not saying that at all.

7/14/2010 6:01:26 AM

I think Bowles is right in his assessment, but I question the effectiveness of any solution they propose, nor do I think Congress will be able to work together to get anything sensible done.

In an ideal world we would:

1. freeze all spending now

2. cease all foreign AID and assistance... even precious pet Israel

3. drop taxes, don't raise them.

4. remove ourselves from all foreign entanglements.

5. raise retirement age

7/14/2010 6:49:31 AM

bowles' statement is a 'water is wet kind' of assertion.

7/14/2010 8:07:33 AM

life expectancy at the age of retirement has actually changed very little since the beginning of the program, especially among those who actually will need the money.

ie, raising the retirement age wouldn't hurt the rich nearly as much as the poor (who often have more physically difficult jobs in the first place):



[Edited on July 14, 2010 at 8:20 AM. Reason : .]

7/14/2010 8:08:56 AM

Quote :

"In an ideal world we would: 1. freeze all spending now 2. cease all foreign AID and assistance... even precious pet Israel 3. drop taxes, don't raise them. 4. remove ourselves from all foreign entanglements. 5. raise retirement age"

7/14/2010 10:40:38 AM

Quote :

"In an ideal world we would: 1. freeze some spending now 2. cease some foreign AID and assistance 3. don't raise taxes, but don't drop them either, not if we really want a balanced budget. 4. remove ourselves from all foreign entanglements. 5. raise retirement age, & perhaps make social security more need based, i mean if the idea is a social safety net then it doesn't need to be catching people who aren't falling"

I'm absolutely okay with soldiers being used/my tax dollars being spent for humanitarian purposes like emergency situations in Haiti. I said freeze some spending & cease some foreign aid, but not all, we should look at the kinds of negative externalities that might result before deciding that freezing aid is the best/cheapest solution. Also, ending many aspects of the war on drugs wouldn't hurt.

And I agree that the commission statement sounds like a flip flop. I'm guessing it meant we need more action than just a commission, but if he opposed the idea of commissions altogether then that is a straight up flip flop. But in general one of the main points of commissions is to give political cover to do what everyone already knows should be done, but that is politically hard. If everyone can blame a bipartisan commission for the necessary fixes to social security it makes it an easier pill to swallow when you have to run for re-election.

[Edited on July 14, 2010 at 11:32 AM. Reason : .]

7/14/2010 11:24:12 AM

^
Why did you remove "cease foreign AID and assistance" for Israel???

Quote :

"make social security more need based, i mean if the idea is a social safety net then it doesn't need to be catching people who aren't falling"

I agree.

Quote :

"ending many aspects of the war on drugs"

Or even ending all of it.

7/14/2010 11:28:11 AM

I don't know enough about foreign aid to intelligently say where it should go, my point was that I'm not for ceasing it completely, instead we could probably cut it some and focus on humanitarian aid & places where the positive & negative externalities might affect the decision. I just wanted to make a more generic statement, it wasn't intended as specific support or opposition to aid to any particular place.

7/14/2010 11:34:18 AM

I don't support foriegn military aid, but I would encourage foriegn economic aid. Much of the economic growth in Asia and South America that has benefitted us so much has been a result of economic foriegn aid.

7/14/2010 1:00:42 PM

Bump by request

11/21/2010 7:57:16 AM

Quote :

"Much of the economic growth in Asia and South America that has benefitted us so much has been a result of economic foriegn aid."

Ha. Foreign aid to these countries was relatively puny. There is no question to me that they financed their growth themselves.

11/21/2010 9:16:33 AM

It doesn't matter if our aid financed it or they did. Foreign aid is a relatively insignificant part of our budget but it's a big deal to many countries, and it engenders something called "good will" that is actually important, especially when you consider the substantial investment that China is putting into many of these countries. One day it might be helpful to remind some of these countries that we helped build their infrastructures or feed their people.

Aid to Israel could be useful -- if we use at as a carrot/stick, rather than just a given. I'd be all for saying, "Look, fuckmooks, stop with this settlement bullshit and given them a fucking country or we're turning off the money spigot." If they comply they get to keep getting money. If they don't -- and this is the part I don't think any administration yet has had the balls to pull off -- we stop giving them free money.

11/21/2010 4:00:02 PM

I doubt foreign aid, or the giving of money to corrupt despots, engenders much good will outside of Europe. Far better to make people like you by being their best customer. Abolish tariffs!

11/21/2010 4:48:51 PM

Your habit of ignoring things that are actually being discussed in order to bring up unrelated libertarian points is less endearing than you think.

I'd be glad to see the tariffs go, but it does not follow that foreign aid is bad or useless.

11/21/2010 5:28:58 PM