Since Brian Cashman went down to Arkansas to talk to Cliff Lee I think it is time to start the 2011 Yankees thread. God knows we need pitching help. Andy's getting old, AJ is a head case so if we get Cliff we could go CC - Cliff - Hughes and fill in the rest.

11/11/2010 9:07:42 AM

You guys going after Carl Crawford, too? Or are they OK with Gardner longterm?

11/11/2010 9:08:15 AM

11/11/2010 9:12:26 AM

same story every winter, same result every october

[Edited on November 11, 2010 at 9:13 AM. Reason : season]

11/11/2010 9:13:12 AM

I am not sure for what we would have to pay for Crawford he is worth it. He is a upgrade from Gardner but how much. If I was the GM I would stick with Gardner. But knowing them they will probably try to get Crawford. But Cliff Lee to me is a must, because I don't think we can get there with the staff we have presently.

11/11/2010 9:14:31 AM

how much are you, gforce, going to offer Cliff Lee?

11/11/2010 9:20:10 AM

Oh I am sorry dweedle....I meant the Yankees. When I referred to myself I meant me as a fan of the Yankees. I think most people would get that, but then again with a nic-name like dweedle it doesn't surprise me you didn't understand that. Are you ok now... :-)

11/11/2010 9:54:41 AM

Quote :

"You guys going after Carl Crawford, too? Or are they OK with Gardner longterm?"

I can't imagine they will go after Crawford. It just doesn't fit with the whole get younger/reduce payroll mantra they've been sticking to lately.

Everyone made a huge deal about the signings last year (and rightfully so), but the fact was the team's payroll went DOWN from 2008 to 2009.

Is Crawford an upgrade over Gardner? Of course. They both had 47 stolen bases this year, but Crawford has FAR more power. Gardner is signed for $450,000 and is two years younger. So the question is, do Hal, Hank and Cashman think Crawford is a $15-million upgrade? Probably not.

They get speed in the OF from Gardner and Granderson, and they get power from Swisher and, later in the year, Granderson.

If they want to spend money in the OF, I think it has to be Werth. All of the power hitters (except for A-Rod) are either lefties or switch hitters better from the left side. A right-handed power bat is more important than Crawford.

The priority is SP and lefty relief pitching, and possibly a set-up guy (depending on Joba).

Pettitte is older, but he was money when he was healthy. They can definitely try to get one more year out of him. I feel better about that if he's the No. 3 starter and not the No. 2 starter, but we'll have to see how that goes.

And I've officially spent way too much time on this post.

11/11/2010 10:49:40 AM

I agree with everything you say, and the Giants proved once again.....Pitching wins...end of story.

11/11/2010 5:28:43 PM

hopefully they'll give jeter a 5 year deal or something

11/11/2010 5:58:22 PM

Well of course they will.

Minimum of a four-year deal. I don't think anyone involved thinks otherwise.

11/11/2010 8:22:03 PM

If they really offer that 3 year, $45M deal that is just a slap in the face to Jeter. I realize he is NOT the player he was and that his range at SS and bat speed will only decrease further over the life of the contract but offering him $5M less overall than AJ Burnett is going to get over that time is just awful.

Don't tell me they don't have the money, the guy is a legend in the ilk of DiMaggio/Mantle to this generation of Yankees fans. He'll accept it or at the very least give them time to up it a bit, because he's a good guy, but that is disgraceful.

11/20/2010 10:35:22 AM

Explain to me why he feels like he should be making twice as much as the next highest paid shortstop? Hell, his last contract already made him massively overpaid and that was during his prime.

The guy has no range, no power, his average is on the decline, and it's only going to get worse from here.

They offered him a contract that will allow him to retire as a Yankee and is much more than he would ever get from any other team. If Jeter is really such a great team first guy and wants to show that he's all about winning he should shut up and sign the deal. It's either that or leave and make 4 or 5 mill a year less than he's currently being offered.

11/29/2010 7:01:55 PM

yeah i was shocked that the yankees offered that much money to him, and then beyond floored when i saw what he wanted (4-5 years at 20+ per). really can't see the yankees upping that by more than a million per year

11/29/2010 7:14:53 PM

^^ The fact that they massively overpaid for AJ Burnett is not a good reason to massively overpay for an over the hill SS who doesn't have the pop to end his career as a DH and who they have already considered moving to the outfield.

11/29/2010 7:32:13 PM

I think the thing you're missing here is that Jeter isn't worth $Texas to the yankees because of his on field play. He's worth $Texas to the yankees b/c of who he is. Hasn't he been leading the MLB in jersey sales for years? And that's certainly not the only area where he is contributing to their bottom line.

11/29/2010 8:02:59 PM

If he leaves (and we all know he won't) then you'll see a spike in Robinson Cano jersey sales. He's the next face of the Yankees, and he's one of the top 10 every day players in the game right now.

Jeter needs the Yankees far more than the Yankees need Jeter. How much of the jersey sale argument and how much of his endorsement money is because he's the Yankee captain? How different would it be if he played for the Royals?

11/29/2010 8:15:02 PM

I think they need each other. If the Yankees let Jeter walk they're likely to alienate fans and lose lots of money. While Jeter is likely to get much less money elsewhere.

Also, Jeter's brand >>> Robinson Cano. I'm not a baseball fan at all, and as such I have no idea who Robinson Cano is. But the one game I ever paid to go to was a Yankees/Royals game in KC b/c I wanted to see Derek Jeter play. Dude is pretty close to being a living legend.

11/29/2010 8:59:54 PM

Well then that's your problem. I abhor baseball and I still know that Cano is fucking insane, especially for a 2B.

11/29/2010 9:04:56 PM

I didn't say anything about his in-saneness.

11/29/2010 9:06:47 PM

Quote :

"I think the thing you're missing here is that Jeter isn't worth $Texas to the yankees because of his on field play. He's worth $Texas to the yankees b/c of who he is. Hasn't he been leading the MLB in jersey sales for years? And that's certainly not the only area where he is contributing to their bottom line."

He might be worth more than 15 million a year to the yankees, but is he worth more than 10 or 12 million to anyone else?

If not, then he the yankees will be able to sign him for less than the max they would pay for him.

11/29/2010 9:10:00 PM

^^Then how do you say you don't know who he is?

Seriously I'm apathetic on baseball but I recognize Cano as a generational talent and a future HOF player.

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 9:11 PM. Reason : .]

11/29/2010 9:10:26 PM

it seems like the yanks are trying to take a stand about making big money signings on older players, but they absolutely picked the wrong player to do it with.

jeter is a legend, and he's done as much for the yankees as any player ever probably. so the yanks need to stop messing around and sign him before they look like asses. they will lose a lot of fans if they mess up jeter's legacy at all, and he's never done anything to deserve it.

11/29/2010 9:15:35 PM

^^ I'm talking about his worth for the Yankees as a brand name. I don't think he's got Jeter beat in that area.

11/29/2010 9:19:24 PM

Quote :

"I think they need each other. If the Yankees let Jeter walk they're likely to alienate fans and lose lots of money."

oh bs. you really think the yankees will lose fans because jeter is asking for way too much money? i hate the yankees, but i generally think of their fans as mostly sports intelligent and able to comprehend a terrible business decision. chipper jones has been the face of the braves for forever too, but i'd call the management damn fools if they offered him what jeter wants

11/29/2010 9:26:08 PM

Sometimes you tell your legends thank you for their service, and then you let them walk.

11/29/2010 9:29:06 PM

The yankees wont lose a single fan if Jeter leaves, for whatever reason. Sure they'll boo loudly at first. Sure they'll bitch and moan on messageboards/sports talk shows. Sure they will say they will boycott games and gear. There will be a shitstorm in the press for a few weeks. But once they start playing and winning it'll blow over.

Then once he walks into the HOF he will have his yankess cap on and it will be a love fest again.

11/29/2010 9:31:42 PM

11/29/2010 9:53:57 PM

I'd love to see the Mets pay Jeter 20 mil a year for 4 years.

11/29/2010 9:59:25 PM

Quote :

"I'm not a baseball fan at all, and as such I have no idea who Robinson Cano is"

Then how do you know anything about Jeter?

And why would you even enter this thread?

$15 million a year for 3 years is a very generous offer in my opinion. And to think he'll make bank past the age of 40 while playing the SS position is ridiculous.

11/29/2010 10:43:46 PM

Quote :

"Sometimes you tell your legends thank you for their service, and then you let them walk."

Yes.

First of all, of course they'll sign him. But this wouldn't be the first time a legend finished his career elsewhere.

Babe Ruth is the most obvious Yankee example. To a lesser extent, Roger Maris, Reggie Jackson and Yogi Berra all ended their careers in another uniform after doing extraordinary things with the Yankees, or in Berra's case, being a Yankee legend himself (although admittedly, that was just four games with the Mets).

11/29/2010 10:47:26 PM

Quote :

"If he leaves (and we all know he won't) then you'll see a spike in Robinson Cano jersey sales. He's the next face of the Yankees, and he's one of the top 10 every day players in the game right now. "

Slow down.

Robinson Cano will never replace a guy like Derek Jeter. First off he hasn't won 4 titles in his first 5 years. Second, he has had little playoff impact at an organizational level. Third, he is best known for being Melky Cabrera's wingman to fucking Mary Carey in the tabloids. Fourth, he barely speaks English.

Derek Jeter IS the Yankees to 75% of the fanbase (in other words, all of the '96ers). For anyone who isn't familiar to New York baseball, the Mets were the team of the 80's/early-90's. You poll New Yorkers in 1994 and 2/3's say they are Mets fans. Derek Jeter and those teams changed that.

To say that he will simply be replaced by Cano is asinine.

Most importantly, who the hell is going to replace him? Reyes is available at a price (that price includes Hughes and Montero as a base) but that isn't going to happen. Have you seen the Yankees infield prospects? Yeah, I haven't either. Guy isn't going anywhere...

[Edited on November 29, 2010 at 11:00 PM. Reason : x]

11/29/2010 11:00:06 PM

Every Yankee fan I've talked to, and I've talked to a lot of them about this (I live in NY), has agreed that they think Jeter is off his rocker to ask for that much money. They all love him but they all understand he isn't worth that much.

If he goes to another team because the Yankees are only willing to spend X more than the other teams and not 100X there will be very, very few Yankee fans upset about it to the point of disenfranchising them.

11/30/2010 10:11:53 AM

The same thing that happened with manny and the dodgers 2-3 years ago will happen with jeter and nyy. He'll insist he's worth more, realize no one else will match the yankees' offer, and come crawling back in the end.

11/30/2010 10:19:49 AM

He'll be in pinstripes next year. Won't be long before he realizes nobody else will offer even half of what the Yankees have already offered him.

11/30/2010 11:07:18 AM

How many of Maxim's top 100 sexiest women has Cano banged? Jeter has banged like 90 of them...and some of the sexiest dudes too!

11/30/2010 11:11:06 AM

Derek Jeter the Baseball player is probably worth about a two year 15 million dollar deal at this point. Doubling his per year salary from his market value is more than enough to account for his "value to the franchise" from the Yankee's perspective.

From a pure baseball move, they would be better served using that money to sign Carl Crawford and letting Pena/other assorted bums play SS and hit 9th.

11/30/2010 11:13:31 AM

You're telling me the yankees, with seemingly limitless funds and have been known to just shell out extra years and dollars on contracts to players that no other team would ever even come close to (i.e. aj burnett's 5-year $82.5mil contract, and he was one of the worst pitchers in baseball last year), are playing a highly public cat and mouse game with arguably one of the greatest players in their history and the face of their franchise over a few extra million per year that they could easily afford just bc they're the yankees? How fucking idiotic, just more fuel for the yankee-hating fire

11/30/2010 2:01:23 PM

the braves were going to offer aj burnett. probably other teams too. yeah, the yankees blew everybody out of the water, but they felt they needed a pitcher. jeter doesn't really have a choice, i don't think anybody's going out looking for derek jeter. although the yankees probably don't really have a choice either. no way jeter deserves 22 mil, but they could probably bump him up 1 or 2 from the 15 they offered.

11/30/2010 2:21:38 PM

First of all, it's not just, "a couple million extra per year"

Second, and I say this with as much hate for the Yankees as anyone, you are basically saying people hate the Yankees because they spend too much money, and now people should hate them even more for not spending too much money just because a certain player has done so much for the team in the past...that's fucking stupid man

The Yankees spend to win. Sometimes they pick the right people, sometimes they don't. No one is in the business of just handing out millions of dollars just because.

11/30/2010 2:33:23 PM

Nevermind

[Edited on November 30, 2010 at 3:00 PM. Reason : .]

11/30/2010 2:49:24 PM

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/tom_verducci/11/30/derek.jeter.yankees/index.html?eref=sihp

Puts it all in perspective. I'm just saying that the yankees seem to be on the verge of very much alienating a large portion of their fanbase over a fiscal issue that in the long run means nothing to them because they seemingly have no limits. Obviously you don't give jeter his request for a-rod money, but at least offer him an extension along the lines of his old contract. They would be losing much more if they just let jeter walk

11/30/2010 2:58:08 PM

Quote :

"Generally they do whatever it takes to get what they want, but they've been getting a little smarter about the way they spend money. "

Absolutely. As I said earlier:

Quote :

"Everyone made a huge deal about the signings last year (and rightfully so), but the fact was the team's payroll went DOWN from 2008 to 2009. "

The money advantage means nothing if it's not used effectively. I want Jeter back. I think he's the type of guy who will use this past year as motivation for one more better-than-average year. But just blowing millions "because they have it" is the fast track back to the early-00s Yankees teams that were overhyped, underperforming "All-Star" teams that would win 95-100 games and then lose in the first round.

With that said, I recognize the difference between "blowing it" on Jeter and any other overpaid veteran. In the end, they'll probably up the offer a bit so everyone can save face.

[Edited on November 30, 2010 at 3:04 PM. Reason : edit]

11/30/2010 3:00:11 PM

Its more the years than the average salary. If Jeter really wanted the same money from before ($18.9), the Yankees would probably do that over three years. But he wants the same money AND 5-6 years, which makes it much tougher for NY to swallow.

11/30/2010 3:06:27 PM

I think you and this writer are looking at this as if it's some black or white issue with no in between. Either they give Jeter a raise as a reward or they smack him in the face with their current horrible offer. This is not an accurate representation of the scenario.

1) They are offering him more money than any other team will likely offer him. If he goes out and finds a competing offer, they will probably raise theirs. But point is, they're offering above market value. Isn't that a good enough reward for an older player with declining numbers?

2) This article compares Jeter to the likes of Cal Ripken, Barry Larkin, etc. Problem is, those players didn't necessarily have overblown contracts for their prior years like Jeter has. It's not the same situation.

3) Since it mentions Ripken's raise, let's take a look at that. If memory serves me correct, when they flashed his contract up on the O's scoreboard that day the entire crowd booed. Good thing they didn't alienate their fan base...

11/30/2010 3:13:14 PM

Quote :

"http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/tom_verducci/11/30/derek.jeter.yankees/index.html?eref=sihp Puts it all in perspective. I'm just saying that the yankees seem to be on the verge of very much alienating a large portion of their fanbase over a fiscal issue that in the long run means nothing to them because they seemingly have no limits. Obviously you don't give jeter his request for a-rod money, but at least offer him an extension along the lines of his old contract. They would be losing much more if they just let jeter walk"

So give in to jester's demands using the orioles from 13 years ago, a time when front office strategy was completely different, as an example? The only thing that puts into perspective is you and verducci's shitty ideas on the way things should be.

11/30/2010 3:14:00 PM

EVERYONE SHUTUP, BRIAN CASHMAN IS GONNA RAPPEL 22 STORIES IN AN ELF COSTUME


no really.


http://sports.espn.go.com/new-york/mlb/news/story?id=5866872&campaign=rss&source=ESPNHeadlines

[Edited on November 30, 2010 at 3:53 PM. Reason : ]

11/30/2010 3:52:31 PM

There is nothing the Yankees could do to alienate their fanbase short of consecutive losing seasons or a couple Word Series wins by the Mets to switch the allegiances of shitty NY fans. They'll continue to be the biggest draw in the game no matter what uniform Jeter is wearing when he does his stupid jump throw.

11/30/2010 3:57:15 PM

Do you have any idea how many times that jump throw has gotten him laid?

11/30/2010 3:57:48 PM

11/30/2010 4:01:27 PM