This Friday students will be assembling at The Pit at 9:30am to begin a march to the UNC General Admin Building at 10:00am. We must stop the tuition hikes! Please if you have the time come out the support your fellow students in the UNC system. We know about the 15% budget cut that is straining our university, but what hasn't been mentioned is that the board intends to spike our tuition up once more. Not only are they crippling the education services by starving it of funding, they are charging us MORE for sub par services! Tell them to stop!
http://www.facebook.com/#!/event.php?eid=170426293003578

2/8/2011 2:03:11 AM

So there isn't enough money to operate the university, but they can't cut the budget or raise tuition... Gotcha!

Just eliminate 50% of the humanities and social sciences, pretty much only a self-perpetuating racket anyways.

2/8/2011 2:10:00 AM

Pulling from another thread:

Quote :

"I saw an old budgeting professor yesterday who I haven't seen in about a year, and he was talking about the election results. He's a pretty conservative guy, but he still seemed a little bummed about the results b/c he felt the GOP wont give the university system special consideration when doing the cuts, they'll be as vulnerable as everyone else."

If we didn't add the new voting restrictions, didn't push for new abortion restrictions, and didn't push the gay marriage constitutional amendment, that could about cover the cuts NCSU has to make to their budget.

Students turn out to vote at such a low rate that it is hard for our interests to be taken seriously. I mean we did alright in the 2008 election, but young people barely showed up at all in 2010.

It reminds me of the wake county socio-economic diversity policy. As much as I might be inclined to support such a system, it still strikes me as somewhat too late when more people show up to protest the decisions than to vote on the deciders.

I'm all for a good protest, and I applaud your efforts, but I believe protests only worth in conjunction with letter writing, issue education, advocacy, and a strong commitment to voting from a well-researched position on how the candidates prioritize the issue(s) you care about.

Another quote from another thread:

Quote :

" We are in a weak economy. We have to cut services or increase tax revenue (increase taxes, increase tax collection rate, or find new revenue sources to spread the pain) We have a thread with arguing against the firing of people who work for the school system. [also against combining the undergrad zoology & animal sci programs] We've had dozens of threads it feels like against paying more taxes We've had a thread recently about how evil it is for government to publish the names of people who aren't paying their taxes (a common mechanism for municipalities to increase the collect rate rather than raising taxes over all). And now we've had a thread saying don't try to find new revenue sources, even if that revenue source is mostly luxury items that wont affect hurt vulnerable populations like the poor & the elderly who don't do lots of online purchases of DVDs. As a unit, TWW has opposed decreased spending, increased taxes, increased tax collection rates, and new tax revenue sources. Individually we all have our own positions, but we have elected officials that have to serve units that are much larger and less educated on average than TWW."

A true systematic opposition to tuition increases would also include advocacy for ending our zoology department and firing teachers and all that.

----


Not to sound like buzz-killington the 3rd. I totally support people expressing their views, it is a very democratic thing to do. While I think a holistic approach is best, I offer kudos for spreading word about this event.

[Edited on February 8, 2011 at 2:35 AM. Reason : buzz-killington]

2/8/2011 2:33:45 AM

Quote :

"ssembling at The Pit "

you're kidding yourself if you think i'm stepping foot on that fucking campus.

2/8/2011 7:13:04 AM

Mind if I toss my ignorance into the thread

How many worthless projects does NCSU have going? Remodeling the library (years past), Talley, the book store, demolishing Harrelson, etc. Stuff that doesn't have to be done right now, but they are doing it. It's like the people in charge have no concept of wants, needs, and taking care of frivolous things when there's plenty of money to go around and postponing them when there isn't.

Sure, that's just NCSU, not the entire system of NC colleges, but I've got to think stuff like that is going on on all campuses. It's nice to have renovations, it's necessary if there are structural considerations, but come on, some stuff can wait until the economy recovers.

2/8/2011 9:33:42 AM

tuition goes up every single year, and every single year students are outraged.

2/8/2011 9:41:02 AM

I haven't been around forever, but it seems like tuition has risen faster and by a greater percentage than in years past. Heck, while I was in school tuition went up something like 250%. I'm fairly certain it didn't go up by 250% in the same time span immediately before I started school. What was tuition like $3.50 in the 60s?

The excuse that it has always risen and people have always been upset about it only lasts but so long. Let's raise it by $4000 per semester next year. No worries, it's always gone up, and it's not like you haven't complained before.

2/8/2011 9:48:05 AM

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA'

first off. want to fix this? privatize nc state and let it make a profit. unchain the free market.

also this is done by a communist group and the Redstar is a communist/socialist symbol.

2/8/2011 10:15:11 AM

you want to stop annual tuition increases and stop the education bubble? dial back student loans.

2/8/2011 11:01:58 AM

I thought for some reason they were assembling at the barbecue restaurant "The Pit"... seemed like an odd place...

2/8/2011 11:08:01 AM

Are the renovations a "color of money" issue? Meaning that renovations are funded out of a different bucket of money (bond money for example) versus the operating expenses of the university which are covered by a different budget comprised of tuition, research funds, and annual state support?

2/8/2011 11:22:28 AM

^^^This.

It's comical to me when people rail against tuition hikes and budget cuts without bothering to understand the reasons why they're needed.

[Edited on February 8, 2011 at 11:35 AM. Reason : ]

2/8/2011 11:34:46 AM

So how many of you would have ever set foot on NC State campus without federal loans or state subsidies, seriously?

I doubt there's a single one of you who payed your way through at the current out-of-state rates or took only private loans on principle.

And furthermore, how many of you would have even gotten into a more selective NC State (one that had, let's say, 10,000 students)?

[Edited on February 8, 2011 at 3:41 PM. Reason : a]

2/8/2011 3:38:01 PM

i used a federal loan for my second degree, and understand how its a sensitive balance. however, when you continue to loan people as much money as they want for any degree there is no feedback for tuition prices. it fails to be a fair market because as prices increase demand doesn't fall, people just borrow more money.

the increase in education prices over the last 20 years should be terrifying to everyone, there is no excuse for the amount of debt that our generation is finishing college with


[Edited on February 8, 2011 at 4:33 PM. Reason : to your second point, i know plenty of people who had to use shitty private loans]

2/8/2011 4:32:09 PM

"Sub-par services?" What a joke. The UNC system provides an astonishing value for the money. Even cutting funds and raising fees, we're still getting a pretty good goddamn deal. Unless you go to UNC Pembroke or something, in which case...well, that's your own damn fault.

2/8/2011 8:36:16 PM

^lol

2/8/2011 11:14:28 PM

Quote :

"So how many of you would have ever set foot on NC State campus without federal loans or state subsidies, seriously? I doubt there's a single one of you who payed your way through at the current out-of-state rates or took only private loans on principle."

Oh, I definitely got subsidized loans. I have no problem milking the system. I didn't agree to pay into it, and I didn't agree to have the money spent the way it's being spent. This idea you have that someone who opposes government somehow betrays principle by taking advantage of that very system is silly. It's the equivalent of saying that a slave, who despises his master, should refuse to take whatever of the owner's possessions he can obtain...out of principle. This is real life, dude, not a fucking Ayn Rand book. I don't have enough money to "take the high road," if it can even be considered that.

When you expand access to student loans beyond what the market allows for (when the government "backs" student loans), you will see increasing prices. It's inevitable. Demand is artificially inflated with subsidized student loans, which means higher prices - higher tuition. If you want everyone to have access to student loans, okay, but in return you get perpetually higher tuition. It's a trade off.

2/9/2011 12:00:34 AM

Drain the beast. Take everything you can from government, give back nothing they do not forcibly demand, and all the while laugh about it to your friends. Maybe after showing everyone how ungrateful we are for the entitlements, voters will have a change of heart and take them away. We can only hope.

Until then, never let a government program go by without applying for it, no matter what it is or how much time it costs to apply, for you are draining the beast for the good of humanity.

2/9/2011 12:31:09 AM

Parents paid out of pocket for my me, same with other sister that graduated from State and another sister from UNC....they didnt want us to be buried in debt right after college.

2/9/2011 1:14:30 AM

^Same here. But our tuition was still subsidized by the state.

If my tuition wasn't subsidized, I probably wouldn't have a college degree. Parents woulda pulled the plug after spending a boatload of money for me to get multiple semesters of Fs, and I wouldn't have been motivated to take out loans to continue with school.

2/9/2011 1:39:12 AM

I too was dependent on student loans and in state tuition. I had a couple of scholarships, and I worked part time during college, but there was no way a public school teacher & half-blind mechanic could have paid a lot towards twins going to college at the same time. And they started saving for my college by the time I was born.

Quote :

"Drain the beast. Take everything you can from government, give back nothing they do not forcibly demand, and all the while laugh about it to your friends."

Fiscal conservative ideology is fine. But it is a different thing than saying all government spending is bad. Like when people attack drug rehab and job training programs as something that should be drained, even though they might be cheaper putting people in jail and unemployment. There are positive and negative externalities to take in mind.

Granted not nearly enough programs are decided with a cost-benefit analysis in mind, but education is one of those very few things that has both wide acknowledgment as having positive externalities on our society and having broad public support which is a good thing for programs to have in democracy.

If you want to drain the beast there are a lot of significantly more legitimate targets than education, and I think it undermines your case if you are counting education as part of the beast.

2/9/2011 3:19:54 AM

Why are you protesting both at the UNC General Administration? It seems they will need to do one or the other. Did the General Assembly starting meeting there and I didn't hear about it?

2/9/2011 6:31:13 AM

^^ I was only referring to programs I disagreed with politically. The vast majority of what the city and county do on a daily basis, I agree with, so no beast to drain there.

And yes, education is ungodly important and deserves subsidization, which is why I am annoyed that America doe ssuch a terrible job at it. My complaint is not that we spend too much, but that what we spend we spend so horribly. My biggest complaint is with primary education, but also NCState at this point is too expensive. for the same money the state is spending to subsidize NCState students, for the same money could be sending twice as many students to cheaper community colleges.

2/9/2011 9:17:06 AM

Quote :

"you want to stop annual tuition increases and stop the education bubble? dial back student loans. "

While I agree that blindly handing out student loans puts a positive upward trend on tuition, you would have to be a babboon to correlate the current tuition hikes to this before mentioned affect.

2/9/2011 10:27:09 AM

then what is the explanation for this?

2/9/2011 10:31:14 AM

I am not arguing against the overall trend but I think the acute problem is the state budget cuts. Of course these budget cuts are a symptom of the economy and shortfall of revenue to the state as a function of unemployment.

2/9/2011 10:49:18 AM

Quote :

"While I agree that blindly handing out student loans puts a positive upward trend on tuition, you would have to be a babboon to correlate the current tuition hikes to this before mentioned affect."

No, it's much more significant than you think. Universities, knowing that all students can get loans (and will get loans), don't have the normal market incentive to cut costs. Big deal, tuition hike might result in some kids protesting, but who really cares? They'll be enrolled next semester either way.

The price of education should be going down, like everything else in a free market. Student loans are the next big bubble, because you've got a bunch of people graduating with a mountain of debt, and there's absolutely no way they're all going to pay it off - especially when they can't even find a job with their degree.

[Edited on February 9, 2011 at 11:56 AM. Reason : ]

2/9/2011 11:56:18 AM

And, similar to encouraging home buying during the housing bubble, it's paired with government and educational policies encouraging everyone that they need to go to college. Everyone does not need to go to college. Now we've created this bubble and also raised the standard so that post-graduate degrees are generally recommended now in most professions. And there is no walking away from student loans, no bankruptcy and starting over option. The debt our generation is graduating with is going to cause problems for a long time.

2/9/2011 12:23:33 PM

Quote :

"it's paired with government and educational policies encouraging everyone that they need to go to college"

I agree, not everyone should be going to college. There needs to be more encouragement for vocational training out of high school. Honestly I think gov't need based assistance should be tied into grades. We really should not be paying for some punk to be sitting in his boxers all day playing video games smoking pot. IMHO if GPA >3.0 you get full distribution of your government assistance. If semester GPA is 2.25-2.75 your funds get cut 50%. If overall GPA falls below 2.5 for 2 consecutive semesters, you get 0%.

For those making grades >3.0, however, I have no problem disbursing government monies for need based reasons. Better for them to be studying, being the next top tier engineers or professional business leaders than working 40 hours on top of school. At the same time getting out competed by foreign students, whose governments pay for them to be educated over here (i.e. China).

This though does not include unsubsidized student loans, although I do not agree with the mandate that all student loans must originate from the government (taking the state out of the picture).

[Edited on February 10, 2011 at 8:46 AM. Reason : a]

2/10/2011 8:43:45 AM

Quote :

"IMHO if GPA >3.0 you get full distribution of your government assistance. If semester GPA is 2.25-2.75 your funds get cut 50%. If overall GPA falls below 2.5 for 2 consecutive semesters, you get 0%."

1) if grade inflation is bad now, wait until this sort of a system is put in place

2) what about more difficult majors? or ones that have a different idea of what a C vs a B means?

2/10/2011 9:24:12 AM

i don't think that would work either

2/10/2011 9:26:28 AM

There are plenty of scholarships and non-government grants that require minimum GPA's to keep your award.

2/10/2011 10:15:44 AM

don'y you already have to be making academic progress and be in good academic standing? i would probably be ok with raising the bar some, but if we are offering student loans i don't want to penalize someone because they chose some engineering or science degree instead of PRT.

i wonder how well a program would work that determined the amount you could borrow based on your degree. graduating with $40k in debt with a nuclear engineering degree from some top-tier program is different than graduating with $40k in debt with a communications degree from some random state school. i don't know that this would help the problem of skyrocketing tuition, but maybe dialing back loans just that much would help.

2/10/2011 10:30:15 AM

When we look at the spike in tuition costs, I think we would be utter fools to ignore the role of for-profit "universities" in that trend.

LoneSnark wants us to drain the beast. Well, they are. And they're getting rich off the rest of us in doing it. Of course, the for-profits are just a response to persistent problems in education and current issues in the economy. By response, I mean ruthless, cynical, short-sighted money grabs.

[Edited on February 10, 2011 at 5:13 PM. Reason : ]

2/10/2011 5:12:35 PM

Quote :

"The price of education should be going down, like everything else in a free market"

ehhh...

I think that part of it is simply supply and demand. Demand has risen sharply over the last few decades, as we've somehow gotten into our heads that a college education is something that you're just supposed to go do, and you're kinda falling behind if you don't. People go to college for no good reason, getting degrees that they don't need or use, just because that has become the societal expectation.

2/10/2011 5:23:36 PM

Quote :

"I think that part of it is simply supply and demand. Demand has risen sharply over the last few decades, as we've somehow gotten into our heads that a college education is something that you're just supposed to go do, and you're kinda falling behind if you don't. People go to college for no good reason, getting degrees that they don't need or use, just because that has become the societal expectation."

It's completely supply and demand. Demand for education, though, is only established when an individual is granted admission and has some means of payment. As I explained, early in the 20th century, student loans were not widely accessible. You had to be willing to front much of the cost on your own, and if you were going to get a loan, you needed to make the case to the loan officer that you were a worthy investment. These days, to get a loan, no one even interviews you. You sign some papers and it's a done deal. You just have to be willing to bury yourself under a mountain of debt, and most 18-19 year olds are not able to see that burden for what it is.

Now, a byproduct of these student loans becoming widely accessible is that the university degree has been devalued. In the past, you really had to work hard to even have the opportunity to go to school. These days you just have to do decently in public school, which can easily be done without doing a single day of homework, ever. The rarity of degrees has gone down, meaning that in order to stand out from the crowd, you need more than a B.A. or B.S. - you need a Masters or Doctorate. A high school degree won't get you much of anything, except a job waiting tables at Applebees.

2/10/2011 5:47:50 PM

Quote :

"Just eliminate 50% of the humanities and social sciences, pretty much only a self-perpetuating racket anyways."

I'm sure you know this from great personal familiarity with the literature

2/10/2011 6:50:07 PM

Quote :

"When we look at the spike in tuition costs, I think we would be utter fools to ignore the role of for-profit "universities" in that trend."

i think its pretty silly to blame a trend that started 30 years ago on for-profit universities

how about an example of in-state tuition for state schools:

Quote :

"Back in 1990 the cost to attend the UC was under $2,000 per year. At that time, the median household income was making $33,000 in California. So the cost was 6% of total median annual household income. Today, the median household income is $57,000 and the cost is over $10,000 per year. It now eats up 17% of the annual household gross income."

http://financemymoney.com/student-loan-market-college-loans-for-profit-education-pell-grants-debt-educational-outcomes-bubble-in-higher-education/

2/10/2011 8:48:49 PM

To the main point of the thread:

http://www.wral.com/news/education/story/9092521/

Quote :

"...approved recommendations to increase in-state tuition for undergraduates at public universities across the state. The recommendations now go to the full Board, which will vote Friday. If approved, state lawmakers must give final approval."

Quote :

"North Carolina State University wants a 6.2 percent hike"

Quote :

"University leaders have warned that additional cuts will affect the quality of academics. What is still unclear is if additional money from the tuition increases will be returned to the campuses. North Carolina lawmakers could decide to put that back into the state’s General Fund."

That would suck if the general assembly is cutting our funds a lot, we raise tuition to make up for it, and then they take that too.

2/10/2011 11:12:56 PM

Quote :

"rbrthwrd: i think its pretty silly to blame a trend that started 30 years ago on for-profit universities"

?

For-profit universities started over thirty years ago. And I'm not blaming the trend entirely on them. I'm saying they made it a whole lot worse. As they stand, they're a perversion, and traditional education should have done a better job of responding to changing conditions instead of letting these institutions move in.

2/10/2011 11:59:40 PM

Just as a brief correction to the thread:

Quote :

"Supplanter: That would suck if the general assembly is cutting our funds a lot, we raise tuition to make up for it, and then they take that too."

The UNC Board of Governors doesn't really have true tuition-raising authority, because their grant of power under state statute is that they set rates "not inconsistent with acts of the General Assembly" -- which in a nutshell means the politicians in the legislative branch have the final say.

So to say "we raise tuition to make up for it, and then they take that too" is a bit of a misnomer -- the NCGA is going to set/raise tuition to whatever rate the NCGA decides to set/raise tuition, regardless of what (if anything) the BOG does. This is why, for example, pre-2007 it used to be official BOG policy to request $0 increases every year.

It's also why this march/protest is completely and totally pointless. They need to keep marching another 30 miles southeast to have any influence. 

2/11/2011 12:25:50 AM

^^ well no shit they existed then, but they were hardly the market they are today. even today i don't see their enrollment numbers or tuition being sufficient to effect an average

2/11/2011 12:27:16 AM

^^I don't think we're in any disagreement. What you've said is not so different from the things I've already quoted like "state lawmakers must give final approval" and things I've already said like the part about the General Assembly being important and that they should have started their advocacy earlier during election/voting season.

2/11/2011 12:38:32 AM

^^They represent like ten percent of the student population, and they take out over a quarter of the federal loans, and it's estimated that by next Fall, they'll be receiving more money in federal Pell grants than all traditional schools combined. Since for-profit schools suck/or prey on people who don't finish (they've used high pressure recruiting tactics at homeless shelters), they're also responsible for almost half of the defaults on those federal loans.

According to law, only 90 percent of their revenue can come from federal loans...they have to get the ten percent from somewhere else. In order to do this, some schools have to raise tuition high enough such that grants and loans will not cover a student's expenses so that the student will have to take out private loans (these loans count towards the ten percent). Of course, it's hard for folks to get a loan these days so the school itself will lend you the money to pay for your tuition, knowing that you most likely won't be able to pay it back.

It's all just an illusion of ten percent so they can get the 90 percent from the federal government....and that 90 percent is so much money that they don't even care about the half of the ten percent that they will have to write off. And despite the fact that they're rolling in enough free money to make ridiculous profits, they still managed to get 2.2 billion in stimulus money...in exchange, they ran institutions with an overall 50 percent first-year drop-out rate and a 40 percent six-year graduation rate. Of course, many of those graduates will still default on their loans because they aren't actually prepared for a career, and the tuition was too damn high anyway.

According to wiki, for-profits began booming in the mid-90s. And I believe the problem is growing. The current recession is giving them more jobless prey, and more legitimate, accredited universities are having to sell out to for-profits. Overall, for-profit universities now receive 75 percent of their revenue from the federal government (up from around 50 percent in 2001). I'm not saying they're entirely responsible for the trend, but they've certainly contributed to part of it.

And at least when you overpay for education at a traditional school, you get a more comfortable dorm, more technology in the library, more employees getting paid more money, kids graduating with a decent education, a nicer cafeteria, some cutting edge lab stuff, whatever... You overpay at a for-profit school, you get nothing for it, and some smug jerk get richer.

[Edited on February 11, 2011 at 3:34 AM. Reason : unnecessary cursing]

2/11/2011 3:21:53 AM

sources

2/11/2011 8:51:38 AM

Supplanter: We're not, I was just using your quote to illustrate the point because you were the last person to make the comment explicitly

There seemed to be a perception in the thread (and in NC generally) that the UNC Board of Governors is an all-powerful body when it comes to tuition. They might have bona fide tuition-setting power when budget times are good (and the NCGA just goes along with their recommendations so legislators don't catch political heat for rising tuition rates), but when the state budget is in bad shape the NCGA does what the hell they please.

It's part of why I can't stand Governor Perdue, who during her time as a legislator justified huge year-over-year tuition increases by saying it was just "beer and party money" anyway -- increases that forced me (a guy who had neither drank nor partied during my first 2 years at NCSU) to drop out at the end of my sophomore year.

2/11/2011 9:47:58 AM

Are "for-profit" universities the ones like U. of Phoenix, Miller-Motte, and Ashecroft??

My roommate is receiving federal loan money to attend Ashecroft (maybe its Asheford), on-line. I can't beleive they will actually dispense money for such crap institutions.

2/11/2011 11:35:58 AM

^^^?

Pell Grants:

Quote :

"Two years ago, students at for-profit trade schools received $3.2 billion in Pell grants, according to the Department of Education, less than went to students at two-year public institutions. By the 2011-12 school year, the administration now estimates, students at for-profit schools should receive more than $10 billion in Pell grants, more than their public counterparts. (Those anticipated increases may shrink, depending on the outcome of wrangling in Congress over health care and student lending.)"

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/14/business/14schools.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2


Homeless People:

Quote :

"Benson Rollins wants a college degree. The unemployed high school dropout who attends Alcoholics Anonymous and has been homeless for 10 months is being courted by the University of Phoenix....Rollins’s experience is increasingly common. The boom in for-profit education, driven by a political consensus that all Americans need more than a high school diploma, has intensified efforts to recruit the homeless, Bloomberg Businessweek magazine reports in its May 3 issue. Such disadvantaged students are desirable because they qualify for federal grants and loans, which are largely responsible for the prosperity of for-profit colleges."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-04-30/homeless-dropouts-from-high-school-lured-by-for-profit-colleges-with-cash.html


Defaults:

Quote :

"In 2007, coalition members said, students at for-profit colleges made up only 7 percent of those in higher education but 44 percent of those defaulting on federal student loans."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/14/business/14schools.html?_r=1&pagewanted=2


Private Loans Offered by Schools:

Quote :

"In an especially strange twist, a number of for-profit educational companies, including Corinthian Colleges, ITT Technical Institute, and Career Education Corporation, have recognized that students require private loans to afford their tuitions, and now themselves double as banks, offering loans directly to students. Corinthian Colleges continues to provide these loans even though it assumes that over half of students will default."

http://www.edtrust.org/sites/edtrust.org/files/publications/files/Subprime_report.pdf

Quote :

"Most federal student loans are capped at rates of 6.8 percent or lower. For a newly created private loan program at ITT Technical Institute, rates can range anywhere from 4.75 percent to 14.75 percent interest, depending on a student’s credit score. Interest rates can adjust over time, and can range as high as 25 percent, according to ITT documents in the report."

http://www.studentloanconsolidationcalc.com/private-loans-for-profit-colleges-offer-high-risk-loans-to-keep-fed-dollars-flowing-…/

Quote :

"The so-called “90/10 rule” has been a flashpoint in the debate on the for-profit education sector. Critics of the industry argue that the regulation creates incentives for schools to game the system by increasing tuition to a point where students will have to come up with out-of-pocket expenses to satisfy the 10-percent category. The Consumer Law Center report asserts that schools are satisfying the non-federal income by increasing such institutional loans, even though some institutions expect more than 50 percent of the loans to eventually default."

http://www.studentloanconsolidationcalc.com/private-loans-for-profit-colleges-offer-high-risk-loans-to-keep-fed-dollars-flowing-…/


Stimulus Money from ARRI:

Quote :

"Massage and beauty schools, online universities and other for-profit colleges in Georgia and across the nation are cashing in on federal stimulus spending, collecting $2.2 billion in tuition grants for low-income students, public records show. That represents nearly a quarter of the stimulus money spent on these grants to date."

http://www.ajc.com/news/for-profit-colleges-reap-541761.html


Drop-Out Rate: (not first year, my bad)

Quote :

"Of about 960,000 students who enrolled from July 2008 through June 2009 in schools run by 16 for-profit companies, data show that 57 percent had withdrawn from school as of August 2010, according to Harkin."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/09/30/AR2010093006606.html


Six Year Graduation Rate: (figure here even worse since it's for first time students)

Quote :

"The report, “Subprime Opportunity,” by the Education Trust, found that in 2008, only 22 percent of the first-time, full-time bachelor’s degree students at for-profit colleges over all graduate within six years, compared with 55 percent at public institutions and 65 percent at private nonprofit colleges."

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/11/24/education/24colleges.html


Increased Revenue from Federal Funds:

Quote :

"Publicly traded higher education companies derive three-fourths of their revenue from federal funds, with Phoenix at 86 percent, up from just 48 percent in 2001 and approaching the 90 percent limit set by federal law."

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-04-30/homeless-dropouts-from-high-school-lured-by-for-profit-colleges-with-cash.html



Frontline offers a bunch of perspectives: (video)
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/collegeinc/view/

Another good source:
http://www.edtrust.org/sites/edtrust.org/files/publications/files/Subprime_report.pdf



^Ashford University is actually the reason I got curious about this stuff. A friend of mine got a degree from there, and I wanted to check it out so I went to their website to discover that it was a small school in Iowa founded in 1917 with a beautiful campus/regional accreditation. I had no idea you could buy a legitimate university with financial problems (Mount St. Clair College), change the name (Ashford University), pervert everything about it, and keep the previous school's accreditation. Ashford has been busted for stealing loan money from its students, but it hasn't lost its accreditation yet.

[Edited on February 11, 2011 at 9:05 PM. Reason : ]

2/11/2011 9:03:45 PM

Well done Redstar, the protest was a huge success...

http://blogs.newsobserver.com/campusnotes/at-unc-a-protest-too-late

Quote :

"At UNC, a protest too late Submitted by eferreri on 02/11/2011 - 10:56 General rule of thumb: If you're planning to protest a big decision by a governing body, get there while that body is actually meeting. This morning, a small collection of students primarily from UNC-Chapel Hill gathered at 10 a.m. at The Pit toting protest signs. They then marched resolutely down South Road to the Spangler Center, where the UNC system's Board of Governors meets. Problem: They were late. The board did in fact meet Friday, and approved tuition hikes averaging 6.8 percent for public university students. But the meeting began at 9 and was done before 10 a.m., well before the protesters arrived. Kinda blunts the power of the message, doesn't it? The small group arrived around 10:20 a.m., chanting "No Cuts, No Fees, Education Should be Free," a noble sentiment, if unlikely."

2/12/2011 5:41:28 PM

BridgetSPK, that's a lot of information.

Could you also put up some kind of link that shows how much tax payer money goes to educate people who live here illegally?

kkthx

2/12/2011 9:24:24 PM