The delirium of these folks is incomprehensible.

Saddam was not contained.
He could rapidly reconstitute WMDs even though he didn't have any.
How many resolutions did he get to viloate before we did something about it.
The world is a better place.

Stephanopolous (sp? lulz) is actually getting after him fairly aggressively. It's too bad I haven't seen anyone grill the present administration in a similar manner.

2/8/2011 7:13:56 AM

Pretty sure Saddam had and used WMDs. There's even video proof. Hell, we even gave him some, which he then used on his own, innocent people.

Not defending the choice to go to war when we did, but for anyone to say there were no WMDs is a blatant lie; the only question is what did he do with them and when did he do it.

2/8/2011 7:43:36 AM

Rumsfeld deserves the grilling just based on how he handled the war. Thank god Bush made the switch.

2/8/2011 7:46:08 AM

The story with Sadam wouldn't be over if he had been left in power. It's difficult to think what would have tipped that, but my personal impression is that Iraq before 2003 was a lot like N. Korea is still right now. There is a small group of nations in modern times that have gone so far over the edge that revolts like in Egypt and Tunisia are simply not possible.

That doesn't make it right, and the people of Iraq may not be better off than if we never showed up. But... I think that in 10 years they will be better off.

2/8/2011 10:40:25 AM

Quote :

"Rumsfeld deserves the grilling just based on how he handled the war. Thank god Bush made the switch."

THIS. plus, he is obviously a huge douche.

2/8/2011 10:44:36 AM

yes, wdprice3, the chemical attack on the kurds in 1988 is why we went to war in 2003

here is a good video for you to watch, it has naomi watts so maybe it will keep your attention
http://www.icefilms.info/ip.php?v=124483&

2/8/2011 10:59:00 AM

I thought wikileaks confirmed chemical weapons stockpiles and laboratories were found after the invasion.

2/8/2011 1:12:38 PM

^^ somehow you missed where wdprice3 said

Quote :

"Not defending the choice to go to war when we did"

2/8/2011 1:27:56 PM

^^ a few degraded chemical weapons were found that were left over from the iran-iraq war era and were past their shelf life. The Iraq Survey Group reported to the Armed Services Committee that there was no evidence Iraq produces or stockpiled any weapons since sanctions began in 1991. They said at another time that some chemical weapons did still exist but they were far beyond their shelf-life and were not in sufficient quantities for any kind of military significance. They did still have some depleted uranium from previous nuclear programs which was removed but they had no active program and would have a long way to go to try to start one again.

2/8/2011 4:49:28 PM

Rumsfeld is receiving the "Defender of the Constitution" award at CPAC this year

There will be at least a group of 100-200 Ron Paul-types who will be walking out on him mid-speech.

That'll show him

2/8/2011 5:01:10 PM

I can just imagine the committee that made that decision chuckling over hors d'oeuvres and expensive champagne.

2/8/2011 5:10:34 PM

^^ Wow.

2/8/2011 5:16:09 PM

YO DICK, TELL EM WHAT WE DO AT THE RANCH

2/8/2011 5:55:11 PM

There are special sections of hell reserved for Rumsfeld, Ashcroft, Bush, Cheney, and Wolfowitz. (and a few of their cronies)

2/8/2011 6:32:36 PM

Fucking CPAC

2/8/2011 8:20:10 PM

Saddam had it coming and I'm still glad we gave it to him. The justifications used were weak. The planning of the war was shoddy. But I'm damned happy he's in hell and Iraq has no real hope of threatening anybody any time soon.

2/8/2011 8:39:25 PM

Is it a conservative or war monger thing to always fear attack? Someone made the argument of Iraq was like N Korea, which we all agree isn't a desirable entity in the world. But, can't we just wait for something bad to happen...to AMERICA...and then have an actual justification for kicking some serious ass? I get really bored with the whole "well, he needed to be removed and thats a good thing argument" because that was nearly $1 trillion in taxpayer monies and thousands of American lives eliminated for our good deed.

2/9/2011 6:25:35 AM

Quote :

"Saddam had it coming and I'm still glad we gave it to him. The justifications used were weak. The planning of the war was shoddy. But I'm damned happy he's in hell and Iraq has no real hope of threatening anybody any time soon nor becoming a functioning and safe society for decades."

2/9/2011 6:32:30 AM

Quote :

"my personal impression is that Iraq before 2003 was a lot like N. Korea is still right now"

Dude, not even close. N. Korea represents a whole magnitude of potential threat to world peace than Iraq.

Quote :

"That doesn't make it right, and the people of Iraq may not be better off than if we never showed up. But... I think that in 10 years they will be better off. "

Say that to those killed from our "collateral" damage, blown up during the insurgency, or kids missing limbs from cluster bombs.

Quote :

"yes, wdprice3, the chemical attack on the kurds in 1988 is why we went to war in 2003 "

15 years to late. Reagan and Bush Sr did not seem to care enough to invade until after Saddam attacked our oil buddy in Kuwait.
Iraqi freedom my ass.

2/9/2011 9:21:23 AM

Quote :

"Dude, not even close. N. Korea represents a whole magnitude of potential threat to world peace than Iraq."

Are they really a threat to anyone outside of their immediate area? Or is this because of nuclear proliferation concerns?

2/9/2011 10:26:43 AM

Ask South Korea.

2/9/2011 1:40:48 PM

It doesn't matter if they're a threat outside their area, we have ironclad defensive agreements with two of the countries in the area, and the North doesn't like either of them.

Quote :

"But I'm damned happy he's in hell and Iraq has no real hope of threatening anybody any time soon nor becoming a functioning and safe society for decades."

I'm not happy that it can't become a functioning and safe society. Possibly that quality falls under "shoddy planning." Or possibly for the time being a functioning and safe Iraq is going to be one that threatens other countries. If that's the case, I'd rather them be in non-functioning danger.

2/9/2011 1:49:32 PM

He never believed it was just are you kidding? It's always been about the cheddar.

2/9/2011 2:45:48 PM

Quote :

"He never believed it was just are you kidding? It's always been about the cheddar. "

Rumsfeld and Cheney had some happy friends because of the war.

2/9/2011 3:04:54 PM

Quote :

"But, can't we just wait for something bad to happen...to AMERICA...and then have an actual justification for kicking some serious ass?"

Maybe, if you're comfortable with THE SMOKING GUN BEING A MUSHROOM CLOUD.

2/9/2011 3:20:27 PM

It's all a conspiracy.

2/10/2011 9:10:51 AM

Defector admits to WMD lies that triggered Iraq war

Quote :

"The defector who convinced the White House that Iraq had a secret biological weapons programme has admitted for the first time that he lied about his story, then watched in shock as it was used to justify the war. Rafid Ahmed Alwan al-Janabi, codenamed Curveball by German and American intelligence officials who dealt with his claims, has told the Guardian that he fabricated tales of mobile bioweapons trucks and clandestine factories in an attempt to bring down the Saddam Hussein regime, from which he had fled in 1995. ... In a series of meetings with the Guardian in Germany where he has been granted asylum, he said he had told a German official, who he identified as Dr Paul, about mobile bioweapons trucks throughout 2000. He said the BND (German Secret Service) had identified him as a Baghdad-trained chemical engineer and approached him shortly after 13 March of that year, looking for inside information about Saddam's Iraq. "I had a problem with the Saddam regime," he said. "I wanted to get rid of him and now I had this chance." He portrays the BND as gullible and so eager to tease details from him that they gave him a Perry's Chemical Engineering Handbook to help communicate. He still has the book in his small, rented flat in Karlsruhe, south-west Germany. "They were asking me about pumps for filtration, how to make detergent after the reaction," he said. "Any engineer who studied in this field can explain or answer any question they asked." Janabi claimed he was first exposed as a liar as early as mid-2000, when the BND travelled to a Gulf city, believed to be Dubai, to speak with his former boss at the Military Industries Commission in Iraq, Dr Bassil Latif. The Guardian has learned separately that British intelligence officials were at that meeting, investigating a claim made by Janabi that Latif's son, who was studying in Britain, was procuring weapons for Saddam. That claim was proven false, and Latif strongly denied Janabi's claim of mobile bioweapons trucks and another allegation that 12 people had died during an accident at a secret bioweapons facility in south-east Baghdad. The German officials returned to confront him with Latif's version. "He says, 'There are no trucks,' and I say, 'OK, when [Latif says] there no trucks then [there are none],'" Janabi recalled. He said the BND did not contact him again until the end of May 2002. But he said it soon became clear that he was still being taken seriously. He claimed the officials gave him an incentive to speak by implying that his then pregnant Moroccan-born wife may not be able to travel from Spain to join him in Germany if he did not co-operate with them. "He says, you work with us or your wife and child go to Morocco." The meetings continued throughout 2002 and it became apparent to Janabi that a case for war was being constructed. He said he was not asked again about the bioweapons trucks until a month before Powell's speech. After the speech, Janabi said he called his handler at the BND and accused the secret service of breaking an agreement that they would not share anything he had told them with another country. He said he was told not to speak and placed in confinement for around 90 days."

tl;dr version: We went to war based on this guy's word, even after he was exposed as a liar. In fact, we didn't even care that he lied, and Germany actually threatened his family if he didn't continue to lie. Colin Powell shared what should have been known to be additional lies with the UN on Feb 5th, 2003, and the rest is history.

2/15/2011 1:46:49 PM

This is old... he was outed as a liar years ago.

So the US took his lies (which were known to be lies by then), and slaughtered and facilitated the slaughter of hundreds of thousands of civilians.

I think it is only fair that he should be turned over the Iraqi public, and they can do what they like with him in the streets of Baghdad.

And he is not the only one. There were at least 2 others who lied about weapons and/or Al Qaeda being in Iraq so that the US would attack Iraq. The guy who lied about Al Qaeda was a senior militant himself, captured in Afghanistan. He had an ulterior motive; he wanted all the world's militants to flock to Iraq so that they could kill Americans, and so he lied about Al Qaeda already being there.

All such people should be turned over to the Iraqi public, along with people such as Powell, Cheney, Bush, Rice, and others, including the 'intelligence' officers from Germany and US.

2/16/2011 5:17:18 AM

Have you people not seen "The Green Zone"? Matt Damon figured this shit out a year ago.

2/16/2011 11:08:17 AM

So wait now that there is some movement towards more democracy in the middle east, why aren't the neocons claiming a victory? wasn't that one of their main objectives?

2/16/2011 5:05:39 PM

^^ or
http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0977855/
Fair Game
Plame's status as a CIA agent was revealed by White House officials allegedly out to discredit her husband after he wrote a 2003 New York Times op-ed piece saying that the Bush administration had manipulated intelligence about weapons of mass destruction to justify the invasion of Iraq

2/16/2011 5:28:22 PM

- 2003

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/21/world/meast/iraq-us-troops/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Quote :

"Obama: Iraq war will be over by year's end; troops coming home (CNN) -- President Barack Obama on Friday announced that virtually all U.S. troops will come home from Iraq by the end of the year -- at which point he can declare an end to America's long and costly war in that Middle Eastern nation. "After nearly nine years, America's war in Iraq will be over," Obama said. "The coming months will be a season of homecomings. Our troops in Iraq will definitely be home for the holidays." Of the 39,000 troops in Iraq, about 150, a negligible force, will remain to assist in arms sales, a U.S. official told CNN. The rest will be out of Iraq by December 31."

Romney has already denounced this effort basically saying we need to stay the course for an indefinite number of years.

[Edited on October 21, 2011 at 10:18 PM. Reason : .]

10/21/2011 10:07:34 PM

Yeah, he also accused the President of withdrawing for purely political reasons, ignoring that Obama is just holding to the terms of Bush's agreement with the Iraqis.

Of course, had the Iraqis been willing to grant immunity who knows how long we would have stayed.

10/22/2011 10:24:21 AM

we are still in germany and japan. maybe a full withdrawal is in order there too finally?

10/23/2011 12:06:53 PM

Rummy and Cheney on Iraq: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GS6FCoq349o#t=04m07s

10/23/2011 12:55:14 PM

If the German and Japanese governments stepped up to kick us out I wouldn't object.

The Iraqis don't want us there anymore. At least not as an occupation force.

10/23/2011 1:16:53 PM

how "not there" are we really going to be?

(not a rhetorical question)

10/23/2011 8:53:37 PM

^I'm not sure this is all there is to it, but the CNN story said:

Quote :

"...about 150, a negligible force, will remain..."

10/23/2011 9:54:57 PM

There will probably be some CIA and tier-1 special forces (black SEALs, Delta, etc) as needed. Other than that, I expect that it'll be he advertised 150.

[Edited on October 23, 2011 at 10:54 PM. Reason : And I guess MSGs at the embassy]

10/23/2011 10:53:23 PM

and to think we could have just waited for the Iraqi people to topple Saddam on their own. would have cost us a few hundred million and somewhere around zero American deaths.... and who knows maybe the economy wouldn't have tanked so hard in 2008 if we had saved that $1 Trillion instead of burning it up on all those weapons and fraudulent contractor bills.

oh, wait, i forgot. Saddam was hoarding WMDs and he led the attacks on 9/11




[Edited on October 24, 2011 at 4:46 AM. Reason : ]

10/24/2011 4:43:32 AM

didn't want that smoking gun to be a mushroom cloud dontcha kno

10/24/2011 5:46:54 AM

Quote :

"and who knows maybe the economy wouldn't have tanked so hard in 2008 if we had saved that $1 Trillion instead of burning it up on all those weapons and fraudulent contractor bills."

That doesn't sound very Keynesian of you.

Just to be clear, you've turned to fiscal conservatism and reject the Democratic "job creation" approaches of hiring lots of government workers and trying to spend our way out of a weak economy?

10/24/2011 8:23:45 AM

Not to speak for joe_schmoe, but if we had not spent more than a trillion dollars on the war in Iraq prior to the economic crisis, then that additional trillion dollars could have been used to double the size of the post-crisis stimulus.

10/24/2011 9:20:16 AM

Reminder that conservatives generally fall back on unfalsifiable theories that all the WMD's and records of WMD's were spirited away to Syria in the dead of night, drawing on a bunch of news stories that Fox hawked over the years. Of course, these stories were generally the hearsay of a few questionable individuals, and when proven to be false or inconclusive Fox neglected to air any corrections or addendums.

10/24/2011 12:46:31 PM

http://youtu.be/OgfzqulvhlQ

"They should be in fucking jail."

10/24/2011 12:51:10 PM