Which politicians have it?

5/26/2011 12:10:30 PM

Politics isn't about common sense, it's about playing the game. Since the government now consists of a complex system of competing interest groups, you can't talk about changing anything without alienating a large group of voters. Ideally, politicians would have courage. In reality, they talk a lot without saying anything, because they realize it isn't about being right, it's about being popular.

5/26/2011 12:30:13 PM

If the system is broken, how can we the people fix it? We need to get it where common sense is abundant and running the country is seen as serious business.

5/26/2011 12:58:48 PM

Quote :

"If the system is broken, how can we the people fix it?"

Vote for candidates outside the two-party conglomerate.

5/26/2011 1:01:22 PM

I dont think you can fix it. It will take the collapse for people to really understand the issue with entitlements, mainly medicare. Just look at how serious the Dems took the Ryan plan. No, suggestions just attacks to scare voters.

Just sit back and watch the countdown.

5/26/2011 1:09:17 PM

Quote :

"If the system is broken, how can we the people fix it? We need to get it where common sense is abundant and running the country is seen as serious business."

Basically what ^ said. The system probably won't be reformed. The politicians won't do the right thing until there's literally no other choice. Riots are happening in other parts of the world, where governments are having to level with the people and say, "sorry, you won't be getting all that was promised." That time hasn't come for us, yet. None of the hard decisions are being made, and both parties, at least for the most part, seem to think that hard decisions never will have to be made.

Quote :

"Vote for candidates outside the two-party conglomerate."

I don't think this is likely to force change more than voting for someone of one of the major parties. Personally, I don't care what party someone is, all I care about is how they say they will vote, and what their track record shows. I heard Tim Pawlenty speak the other day, and you would think that he was a true small government conservative, but no one believes that he would stay that way once in office.

5/26/2011 1:18:47 PM

Quote :

"If the system is broken, how can we the people fix it?"

If I've learned anything from this message board its that the best way to fix it is to whine about it, the above posters have given great examples.

5/26/2011 2:46:20 PM

violent revolution

5/26/2011 2:59:58 PM

All politicians have common sense. Problem is that it leaves the rest of us getting shafted

5/30/2011 1:09:58 PM

Common sense is a term that has no meaning.

5/30/2011 1:18:33 PM

Ron Paul.

5/30/2011 1:20:18 PM

Quote :

"If the system is broken, how can we the people fix it? We need to get it where common sense is abundant and running the country is seen as serious business. "

“the people” can’t fix it, because they are the problem.

Fascism is the best way.

5/30/2011 2:56:08 PM

Listen to WKNC.

5/30/2011 3:00:58 PM

Quote :

"Ron Paul. "

i hope that was a joke.

5/30/2011 4:22:06 PM

You're right. His positions are anything but common. The mainstream message from both parties is endless war and deficits don't matter. It's alarming that only a few voices are willing to speak the truth.

5/30/2011 5:01:01 PM

I think money, greed, favoritism, corporate/wall street corruption, oil company corruption, too much oversight on things that don't matter (taxpayer money, contractor money) , too little oversight on things that DO matter (like the lottery winner who gets to keep foodstamps designed for the poor)

Everything I've seen from Obama is legit. My approval rating for the White House is very high.

It's Congress that I have no confidence in.

5/30/2011 5:35:53 PM

Quote :

"My approval rating for the White House is very high"

I keep wondering who is in that 20%.

And you dont see the whitehouse doing ANY of those things your just ranted about?

You even approve of Libya?

5/30/2011 5:43:32 PM

I don't have insider information about libya, but if I did, I'd probably agree with Obama's decision.

Ghadafi has been causing problems since before I was born. Here's what I know from wiki:

"Throughout the 1970s and 1980s, Libya under Gaddafi was considered a pariah state by the Western nations,[10][11] which alleged oppression of internal dissidence, acts of state-sponsored terrorism, assassinations of expatriate opposition leaders, and crass nepotism exhibited in amassing a multi-billion-dollar fortune for himself and his family.[12] Gaddafi was a firm supporter of OAPEC and led a Pan-African campaign for a United States of Africa.[13] After the 1986 Bombing of Libya and the 1993 imposition of United Nations sanctions, Gaddafi established closer economic and security relations with the West, cooperated with investigations into previous Libyan acts of state-sponsored terrorism and paid compensation, and ended his nuclear weapons program, resulting in the lifting of UN sanctions in 2003.

In early February 2011, major political protests, which were inspired by recent protests in Tunisia, Egypt and other parts of the Arab world, broke out in Libya against Gaddafi's government and turned into a civil war. Gaddafi vowed to "die a martyr" if necessary in his fight against his people, rebels and external forces, and said that anyone who does not approve of him deserves to die.[14][15][16] On 17 May 2011 the International Criminal Court issued a request for an arrest warrant against Gaddafi for crimes against humanity"

Based on my information, it appears as if the people wanted him out. They just needed help because they've been held down by force for 40 years.

I really don't know what the word on the street is.

5/30/2011 5:54:27 PM

Quote :

"Based on my information, it appears as if the people wanted him out."

clearly not, because they haven't gotten rid of him yet. "The people" include those in the army. But, yes, meddling in MORE countries internal affairs is sure to work. It worked so well in Iran, Iraq, Afghanistan, ...

5/30/2011 6:31:51 PM

Quote :

""The people" include those in the army."

LoL.

5/30/2011 7:31:02 PM

So you dont mind that he flip flopped on his own position and attacked a nation that was no threat to us?

Does it bother you that he just ignored congress altogether? (esp after 30 days)

5/30/2011 7:40:57 PM

inorite? after all the bitching about bush's "illegal war," it's hilarious to see the dems continue not to give a fuck about the Constitution

5/30/2011 9:06:10 PM

You guys, America is not at war with Libya.

NATO is at war with Libya.



NATO is The North Atlantic Treaty Organization.

NATO comprises of 28 members: Albania, Belgium, Bulgaria, Canada, Croatia, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, France, Germany, Greece, Hungary, Iceland, Italy, Latvia, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Turkey, the United Kingdom, and the United States.

5/30/2011 9:08:19 PM

the fuck?

5/30/2011 9:12:21 PM

mind. fuck.

5/30/2011 9:28:08 PM

Doesn't the majority of NATO'S funding come from USA, more than the next two highest counties combined I believe.

5/30/2011 9:35:46 PM

As I said in the other thread:

Quote :

" I'm sorry, but our own constitution doesn't really exist anymore. We don't have freedom of speech, we don't have freedom of press, we don't have the right to bear arms. The US constitution is hanging by a shoestring. The United States is not a free country. That said, NATO is not under any constitution. Perhaps 1/28th is under it at most. But that 1/28th can be further diminished by this country's inability to read and interpret the simple words of the constitution. "

also,

NATO is an alliance. You help me when I'm in trouble, I'll help you when you're in trouble. That's what alliances do. How many countries helped fight in the war with Afghanistan that was in no imminent threat by Afghanistan?? Exactly, it's an alliance.



[Edited on May 30, 2011 at 9:47 PM. Reason : .]

5/30/2011 9:45:42 PM

then I don't EVER want to hear you bitch about something being against the law or being unConstitutional, as you clearly don't care about that

5/30/2011 10:30:32 PM

Quote :

"NATO is an alliance. You help me when I'm in trouble, I'll help you when you're in trouble. "

Again, that doesnt mean you can bypass congress.

AT LEAST Bush got approval from Congress.

Do you honestly think our military leaders defer to other countries military leaders? If our commanders dont like the plan then they dont send our troops in.

5/30/2011 10:36:53 PM

Quote :

"Does it bother you that he just ignored congress altogether? (esp after 30 days)"

He doesn't need congressional approval for 60 days with an additional 30 days to GTFO.

5/30/2011 10:53:41 PM

The thing about it is none of us know whats best for us better than the people who are paid to be there. Thats the congessmen, the senate, and the president.
We need to maintain the faith that they are there for us and they dont care about personal power and wealth.We need to believe they are there for the same reasons they told us theyd be there. If we just keep doing what we're doing it will all work out for the best. Enough skepticism everytime something goes wrong.We are almost back on top.

5/30/2011 10:59:17 PM

Quote :

"The thing about it is none of us know whats best for us better than the people who are paid to be there. Thats the congessmen, the senate, and the president. We need to maintain the faith that they are there for us and they dont care about personal power and wealth.We need to believe they are there for the same reasons they told us theyd be there. If we just keep doing what we're doing it will all work out for the best. Enough skepticism everytime something goes wrong.We are almost back on top."

Agreed. There is still a lot of clean up work to be done though from the major fiasco of the last administration. Congress has almost entirely new members but they still aren't getting the job done. There is a glitch in the system somewhere and I have faith it will be fixed....when people are fed up enough.

[Edited on May 30, 2011 at 11:07 PM. Reason : .]

5/30/2011 11:05:32 PM

I dont think obama gets enough support to get what he needs to be done, done.
on one hand everyone is like lets get medical care but on the other hand people like Pelosi are like whoa i want medical care for everyone except the people in my district. Fuck you kike, you want it for everyone or no one, am i right?We cant let elected officials gone bad like Pelosi take us away from our utopian dream. We can reach a spot where everyone is considered "poor' by modern day standards but no one is destitute. That is what america needs. No success and no starvation.

We want standards that would be considered "hell" by the average american but paradise by the average dominican.

5/30/2011 11:25:07 PM

Quote :

"We want standards that would be considered "hell" by the average american but paradise by the average dominican."

I think we've already achieved that because people in poverty are living better than lower middle class.
They don't have to work but they have more than enough food stamps to feed an entire family, have better clothes, and better cell phones.

But it's killing us.

We need everyone who can work to put in their time. Enough freebies. Even people in wheelchairs can do a desk job. Everyone do their equal share and the standard of living will improve.

5/30/2011 11:56:40 PM

^ I agree,


All animals are equal, but some are more equal than others.

5/31/2011 12:36:15 AM

Quote :

"The thing about it is none of us know whats best for us better than the people who are paid to be there. Thats the congessmen, the senate, and the president. We need to maintain the faith that they are there for us and they dont care about personal power and wealth.We need to believe they are there for the same reasons they told us theyd be there. If we just keep doing what we're doing it will all work out for the best. Enough skepticism everytime something goes wrong.We are almost back on top."

This is a comforting thought for you, I'm sure. Unfortunately, all of the evidence points to the contrary: the politicians don't understand how we ended up in this economic mess, and as a result, they are completely inept when it comes to getting us out. The thought of nearly every politician, at this point, is how do I avoid the wrath of the voters. Currently, doing the right thing would be fiercely unpopular.

5/31/2011 12:44:07 AM

You assume that you know the right thing.

Maybe the right thing is to let this all come down upon itselfs. Maybe Pontiaus Pilate will swoon out of thin air and right this insurmountable debt ceiling like when the walls came tumbling down, down against Joshua.


Heathens vs heathanites in 2012. Viva la revolucion, sid pro quo

5/31/2011 1:06:02 AM

I'm not really worried about entitlements. That's a valve that can be easily measured and closed.

If we're going to have a collapse, it will likely be due to something nebulous, volatile and irreplaceable; like oil.

But I agree with the notion that our current form of government lacks common sense, and its going to take a total collapse for people to move from their couches.

[Edited on May 31, 2011 at 10:33 AM. Reason : .]

5/31/2011 10:27:52 AM

Quote :

"You assume that you know the right thing."

I know that ZIRP (zero interest rate policy) is awful for the economy in the long-term. It sends false signals to investors. Rates should have shot up a long time ago, but the Fed refuses to remove the punchbowl from the party.

The only reason the Fed is having to do what it's doing with ZIRP is because Congress refuses to address the budget problem in a serious way.

5/31/2011 12:03:23 PM

Right now the fed can't afford to raise rates because it would render them insolvent. That's why they passed the law stating when they go insolvent soon they are allowed to shift their losses back to the taxpayers (treasury). They are leveraged at 50:1 currently so a 2% decline in value of their risky securities would do the trick. Raising rates would obviously have this effect

5/31/2011 1:52:03 PM

Yeah. That's why talk of rate hikes in the United States are a little unbelievable to me. Volcker raised the federal funds rate to 20% in the 1980s. If Bernanke were to do the same, it'd put an end to the party faster than anyone thought possible, and it would likely usher in a domestic (possibly global) deflationary depression.

5/31/2011 2:06:36 PM

I think wed get that at 5%. 20% would be armageddon

5/31/2011 3:34:40 PM

It would be a great change of pace to see you two jack each other off with something more than baseless speculation, but I sadly know that will never happen.

5/31/2011 6:43:16 PM

Quote :

"The full consequences of a default — or even the serious prospect of default — by the United States are impossible to predict and awesome to contemplate. Denigration of the full faith and credit of the United States would have substantial effects on the domestic financial markets and the value of the dollar in exchange markets. The Nation can ill afford to allow such a result. The risks, the costs, the disruptions, and the incalculable damage lead me to but one conclusion: the Senate must pass this legislation before the Congress adjourns."

- Ronald Reagan on raising the debt ceiling.

[Edited on June 1, 2011 at 1:13 AM. Reason : ...]

6/1/2011 1:13:35 AM

Quote :

"You guys, America is not at war with Libya. NATO is at war with Libya. "

i was at SHAPE in Belgium earlier this year and it's basically 75% americans there it seemed like to me

6/1/2011 3:36:05 AM

You're going to have to put that into some context if you want us to know what that means.

6/1/2011 8:17:02 AM

Kris, my posts are anything but abstract. I am simply pointing out facts.

The facts dictate that our debt is unsustainable and our economy is breaking down.

We are in the middle of a debt crisis and dollar crisis. We are rapidly approaching another recession and that is why the government and treasury are panicking right now.

What does Obama do, cut spending? No way. That would ensure he'd lose the election. He has already decided to take more "emergency measures" that will temporarily stabilize the economy at the expense of our future health.

I suspect these measures will delay the crisis by another 2-5 years, but it will certainly make the crisis itself worse.

Let me dumb this down for you, so there won't be anymore misunderstanding.

We are eating one cheeseburger today but we will owe two cheeseburgers tomorrow. Who will provide these burgers?

6/1/2011 12:58:02 PM

I wasn't saying that your posts are abstract, just that they are crap.

All you say is "we owe money" or "we're in a dollar and debt crisis" and "we're in the beginning of a recession" without actually proving any of that. It's not your conclusion that is debated, it's your premise that tends to be made up.

6/1/2011 2:12:53 PM

False, I'm not making anything up. You are the one distorting reality by pretending what I'm saying is debatable

6/1/2011 2:58:22 PM

I implore you all to read up on Ron Paul. This is the real change America needs.

http://youtu.be/xDiqczZJHTQ



[Edited on June 1, 2011 at 3:41 PM. Reason : ]]

6/1/2011 3:41:06 PM