[WORDS]
So I have finally accepted what I've been trying to avoid--I need to sell the Marauder and get something more, for lack of a better word, responsible. Gas is killing me--I drive 40-50 miles per day and it takes premium, 20 mpg highway. Plus money is tight and the payment is high, as I've had a pay cut since I bought it (about a year from paid off, I do have a couple grand positive equity). And the girlfriend's car is getting less-than-reliable in its old age so I want to put her in something that I can trust.

So, the plan is for me to use her car as a DD, and I will buy something new(er) for her to drive daily and for us to use on trips etc. What I'm looking for is as follows:
-price range $9k to $13k (I want to get my monthly payment <250 on a 3 or 4 year loan with ~2000 down)
-highway MPG >30
-reliable (must last length of loan at least with no major repair bills)
-reasonably nice interior
-doesn't totally suck to drive, as I will be driving it occasionally and it's my money I'm spending
-not an SUV, CUV, MPV, or any of that mess

Cars I have been thinking of (have not driven any of these yet, make the appropriate adjustments to year to hit the target price range): Civic Si, Scion tC, Hyundai Sonata (4cyl)/Elantra, Ford Fusion (4cyl), Chevy Malibu (4cyl), Pontiac G6 GXP coupe (MPG might not be good enough?), Volvo S60 2.5t (MPG, reliability as they age?), MINI (reliability?)

Cars I have mostly ruled out: Corolla (*boring*), Accord/Camry (boring plus overinflated resale value), any VW (I wouldn't trust it unless it was CPO/warranty and that will be out of my price range), any Mazda (reliability), any Nissan (NMSJ), Caliber (what a piece of crap), Cobalt (see caliber), Focus (I like the new ones but the old ones are just blah).

Ideas? Also, on a related note, anyone wanna buy a Marauder?
[/WORDS]

[Edited on August 14, 2011 at 2:33 PM. Reason : d]

8/14/2011 2:31:11 PM

91 accord 5 speed

8/14/2011 4:47:41 PM

You could buy my Z06. It gets more like high 20s on the interstate at 75-80 mph (although it will get > 30 mpg if you're doing, say, a stead 60 or maybe 65 mph...you can also run 87 in it on the highway (I mean, you could run it anywhere, but the ECU goes full retard on the timing and you lose a good bit of power, so I only do it on interstate road trips).

I get about 20 or so on an average tank in mixed driving.


Driving it does not suck and you will not be bored.

[Edited on August 14, 2011 at 5:51 PM. Reason : also slightly above your price range, but not by much.]

8/14/2011 5:51:23 PM

How many miles on the Marauder and what are you looking to get for it? I know a couple of people that are always trying to talk me out of mine, will be glad to point them your way.

8/14/2011 6:22:44 PM

"NMSJ" and you have a marauder? ha

anyways, I'd check out a honda fit sport

8/14/2011 6:26:19 PM

Quote :

"Accord/Camry (boring plus overinflated resale value)"

Hopefully you're smart enough to figure out that the resale value is high for a reason. Hint: its not the edgy styling.

8/14/2011 8:39:13 PM

It is due to the reputation Honda and Toyota built through the 90s and into early 2000's. They lost the edge in the last few years IMO as they have gotten more complacent and the Big Three and Koreans really stepped it up. So I ageree with OP if we are talking about a car made within last 5 years or so.

8/14/2011 8:45:54 PM

Newest Gen Civic Si takes premium gas, so that eats into the relatively decent fuel economy that you might be expecting. Personally, I think it's worth it though. It's a hell of a car. You can always find a previous gen Si hatch in the $8k range though, usually with ~100k or less; and it will run on 87 octane. I also think that's a good one for the money. $13k won't go far on the newest gen, but $9k will go a long ways on the last gen.

[Edited on August 15, 2011 at 12:02 AM. Reason : l]

8/15/2011 12:02:23 AM

Quote :

"How many miles on the Marauder and what are you looking to get for it?"

116K. Haven't really settled on a target price yet, need to do some research, but when I decide I'll let you know.

Quote :

""NMSJ" and you have a marauder? ha"

It's been pretty damn reliable for 116K miles and I'm not getting rid of it because I'm having problems, so I'm satisfied. I'm not by nature a Nissan hater but I figure if so many people have something against them, there's got to be something to it. Kind of sad because I really do like the Altima coupe.

Quote :

"Hopefully you're smart enough to figure out that the resale value is high for a reason. Hint: its not the edgy styling."

Oh, believe me, I know. But I'm not buying it in the hopes of selling it dear down the line, and while they are great cars (I owned a '91 Accord for a while that stayed in the family until it was totaled at around 185K) it's just not something I'm looking at currently.

Quote :

"Newest Gen Civic Si takes premium gas, so that eats into the relatively decent fuel economy that you might be expecting. Personally, I think it's worth it though. It's a hell of a car. "

That's why it's at the top of my list. But the price worries me, as I just can't abide the styling of the previous-gen hatches. Something about the looks REALLY grates on my nerves. So it's a recent-gen or nothing there.

8/15/2011 12:43:24 AM

ok the sonata you can't afford in the good models. so nix that one.

the kia soul you could about buy new and its actually a very nice/ fun car.

the s60/s40 T5 is a car i would buy new but i would not trust the vast majority of volvo drivers to properly maintain.

i'd cross off the gm products because their interiors inspire suicidal thoughts

Leaving the SI, Fusion, Elantra, and Tc

the SI would be the most fun, the Elantra would be the most economical, the fusion is the biggest and the Tc is a compromise between fun and economical. And i would check out the soul because it is a good compromise of large (ok so i know it looks tiny but since you sit upright it actually has way more room then expected), economical, and fun

and i don't know if you can get a loan for a used TDI that you can afford but that may be worth a shot too.


[Edited on August 15, 2011 at 8:40 AM. Reason : .]

8/15/2011 8:37:37 AM

soul can be had with awd, no? (dont feel like goggling)

8/15/2011 8:41:32 AM

nahh that'd be cool though...

i really wish they'd put the turbo 2.0 in it lol.

8/15/2011 8:48:01 AM

Suzuki SX4?

worth taking a look at IMO

I think they only get low 30s mpg and I kinda doubt they are that much fun but would be reliable and in your price range.

^^sx4 has an AWD option



also my buddies '08 Civic's engine block just cracked. He claimed it was an issue with that generation and Honda released a warranty extension but his wasn't covered for whatever reason. I have no idea if thats the same block as in the Si but probably worth looking into.

[Edited on August 15, 2011 at 9:47 AM. Reason : I think its just one of those 1 in every several thousand cars built type problems]

8/15/2011 9:25:33 AM

Acura TSX '04-08

8/15/2011 10:41:28 AM

Soul and TSX (and maybe RSX? When did those go out of production?) are worth consideration.

Interior would probably kill the G6 (that plus the coupe being uncommon and the sedan being ugly) but the higher-line Malibus actually have nice interiors. The two-tone in the LTZ is pretty sweet. Price may be an issue there though (and can you get a 4cyl LTZ? V6 would not meet my MPG goals I don't think)

8/15/2011 10:49:38 AM

i just bought an 03 accord to put the gto in the garage.

so far first tank was 27 mpg, and 29 mpg on the 2nd tank.

I have the automatic (so the gf can drive me when er, im not fit).

The manual will get better mpg. Its got a nice leather interior, decent stereo and its not a bad car to drive. It doent feel as disconnected as the camry does. Wish i woulda got the 4 door though.

[Edited on August 15, 2011 at 11:22 AM. Reason : I spent 7.5k on a 03 coupe EX-L with 115,000]

8/15/2011 11:21:57 AM

I got 33 MPG driving to Snowshoe last weekend and 35 MPG coming back in the 08 Civic EX. Keeping the revs up and hammering every mountain pass on WV 219 and VA 220 as hard as I could probably burned a good bit of extra fuel.

8/15/2011 11:47:03 AM

Quote :

"i just bought an 03 accord to put the gto in the garage. so far first tank was 27 mpg, and 29 mpg on the 2nd tank. I have the automatic (so the gf can drive me when er, im not fit). The manual will get better mpg. Its got a nice leather interior, decent stereo and its not a bad car to drive. It doent feel as disconnected as the camry does. Wish i woulda got the 4 door though. "

If my experience is anything worth noting, the mileage isn't that much better with the 5 speed. I almost never get above 30 mpg on the highway...and my daily mileage (about 50/50 city/highway) averages around 26-27. And I don't have a lead foot.

8/15/2011 12:35:14 PM

Yea I was pleasantly suprised, i wanted a decent interior and stuff and the fit and civic just didn't have the feel of the accord.

The gas I'm saving in the accord (about $150 a month in gas) to the GTO (was about $275) pays for itself.

And now I can screw with the GTO without as much concern.

I do miss the v8 power, feels funny to have the car downshift when going up a hill.

8/15/2011 2:34:25 PM

Just got an '12 Civic LX for my wife to drive back and forth to Chapel Hill. We drove it from Raleigh to Myrtle Beach and back on just over 9 gallons this weekend (39.4 mpg) We hit EVERY stoplight going and coming.

8/15/2011 4:05:08 PM

I don't know how important the highway mileage OVER 30 is but you'll be pushing it in the Si. Best I've gotten in my '07 sedan is 31 totally highway. I'm a serious lead foot but use large throttle openings and shift early otherwise and end up around 26.5 mixed normally with more city than highway.

Overall, I enjoy the car but there are some shortcomings. The "alcantara" on the armrest sucks and wears easily. Transmission issues were really problematic in these cars (2006-08 I believe). My 3rd gear was replaced but it took 13k miles of complaints and I still have issues with it and 2nd occasionally (I really miss Honda's old rod shifters). 2006-07 models have way too much negative camber in the rear (over 2* on mine). I struggle to get 20k miles out of a set of all-season tires and that's a large part of it. A-pillars are SO FUCKING HUGE!!!

On the plus sides, it handles great for a stock car. The LSD is a really nice addition and the car can definitely take advantage of it. It's a really solid car and feels a couple of notches above the previous generation of civics. The engine is typical Honda in that it loves to rev but it actually has a bit of torque (passing on the highway is actually possible without dropping out of 6th gear!). I bought mine new and have right at 55k miles on it now. Overall, I don't regret buying it but I've been looking at other vehicles for several months now (namely WRX wagons for snow+speed+utility).

If you have any specific questions on them, let me know.

8/15/2011 8:33:59 PM

Just realized I had neglected to mention an important point--has to be automatic. This is a function of the fact that it will be the lady's DD during the week--I could teach her to drive a manual, I'm sure, but I'm also sure that I will not be able to convince her to live with one every day.

Decreases the fun factor of most of these, I'm sure.

8/15/2011 9:08:18 PM

Quote :

"A-pillars are SO FUCKING HUGE!!! "

So true. It's not uncommon to have to shift your head around in the cabin a significant amount in order to see the apexes in a sharp curve.

C-pillars are pretty fucking big too. If a SUV parks next to you you'll just have to back up slowly and get half your car in the lane before you can see past it.

[Edited on August 15, 2011 at 9:46 PM. Reason : l]

8/15/2011 9:45:41 PM

You can pretty much pick a gear, any gear in my Z06. Start off in 3rd? Feels about like starting off in 1st in some cars. In 6th and need to speed up? Gas it and go.

Trunck holds 2 pretty good-sized suitcases, too. It's good fuel-efficient family hauler.

8/15/2011 9:58:31 PM

I don't think civic si comes in automatic

8/15/2011 10:34:47 PM

e36 325i/328i

you will get high 28-29mpg on highway. dead reliable. FUN to drive. $4k for a nice example. $1.5-2k in rough shape. pocket the difference of the budget. interior is practical for its age, but it does fall apart.

8/16/2011 2:20:31 AM

Quote :

"has to be automatic"

Civic Si is manual only so go ahead and scratch it off your list.

8/16/2011 7:40:02 AM

The Civic Si is the best car listed by you as a potential purchase. Break down and teach your girlfriend how to drive a stick.

Quote :

"also my buddies '08 Civic's engine block just cracked. He claimed it was an issue with that generation and Honda released a warranty extension but his wasn't covered for whatever reason. I have no idea if thats the same block as in the Si but probably worth looking into."

The Si has an entirely different engine.

8/16/2011 8:47:58 AM

^word



You could get a CVT with paddle shifters in a SX4

8/16/2011 9:41:01 AM

CVTs are teh suck

8/16/2011 11:39:27 AM

yeah but paddle shifters are automatic cool points


/not really

[Edited on August 16, 2011 at 11:48 AM. Reason : I'm really just trying to push the SX4 on everyone]

8/16/2011 11:47:49 AM

lol

The only SX4 I like is the WRC version

8/16/2011 1:04:43 PM

Update--another automatic disqualification is requires premium. I disagree with that one but I won't be the one putting gas in it, so it's not really for me to argue with. Not used to having to count someone else's opinions more highly than my own when car shopping.

So the Si and RSX-S are out (no automatic available), as are the TSX and S60 (28 MPG highway + premium gas on both), Fusion (29 MPG + the good ones (i.e. 2010-up) likely out of my price range), MINI (requires premium), Scion tC (only 27 MPG? Really, Scion?)

Still in running:
-Civic (non-Si)
-RSX (non type-S)
-Elantra
-Malibu
-Forte
-Soul
-Fiesta (maybe, not sure if it will be too small)

That list got short in a hurry. Plus the RSX is on shaky ground since 2006 was the last year and I don't know if I want to go 5 years old (and a 10 year old design).

8/16/2011 4:22:10 PM

Not to be rude, but why don't you just tell her to buy her own damn car? I can't imagine buying a car for a girlfriend. Maybe letting a really serious one drive one of my cars regularly, but I'll be damned if I'd let her go car shopping with my money.

Also, it's not like the different between $1.00/gallon and $1.20/gallon. When unleaded is $3.60/gallon, paying 20-cents more for high test is only 5% more in fuel cost. That's the same thing as saying "I'm cool with this car that gets 35 mpg, but I flat out won't accept this other car that gets 33 mpg." Or "My car gets 20 mpg, but if that thing ever drops to 19 mpg, I'm selling it."

[Edited on August 16, 2011 at 5:37 PM. Reason : looking a gift horse in the mouth AND making a strictly business decision based purely on emotion.]

8/16/2011 5:35:54 PM

Quote :

"also my buddies '08 Civic's engine block just cracked. He claimed it was an issue with that generation and Honda released a warranty extension but his wasn't covered for whatever reason. I have no idea if thats the same block as in the Si but probably worth looking into."

Apparently that's not too uncommon. Honda is normally pretty good about replacing them now though, so I'd raise a serious stink if it happened to mine and they wanted me to pay for the replacement engine.

8/16/2011 6:02:48 PM

if you'd consider a soul and fiesta, why not the Fit?

Quote :

"The Fit don't drift, but it's got enough poke, control and feedback to generate some of the Mini Cooper's smile-generating tossability. Rumor (Car & Driver) has it that the Fit can hustle through cones faster than a Z06. Yes, you just read that. And the brakes are out of this class."

8/16/2011 7:17:01 PM

Quote :

"Not to be rude, but why don't you just tell her to buy her own damn car? I can't imagine buying a car for a girlfriend. Maybe letting a really serious one drive one of my cars regularly, but I'll be damned if I'd let her go car shopping with my money."

Figured that would come up sooner or later. Basically--her car is old, falling apart, and not very reliable. She works late hours (server at a restaurant) plus is going back to school doing prep work before starting a master's program. So I'm not thrilled with the idea of her being stuck with this wonky, unreliable car, but she can't afford to buy anything much better. Seeing as how I feel I need to sell my current car and I'm in a slightly better financial spot than her right now, I figured it would be the better decision to give her the nicer/more reliable/safer car and for me to deal with the old crappy one. If the car doesn't start one morning I can take the bus to work. She cannot do this as easily. Once she's done with grad school and making more money than me, the favor can be repaid.

Plus we've been together for 4 years, living together for 2.5 of that. Proposal is not far off. For all intents and purposes we're married anyway so that's the viewpoint from which I'm framing the decision. And on the conditions (auto, regular gas)--if I bought something that didn't satisfy those, she'd keep driving her current car. I'm not cool with that for much longer. Therefore, I will follow these conditions and probably leave the ultimate decision up to her.

8/16/2011 7:17:18 PM

Quote :

""The Fit don't drift, but it's got enough poke, control and feedback to generate some of the Mini Cooper's smile-generating tossability. Rumor (Car & Driver) has it that the Fit can hustle through cones faster than a Z06. Yes, you just read that. And the brakes are out of this class.""

I think they're kind of homely. But having read that, it just may merit a test drive. All three (Soul, Fiesta, Fit) are on the small end of, or perhaps beyond, my comfort zone though.

8/16/2011 7:18:38 PM

I'm telling yah the fit looks smaller then it feels inside.

I personally would get a forte coupe over a fit only because it doesn't look as chicky to me. (we aretalking 4or 5 1 being ultra chick car 10 being 2.5 ton millitary truck)

8/16/2011 9:30:03 PM

If priority #1 is economy, you're doing a disservice to yourself by;
*Getting a car payment on a $10k car
*Refusing a manual

I would buy something older, w/a manual transmission. e36 BMWs are fairly reliable. If you just have to have something boring perhaps an older econobox for around $3k?

8/16/2011 10:05:13 PM

Quote :

"Basically--her car is old, falling apart, and not very reliable. She works late hours (server at a restaurant) plus is going back to school doing prep work before starting a master's program. So I'm not thrilled with the idea of her being stuck with this wonky, unreliable car, but she can't afford to buy anything much better."

not worth going in debt over this situation. join AAA.

and i'm sure if she made some minor sacrifices she could save up the $2-3k it would take to purchase reliable basic transportation. any car is gonna require maintenance. do not neglect them.

[Edited on August 16, 2011 at 10:30 PM. Reason : adsf]

8/16/2011 10:26:27 PM

Quote :

"If priority #1 is economy, you're doing a disservice to yourself by; *Getting a car payment on a $10k car *Refusing a manual"

I don't know man...It seems like automatic cars are a dime a dozen, but finding a clean car with a manual is getting harder and harder these days. It seems like most people buying a new car just get an auto and there is a higher percentage of buyers looking for manual transmission cars in the used sector.

8/16/2011 10:30:40 PM

^^

8/16/2011 10:45:19 PM

gf has an 03 cavalier auto, sedan

- auto, 2.2 ecotec has good power for what it is
- disposable interior (who cares)
- peeling paint (who cares)
- avg 28-30mpg, hwy trips avg 35mpg
- $3500 purchase price in 2008, done nothing buy tires/oil/filters since


tell her to get a life, or a job (the bums will always lose), swallow your pride, and buy her a cheap, reliable car that will get the job done.

if you're worried about roadside breakdowns, get AAA

8/17/2011 8:03:26 AM

How about a VW Jetta? My 2004 1.8T GLS is going up for sale soon, but its a 5-speed. For $9-$10k you should be able to find the newer body design of the 2005 year.

Mine has been great, 30-34mpg on the highway, fun to drive, turbo, and its a nice car (leather, sunroof, heated seats, etc).

8/17/2011 8:33:20 AM

Quote :

"Not to be rude, but why don't you just tell her to buy her own damn car? I can't imagine buying a car for a girlfriend. Maybe letting a really serious one drive one of my cars regularly, but I'll be damned if I'd let her go car shopping with my money. Also, it's not like the different between $1.00/gallon and $1.20/gallon. When unleaded is $3.60/gallon, paying 20-cents more for high test is only 5% more in fuel cost. That's the same thing as saying "I'm cool with this car that gets 35 mpg, but I flat out won't accept this other car that gets 33 mpg." Or "My car gets 20 mpg, but if that thing ever drops to 19 mpg, I'm selling it.""

I'm with Duke on this one. I also can't believe she'd refuse a car purchased by you for her to drive if it required premium fuel. What kind of common sense are we talking about here? I've had cars requiring premium fuel only since 1999, it's not that bad.

Quote :

"Rumor (Car & Driver) has it that the Fit can hustle through cones faster than a Z06. Yes, you just read that."

That's a fairly misleading quote. 1st, the Fit is MUCH narrower than the Z06 so it will be easier to navigate through the cones as less steering angle is required. And 2nd, a light FWD chassis is inherently good at that type of handling test. That being said I've heard nothing but good things about the Fit and that it is fun to drive. In fact I have no problem saying it's the most fun driving Honda sold these days.

At this point I say Kia Forte

[Edited on August 17, 2011 at 8:47 AM. Reason : Fit is the last carryover of when Honda built fun cars]

8/17/2011 8:45:53 AM

late 90's early 00's saturn for ~$1500. if you arent driving it, who cares about the interior. they're cheap and run forever

8/17/2011 8:54:05 AM

so can a fiesta.. but that doesn't mean it's really a better car.


My personal opinion is:
On a track, i'd love to have a vette on the street i don't like the visibility, i don't like how wide it is and i don't feel its that maneuverable. But throw it into a high speed high G turn and you can't beat it.

I still don't understand why people auto cross vettes.

8/17/2011 9:44:44 AM

Quote :

"In fact I have no problem saying it's the most fun driving Honda sold these days."

I'd be really surprised if the Fit was more fun than a Civic Si. High revving VTEC, 6-speed, LSD, good seats, and relatively tight suspension for a stock car wins hands down IMO.

8/17/2011 11:42:44 AM

All the reviews say the "Honda" feel is gone from the new Civic, Si included. Though it is faster so its hard to argue that. Also, I could have sworn I edited out that last sentence.

8/17/2011 12:46:38 PM