Ok so for those who have had a home built (either a predone plan or custom) this is the thread to provide all those lessons learned, things you would have done differently, etc....


And yes there is a selfish purpose to this thread as I am just embarking on building a custom home. We close on 6.5 acres on the 20th.

Both my wife and I are engineers, and we already developed a rough plan that is being scaled and going into CAD this week to determine load bearing walls, roof lines, etc.....really looking for anything people can lend in the way of advice. I already have an awesome custom home builder lined up for my area.

9/12/2011 6:17:42 AM

I haven't built a home but I am adding this to my topics.

9/12/2011 10:39:55 AM

I just finished up my home in November of last year. I highly recommend using spray in foam insulation along with a sealed crawl space and high efficiency a/c units. I am heating and cooling 5800 sq ft and our power bill this summer has not been over $180. Last January and February i think it topped out at just under $300 due to the ice/snow storms.

I also enjoy our whole house audio system. We have speakers in every room where I can listen to whats on the TV in the living room or I can plug in an iPod and listen to it in just that room.

Also, if you are building at the back of your 6 acres check with your utilities to make sure there will not be any additional charges to run their stuff back to your house. I had to pay progress energy $4000 to run power line underground to my house from the road and Time Warner wants $7500 to run cable back to my house. I am 1200 ft from the road.


And as always build the biggest and nicest you can right now, its not going to get any cheaper.

9/12/2011 11:19:07 AM

I just spent my second night in my new house, so I'll have to post more things as I discover them. We built a modular home from a stock floorplan with minor modifications.

1. Pay extra attention to where you put electrical switches and outlets. One of the first things I figured out after moving in is that a 3-way switch in the living room would be nice so I could shut off the light as I walk into the bedroom instead of having to walk across the room in the dark. We also identified our cable outlet locations and then stuck the TV on a different wall when we actually laid out the furniture.

2. Utility hookups are going to take way longer than you think, and it's something your builder has no control over. The power company operates on whatever schedule it feels like being on.

3. When choosing your finishes, there are a lot of tradeoffs between material and labor costs to be considered. For example, our whole house has crown molding and textured ceilings because the extra material hides the drywall seams. You can save a lot of money by being smart about construction methods.

4. Site improvements are deceptively expensive. For us, they were nearly as much as the house itself.

5. Dealing with the county building department can be a hassle. We're in York County, VA and they are particularly difficult. We had several instances of the health department making up requirements for our septic system and our builder lost a lot of hours fighting with them (he won).

6. Unless you've got a lot of cash sitting around beyond what you need as a minimum down payment, appraisal value drives what you can build, not what you can actually afford. Make sure you know the value of comps in your area, because those will be used to determine your financing instead of the construction cost. We had to appeal our appraisal to get the value above the construction cost because another factor out there is you have no control over the skill level of the appraiser. Appraisal value is very much based on age, room count, and square footage and veneer is about the only quality of finishes item considered. Since the real estate market is generally shitty and still declining, this will be a factor that drives a lot of your design decisions. We built a larger house than we needed and didn't do some of the upgrades we wanted just so their funny math would work out.

9/16/2011 9:42:11 AM

Well I used to work for a custom home builder, so I could write pages on this stuff but I don't really feel like it

But if you have any specific questions, feel free to ask and I'll do my best to answer

9/16/2011 3:44:42 PM

I find cooling 5800 sq ft at under $180 hard to believe.

9/16/2011 5:31:39 PM

^^What was the most common "splurge" that you would see, that seemed completely unnecessary, or a waste of money?

And alternatively, what is the one thing you would say to definitely spend the extra money?

And why is it so hard to find a floor plan with big bedrooms, and not just the master! It seems the third bedroom is always relegated to 10 x 12, etc.

9/16/2011 5:38:01 PM

Quote :

"Both my wife and I are engineers, and we already developed a rough plan that is being scaled and going into CAD this week to determine load bearing walls, roof lines, etc"

I hope you've done yourself a favor and hired a designer/architect.

9/16/2011 10:31:36 PM

5800 sf is fucking retarded.

my advice would be to not overbuild. I had a house that was way too big, there were rooms I literally did not go into for months, which was fucking stupid. There will be many many things that you think you are "supposed to have" as a successful professional that are really just a waste of money and space, try to fight that and use the money elsewhere. Always value location over the actual house.

[Edited on September 16, 2011 at 10:52 PM. Reason : d]

9/16/2011 10:46:08 PM

location is already set...had our second meeting with the builder today, went well. I'll post a pic of the 1st floor when I get it for your comments.

9/17/2011 3:02:52 PM

6.5 acres? awesome!

what are you going to do with your land?

9/17/2011 5:09:18 PM

Quote :

"^^What was the most common "splurge" that you would see, that seemed completely unnecessary, or a waste of money? And alternatively, what is the one thing you would say to definitely spend the extra money? And why is it so hard to find a floor plan with big bedrooms, and not just the master! It seems the third bedroom is always relegated to 10 x 12, etc."

As far as unnecessary splurges, one would be concrete stamping and sealing. While it may look good, lots of times it gets really slick when wet and I've seen/heard of a bunch of people slipping on them. Some of our clients got to the point where they wouldn't even walk on the sidewalk leading up to the front door if they had it done as they had gotten hurt from one of the falls..

Screened in porches can also be an issue if you have grasshoppers in the area. They'll eat right through the screen essentially making it useless.

For areas that you should spend extra money, I can name several but the few I'm thinking of right now is windows, roofing, and insulation. Nobody ever pays attention to windows (except maybe what type of frame/grill is in the window) so a bunch of builders put the cheapest window they can find in their houses and no one notices. Never underestimate the headaches you'll get from windows that don't operate right.

For roofing, I guess it depends on how long you want to stay in your house. If you plan to live most of your life there, then you're going to have to replace it at somepoint so no biggie. But since a lot of people will move after living there 10-12 years or so, putting in a 20 year roof might be a headache when you go to move. In high-wind prone areas (and NC can be one due to hurricanes) shingles are known to last only 2/3-3/4 of the time they're supposed to (i.e. 12-15yrs for a 20yr shingle). Since you can pretty much guarantee to have an inspection done by the potential buyer, the inspector will probably reccomend the roof to be fixed or replaced if your passed the 10-12 yr mark.

For insulation, I'm mainly refering to sound-proofing insulation around the master and potentially any bathrooms. The master for obvious reasons and the bathrooms due to people taking showers. Sometimes if one of you has to wake up earlier to get ready for work, the noise of the shower can be an issue to the sleeping person.

As far as small bedrooms, I think its because all the womenz want huge kitchens, closets, and bathrooms so they take it from the space that could be used for bedrooms

Seriously, try to sell a house that has a small kitchen, closets and bathrooms. As long as they're big, the bedrooms can be just big enough the fit the bed in and they'll sell all day long

9/17/2011 8:34:28 PM

What is he charging per foot and where are you located? ive found that custom builders are all over the place on pricing right now.

9/17/2011 10:19:27 PM

As someone already mentioned, take a lot of time when you are deciding where to place phone jacks, cable outlets, light switches, etc... We have already found a few places where we wish we had an electric outlet.

I would suggest checking on your home at least 3-4 times a week (if not more) while it is being built. There were all kinds of "wtf" moments that we (my wife and I ) had when we went and checked on it through various stages.
Sometimes, the people that the builder contracts to do the work aren't exactly on the same page with the builder. We came in one day and noticed our dining room paint color looked a lot more "purple" than the one we picked out. Come to find out, they had our paint color mixed up with the one in the house next door....so they had to repaint the dining room.

There were also minor things here and there that we caught while the house was being built. So just be dilligent about it.

Also, I'm sure you'll get some type of warranty with your builder (mine was 1 year), but get as much stuff taken care of BEFORE you close. My builder was awfully hard to get in touch with after we closed. Lots of folks warned me that's how a lot of builders are.

9/17/2011 10:23:54 PM

Don't know how much is will cost per sqaure foot yet (depends on upgrades). We will be betweem 3200-3800 sq ft depending on adding a MIL suite

9/18/2011 10:05:23 AM

Quote :

"Screened in porches can also be an issue if you have grasshoppers in the area. They'll eat right through the screen essentially making it useless."

do they eat through metal screen too, or just the crappy/cheap looking plastic stuff?

+1 for hiring an architect

9/18/2011 10:50:23 AM

Reason I ask is that a lot of builders will take what you paid for the lot minus the appraised value of homes in the area and make the delta their price to build.

Example: A developer in my neighborhood is selling a 1500 sqft presale custom for a "package price" of $315k (that price is based on what other homes have sold for in the neighborhood). I am building a 2000 sqft home for $229k for a lady. She has $90k in the lot so her total package is $319k. She is getting a bigger lot, 2 car garage, much nicer finishes/trim package for $50/sqft cheaper because she acquired the land on her own. He goes in the the home with 0 equity while she goes in with $50k+.

I would just make sure the builder isn't raising his price per sqft to build just based on what homes in your area are appraising for. It also varies greatly per area so all this may be a moot point.

If you were to buy a "spec home" then you should be prepared to pay what the other homes in the neighborhood are going for.

also +1 for a good architect/designer. designers are typically cheaper and for a single family home they are more than sufficient.

[Edited on September 18, 2011 at 3:03 PM. Reason : ........]

9/18/2011 3:01:58 PM

Do a custom build if at all possible. You'll end up wanting to renovate sooner than necessary when you have only a few optins and configurations.

Run a conduit from the crawl space to the attic so that you can easily run wires. This will page huge dividends.

Learn from my mistake, and don't build or buy a house on a big hill. It will really hurt resale later.

Overspend in your bathroom and kitchen.

9/18/2011 5:15:28 PM

Quote :

"And why is it so hard to find a floor plan with big bedrooms, and not just the master! It seems the third bedroom is always relegated to 10 x 12, etc"

Quote :

"As far as small bedrooms, I think its because all the womenz want huge kitchens, closets, and bathrooms so they take it from the space that could be used for bedrooms"

I'm with wolfpack0122. I want the space in the common areas. Our master is too big. There is wasted space everywhere. Our kids only sleep in their bedrooms. A room only needs to be big enough for the bed and the dresser.

I would LOVE for our laundry to be connected to our master closet. I have yet to figure out why the laundry is always off the kitchen. Why do the dirty clothes need to make a journey all the way across the house and the clean ones need to be carried back? It seems to be an efficiency loss.

Make sure your garage is big enough for YOUR cars. We did not "test fit" our vehicles in our two car garage prior to purchasing and they will not fit. I drive an F150 and the wife's vehicle is an Edge. Our garage is 20x20 which is just big enough for two midsize sedans or one car any bigger than that if there is anything other than the cars in there. It is not a deal killer, but my truck stays in the driveway in front of the garage.

Also, pay attention to the orientation of the house/lot. The front of our house and driveway is the north face. Ice, snow, etc. does not melt as well and can re-ice in the winter. This makes our front steps precarious after winter events. Also, note which rooms will be bright in early morning and late afternoon. Our master bedroom gets noticeably warmer in the summer afternoons because of the solar gain due to the afternoon sun (also due to poor circulation of A/C). None of our bedrooms are on the east face for morning sun (which in my book is a good thing). Kids are extremely sensitive to waking up at dawn if their window gets bright.

Basements: I love a basement. The increased cost for a basement is not that much greater than the already expensive foundation. Due to the nature of a basement, the cost for conditioning the space is much less than above grade square footage.

9/19/2011 10:26:15 AM

This thread should be moved to the Lounge to get more traffic. It is a good read.

My wife and I may be building a home soon, but I am very wary of building new as I have heard all of the horror stories plus all of the extra costs that aren't usually included in new homes like blinds, grass and landscaping, sprinkler system/well, fence, etc.




[Edited on September 19, 2011 at 10:50 AM. Reason : 678]

9/19/2011 10:50:16 AM

Quote :

"And why is it so hard to find a floor plan with big bedrooms, and not just the master! It seems the third bedroom is always relegated to 10 x 12, etc"

Eugh, I hated that as well. Whenever I looked at bigger floor plans for new homes they would always squeeze in an extra 4th/5th bedroom, an office, or just some stupid waste of space.

There were a few upgrades I skimped out on due to cost but in hindsight spending an extra few thousand in upgrades would have upped the mortgage by just a few dollars a month, so I probably should have just gone ahead and gotten them. I'm also really happy I picked the largest lot available. It's raised and I have no drainage issues, whereas rainwater seems to collect in my neighbors driveway right where it meets the garage door. I never really cared about having a garage but my realtor convinced me to get one for resale purposes and I'm really glad I did. It's so nice never having to worry about scraping off my car windows in the winter and the extra storage space is a huge plus. I'd also do any wiring for speakers and stuff before the drywall goes up.

9/19/2011 10:51:47 AM

^ That extra 4th/5th bedroom is a big deal to people with 2+ kids. Some builders do the loft things as a space filler, but I'd rather have a conventional bedroom in stead of a loft.



[Edited on September 19, 2011 at 11:01 AM. Reason : ssd]

9/19/2011 11:00:17 AM

I love my 300 sqr foot loft, although the builder did have the option to make another bedroom/mother in law suite which I think is a way better idea than forcing you to have a 4th bedroom. I see your point about the 4th/5th bedroom, but I probably had to look through 100 floor plans to find a house around 2000 sqr feet and only three bedrooms. I really wanted a pool table so that requirement was set in stone.

9/19/2011 11:05:03 AM

We didn't build our house but I think I can still chime in. Our house is over 2400ft² and we have 4 bedrooms (master + 3) and a bonus room over the garage that was billed as a 5th bedroom. I kind of like having the extra rooms as opposed to slightly bigger bedrooms to be honest. I almost wish our master was smaller. I'd easily take some space from the master and spread it out into one of the living areas or something.

We have enough space to turn one bedroom into an exercise room, the bonus room into more workout/hangout space + music room, and still have two guest bedrooms to go along with our master currently. It is nice to know that if/when we have a kid we won't have to give up an exercise room or a music room or be left with 0 guest bedrooms to make room for the kid.

Being an engineer who also loves architecture and just home and interior design in general, I would love to build a house someday. I am just torn on whether we really need to use new land to build our own house versus simply buying an existing house and making it into what we want (which is what we are doing to our current home). We'll see

[Edited on September 19, 2011 at 12:46 PM. Reason : ]

9/19/2011 12:46:13 PM

Quote :

"This thread should be moved to the Lounge to get more traffic. It is a good read. My wife and I may be building a home soon, but I am very wary of building new as I have heard all of the horror stories plus all of the extra costs that aren't usually included in new homes like blinds, grass and landscaping, sprinkler system/well, fence, etc. "

At least talk to me if you are in the area. I've built two this year and both owners have been very pleased. One was lump sum and one was cost plus contract. Both worked out well for the owner and myself. If you aren't in the area I would be willing to talk with you guys and help you get through the contract portion. That is where most people that build their own homes miss a bunch of things. A good contract will eliminate any issues you may have.

Also, if a builder is willing to do a cost plus contract and willing to have monthly billing meetings and give you a good guideline on approximate cost for construction then that is the best way IMO to do undertake the process.

9/19/2011 1:46:40 PM

FYI, under NC law, a homeowner can act as their own General Contractor; no license is required (as long as they live in the home a prescribed amount of time).

I, too, condone the move to the lounge.

9/19/2011 3:29:43 PM

^true. I think most require the home to be primary residence for a year.

But if you aren't in the business this could really turn in to a headache. I did this on my first home but I worked for a commercial contractor and managed multiple subs on multiple projects at the time. Even the cash flow aspect is hard to handle if it's something you don't do every day. Not saying it can't be done but not the easiest especially with subs/suppliers wanting money right now.

9/19/2011 4:08:22 PM

^I didn't say it would be easy...just legal.

The biggest benefit would be saving the 15-20% that you would pay the GC to manage the work. Mostly what you are paying for is his contact network (he knows the subs who do good work).

9/20/2011 10:36:56 AM

That's a pretty bold statement.

- how many homeowners that aren't builders are getting approved for construction loans right now?
- no matter how accurate you are on take offs it is inevitable that a sub will need additional materials during the work day.
- no matter how deep in detail you go with these subs there are questions that have to be answered during the day to keep them moving.
- have you pulled permits for anything in any jurisdiction and it been easy? Try going in as a homeowner having a full time job.
- how many inspectors do you know that enjoy walking around a job site unaccompanied?
- opening lines of credit (big enough) at material suppliers is not easy for homeowners.
- having enough cash flow to pay subs/suppliers before bank inspection/draw takes place is tough.

Selections for a custom home alone are enough of a distraction from a full time job.

[Edited on September 20, 2011 at 12:02 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on September 20, 2011 at 12:06 PM. Reason : ..]

9/20/2011 11:54:08 AM

dude...you're preaching to the choir.

It is never easy, but not insurmountable. 5/7 of those items are EASILY handled by anyone with an ounce of project management skill. The issues are 99% communication and dealing with people. The other 2 are finance/cash flow, while critical, can be overcome with a little planning.

I realize you are in residential construction and you are trying to discourage the DiYers to protect your market, but geez, lighten up, Francis.

Construction Cash Flow tips:
- Never ship material on the last day of the billing cycle if you can avoid it. The invoice will come due faster. Always ship on the first of the billing cycle if possible. (particularly if your draws are tied to % completion). Check to see if your bank will pay for stored materials.
- Include payment terms in the contract you write your subs (i.e. I will pay you on the 25th because I am able to make my draws on the 24th, etc.)
- Always write your subcontracts. Never sign the contracts your sub provides. Make sure each item is on your terms, especially schedule and cash flow.

[Edited on September 20, 2011 at 12:55 PM. Reason : .]

9/20/2011 12:53:56 PM

Quote :

" Mostly what you are paying for is his contact network (he knows the subs who do good work)."

This is the statement I was arguing bud.

Also, how do you plan/manage a bank giving you a construction loan with no experience in building?

I will gladly refer any of my subs to anyone for free.

Back to original topic. If you want to take on the task yourself and things go wrong then be prepared to pay +20% for someone to come clean it up.

[Edited on September 20, 2011 at 3:27 PM. Reason : .]

9/20/2011 3:24:24 PM

I did structural engineering for residential construction for a few years. Every single homeowner who acted as their own GC was a complete disaster. Every. One.

9/20/2011 9:44:18 PM

moved for more exposure

9/22/2011 5:26:05 PM

Quote :

"I just finished up my home in November....5800 sq ft"

that's like 4 time the size of my house. what kind of ME are you?

9/22/2011 5:55:40 PM

didn't really go into that field. Got into Six Sigma and Lean working in a pharmaceutical manufacturing plant. So far its been pretty good to me.

9/22/2011 6:29:39 PM

look into a basf super home....i install spray foam insulation(demelec) and we just finished a house in wnc that is approx 3800 sq ft and power bill was absurd ($38) a month...its a whole system panelized home and cheaper, pm me for more info

9/22/2011 6:47:28 PM

install a water softener...i don't suppose it really matters if you're building a home or not, but spend the extra $500 (or less, just depends on what your needs are)...even if your water isn't especially hard, it makes a huge difference

9/23/2011 8:25:08 AM

One piece of advice: Do not use a f#cking builder. If you're going to build your own home, hire a damn architect. They will be able to evaluate your needs and look at your sketched floorplans to make suggestions. Builders don't know shit about flow through a home, or how people will actually live in one. they know about maximizing square footage and selling points.

When I did finish carpentry, we worked with a GC several times, always with an architect. He was also a "builder", and those properties were train wrecks in comparison. The predone floorlans that builders use are rarely done with liveability as the primary goal.

9/23/2011 11:01:03 AM

heres the news coverage of the home we just did

http://www.wlos.com/shared/newsroom/features/special-reports/videos/wlos_vid_271.shtml

9/24/2011 5:01:06 PM

^^ maybe I missed somethingbut did he say that the builder was designing his home???

9/24/2011 5:26:18 PM

I think what he meant to say was to use an architect for the design.

A GC will basically put the design into action. Agree, though, that most floorplans you see in books don't always lead towards efficiency of square footage.

9/24/2011 6:41:16 PM

Maybe he meant to post in the "Lessons Learned from designing your own home."

When I build a custom home I send the homeowners to a designer to design their home. I attend to provide insight on feasibility and such. that then goes to the structural engineer and then to real life.

[Edited on September 24, 2011 at 9:42 PM. Reason : .]

9/24/2011 9:39:48 PM

Any experience with urethane or epoxy tile grout?

I want to eventually put tile in a house with a crawlspace/basement and the flexibility and no sealing makes it seem like the best option.

9/24/2011 11:57:43 PM

when sitting down with the builders for the contract, READ EVERY FUCKING LINE

me and my dad took 4.5 hours to get through the 30 page thing, we even crossed out
things we didnt like (cost of materials increase, cost of labor increase, etc, cause you
know they would say it did)

every single time the guy was like "we cant do that"

and we are like "maybe your competitor can"

in a better economy, they would have kicked us out im sure

also, if you know anyone who does any of the subcontractor work, get them to do it,
and pay them yourself, the builder has a mark up, and gets pissed when he does not get
it fair and square

so yeah, they prolly still think im an asshole 3 years later, but i saved money

(PS i didnt read the thread, so if you posted this already, deal with it)

9/25/2011 11:29:03 AM

Centralize as much of your wiring as you can - cable, telephone, and Ethernet. If you're not going to get an alarm system right away and you think you may in the future, pre-wiring is pretty cheap.

9/25/2011 1:14:05 PM

firstly, where are the GC's making 15-20%?

secondly, who has a 30 page contract?

thirdly, if you think you can build a house on time and in budget the same way a professional can, you are most likely kidding yourself. i would guess one in ten being successful at this.

fourthly, absolutely hire/consult with a design professional (not a builder) if you are going custom.

[Edited on September 25, 2011 at 2:43 PM. Reason : .]

[Edited on September 25, 2011 at 2:44 PM. Reason : ..]

9/25/2011 2:42:48 PM

Quote :

" if you know anyone who does any of the subcontractor work, get them to do it, and pay them yourself, the builder has a mark up, and gets pissed when he does not get it fair and square"

if you do this be prepared to have them warranty that portion of the work and when/if something goes wrong don't expect the GC to come out and oversee what they are doing to fix it. Not a lot of GCs will do this. Especially if they don't know them or know of them.

I would say hire them to do their job with their people or do it yourself...

9/25/2011 3:42:43 PM

^ yep. Know that the GC won't supervise them or warranty their work. And if they fail inspection, you're the one thats going to be calling them and forcing them to pay the reinspection fee and come back out and fix it.

And yeah, the builder will get a bit upset if you want to use your own sub since thats profit out of his pocket and creates more headaches for him. That markup is because the builder knows who the quality subs are (assuming you're working with a reputable builder), knows how to schedule them and work with them so stuff is done on time and in budget.Though we would work with people if their brother was a plumber or something, but every time we did it would slow the process down. If someone wanted to use someone else for each trade, we would tell them to fuck off. We always made sure we had the construction loan in our (the business') name and there were a few times that customers pissed us off so bad we built it as we wanted and sold it as a spec instead.

Not saying you shouldn't try and get what you want, and in this economy you might be able to get more than you would have a few years ago, but that doesn't mean you're allowed to be a total dick about every aspect either

9/25/2011 4:09:19 PM

I will also say don't be a dick and hire your own contractors to avoid paying the GCs mark up. I had people I wanted to do certain things but I always let my GC know what I paid them so he could get his percentage at the end of the build. He was the one that supervised them working last summer in the 100 degree weather while I was sitting in my comfy desk job at work.

Also, if you take care of your GC then your GC will take care of you. If your going to be a dick to your GC then don't expect any favors down the road.

9/25/2011 5:06:54 PM

i was a dick, it saved me a lot of money, I have not had any problems with any of the work my subs did

the only problems were with work their subs did

i really dont plan on calling the GC at all once the warranty is out

i dont really care if they are pissed they didnt get to pick my pocket

9/25/2011 5:11:09 PM