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Smath74
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"^^ She didn't turn Dexter into a serial killer, he would have been one anyway. She just helped Harry develop the code so he wouldn't get caught. "

she definitely had a huge part to play, and they are heavily hinting that he wouldn't have been and she misdiagnosed him as a psychopath.

7/17/2013 10:52:56 PM

BridgetSPK
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Yeah, like how he is actually feeling bad about Deb.

7/17/2013 10:56:29 PM

omicron101
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I still think Dexter would've ended up a serial killer anyway. He was locked in a container in a pool of his mother's blood for three days. And remember, so was his brother who also turned out to be a serial killer without any guidance from Dr. Vogel.

Also, Harry noticed the signs Dexter was leaning that way as a child before he met with Dr. Vogel. I'm pretty sure Dex had also already started killing neighbor's dogs and other animals before Harry finally went into therapy. I don't doubt that Vogel had a role in developing what kind of serial killer he became, but I think Dexter was going to be a serial killer despite Vogel's unknown guidance as to how he would live and get away with it.

7/17/2013 11:02:39 PM

Smath74
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or maybe he was destined to be a vet and was curious about how the animals work, (or whatever) and harry mis-characterized it and with the help of the good doctor, typecast him into the psychopath serial killer role and inadvertently created the dark passenger.

7/17/2013 11:14:15 PM

duro982
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"She didn't turn Dexter into a serial killer, he would have been one anyway. She just helped Harry develop the code so he wouldn't get caught. "


That's sort of the whole premise they've being playing with off and on for a few seasons now. Does he kill because he has to or because he wants to? Does he actually enjoy it? That started a few seasons back. Then there was the whole "harry made me who I am" thing that he went through. Then he came back around to accept it.

And now there's this woman how really guided harry based on her diagnoses. And she is the "psychopath whisperer" but has been caught off guard a little by Dexter's reaction to certain things. Reactions that don't jive with being a psychopath based on her very long, prestigious career. But she just explains it away by finding a way to twist it into Dexter being selfish.


It's an interesting thread of the show. One that they've very clearly pulled on in the past. So it's not crazy at all for them to keep going.

I certainly don't buy the "he was in the container when his mom was murdered, so he absolutely was going to be a serial killer no matter what" thought. I know we're talking about a fictional tv show, but c'mon.. that's pretty absurd.

7/17/2013 11:40:24 PM

TreeTwista10
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It'd be interesting if they plopped Dexter in the middle of the The Walking Dead universe

7/17/2013 11:50:53 PM

Smath74
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"I certainly don't buy the "he was in the container when his mom was murdered, so he absolutely was going to be a serial killer no matter what" thought. I know we're talking about a fictional tv show, but c'mon.. that's pretty absurd."

7/19/2013 1:05:34 PM

omicron101
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So the fact that his brother who also witnessed their mother being dismembered by a chainsaw in front of them becoming a serial killer was what, a coincidence? I'm pretty sure that's how their lack of empathy towards others began, which directly led them down the psychopath/serial killer road. Trauma like that at a very young age can affect someone's emotional growth. And don't forget, Dex and Brian both liked to dismember their victims...

Also, Dex wanting to be a vet? haha please. He specifically told Harry he killed the neighbor's dog because it wouldn't stop barking at night. Worst vet ever.

7/19/2013 2:02:52 PM

BigMan157
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i think they're trying to show that dexter is something altogether different

7/19/2013 2:11:37 PM

omicron101
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I think he's evolved, especially after meeting Rita and the kids. He's started to show hints of emotion and empathy that confuses him at time. But initially that dark passenger joined him in that container.

7/19/2013 2:20:36 PM

BigMan157
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it'd be interesting if the big bad is one of the doc's old patients that she removed that portion of the brain from

the perfect psychopath that she thinks dexter is vs. the perfect psychopath she surgically created

prob wrong though

7/19/2013 2:28:55 PM

duro982
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"So the fact that his brother who also witnessed their mother being dismembered by a chainsaw in front of them becoming a serial killer was what, a coincidence?"


Nobody has/is suggesting that it didn't impact his development. But you did suggest that he was going to be a serial killer no matter what because of that experience. You had a very "absolute" approach to it. And that's a little absurd to me. There's no way what so ever that someone could see their mother brutally murdered and NOT become a serial killer?

And like I said, it's especially silly considering they have been playing with that idea for several seasons now. Did he ever have choice? What if Harry hadn't taught him to be a serial killer? Etc. And now we're seeing that Harry did what he did all because of Vogel's diagnoses of Dexter being a psychopath. What if she was wrong? Would she have treated him the same? Maybe she's sick and twisted and has been using therapy to create serial killers all this time, and Dexter was "perfect" because she got to him at such a young age. What if Vogel said "it's going to be an uphill battle, but I think we can help him not go down that path." And focused Harry's efforts on helping Dexter not be a serial killer instead of being a "perfect" serial killer?

Your take on it just seems very narrow (again, no offense) given the possibilities and what's already been/being explored on the show.

And keep in mind that Brian was several years older than Dexter. He was much more cognizant of what was taking place when it happened. So I'm sure it would impact him differently.

But, it's a show... so who the hell knows what fictional explanation they may come up with or not.

[Edited on July 19, 2013 at 4:40 PM. Reason : .]

7/19/2013 4:36:43 PM

omicron101
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No offense taken, I was just trying to be clear as to why I think he ultimately became a serial killer. The way I've seen it, what Dexter experienced caused him to become more detached emotionally and unable to feel empathy towards others. That led to his mutilation of animals at an early age, which, I believe would have eventually progressed to human beings as he got older. It may be an opinion I've formed from watching too many Investigation Discovery Channel shows where serial killers or psychopaths sometimes began mutilating animals at a young age before moving on to humans.

To me it seemed Harry also thought Dexter would become a serial killer based on his experience as a police officer and he saw only two options: have Dexter committed or teach him not to get caught. He also thought he was going to be a killer, but perhaps that's where the problem began.

But you're right, in the past seasons and in this one it appears the show has asked the question as to how much of a role Harry (and now Dr. Vogel) had in shaping him into becoming the killer he is. It will be interesting to see how they decide to resolve that issue or if they leave it open to the viewer.

I started reading the books over the 4th of July weekend and it's interesting to see how they coincide and differ from the show (especially the ending of the first book). I've only read the first two but have already picked up the remaining four. The seventh book comes out in September. One thing I will point out is that in the books, Cody is showing the same signs Dexter did as a kid. He was abused at a young age by his father, he killed his neighbor's dog and stabbed a fish he caught with Dexter and commented on how fun and cool it was to watch the blood run out of it.

7/19/2013 4:53:56 PM

duro982
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I've heard the books are pretty good. And that they differ a fair amount to make them worth reading even if you've seen the show. I've heard they're darker in tone, is that right? Dexter (the show) can be a little odd to describe to someone who's never seen it. The subject matter is obviously dark, but the show itself isn't usually as dark as the subject matter would suggest.

7/19/2013 5:10:27 PM

puck_it
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It does differ significantly. Some general themes are used, but that's about it. First book uses a killer from the show (well, other way around)... Other than that....

7/19/2013 5:35:47 PM

SchndlrsFist
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^^The are very different in tone after the first book, Darkly Dreaming Dexter. The books are very internal to Dexter and are told from his perspective. The main difference is that Dexter's "Dark Passenger" is a manafest entity in the books where it is just a metaphor in the tv series. IMO the first two books are good and the latest one, Double Dexter, is also good. Do yourself a favor and skip Dexter is Delicious, it sucks.

7/20/2013 2:36:30 PM

TreeTwista10
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body has burglar alarms at their homes in Miami

7/21/2013 11:46:58 PM

puck_it
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That was an interesting episode... I figured something would happen after the revelation, but not particularly THAT.

7/22/2013 12:17:18 AM

TreeTwista10
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^^*nobody has...

^yeah it was pretty crazy!

[Edited on July 22, 2013 at 12:49 AM. Reason : .]

7/22/2013 12:49:28 AM

Bweez
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i thought she was going to off herself :0

was cringing with anticipation after her Quinncounter

7/22/2013 1:34:41 AM

ncsuallday
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I thought the ending was pretty corny. Also, why did Dexter say shit to the guy and not just inject his ass?

Maybe I'm way off, but I think if they weren't going for a happy ending, why would they introduce another love interest? The audience certainly won't get close enough to her character to have any kind of effect with her emotional response if Dexter does get caught/killed. It seems like they're going to have Dexter and her sail off into the sunset in the end and Dexter realizing he was made into a killer, and he doesn't have to be one.

I could, however, see Deb dying and some final scene at the cemetery (perhaps years later) where Dexter is explaining to Harrison what a wonderful person she was and how she "saved his life".

7/22/2013 1:41:48 PM

WAR
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I cringed when they introduced that neighbor and Jamie said that Dexter caught her eye or whatever. What made Dexter great was that he was using Rita as a cover. He knew that the profile of a serial killer is being a loner, and with a girlfriend/wife he was less likely to be caught.

Aside from him eventually falling in love with Rita, which I was fine with as it was clearly an important part of what made season 4 so so good, why the hell does he need a new love interest every season? He should be focusing on the three things in his life he cares about. Deb, Harrison and killing. We don't need another ridiculous love story!

7/22/2013 2:10:33 PM

omicron101
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I don't think the love interest thing will amount to much, at least I hope not as others have already stated and explained. Plus, Hannah is still supposed to come back into the picture at some point right? I'm pretty sure I saw her in previews or something.

I also thought Deb may off herself after her exchange with Quinn at the end. The part at the very end was unexpected, but well done. This season sorta feels like "Dexter and Deb go to therapy," but at least you can see it building to something.

7/22/2013 6:57:42 PM

TreeTwista10
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Maybe the killer will kill the neighbor chick or something

7/22/2013 9:17:02 PM

duro982
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I agree, introducing a new character at this point seems silly unless she's a major factor. We already have vogel as a new character... but at least she's very important to the show, plus a new killer. And it's not like Dexter has time to date her. He's all sorts of caught up with Vogel, brain surgeon, and Deb.

What I fear will happen, like many other seasons, Vogel will prove to be nothing more than a plot device that enabled Deb to see the dvd. Dexter will kill the brain surgeon and be done with Vogel within in a couple of more episodes. And a new story for the rest of the season will be introduced which will involve probably involve the neighbor since they introduced her.

Perhaps the neighbor does get involved with Dexter somehow. But he's so distracted with the whole Deb trying to kill him thing and the turmoil he's experiencing that he makes mistakes around her?

But I'm still betting that Sean Patrick Flannery will be involved in a bigger way. Perhaps he starts keep tabs on Deb (he is a PI after all) and finds out about Dexter.


^ I could see that. Introduce her just so we know who she is, the killer sees her with Dexter once or twice, and then kills her for it.

[Edited on July 22, 2013 at 10:50 PM. Reason : ^]

7/22/2013 10:50:00 PM

ncsuallday
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I wonder if the neighbor is somehow tied to Hannah, I had forgotten about here. But hey, while we're at it maybe Julia Styles will come back too!

How many episodes are left? It doesn't feel on pace to be a mind blowing conclusion at this point. I agree, the Vogel and brain scooper guy are going to get wiped out soon. What a boring serial killer in the first place.

Vogel will tell Dexter where to find one last Earth shattering DVD with her last dying breath, I bet.

[Edited on July 23, 2013 at 11:10 AM. Reason : DVD]

7/23/2013 11:09:56 AM

gunzz
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Charlotte Rampling was hoooooooooot back in the day

http://www.uproxx.com/tv/2013/07/the-neuroscientist-in-the-final-season-of-dexter-was-a-total-hottie-back-in-the-day/

7/23/2013 7:18:18 PM

TreeTwista10
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she definitely "fit Harry's code"

7/23/2013 7:28:30 PM

puck_it
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I'm also wondering if debs new boss is going to figure dexter out. He keeps popping up, and is taking an interest in deb, outside of his professional relationship.

7/24/2013 10:54:13 PM

ncsuallday
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I just don't see Dexter getting caught, it would just be anticlimactic. Ok he gets caught, then do they show a trial? The execution? The sad/shocked reactions of everyone in his life after? Boring.

I could see Dexter dying maybe but not at the hands of another serial killer, especially a lame ass like this guy. Can't really see Deb going through with it either now that she could have left him for dead in the car but saved him. If Dexter dies, it will have to be some sort of great self-sacrifice for somebody he loves, or the greater good, or whatever. Then the audience will have their closure, but it will also be cliche.

I still firmly believe that he will turn it around and not kill anymore. I think he somehow gets away with it and sails away into the sunset. How they get to that point will be interesting.

7/25/2013 2:28:49 PM

Smath74
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well of course my year-long free showtime service expired. I very rarely watched it except for Dexter so there was no use in keeping it. is dexter on hulu or any of those services or do I have to find someone with showtime and watch with them?

7/25/2013 4:39:15 PM

duro982
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^ they're usually posted here fairly quickly: http://stream-tv.me/watch-dexter-online/

7/25/2013 6:04:05 PM

BIGcementpon
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What the hell kind of bedpost was that?

7/28/2013 10:04:44 PM

BigMan157
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curtain rod

7/28/2013 10:21:17 PM

BIGcementpon
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Ok. Makes sense.

7/28/2013 11:22:30 PM

TreeTwista10
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Anybody else kinda think he was gonna off Vogel at the end?

7/29/2013 1:04:27 AM

skywalkr
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I for one, loved the curtain rod kill. Also looks like this season will definitely pick up, was a bit concerned with the lame killer if they were going to make that the main plot.

7/29/2013 10:35:43 AM

ncsuallday
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well Deb came around pretty quickly. Also, the chief of police is going to aid in the Dexter cover up and fulfill my prophecy of him walking away.

I thought it was interesting Dexter said on the boat that he wanted "to be with family" so I guess he went from wanting Vogel out of his life to seeing her as a mother figure?

The neighbor chick is pretty down, I like her so far.

Any thoughts on what Masuka's (sp?) daughter is up to, besides the obvious money grubbing implications?

[Edited on July 29, 2013 at 12:03 PM. Reason : .]

7/29/2013 12:01:58 PM

TreeTwista10
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Not sure about what Masuka's daughter is up to, but what movie do I recognize her from?

7/29/2013 1:44:16 PM

Bweez
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friday night lights

7/29/2013 2:26:52 PM

TreeTwista10
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ah, yeah thats right

7/29/2013 2:51:10 PM

WAR
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Calling it now... Cassie is Rudy's father's brother's nephew's cousin's former roommate.

7/29/2013 2:53:27 PM

duro982
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She's gotta be something to be introducing her so late in the series with it wrapping up.



Is everyone satisfied that Yates was actually the brain surgeon killer? Cutting the pieces of brain out wasn't his M.O. at all as a killer. Granted, it could have just done it to mess with Vogel. And it obviously fit with the fact that he had brain surgery. But I can't think of anytime during the show where he confirmed it was him.

Actually, he said something like "you should have just left me alone" which suggests that he thought she/Dexter messed with him first. On the other hand, he did say something like "so she found a hero" when he found Dexter in his house and heard him on the phone with Vogel. Which would suggest that she needed saving and he was aware of as much.

I don't know, it's just odd to me that he didn't acknowledge it. But maybe I missed a line or two in which he did. Or maybe I'm reading too much into it not being force fed.

[Edited on July 29, 2013 at 6:54 PM. Reason : .]

7/29/2013 6:52:55 PM

puck_it
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It can't be him.... He didn't know who dexter was, but sent his and her jars of brain at one point. Why would he be so surprised by dexter protecting Vogel? (Or major plot hole)

8/1/2013 11:49:05 PM

duro982
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Good, I thought I may be the only person thinking that way.

I suspect that a new body/piece of brain will turn up in the next episode or two. If it turns out that it was Yates, I think it's pretty sloppy.

[Edited on August 2, 2013 at 12:00 AM. Reason : s]

8/1/2013 11:59:44 PM

Bweez
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it's obviously doaks

8/2/2013 1:23:34 AM

YOMAMA
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It's Vogel

8/2/2013 9:59:59 AM

BigMan157
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it's dexter's father, who previously faked his death

8/2/2013 10:09:30 AM

puck_it
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^^makes me wonder if it really is her. Hey, let's make it the easy thing to think, so you look else where, provide someone that fits the bill, you think its over and Vogel is back as the suspect.

Maybe shes getting these brain cores to lure dexter to kill her former patients... Nope, not the cannibal, but he deserves to die soooooo

8/2/2013 2:42:33 PM

Bweez
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it's totally unfair to the viewer if it's vogel.

she received a text message saying "look on your porch" or whatever [for the brain bits], among other similar things.

that would be a gaping plot hole.

[Edited on August 2, 2013 at 5:12 PM. Reason : .]

8/2/2013 5:12:34 PM

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