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 Message Boards » » The Generic Mass Shooting Thread Page 1 ... 16 17 18 19 [20] 21, Prev Next  
rjrumfel
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I'm playing devil's advocate here, because for me personally, I don't believe teachers should have guns. Any normal person is going to choke when faced with some sort of active shooter situation. We'd like to think we're all Jason Bourne's when shit goes down, but we're not. Adrenaline will kick in, and even if we don't fumble getting the gun out of the drawer, we would end up shooting the wrong person.

But why is it impossible for you to recognize that someone might believe that a teacher's personal world views be integrated into lesson plans, either purposefully or just anecdotally, and still be able to wield a weapon? The two aren't mutually exclusive.

Again, not a proponent of arming teachers here, it's just that you keep discounting the right and generalizing them all as idiots. And unless the other side puts up a stellar candidate in '24, or unless things turn around sharply economically, you'll be having to deal with their shit in the news for another four years.

5/26/2022 8:59:20 AM

rwoody
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Wooof

5/26/2022 9:11:41 AM

dmspack
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Quote :
" But why is it impossible for you to recognize that someone might believe that a teacher's personal world views be integrated into lesson plans, either purposefully or just anecdotally, and still be able to wield a weapon? The two aren't mutually exclusive."


It’s not that anybody thinks it’s impossible that a teacher might allow their own political/personal beliefs into their lesson plans. It’s the dichotomy of “I don’t even trust the teacher to not turn my kid gay but I do trust that same teacher to be armed at all times and to responsibly handle a firearm and to take down a gunman”.

But yes. Arming teachers is a completely horrific idea.

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 9:14 AM. Reason : W]

5/26/2022 9:14:22 AM

fatcatt316
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Good God, think back to some of the teachers y'all had in elementary and middle school.

Some of them might not have been the sharpest crayons in the box. Some of them might've had some anger issues. Some of them might've just dozed off or not paid attention during class.

Now imagine giving them a gun in the classroom. How many would do something dumb like shoot a bullet through the ceiling to make a point or shut some kids up? How many kids would somehow end up with their hands on the gun and (accidentally or not) shoot some other kid?

I feel like it'd be way worse than the current amount of school shootings, and that's a pretty low bar.

5/26/2022 9:36:18 AM

dmspack
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Quote :
" I feel like it'd be way worse than the current amount of school shootings, and that's a pretty low bar."


More guns in schools would definitely lead to more school shootings, not less.


Quote :
" it's just that you keep discounting the right and generalizing them all as idiots."


The right keeps saying that teachers are incapable of having nuanced discussion on race and that teachers will groom students and turn them gay. But also that teachers should be armed. You do see the insanity of those two things side by side, right?

5/26/2022 9:41:37 AM

EMCE
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-We had a band teacher I'm 6th grade that got pissed, and threw a metal chair at a kid.
-In high school, one of our gym teachers got pissed at a kid (rightfully so) and chucked a basketball at the kid's head when he was running away.
-Our football coach was fired after purposefully hitting a student with his car.




lol, I can only imagine what might happen had these guys been armed.

5/26/2022 9:44:17 AM

rjrumfel
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It would only be a matter of time before a gun was used to "diffuse" a fight, and a student ends up shot.

And there shouldn't be a dichotomy there. You can trust a gay man to be a crack shot while simultaneously indoctrinating your child on how to give the best male to male blowjob this side of San Francisco. That was obviously sarcasm, but you get my point.

If you're going to brainwash my kid, at least do it while successfully fending off active shooters. Not my views, but just saying that is maybe where the "arm the teachers" crowd is going.

5/26/2022 9:53:10 AM

fatcatt316
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^^ Exactly!

- My 5th grade teacher would scream at the class, and flip tables or kick chairs over
- Middle school PE teacher picked up a kid and slammed him against a fence
- High school teacher would hang out in her office 90% of the time with swim team people while the rest of us did whatever

It feels like it's so easy to shoot down the "arm every teacher" idea as being terrible, yet some people still believe it

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 9:54 AM. Reason : ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^]

5/26/2022 9:54:15 AM

rjrumfel
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We can debate the best way to fend off mass shootings via legislation all day.

But school shootings specifically - I think the worse shootings have all involved men who did not belong to the school that they targeted. So maybe an elephant in the room? Why was the guy from yesterday able to walk right in? There was, at the very least, criminal lax in security. I can't even pick up my daughter after 2:30 PM at her school. Don't bend my words and say I'm calling for schools to be prison-like...how about we just lock the fuggin doors. It looks like he entered through a side door? All visitors should be forced to come into the main door through the front office.

This won't prevent them all, and attacks could always be made at recess, but yesterday, a locked door may have given someone just enough time to call the cops sooner.

5/26/2022 10:00:56 AM

dmspack
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Quote :
" If you're going to brainwash my kid, at least do it while successfully fending off active shooters. Not my views, but just saying that is maybe where the "arm the teachers" crowd is going."


I honestly think even that is giving them too much credit. I think the “arm the teachers” crowd is just an incredibly short sighted argument by people that refuse to be open to the idea of any kind of gun control. Their solution to every thing is more guns and more cops.

Quote :
" like...how about we just lock the fuggin doors. "


I think Ted Cruz said something similar yesterday. One entry/exit that is guarded at all times. That won’t fly with any fire marshal. And definitely isn’t gonna be reasonable when most every school I see has mobile unit class rooms outside as well.

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 10:05 AM. Reason : Aa]

5/26/2022 10:02:12 AM

Bullet
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So they're now reporting that the cops arrived and waited outside for 30+ minutes while the shooting was actively happening and wouldn't even enter the school (didn't something similar happen at Sandy Hook? or somewhere, hard to keep up, where a security guard hung out at his car while the massacre was happening). If that's true, that right there anecdotally debunks all kinds of "solutions" that the right throws around.

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 10:07 AM. Reason : anecdote]

5/26/2022 10:06:10 AM

Money_Jones
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^i believe it was parkland where school resource officer refused to go try to do anything

5/26/2022 10:14:48 AM

dmspack
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Yeah the cops seem to have done a terrible job here although I doubt we’ll get a full and accurate story of exactly what the cops did and didn’t do.

A greater cop presence at schools will surely lead to more students being arrested for bullshit stuff than actually stopping shooters.

5/26/2022 10:19:38 AM

TerdFerguson
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Quote :
"It’s the dichotomy of “I don’t even trust the teacher to not turn my kid gay but I do trust that same teacher to be armed at all times and to responsibly handle a firearm and to take down a gunman”."


This. But to add: it’s also the dichotomy of how much evidence we have of each scenario occurring and also how quickly legislation was passed to address each scenario.

The evidence I’ve seen of gay or CRT indoctrination is pretty much a nothingburger. I’ll admit it’s possibly happening somewhere, but is it really the epidemic it’s portrayed as? No, It’s mostly manufactured hysteria as far as I can tell (OMG furries are requesting litter boxes to poop in at school1!1!!1). Yet we had multiple states passing legislation to address the issue, ignoring the side effects and opponents, and pushing through the controversy to “get it done for the kids.”

Yet we do have evidence that mass shooters at schools over the last decade have become a repeating problem that inflicts terrible, almost unthinkable harm. But somehow we can’t even pick the most basic low hanging fruit to address the problem (like improving our background check system, making mental health professionals available in schools, etc)? I’m not even saying school shooters is a problem that we can prevent in every circumstance, but it seems to me we aren’t even trying to reduce the potential. An elementary student body count is just…………accepted



I want you to know, rjrumfel, that my intent isn’t to attack you or your family personally. I actually believe there are legitimate conservative positions and some of those arguments are needed to balance the country’s politics. But the direction of the conservative movement in the last decade is just unacceptable to me, I’ve literally seen this change in my own family members and had those arguments. If you sense venom in my posts it’s because I’m fucking pissed. Pissed at how this movement is sabotaging my and my kids future. Pissed about the bridges that had to be burned in my family so I didn’t compromise my own beliefs. Pissed at how powerless I really am to effect change or convince others. TWW is my outlet for that anger so that my other social media is less politically heavy.

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 10:32 AM. Reason : Y’all posting with speeeeedddfffff]

5/26/2022 10:31:59 AM

thegoodlife3
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Quote :
"Again, not a proponent of arming teachers here, it's just that you keep discounting the right and generalizing them all as idiots. And unless the other side puts up a stellar candidate in '24, or unless things turn around sharply economically, you'll be having to deal with their shit in the news for another four years."


you say this as if they’re above criticizing

their bullshit deserves to be called out

5/26/2022 11:28:17 AM

A Tanzarian
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^^^, ^^^^, ^^^^^

From my morning newspaper:

Quote :
"Texas Department of Public Safety Director Steve McCraw said Wednesday that 40 minutes to an hour elapsed from when Ramos opened fire on the school security officer to when the tactical team shot him.

"The bottom line is law enforcement was there," McCraw said. "They did engage immediately. They did contain (Ramos) in the classroom."


We locked him in a classroom with the kids! Problem solved!

The tactical team was actually Border Patrol. Local and state law enforcement seem pretty passive in this. Maybe they should think about that thin blue line flag they like to wave around.

[Edited on May 26, 2022 at 11:31 AM. Reason : ^]

5/26/2022 11:30:34 AM

PackMan2003
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Seems law enforcement only find their courage when they encounter unarmed black people.

5/26/2022 11:52:55 AM

Kickstand
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RAWR RAWR RAWR, stop politicizing mass murders!
Left: GeRnS!
Right: ThErNkEnT eRmEnDmErNt!

5/26/2022 2:05:07 PM

rwoody
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Someone must consider the real victims here
Quote :
"Victor Escalon, Regional Director, South Texas, Department of Public Safety literally just said of cops involved: "I'm a father. I can't go home tonight and hug my kids. That hurts. The members behind me--our family members. Their kids. It's tough. It's hard." What the holy fuck.
We can't hug our kids tonight because we're investigating the mass murder we didn't try to stop, sort of like those parents whose kids were murdered, is next-level chutzpah.
I couldn't actually believe what I was hearing and had to watch several times. HE can't hug HIS kids (tonight)?!?!? https://t.co/5dkd5HlBYz"

5/26/2022 3:38:32 PM

thegoodlife3
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cops are nothing but an army of dipshits

5/26/2022 3:55:46 PM

dmspack
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Look at these heroes. Never demanding a pat on the back. Never thinking of themselves first.

I want so badly to actually believe that it really is just a few bad apples. And that most LEOs really are good. But Jesus Christ they make it impossible to actually believe that.

5/26/2022 4:38:01 PM

HaLo
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https://www.nybooks.com/daily/2012/12/15/our-moloch/

5/26/2022 5:31:09 PM

thegoodlife3
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^^ have seen the point made by multiple people that it’s a majority of bad apples and the good ones are in the vast minority

5/26/2022 5:59:06 PM

dmspack
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The evidence would certainly point to that being the case ^

5/26/2022 6:12:05 PM

The Coz
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Quote :
"THE

VAST

MINORITY"

5/26/2022 7:44:48 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
" A Texas Department of Public Safety official said responding officers were cautious as they entered Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas because “they could’ve been shot.”
"


Guess blue lives matter more than childrens lives.

https://www.mediaite.com/tv/texas-police-lieutenant-says-cops-were-reluctant-to-engage-gunman-because-they-couldve-been-shot/

5/26/2022 8:43:00 PM

The Coz
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Quote :
"A Texas Department of Public Safety official said responding officers were cautious as they entered Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas because "they could've been shot.""

He's got a point there. You never know what might happen. Shooters gonna shoot!

5/26/2022 9:38:34 PM

rjrumfel
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I will not stand behind cops that are afraid to stand in front of me.

Is manslaughter for inaction something that can be done?

Looks like it was actually a parent that ended up taking matters into his own hands. It just so happened that this parent had a gun and some federal authority.

[Edited on May 27, 2022 at 9:01 AM. Reason : asdfa]

5/27/2022 8:57:44 AM

HaLo
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The thin blue line is a lie

5/27/2022 11:33:59 AM

The Coz
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The secret is out. It's been a fat blue line all along.

5/27/2022 12:25:24 PM

thegoodlife3
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http://twitter.com/abbydphillip/status/1530222677226577920

Quote :
"Unreal: This official just said that a decision was made to not break into the classroom because the officers on site believed there was no longer an active shooting situation, even though children were calling 911 at the time pleading for officers to come and save them. My God."

5/27/2022 12:53:36 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
"@emmersbrown

A child at Robb Elementary repeatedly called 911 during the hour the gunman was inside, per press briefing just now. Gunshots could be heard over the line. "Please send the police now," the child asked.

Asked why police did not breach the classroom door sooner, Texas DPS official says the on-scene commander believed the active shooter situation had ended and kids were no longer at risk. In hindsight, he says, that was not the right decision. "It was the wrong decision, period.""


Fucking atrocious police work. And people still think more cops and more cop funding is the answer. What the fuck.

[Edited on May 27, 2022 at 12:55 PM. Reason : ^yeah beat me to it. Fire every single one of them MFers, don’t let them get another police job]

5/27/2022 12:54:18 PM

rwoody
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""If I thought it would help, I would apologise," Steven McCraw said during a heated press conference Friday."


In other words "I will not apologize"

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-61613177

5/27/2022 1:05:24 PM

fatcatt316
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How are those officers not fired and then blacklisted from ever being a cop? What police group would ever want to hire one of them after this?

5/27/2022 2:21:46 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
" What police group would ever want to hire one of them after this?"


Sadly, fired/disgraced cops seem to be able to get new jobs work out much trouble.

5/27/2022 2:32:27 PM

A Tanzarian
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They're shuffled around like molesting priests.

5/27/2022 4:25:48 PM

dmspack
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^^without much trouble. Whoops

5/27/2022 4:26:25 PM

moron
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Quote :
" to it. Fire every single one of them MFers"


Into a volcano

5/27/2022 6:59:42 PM

rwoody
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"Someone heckled Ted Cruz while he was eating at a restaurant last night

“19 children died! That’s on your hands! Ted Cruz, that’s on your hands!” https://t.co/PaeiQYqfBo"


Fuck yes not a moment of peace

5/28/2022 3:01:54 PM

justinh524
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Won't somebody think of the children fat men trying to eat???

5/28/2022 5:00:08 PM

Nighthawk
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Thankfully our Lt. Governor went to the NRA Convention and promised to protect our second amendment rights from the libtard gun grab.

5/28/2022 9:13:33 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
" @thetonymorrison BREAKING: The Uvalde Police Department and the Uvalde ISD police force are no longer cooperating with the TX Department of Public Safety investigation into the massacre at Robb Elementary and the state’s review of police response, multiple law enforcement sources told ABC News.

Per sources, the decision to stop cooperating began after the director of DPS, Col. Steven McCraw, held a presser Friday where he said the delayed police entry into the classroom was “the wrong decision” and contrary to both protocol and initial accounts from local authorities."


Look at these brave cops refusing to cooperate. Love the blue, baby!

5/31/2022 6:15:51 PM

rwoody
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Just comply?

5/31/2022 6:46:01 PM

dmspack
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Quote :
" Texas state police are walking back earlier statements that a teacher had left an exterior door propped open, allowing a gunman to get inside Robb Elementary School in Uvalde, Texas."



https://apnews.com/article/uvalde-school-shooting-texas-a55b3ccc5a32dce916e7d0a10d7c546e?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_medium=AP&utm_source=Twitter

Continuing to change their story. Can we stop pretending cops are better at remembering things/recounting events/telling the truth than ordinary citizens?

5/31/2022 6:48:49 PM

The Coz
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^^Got 'em!

5/31/2022 6:56:46 PM

HaLo
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https://www.cnn.com/2022/06/01/us/tulsa-police-incident-active-shooter/index.html

Tulsa Hospital

6/1/2022 7:32:29 PM

TreeTwista10
MyYouthIPrayToKeep
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Arm the teachers doctors and nurses

6/1/2022 8:20:43 PM

bbehe
Burn it all down.
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Hospital was asking for it, too many doors

6/1/2022 8:27:03 PM

HaLo
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Prayers and thoughts

6/1/2022 8:38:34 PM

rwoody
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Quote :
"BREAKING: Multiple officers were inside Robb Elementary School with rifles and at least one ballistic shield at 11:52 a.m. the day of the shooting, new video and other evidence shows. They didn’t enter the classroom for another 58 minutes. More soon via @statesman and @KVUE. 1/2 https://t.co/0BcYgq2hcQ"

6/20/2022 10:40:36 PM

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