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 Message Boards » » Arguments against the idea of a deity Page [1] 2, Next  
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humans frequently lie

we have only heard of God/Jesus/etc from other humans

why should I trust other humans as any kind of authority whatsoever?

fucking magnets - how do they work?

2/25/2023 1:05:42 PM

ReceiveDeath
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also, I believe that there's either none, or there are a lot of (beings/forces) working together

monotheism? no thanks

2/25/2023 1:07:09 PM

Kickstand
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You polyheathen!

2/25/2023 1:24:44 PM

justinh524
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Polyatheist

2/25/2023 1:28:29 PM

ReceiveDeath
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polyatheist sounds good

2/25/2023 2:14:30 PM

qntmfred
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There are several arguments against the existence of a deity, or at least against the idea that a deity exists as typically conceived:

1. Lack of empirical evidence: One of the most common arguments against the existence of a deity is the lack of empirical evidence. While some may argue that personal experience or religious texts are sufficient evidence, these are often dismissed as subjective or unreliable.

2. The problem of evil: The problem of evil refers to the apparent contradiction between the existence of a benevolent, omnipotent deity and the existence of evil and suffering in the world. If a deity were truly benevolent and omnipotent, why would it allow such evil and suffering to exist?

3. Inconsistencies in religious beliefs: There are many different religious beliefs and traditions, each with its own conception of deity or deities. However, these beliefs often contradict each other, making it difficult to determine which, if any, is true.

4. Logical contradictions: There are many logical contradictions inherent in the concept of a deity. For example, if a deity is truly omnipotent, can it create a rock so heavy that even it cannot lift it?

5. The role of science: Many people argue that science has made religious explanations for the workings of the universe unnecessary. As scientific knowledge continues to expand, the need for a deity to explain natural phenomena becomes less and less compelling.

6. The problem of divine hiddenness: If a deity exists, why does it remain hidden? If it truly wanted people to believe in it, why wouldn't it reveal itself in an unmistakable way?

Overall, these and other arguments have led many people to reject the idea of a deity as either unlikely or unnecessary. However, it is worth noting that these arguments are not universally accepted and that many people continue to believe in the existence of a deity despite them.

2/25/2023 5:58:05 PM

The Coz
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Thanks, qntmGPT.

2/25/2023 6:29:49 PM

justinh524
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evangelical atheists and religious fundamentalists are the same people

2/25/2023 7:50:29 PM

emnsk
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a deity surely could exist

logically we can never know everything and everything could be a lie

but if this deity is one of the types that is purported to save us if we "recognize it" as the truth, I would never do so cause why would I worship an entity which sets up such a game? and that is assuming free will which in itself is a concept which is not true

and if there is a deity that is concious, logically then it must have its own creator, as something must emerge from something.

thus I would only subscribe to the idea that God is "will" itself, how every action combines with another across the world to facilitate reality. in a sense, the past is the God of the present.

[Edited on February 25, 2023 at 9:42 PM. Reason : it creates itself, no ending and no beginning, reality is "God" in a way.]

2/25/2023 9:39:34 PM

emnsk
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.

[Edited on February 25, 2023 at 10:17 PM. Reason : accident]

2/25/2023 10:17:20 PM

justinh524
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Quote :
"God is "will" itself"


I prefer to call him Billy

2/25/2023 10:44:26 PM

ReceiveDeath
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all I know is, I definitely don't believe in this "etc" character

2/26/2023 11:49:06 AM

emnsk
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religion is often a substitute for philosophy

2/27/2023 7:05:31 AM

rjrumfel
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The idea that there is something after our bodies turn to dirt or ash is a very powerful motivator.

2/27/2023 11:22:22 AM

thegoodlife3
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our friends just lost their 3 month old to an extremely rare condition

2/27/2023 12:18:05 PM

Bullet
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^^yes, but that's pretty weak. I don't like the thought of death being the end. But that can't convince my brain to believe in a deity.

Nice post Fred!

Are you really a student emnsk? That was pretty deep.

2/27/2023 1:01:03 PM

emnsk
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^^^ yeah, I find it ironic that many believe that a demonish character is feeding ill omens to the world, but simultaneously believe only out of faith that only they are their people are destined for some heaven where they can retain their identity.
because wouldn't the most devilish thing of all be to lure a man by his own ego? it would be the greatest trick for a devil to play at all, to trick a man into thinking that, and to lead him to reject all other belief and culture in the plague of his superiority

if the devil exists, he has sure got the majority played

^yeah! today we had three separate religious representatives on the brickyard today, interesting stuff. some people hate the regular guy but he earnestly believes that he is helping save people from hell so I can't blame him

2/27/2023 4:33:01 PM

ReceiveDeath
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so everyone (in theory) should be equal as a human

I mean, philosophically speaking, at least.. right?

so why would Jesus etc have only come to certain people with information, and kept the others in the dark?

he wouldn't

I keep reading about NDEs and stuff and about how we're made out of energy/electricity so, I guess my current half-assed theory still stands, about how we get stuck in limbo or somethin', before I brain shuts down, and it feels like an eternity

even that is a crackpot theory really

shut up me

ok sorry

2/27/2023 5:47:14 PM

ReceiveDeath
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Quote :
"BEFORE

I

BRAIN"


speaking of brain shutdowns

2/27/2023 5:48:03 PM

Walter
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There’s more proof for Bigfoot than there is of any gods/goddesses. Have you seen the movie Harry and the Hendersons? If that doesn’t convince you He’s real then I’m not sure what will.

2/28/2023 3:55:23 PM

emnsk
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if someone has a foot fetish then big foot is a definitely a God for them

[Edited on February 28, 2023 at 4:44 PM. Reason : e]

2/28/2023 4:44:17 PM

emnsk
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https://twitter.com/ge0rgeh0pkins/status/1628182572231544834

2/28/2023 4:54:08 PM

ReceiveDeath
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Watler LOL for u sir

2/28/2023 5:07:52 PM

moron
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Between jwst and Hubble, we’ve captured hundreds of thousands of pictures of different galaxies in various states, from formation, to merging, to dying. Not a single Galaxy so far shows signs of being populated by a super advanced civilization that can build massive super structures. If it turns out that we’re alone in the universe, it does imply humanity is special somehow.

3/1/2023 10:01:56 PM

justinh524
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Not sure why you think we'd be able to see anything built by beings in other galaxies.

3/1/2023 10:34:36 PM

moron
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a technologically advanced society would use so much energy that you’d expect to see the effects on a galactic scale.

3/1/2023 11:25:08 PM

justinh524
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Nah

3/1/2023 11:58:04 PM

Cabbage
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^^But the absence of galactic scale technology comes nowhere near justifying we're alone in the universe; there's a wide fucking window between the two.

3/2/2023 12:15:31 AM

emnsk
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yeah... I mean we can only think in terms of the knowledge we have. There could be, no, there are entire physical phenomena or dimensions we can't even perceive

and even if that weren't the case, what Cabbage said^

3/2/2023 7:17:56 AM

The Coz
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Would the existence of KFC's "Double Down" be a supporting argument here?

3/2/2023 7:49:21 AM

emnsk
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in some universe is it possible that the primary intelligent life forms resemble KFC sandwiches?

[Edited on March 2, 2023 at 9:08 AM. Reason : I hope so, our intergalactic wars would be tasty]

3/2/2023 9:07:42 AM

rwoody
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moron read this
https://what-if.xkcd.com/47/
Quote :
"Let's assume there's life on the the nearest habitable exoplanet and that they have technology comparable to ours. If they looked at our star right now, what would they see?"

3/2/2023 10:17:44 AM

emnsk
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^very interesting site!

3/2/2023 11:18:08 AM

rwoody
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If you're not familiar, xkcd is a web comic written by a guy well versed in physics/engineering, and at some point he started doing those what ifs, which are pretty cool. He has books out I believe.

3/2/2023 1:27:25 PM

ReceiveDeath
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IDK why I made this thread

I apologize :3

3/2/2023 5:37:39 PM

emnsk
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https://providencemag.com/2021/02/appeal-to-heaven-our-new-civil-war-us-capitol-johhn-locke/

The whole article is about another topic and I don't necessarily agree with its conclusions on God, but I really liked how this paragraph culminates into what I was thinking about (actually what I specifically wrote earlier in this post), and so I'm quoting it. --specially the last line

Quote :
"In adopting the phrase “an appeal to Heaven,” however, Locke is in fact engaged in some rather clever sleight-of-hand against his Tory opponents. For a century and a half, debate had raged among both Protestant and Catholic political theorists over what rights of resistance, if any, an aggrieved people had against a tyrannical ruler. Although several forms of lawful resistance theory had been elaborated, a majority of English writers still held that in such an event, the people had no recourse except prayer and repentance. There being no one on earth to whom they could lawfully appeal, they must “appeal to heaven” and ask God to deliver them in his own time, by his own means. Reasoning that God helps those who help themselves, however, Locke suggested cheekily by his invocation of Jeptha that an appeal to heaven in no way excludes a call to arms. Locke’s “appeal to heaven” is thus an appeal to the earthliest means of all—the sword—trusting that God will vindicate the injured party and ensure the defeat of the guilty."


Essentially, an appeal to heaven is saying that whatever occurs in that last resort beyond any superior human law is whatever God wills. A "may the best man win", but the "best" itself is ultimately determined by... what happens. Now, when you only relegate that to the things beyond nations themselves (to be fair, locke was writing this specifically to the right of revolution/war), it is kind of imposing a God of the Gaps argument. Is the foundation of that law within a nation not at some point a result of that very 'last resort' that required an appeal of heaven? And thus, when you stretch this appeal to heaven to every facet of the world, you see how every result is a function of what precedes it, or what conditions have arose to have given that result. And thus, all reality would emanate from "God" as such, not as a matter of consciousness, but innate existence.
Quote :
"thus I would only subscribe to the idea that God is "will" itself, how every action combines with another across the world to facilitate reality."

The holy irony lies in that appeal to heaven, the appeal to God's abode, points to the absence of such a conscious 'ultimate' God itself. It points to us being instruments of this 'reality', finding our way through paradigms. You truly gain sight when you rise above simply appealing to heaven for when things seem beyond your perception, but from recognizing that every step forth lies in that appeal--an appeal to reality.

When you think of God beyond religious doctrine itself, it becomes an affair with the unknown, and a beautiful one indeed.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LrkEc2V3mO4 summarizes this in its own garish, yet... subtle way.
Time to do my homework! may have said a bunch of nothing but I'll excuse myself cause it's 4am

[Edited on August 31, 2023 at 4:48 AM. Reason : -]

8/31/2023 4:44:02 AM

EMCE
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Heathens

8/31/2023 9:47:51 AM

ReceiveDeath
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I've decided there is ultimately no point in trying to figure it out

we pretty much going to die, but before that, our brain will fool us into thinking we're in some suspended undead state, which will eventually end upon the actual moment of death

and that's the bottom line

9/12/2023 12:25:45 PM

ReceiveDeath
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I've decided there is ultimately no point in trying to figure it out

we pretty much going to die, but before that, our brain will fool us into thinking we're in some suspended undead state, which will eventually end upon the actual moment of death

and that's the top line

9/12/2023 12:26:38 PM

ReceiveDeath
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I think I might need glasses

I thought it said the first reply was the last reply on page 1

9/12/2023 12:27:46 PM

emnsk
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I'm gonna kill you

9/12/2023 1:27:39 PM

Wraith
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Yo what about the uncontacted tribes in the Amazon and the like? They have never heard of western religions or the Bible or anything like that. Under traditional Christian beliefs, they don't believe in Jesus (or even know that historically a dude named Jesus existed ~2000 years ago), so that means they go to hell. Insert Mohammad or Buddha or whatever other deity that people subscribe to. How is that fair?

9/12/2023 2:07:43 PM

emnsk
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I don't think Buddhists believe in heaven

As for christianity/islam and others, I've asked before and I get the "God knows what to do" argument. this is kinda where that argument "you might as well be religious cause it is better to believe in the chance that god exists than not." but which God, lol? and how do you not know that 'God' actually only sends atheists to heaven cause he thinks religions are an indulgence in pride over other humans or something.
and this all assumes we have the free will to do that and a bunch of other stuff

I don't think "scientific"-atheism is right either, in the sense of those who only belief in existing 'science' without postulating beyond that, which is unscientific in its own way

[Edited on September 12, 2023 at 2:33 PM. Reason : -]

9/12/2023 2:25:37 PM

ReceiveDeath
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Quote :
"I'm gonna kill you"


please ??

9/12/2023 4:10:09 PM

afripino
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if ghosts can respect property lines, then surely there's a god that is all-powerful but is like "I won't show you my power because you can do what you want, free-will...yadda yadda yadda, but I always have a hand in the outcome, but not really, you got it...or do you???...teehee"

9/12/2023 4:11:05 PM

ReceiveDeath
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^I had a pic to post, but it's like a marathon effort to post images these days. Or at least to use them from an existing website - either that or I'm somehow getting more inept with technology. that's more likely

9/12/2023 4:18:32 PM

emnsk
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Quote :
"free-will...yadda yadda yadda, but I always have a hand in the outcome, but not really, you got it...or do you???...teehee""


I cannot see how free will is remotely possible, in any way.

9/12/2023 4:56:02 PM

Bullet
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I cannot see how you cannot see how free will is remotely possible, in any way.

9/12/2023 5:30:03 PM

emnsk
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Everything you do is a product of the past


[Edited on September 12, 2023 at 5:57 PM. Reason : and yeah, my manner of speaking is very redundant. something I need to fix]

9/12/2023 5:53:08 PM

BubbleBobble
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Quote :
"Everything you do is a product of the past"


or is it?

9/12/2023 7:53:00 PM

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