Quote :

"Most Volt owners are fairly amused people compare it to the Cruze, when practically none of us would consider buying a Cruze."

i don't even understand the logic behind the comparison as there is none. i do think the cruze is a decent car. i rented one and drove it disney world. i averaged hand-calculated 46mpg round trip. i would've done a lot better if i didn't hit rush-hour in orlando on the way there.

3/30/2012 9:29:26 PM

Over 2,200 Volts sold on March. Less than 200 are fleet. Beat out every othr plug in car, including the Plug in Prius.

4/3/2012 3:26:44 PM

Quote :

" i rented one"

which one?

4/3/2012 4:33:50 PM

cruze eco model

4/3/2012 9:17:28 PM

http://www.forbes.com/sites/rickungar/2012/04/03/what-does-mitt-romney-and-the-gop-have-against-the-chevy-volt/

4/4/2012 9:28:42 AM

I don't even have to read the article to answer that question. They don't like all the government involvement with that vehicle, which was necessary for it's existence.

4/4/2012 10:12:33 AM

My problem, as a Republican, is how people in my party (mainly), can both 1) see and complain about the problems with oil and 2) completely rally against any real efforts made to get us diversified away from oil. Its why, quite honestly, the vast majority of America is just stupid or uninformed, or both. They most certainly are hypocritical. I see this as a national security issue. Plain and simple. Without affordable transportation costs, our economy and the world economy is dead.

The retort is often, "We wouldnt have the problem if we drilled more domestically!"

Many problems with this:
1) It ignores the current situation. It doesnt honestly matter what we could or should have done with drilling. We didnt. If we start drilling every area of America, it would take over a decade to bring enough production available to wean us off imports, and probably longer, if it is even possible.

2) Even if we do come completely self sufficient, it doesnt cure us of the lack of fueling diversity, or necessarily lead to lower prices. Since oil is a global commodity, while producing it locally may make us feel better, its still going to be priced on the global market. OPEC could reduce their output to match our increased output, and the end result would be the same prices. If we put government controls on oil prices, oil companies will simply stop investing in the more expensive drilling we need to provide the huge amount of oil we need to eliminate imports. We wouldnt be sending our money out of the country, we'd just be making the oil companies even more incredibly rich. The only way to bring down prices to create real competition in the market place, and that doesnt happen until there is a fuel source substitution. That substitution could be nuclear/coal/natural gas providing the energy for electric cars or CNG.

3) It ignores the reality that eventually we simply will be unable to produce enough oil to meet our needs, and will have to transition or diversify to something else. It is obviously such a painful transition, that we had best starting working on it, because it will take decades.

I am so pissed at Republican's and the party in general over this. It has really illustrated the hypocracy. In one breath, a run of the mill Republican will state how corporations shouldnt be taxed, because corporate taxes are passed onto the consumer and that is the only place where taxes should be given (and through didvideds and stock), and then in the very next breath, say that oil companies need to have their tax breaks removed because they are making too much money. Then they'll follow that with that they believe in a flat tax systems, and that rich people should pay less than they currently do because they already bear the burden of the majority of taxes. And in this state, they'll complain when we lose businesses to other states, and in the very next breath, complain when we have to give tax breaks to keep them.

I am just tired of stupid people. Most people on this board can think critically, and while we dont always agree, there is some rational informed debate. I can't say this for 80% of the population, however.

[Edited on April 4, 2012 at 12:15 PM. Reason : .]

4/4/2012 12:04:53 PM

well spoken.

4/4/2012 1:34:01 PM

^^ the core of your political party is founded on has valid points.

The people who run your party these days pander to ignorant people for votes and make policies to keep rich people rich. Since it is primarily funded by oil, and "the war machine" these are things you will see policies made to protect while repubs control congress etc.

I don't like how they try to control my "liberty" and act like they protect it.


Dems do something similar too just in a different way for different people.

I would say i don't like how they try to control my money... but to be honest a house-hold really needs to make >250k for republican policies to be beneficial, and as we may be approaching that but not there yet... it doesn't really bother me.... yet...

4/4/2012 1:40:54 PM

Quote :

"I am just tired of stupid people. Most people on this board can think critically, and while we dont always agree, there is some rational informed debate. I can't say this for 80% of the population, however. "

I agree. Good thing about stupid people is I have job security. The average Joe Citizen doesn't realize how bad society has become. I see it everyday I ride a fire truck. Some folks have just enough sense to keep from shitting on themselves.

4/4/2012 9:18:47 PM

yep...

I test mechanical systems and half the time i think... "this fuck-up brought to you by Facebook"

4/5/2012 8:07:45 AM

Quote :

"Improving Chevy Volt sales leads GM to shorten summer shutdown Just the other day, we heard that General Motors might extend its traditional two-week summer shutdown to three weeks for the Chevrolet Volt. But, after record Volt sales last month, we wonder how the calendar looks in Hamtramck now. We wonder because we are hearing reports that the current shutdown – originally scheduled to run for five weeks, from March 19 to April 23 – will be shortened by a week. GM originally decided on the hold to reduce supply that had grown too large because of soft demand. Don LaForest, the chairman of the United Auto Workers bargaining committee at the Hamtramck plant where the Volt is made, told Talking Points Memo that GM is "adding a week of production back in." The Detroit News reports that GM President of North America Mark Reuss said the same thing Wednesday during the New York Auto Show. Reuss said, "We're doing it because we sold a lot." Increasing sales numbers (GM sold 2,289 Volts in March – well over double February's 1,023-unit total) come at a time when some of the right-wing attacks on the plug-in hybrid appear to have calmed down. LaForest told TPM that his union workers have been confused about these criticisms. "I don't think Newt or Mitt have said a single negative thing about the Nissan Leaf," he said. "They're attacking our car to get at the President. But our car is going to change the way America does business. It's a breath of fresh air.""

http://www.autoblog.com/2012/04/05/improving-chevy-volt-sales-leads-gm-to-shorten-summer-shutdown/

[Edited on April 5, 2012 at 10:12 AM. Reason : k]

4/5/2012 10:11:48 AM

Damn damn damn. Almost got to trade my Volt for a BMW Active E prototype for the day, but it fell through.

4/11/2012 8:55:19 PM

Get a real job, and pay for gas like a grown up

4/12/2012 10:00:08 AM

This isnt chit chat.

4/12/2012 11:33:33 AM

I hope you are keeping up with your mileage and putting this on your taxes to pay for all the roads you are using FOR FREE.

Another example of the rich taking advantage of us to use the system and not pay their fair share.

4/13/2012 7:22:59 AM

rich motherfuckers dont drive chevy volts, pompous eco-nerds do.

4/13/2012 8:42:56 AM

A lot of hate in this thread on someone who has spent an extra few grand of his money on a car that is both american made and innovative. Not sure if that is a result of close mindedness or jealousy or group mentality or all of those combined. ComputerGuy has no clue. Nighthawk is pissed off at the IRS for taking his dollarbucks and probably underpays his own share by not reporting the value of anything he bought online, even though he gets tax breaks himself for things like owning a home and having a child. Dr. Pepper is getting back at the rest of the population that judgmentally lumps him in with the trailer park high school dropout rednecks who also happen to rock the 4'' dual stack. Come on guys, CarZin is the only person on this board who actually owns an electric vehicle other than a golf cart, which means his ride is more interesting and unique than 90% of the generic shit people in the Garage drive. Sounds like yall could use a real world Garage meet at the cookout or something. I promise it will break most of the stereotypes you have built up in your head about the other users on this board.

4/13/2012 10:22:29 AM

He got a big tax break on an overpriced car that allows him to avoid paying taxes to maintain the roads he drives on. Plain and simple.

4/13/2012 10:47:49 AM

Jealous much? Government provides tax breaks all the time to promote certain activities or to help out to those in need, even if they put themselves into that situation. Should I be upset that you are getting a tax credit because you don't make enough money, have a kid, and save money for their retirement, just because I am not eligible for those credits this year? As far as the road tax, a mandatory fee is probably coming as soon as there is a meaningful number of electric vehicles on the road, similar to what other states did. And once it comes, CarZin will probably be subject to double taxation as he will still be paying gas tax when he does have to fill up.

What you should be thankful for is for someone paving the way for your kid to have access to affordable and diversified energy sources once he is old enough to drive.

And let's be clear, you do not have to be rich to drive a Volt and take advantage of the same benefits. Your 350 V8 was YOUR choice. Volt was made for the masses, from the price to the range to the styling. And the only way you can claim it is overpriced is to show us how much markup GM puts on every Volt as opposed to the other models (or maybe even compare it to the markup GM put on that Z28 when it was new). I have a feeling that the Volt is underpriced if anything in terms of MSRP vs cost of production.

4/13/2012 11:35:36 AM

Quote :

"Come on guys, CarZin is the only person on this board who actually owns an electric vehicle other than a golf cart, which means his ride is more interesting and unique than 90% of the generic shit people in the Garage drive. Sounds like yall could use a real world Garage meet at the cookout or something. I promise it will break most of the stereotypes you have built up in your head about the other users on this board."

Doubt that (bolded part), but I think you're right in that we should have a large meet of sorts. Been forever.

4/13/2012 11:53:18 AM

Quote :

"He got a big tax break on an overpriced car that allows him to avoid paying taxes to maintain the roads he drives on. Plain and simple."

Are you being serious Chris?

I can't imagine he is being serious, as we are friends, and the pointed views he is expressing is closer to someone who is clueless about my motives that the intelligent person I think he is.

The fact that the state doesnt collect taxes on electric cars for road taxes is the fault of the state, not the car owner. All states will be deciding how to tax electric car owners in the near future. I fully support electric owners paying their fair share for road taxes.

[Edited on April 13, 2012 at 12:21 PM. Reason : .]

4/13/2012 12:15:17 PM

i kinda feel like the last few posts were trolling attempts?

4/13/2012 12:36:59 PM

Maybe I'm just giving the electric hippie a hard time after spotting him yesterday.

^I feel like you were right.

[Edited on April 13, 2012 at 12:37 PM. Reason : ]

4/13/2012 12:37:15 PM

If you guys want to have a meet and greet, I'm all for that. I'll even give test drives. Just need to build a list of the assholes that will want to run it into a pole, and exclude them from the process

4/13/2012 12:51:42 PM

i guess i took the troll bait sadly that is exactly the sentiments that many people share about the car and hybrids in general

4/13/2012 12:54:29 PM

^^I am still disappointed that I have not gotten a test drive. WTH man I could walk to the damn thing right now.

4/13/2012 1:05:49 PM

I am on a streak of 2300 miles without a drop burned. If I give a test drive at work, without the availability of a level 2 charger, I will be burning gas on the way home.

BUT...

Orange County is about to install a Level 2 charger across the street. When that happens, I'll be happy to give you a drive.

4/13/2012 1:45:38 PM

Quote :

"allows him to avoid paying taxes to maintain the roads he drives on"

Sounds like a plan to me......totally legal too, if you have a problem with it just write your representative.

There was a time not too far back in our history that a personal vehicle was out of reach for most......then we figured out how to mass produce them economically and in a few decades everyone had one. Do not be ignorant and think another massive shift in means of transportation will never happen again, it will. If the price of gas continues to climb behaviors and preferences will change.

I think eventually we will be required to upload our odometer data and pay tax on that, or even a GPS system will log the miles driven in each state and we will be billed in that manner.

4/13/2012 5:40:24 PM

If anyone is seriously interested in buying or leases these, I now know 'the' place to get them. Stingray Chevrolet in Florida is selling them at 4k below MSRP. They are attempting to be the nationwide Volt leaders. Apparently selling about 5 a week.

If you were to lease a 'well' equipped Volt (not the base model), with ZERO money down and 15k miles a year, it will be LESS than $400 a month. If you get the base, and 12k miles, you are under $350 a month. You will be expected to pay taxes and transfer.

They will do all the paperwork over the phone, and ship the car to you for about $500-600. Definitely worth considering.

4/17/2012 1:28:05 PM

Lease a Volt

lol

4/17/2012 1:53:37 PM

^why's that funny?

^^Hey CarZin correct me if I'm wrong, but are you ineligible for the federal tax credit if you lease the car instead of buy?

4/17/2012 2:09:17 PM

Igor, UMAD, BRO???

I thought this was the garage, where we can ride nutz in one thread and bust ballz in another without any issue????

4/17/2012 2:46:32 PM

^^^ Youre paying for the premium price tag but not keeping it long enough to justify the savings (I presume that's what he means).

4/17/2012 7:25:21 PM

No, he's just being an idiot. Don't give him credit for having a brain.

Actually, with zero money down, $350 a month is a CHEAP price for a lease on a $40k car. If you drive 15k miles a year on a car sub 25k miles, you are likely going to spend close to 300 a month in gas alone. That means you are only paying an extra $50 a month for a brand new car with next to no cost to drive it.

TKE- The reason the lease cost is low is because the leasing company takes the tax credit, and the residual value is very high. It is unlikely you will want to buy the car at the end of the lease with the residual value. The benefit of leasing is that if you DONT have the tax liability to claim the full $7500 tax credit, leasing allows you to capture all of it.

4/17/2012 10:18:21 PM

Quote :

"It is unlikely you will want to buy the car at the end of the lease with the residual value."

could you clarify?

4/18/2012 8:13:22 AM

Quote :

"If you drive 15k miles a year on a car sub 25k miles, you are likely going to spend close to 300 a month in gas alone. That means you are only paying an extra $50 a month for a brand new car with next to no cost to drive it."

Can't you only drive 12k miles a year though. Still an interesting scenario though...

4/18/2012 9:12:27 AM

Dr. Pepper: When you negotiate a lease, you also negotiate the buy-out at the end of the lease. The buy outs at the end of the Volt leases (I am told by other people that have leased) are higher than many people expect the car to actually be worth. In other words, you would be better off to turn the lease in, and just buy a used car in the open market for less. Point of this, is to examine the residual carefully. If you dont plan on buying it, a high residual is good, because it lowers your effective payment. A lower residual would raise it.

synapse: You absolutely can get a 18k, 15k leases, 12k leases, and even 10k leases have been established. I asked the sale guy how much a 15k lease would be over a 12, and he said about 15-20 a month. That is also confirmed by others on gm-volt. With the prices this dealer is quoting on the Volt, I suspect you could get one right at 300/mo plus taxes and transfer with no money down on a base model with 12k a year, and around 325 for a 15k.

It makes it really attractive. Too bad I drive 22k miles a year. I think someone asked me above. I purchased, not leased.

[Edited on April 18, 2012 at 9:35 AM. Reason : .]

4/18/2012 9:33:52 AM

This is what happens if you go 45 days (and in my case, 2600 miles) without the engine running:

4/19/2012 4:49:58 PM

I half expected it to say "CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!"

Do you have to worry about the gas going bad?

4/19/2012 4:57:41 PM

You do, but it also manages that. It knows the average age of your gas, and if it gets close to a year old, it burns it off. It requires premium, and the tank is unvented and pressurized keeping the gas fresh longer.

4/19/2012 9:05:27 PM

This is interesting. This is the Government Accoutability Office study, ammended in 1996, on what it cost to protect middle eastern oil infrastructure, which is obviously deemed critical for national security. The summary is that is costs ~33 billion a year, and that between 1980 and 1990, we spent almost 400 billion. I suspect things havent gotten cheaper with a few subsequent wars. If we didnt protect this, I suspect we'd be paying what Europe pays at the pump, and people wouldnt be making much fun of the Volt. This is also an indirect subsidy to everyone that drives a gas car. At around 2 trillion dollars for the last 30 years, that amounts to a few thousand dollars for EVERY driver in the U.S.:

http://ntl.bts.gov/data/military.pdf

[Edited on April 25, 2012 at 12:40 PM. Reason : .]

4/25/2012 12:39:39 PM

Saw an electric BMW 1 Series coupe today. eMotion or whatever the hell their crappy branding name is these days. It had NY plates and I wonder how she got it down here. I'm guessing either very slowly or on a truck

4/25/2012 12:52:42 PM

I think that is the Active-E prototype most likely, which is currently held by Evatran (wireless charging). That is the vehicle I almost got to trade for a day with the Volt.

4/25/2012 12:59:23 PM

Ahah. I immediately thought of you when I spotted it (on Airport Blvd). If I recall correctly are they only being leased in 2-3 areas of the country right now?

4/25/2012 1:01:15 PM

I dont think they are leasing 'yet'. I think they are getting ready to lease them. I have seen the invitations.

One a non related note, to show the utility of 40 miles of range...

1) Drove to work for 35 miles, all electric. Had maybe 6 or 7 miles left. Started charging at work
2) When leaving work, charge not completely done, but back to 40 miles of range. Drove home the 35 miles, and had about 11 miles of range left. Plugged into charger home charger. (arrived home at 6:30 PM)
3) Left house at 8:30, with about 38 miles of range showing and Went to Pleasant Valley lanes to kick some bowling ass (averaged about 180, with a high score of 202), which was about 25 miles round-trip, all electric.

Moral of this story: You dont need a 100 mile range battery pack necessarily to go 100 miles in a day. $1.50 in electricity.



[Edited on April 25, 2012 at 1:09 PM. Reason : .]

4/25/2012 1:08:23 PM

CarZin spotted on FB?

4/26/2012 12:08:53 PM

Nope . Someone else

4/27/2012 12:30:35 AM

On a daily basis I could see myself barely needing gas with a volt. My commute is maybe 20 miles each way. I may putt around town some but would easily have gaps of time where I could plug in.

4/27/2012 11:12:14 AM

I'd consider one if I had a way to plug it in at my apartment complex

but I'm strongly considering a 2013 Fusion Hybrid whenever they come out in the fall

4/27/2012 7:59:57 PM