updates on what happened today: http://www.guardian.co.uk/news/blog/2010/dec/14/wikileaks-julian-assange-court-appeal-live-updates

cliff notes:
-numerous celebs donate to assange's 'bail fund'
-judge grants bail with restrictions
-swedish prosecution flip flops before finally appealing the bail ruling
-assange put back in jail, appeal will be heard in 48 hours

12/14/2010 2:00:39 PM

If they don't keep him in jail he will be assassinated.

12/14/2010 5:41:34 PM

Quote :

"Oh, i think it's common knowledge that there is and always has been bias in reporting, most of it without conscious intent. However, I lament the current system of blatantly partisan programming and websites that produces and empowers abominations like the Tea Party."

This is how it has always been

12/14/2010 5:42:09 PM

Hahaha... these are great!

Commentary: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/12/wikileaks-cables-azerbaijan-first-lady
Cable: http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/us-embassy-cables-documents/245758

WikiLeaks cable sticks the knife into Azerbaijan's first lady

Quote :

"The first lady of Azerbaijan has problems showing a "full range of facial expression" following "substantial cosmetic surgery, (done) presumably overseas," US diplomats say witheringly in US embassy cables released by WikiLeaks."

Quote :

"Under the headline "A First Lady, Too, in Fashion", Aliyeva is dubbed more "fashion-conscious and daring" than the "average woman in majority-Muslim Azerbaijan". As well as substantial foreign cosmetic surgery, the first lady "wears dresses that would be considered provocative even in the Western world," it says."

Quote :

""On television, in photos, and in person, she appears unable to show a full range of facial expression," it adds. The cable describes how in September 2008 Aliyeva and her two daughters hosted "second lady Lynne Cheney" – the wife of former US vice-president Dick Cheney. With exquisite bitchiness it recalls: "Prior to the Second Lady's arrival, while the three ladies were waiting for Mrs Cheney's car, one Secret Service agent asked 'which one of those is the mother?' Emboffs (embassy officials) and White House staff studied the three for several moments, and then Emboff said, 'Well, logically the mother would probably stand in the middle.'""

12/14/2010 6:59:19 PM

Quote :

"This sounds a lot like what I said before. And no, I don't expect the US Government to be impartial on the matter, considering that they are getting the brunt of the criticism, but it's a valid point. Based on the way WikiLeaks has chosen to editorilize it's leaks and the way Assange has chosen to drum up the sensationalism of the cables and transcripts in his possession, you cannot consider them a media orgainization in the vein of others who try to report "just the facts" in their news section, and make their editorials obvious. With wikileaks, the editorializing starts with what they choose to release. "

Let me get this right. You are proud that this idiot makes the same statements you do?
When pressed for actual information he hides behind semantics and vague condemnations.

Quote :

"All I can say is I’m not aware of any contacts between the Department of State and Amazon."

In other words yes the government has been putting pressure on Amazon and no I will not admit it.

Quote :

"Well, his – I mean he could be considered a political actor. I think he’s an anarchist, but he’s not a journalist."

How about you defend your accusations with some facts? OH wait because you can't. You think he is an anarchist because he is upsetting your systematic corruption?

Quote :

"QUESTION: In the same letter, he said that U.S. is trying to suppress the whole thing about human rights abuses. And do you agree with his contention that the U.S. is -- MR. CROWLEY: I found very little that Mr. Assange has said that we agree with.""

Nice way to completely dodge that question...

So to summarize, it is ok to censor FACTS just so long as you vaguely label who ever is responsible for the release of FACTS (notice I didn't say source) as having a "political agenda" or an "anarchist".

12/15/2010 10:17:10 AM

Quote :

"But ultimately, what one thinks of Manning's alleged acts is irrelevant to the issue here. The U.S. ought at least to abide by minimal standards of humane treatment in how it detains him. That's true for every prisoner, at all times. But departures from such standards are particularly egregious where, as here, the detainee has merely been accused, but never convicted, of wrongdoing. These inhumane conditions make a mockery of Barack Obama's repeated pledge to end detainee abuse and torture, as prolonged isolation -- exacerbated by these other deprivations -- is at least as damaging, as violative of international legal standards, and almost as reviled around the world, as the waterboard, hypothermia and other Bush-era tactics that caused so much controversy."

http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/12/14/manning

The full article is worth reading if you care anything about human rights and/or America in general. Manning has been held in isolation 23 hours a day for 7 months without being charged with a crime. As mentioned in the article, the supreme court on at least two occasions has referred to this kind of treatment as causing permanent psychiatric damage and being akin to torture. He doesn't even have a pillow or sheets on his bed, for fuck's sake.

Is this how you want your country to be run?

12/15/2010 12:10:20 PM

Manning has been charged with a crime.

Manning is a piece of shit in general, he gets reduced in rank for fighting another soldier, decides to willfully give out classified information to a foreign national and claims he wants people too see the truth? Really guy?

Salon is calling him whistle blower because Manning didn't endanger anyone or sell his information. He released something along the lines of 250k cables right? Did he read every single one of them? Did he make sure there was absolutely nothing in there that could harm the US? Did he anaylze and think of all possible repercussions for handing out this data? Or was he simply throwing a temper tantrum because good ol'Uncle Sam knocked him down a peg by taking away a stripe?

Does he deserve 23 hour a day isolation? Honestly, I think that's a bit harsh, but maybe he should have thought about that before giving away his data and bragging about it. He's clothed, fed, provided a lawyer, and still getting paid...to compare it to some third world gulag is a bit much. No one forced him to enlist, no one forced him to assault another solider, and I'm damn sure no one forced him to commit his crimes.

[Edited on December 15, 2010 at 12:35 PM. Reason : a]

12/15/2010 12:24:35 PM

Keep missing the point

12/15/2010 12:43:07 PM

What's the point of not releasing 100% of the documents right away?

12/15/2010 12:46:38 PM

Keep missing the point

12/15/2010 1:00:53 PM

Keep avoiding every argument, question, and point presented by someone with a different view.

12/15/2010 1:02:00 PM

I'm sorry but I'm not going to engage in obsessing over the character of the people involved and the ways by which the documents are leaked. I'm going to obsess over the content of the leaks.

You have bought the U.S. establishment's narrative hook, line, and sinker. Keep obsessing over the characters, the personality, and the drama.

12/15/2010 1:04:40 PM

So you just covered your ears and screamed 'I can't hear you..LALALALALA' got it.

12/15/2010 1:07:02 PM

When it comes to wholly irrelevant stuff, yes, I will. Why I should be spending preciously scarce time worrying about Assange and Manning rather than the leaks themselves?

God damn you're a tenacious sucker.

12/15/2010 1:12:16 PM

Perhaps if I stamped a document about the two, classfied or FOUO and leaked it to someone, you would be interested in it

12/15/2010 1:14:52 PM

Quote :

"Manning has been charged with a crime."

Yeah, my bad. Although I should say I'm against inhumane treatment of people being charged with crimes, as well.

12/15/2010 1:17:06 PM

Quote :

"Perhaps if I stamped a document about the two, classfied or FOUO and leaked it to someone, you would be interested in it"

Hahaha do you honestly not get it? All of this time I was giving you the benefit of the doubt and assuming you were morally devoid rather than plain, flat-out stupid.

12/15/2010 1:18:35 PM

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/features/view/feature/US-Should-Thank-Assange-He-Proved-America-Isnt-Evil-2757

Quote :

"Nonetheless, [Assange] and WikiLeaks have done America a massive favour, by inadvertently debunking decades-old conspiracy theories about its foreign policy. For the European and Latin American left, just as for the Chinese or Russian nationalist right, it has long been all but assumed that whatever the Americans say publicly about their foreign policy is simply a cover story for some sort of secret agenda. What that agenda is can vary, according to taste ... But whatever the Americans' secret agenda was held to be, they definitely had one--only the absurdly naive could believe otherwise. And yet, after a fortnight of revelations, WikiLeaks has revealed that, remarkably enough, the public position taken by the US on any given issue is usually the private position as well. ... Conspiracy theorists all over the world must be deeply disappointed."

Interesting perspective. Although the whole thing with how we seemingly played Saddam prior to invading Kuwait seems rather nefarious to me.

(full disclosure, I have not read any of the leaks directly, but I've read a lot of what's been reported on by the media)

12/15/2010 2:15:53 PM

According to reports, Bradley Manning is being tortured and held in complete isolation for seven months now; no bedding, no reading materials, no exercise allowed. God is great. America is greater.

12/15/2010 3:00:06 PM

How is he being tortured

12/15/2010 3:05:25 PM

Reports didn't say.

12/15/2010 3:07:31 PM

Can we get a link to this report?

12/15/2010 3:10:16 PM

This is what is wrong with America. Your people are too lazy.

12/15/2010 3:12:56 PM

So that's a 'no' then.

12/15/2010 3:14:39 PM

Probably this: http://www.salon.com/news/opinion/glenn_greenwald/2010/12/14/manning/

Sounds like Wikileaks is shafting him on payment: http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503543_162-20025358-503543.html

12/15/2010 3:16:06 PM

The Salon article has already been addressed....come on smc, is that all you got?

12/15/2010 3:19:33 PM

Glenn Greenwald should be careful, our President decides who is a journalist and who isn't. Those who aren't can be punished. Salon's not a real publication, after all. Traitors can be hanged.

12/15/2010 3:19:37 PM

According to reports, smc is a plaster cast of Oprah Winfrey's vagina that somehow gained sentience and was given a laptop.

12/15/2010 4:24:26 PM

Well since you say there are reports, I'm grudgingly forced to agree.

12/16/2010 12:02:50 AM

message_topic.aspx?topic=606466

12/16/2010 3:54:55 PM

lullz, i find it amusing that everyone believes that every 'cable' is 100% real and legitimate....

12/16/2010 4:33:01 PM

So far the US government has failed to refute any of it. I would imagine that if false cables were being released we would be hearing all about it.

12/16/2010 4:59:41 PM

do you honestly think the government should justify, legitimize, confirm or deny every single cable?

are you being serious right now? you do realize that would only add to the damage already done, right?

12/17/2010 12:05:04 AM

Quote :

"lullz, i find it amusing that everyone believes that every 'cable' is 100% real and legitimate...."

So you are saying some of them are forgeries? By who? Anti-government people? By pro-government psy-ops agents?

12/17/2010 2:31:56 AM

^ Well, depending on how tight your tin foil is, there's always the possibility that Assange is working for the government and "leaked" these cables to ensure further laws restricting government openness and communications in general.

Still, we haven't had that level of crazy here since salisbury boy left.

12/17/2010 7:39:58 AM

Quote :

"do you honestly think the government should justify, legitimize, confirm or deny every single cable? are you being serious right now? you do realize that would only add to the damage already done, right?"

Do you honestly think that if they could prove a cable was falsified they wouldn't do it? They would love a chance to be able to say "he is making all this up see we have proof".

12/17/2010 7:52:41 AM

Quote :

"The cyberwar has taken an even more sinister turn in foreign capitals, with some countries generating fake cables to bolster their political agendas. Already one Pakistani news agency had to retract cables, published in Pakistani newspapers about India meddling in Pakistani affairs. One, revealed to be a forgery, spoke of India's role in supporting insurgents in Pakistan's tribal regions, while another talked about rifts in India's top army command and yet another mentioned "Bosnialike genocide" by the Indian army in Kashmir. The potential for diplomatic missteps based on erroneous information is enormous."

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-12-15/politics/sweep.wikileaks_1_cables-diplomats-afghan-leader/5?_s=PMOLITICS

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/10/wikileaks-fake-cables-pakistan-apologies

12/17/2010 9:18:49 AM

I am honestly surprised the US hasn't tried that ploy. I am waiting for the "there were weapons of mass destruction" cable.

12/17/2010 10:12:24 AM

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/12/wikileaks-did-not-commit-crime-conyers/

Quote :

"And so whatever you think about this controversy, it is clear that prosecuting Wikileaks would raise the most fundamental questions about freedom of speech, about who is a journalist, and about what the public can know about the actions of its own government," Conyers said. The crime Wikileaks would be charged with involves obtaining classified government information and disseminating it to the public, which journalists have done in the past without being prosecuted. In a parallel example, the leak of the Pentagon Papers -- passed to the New York Times by government whistleblower Daniel Ellsberg -- was upheld as constitutional by the Supreme Court in the 1971 case New York Times Co. v. United States."

12/17/2010 1:14:55 PM

How far the NYT has fallen. Now they are actively colluding with the US government to discredit and suppress information.

12/17/2010 1:31:51 PM

Quote :

"How far the NYT has fallen. Now they are actively colluding with the US government to discredit and suppress information."

Business as usual, they haven't "fallen" anywhere.

12/17/2010 4:19:58 PM

Interesting stuff from a WikiLeaks defector, the guy who will start OpenLeaks to stay true to the original WikiLeaks goal, as per his assertions.

http://www.theaustralian.com.au/news/world/wikileaks-defector-daniel-domscheit-berg-reveals-julian-assanges-siege-mentality/story-e6frg6so-1225930625424

http://www.aolnews.com/2010/12/14/wikileaks-revolt-ex-assange-colleague-forms-openleaks

Assange seems to be a total narcissist.



His many "sex-crimes" in Sweden:

http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2037078,00.html

Behind Assange's Arrest: Sweden's Sex-Crime Problem

Quote :

"It is under this wider definition of the word that police wish to question Assange. Police reports state that the allegations against Assange center around claims by two Swedish women who say that on separate occasions each had consented to have sex with Assange, but that sometime during or after the encounter, he engaged in sexual behavior against their will. According to the Swedish branch of Interpol, a recent arrest warrant for Assange states that the rape accusation stems from a sexual encounter in which the woman "was asleep and in a helpless state." There is also a sexual-molestation allegation based on claims that in a different incident, "the pair [were] sleeping naked together and the suspect [pushed] his naked erect penis into her body." And prosecutors also want to question Assange in relation to the suspicion that he sexually coerced one of the women by "lying on top of [her], using his weight to prevent her from moving, and forcefully spreading her legs," and that he sexually molested both women by "having sex without the use of a condom, without the woman's knowledge.""

And I would like to repost my post from the previous page:


FOR THOSE WHO WANT TO READ THE CABLES AND ARTICLES DISCUSSING THEM

These are 2 great interactive sites where you can click on a country's map to see all the cables emanating from there, as well as succinct summaries:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/interactive/2010/nov/28/us-embassy-cables-wikileaks

http://www.spiegel.de/flash/flash-24861.html



These are well worth a click as well:

Key Points at a Glance
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/nov/29/wikileaks-embassy-cables-key-points

The World's Reaction
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/10/wikileaks-reaction-world-reaction

12/17/2010 6:35:51 PM

It is sad and hypocritical how the US government and citizens scold Pakistan for their lack of human rights and support of terrorism, yet, at the same time, they (ans Europe) suck India's dick hailing it as some great democracy which upholds laws, even sharing nuclear secrets with them.

WikiLeaks cables: India accused of systematic use of torture in Kashmir
Beatings and electric shocks inflicted on hundreds of civilians detained in Kashmir, US diplomats in Delhi told by ICRC
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2010/dec/16/wikileaks-cables-indian-torture-kashmir

Fact is, India is a thuggish state where the police will beat the shit out of you on streets in full daylight and no one can help you. Corruption runs rampant, police brutality is appalling, child slavery is widespread, crimes against women (dowry burnings, killings, gang-rapes) happen all the time and are severely under-reported, and the government tortures citizens and kills them extra-judicially.

If they weren't so advanced in IT AND weren't located in a hotspot, nobody would give a shit about them, least of all the US.

12/17/2010 8:02:51 PM

I saw a rickshaw driver in India get whipped in the face with a cop's billy club for blocking traffic.

12/17/2010 9:25:55 PM

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1339859/Wikileaks-Julian-Assanges-promiscuous-lifestyle-revealed-Jemima-Khan-look-away-now.html

The wildly promiscuous lifestyle of WikiLeaks boss Julian Assange: Look away now Jemima as our report reveals the sordid truth

Nice long read. Beginning:

Quote :

"* Accusers went to police after he refused AIDS test * Days before, he stole THIRD girl from boyfriend's bed * Ex-colleague accuses him of acting like a dictator * Top Guardian journalist now refuses to deal with him The two women who say they were sexually assaulted by the WikiLeaks editor Julian Assange would never have complained to police if he had agreed to take an HIV test, The Mail on Sunday can reveal. WikiLeaks’s Swedish co-ordinator, who worked closely with Mr Assange for months, said in an exclusive interview that he repeatedly begged his boss to have the test, both to head off the possible police investigation and for Mr Assange’s own peace of mind, given his promiscuous sex life. ‘The two women told me, that if he goes to the clinic for an HIV test, then we won’t go to the police,’ said Mr Assange’s colleague, who wishes to remain anonymous because he is a witness in the case brought by Swedish prosecutors, which led to Mr Assange spending nine days in Wandsworth Prison pending extradition."

Also good:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-1339862/Wikileakss-Julian-Assange-preaches-openness-demands-privacy.html

He preaches openness but demands privacy. He reveals 'secrets' but 99% are prurient gossip. He's accused of rape but won't face his accusers. Why do the Left worship the WikiLeaks 'God'?

If this is true, then he is a bad person:

Quote :

"Assange proved he was out of control in August when he demanded $700,000 from Amnesty International which had politely asked him to ensure WikiLeaks did not publish names of Afghan civilians who might then be targeted by the Taliban. Some called it blackmail."

WTF? That's seriously nasty

12/19/2010 5:40:08 PM

More stuff.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340173/I-locked-paedophiles-child-killers-WikiLeaks-boss-Julian-Assange-tells-prison-hell.html

I was locked up with paedophiles and child killers: WikiLeaks boss Julian Assange tells of prison hell

Quote :

"Mr Assange also revealed that he has been bombarded with death threats from U.S. soldiers. Mr Assange says his son Daniel (left) has received death threats. Meanwhile U.S. Vice President Joe Biden (right) has compared the whistleblower to a 'high-tech terrorist' and confirmed the administration is searching for ways to take legal action against him Mr Assange claims his son Daniel, 20, and his lawyer have received similar chilling warnings. Speaking from the Suffolk estate where he is living after being released on £275,000 bail, he said: 'I receive death threats all the time. My lawyer receives them, my son receives them. 'Most of them seem to come from members of the United States armed forces.'"

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340057/WikiLeaks-boss-Assange-fathered-son-girl-17--learned-dark-arts-hacking-rundown-cottage.html

Revealed: The secret son Assange fathered with a girl of 17 - as he learned the dark arts of computer hacking in a rundown cottage




http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1340068/WikiLeaks-boss-Julian-Assanges-week-Sweden-grows-sleazier.html

Tables turned on WikiLeaks chief: Girl No 3 surfaces as the story of the 'seducer' Assange's week in Sweden grows ever sleazier

Quote :

"She tried to reach for a condom but Assange held her arms and pinned her legs, she stated to police. He then agreed to use a condom but, Miss A alleges, he did ‘something’ to it that resulted in it becoming ripped. When police interviewed Assange, he said he did not tear the condom and was not aware it had been torn. After that night, he continued to sleep in her bed for a week and she had never even mentioned it, he said. Certainly, that is one of the most puzzling aspects of the case against Assange. For not only did Miss A indeed let him stay, she threw a party in his honour the night after he allegedly assaulted her."

12/20/2010 9:38:54 PM

lol sounds like juicy gossip

12/20/2010 9:57:58 PM

Assange's lawyer complains about leaked documents

http://patterico.com/2010/12/19/assanges-lawyer-complains-about-leaked-documents-from-his-rape-case/

Quote :

"In a move that surprised many of Mr Assange’s closest supporters on Saturday, The Guardian newspaper published previously unseen police documents that accused Mr Assange in graphic detail of sexually assaulting two Swedish women. One witness is said to have stated: “Not only had it been the world’s worst screw, it had also been violent.” Bjorn Hurtig, Mr Assange’s Swedish lawyer, said he would lodge a formal complaint to the authorities and ask them to investigate how such sensitive police material leaked into the public domain."

Quote :

"“I do not like the idea that Julian may be forced into a trial in the media. And I feel especially concerned that he will be presented with the evidence in his own language for the first time when reading the newspaper. I do not know who has given these documents to the media, but the purpose can only be one thing – trying to make Julian look bad.”"

LOL, the irony is just too thick.


Assange tried to take credit for the Climategate leaks

http://seeker401.wordpress.com/2010/12/15/assange-tries-to-take-credit-for-climategate-and-backs-the-corrupt-scientists-the-jury-has-its-verdict/

This is particularly insane, because Climategate polarized the global warming discussion and set back climate legislation, causes that Assange's biggest fans are all gung ho about. I'm not sure what Assange was trying to prove with this one, but this comment presents a theory: Assange's massive ego at work again.

Quote :

"What a pair of blowhards. They were obviously unnerved by the question. They evidently like leaks that embarrass their political opponents, but in this case they found themselves tagged with a leak that had damaged the side they like; and since it seems to be more about political warfare against governments they dislike than some impartial ideal of transparency and freedom of information, they were stuck scrambling to make up a story about how it really served some nobler purpose. Of course they should simply have said that they weren’t the source of the leak, that it was in full circulation long before anyone looked to them for a copy and they didn’t know much about the details of what followed. But that would have been too humble, especially in front of a room full of simpering hero-worshippers. So they pretended to be insiders and proceeded to deliver a few minutes of sheer drivel."

12/21/2010 3:04:07 AM

^Wow, what a scathing analysis editorial wildy speculative rant.

12/21/2010 9:34:00 AM

Somebody point out to me the relevance of Mr. Assange's sleezery or hypocrisy please

12/21/2010 10:04:20 AM