did he fall asleep at the hillary clinton thing

4/30/2020 10:33:55 AM

I'm sure her story will change drastically as we get closer to the election

4/30/2020 10:34:16 AM

seriously though, no one wants to take a stab at defending how much her story has changed in the past year?

4/30/2020 10:35:09 AM

maybe she was scared

4/30/2020 10:37:25 AM

Maybe she suffered massive trauma and was afraid of reliving that trauma in public only for people to say she is a liar and start a smear campaign?

Also

Quote :

"Bell, who works as a victim advocate at a university in Boston, acknowledged that some parts of Reade’s account are confusing. But she is adamant that that doesn’t mean the country should sweep her story under the rug. “There are no ‘perfect victims,’ and what I would do or what others would do in Ms. Reade’s shoes is, ultimately, not relevant,” she said. “Trauma is messy. Survival is messy.”"

From this story about assault survivors opinions on the situation
https://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/us_5ea08034c5b6a486d08327f8

Also

Quote :

"Just this week, a former neighbor of Reade’s explicitly told Business Insider that she had been informed of the details in the mid-’90s, saying, “And he kind of put her up against a wall. And he put his hand up her skirt and he put his fingers inside her.” This would match Reade’s own, most recent description of her encounter with Biden."

https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2020/04/mother-jones-demonstrates-how-not-to-publish-your-opinion-about-joe-biden-and-tara-reade.html

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 10:57 AM. Reason : E]

4/30/2020 10:53:51 AM

For what it’s worth, Biden should address this head on but under no circumstances should he listen to complete and utter frauds like Mitch McConnell and open up the entirety of his Senate records. That is 100% a fishing fraud by the GOP.

In fact he should straight up tell McConnell to fuck right off.

^ there actually are inconsistencies that should be examined but that’s pretty common in these cases where there is trauma.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 11:07 AM. Reason : X]

4/30/2020 11:06:06 AM

you mean intimidated... which basically happens to all victims.

is anyone going after the others? like the neighbor? trying to discredit them? because the whole "whatever" look is the worst thing they could possibly do if all these people are truly full of shit.

4/30/2020 11:07:14 AM

I'm really hoping that someone else gets the nomination, Biden sucks (whether this is true or not)

4/30/2020 11:40:05 AM

These cases are always difficult. Is it a smear campaign? Is it defamation? Is it true? Seeing as how everybody on this board got emotionally involved in the Duke LAX case, let's not pretend like there isn't historical precedent of people exaggerating and making shit up. It does happen.

However, detailed accounts that only a victim would be able to ascertain, as well as corroborating events from other parties or victims, should definitely not be ignored. Even if that spells disaster for biden and the dems, and of course... even IF the same thing happened to Trump (where there was quite a bit of damning evidence) and he completely got away with it, we shouldn't just brush it off as slander or a money grab.



[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 12:01 PM. Reason : a]

4/30/2020 11:45:54 AM

When does Bill Barr announce the DOJ investigation?

4/30/2020 12:20:33 PM

I'm only talking about the contradictions between now and last April. If she clearly recalled the incident in the 90s (as supported from her coached witnesses), then why give the report in April '19 that said it was touching on the neck and wasn't sexual?

Not the nominee? Inappropriate touching
Presumptive nominee? Now it's rape
Not getting tracking? Off to Fox News to shit on Clinton

Witnesses are being coached, or at least primed, to remember stuff from years ago.

Blasey Ford had documented proof she talked about being rape. She went to her Congress representative. She talked about it under oath. She named Kavanaugh in her criminal complaint. She didn't sit there and try to smear other Republicans. Reade is nothing like this.

All women should be taken seriously and their claims seriously, and I welcome any investigation into this, but right now I don't think her claims are credible

4/30/2020 12:29:18 PM

Quote :

"Witnesses are being coached, or at least primed, to remember stuff from years ago."

You're going to need some pretty great sources for this claim to not look like a conspiracy theorist

4/30/2020 12:34:01 PM

If you interview a witness verbally and they say 'oh I remember Biden touched her shoulders and neck" and then a few days letter they text back and say 'oh, btw, he raped her too it doesn't strike me as reliable

4/30/2020 12:49:57 PM

I am just waiting for more stuff to come out. Like, wasn't the deal behind the AB case something about her wanting to make a settlement, and AB was all "yeah, cool story, fuck off" and then she went public with it? That would also be important to know.

^People add info to such stories/accounts all the time as authorities or departments start to ask more pertinent questions. Sometimes those additional details add up, and sometimes they don't. But, it is generally accepted that something should not be immediately dimissed just because more info came out at a later time.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 1:04 PM. Reason : h]

4/30/2020 1:03:11 PM

^^^ Nathan J Robinson (who is a deeply weird dude regardless) admitted he “coached” the brother so not really a conspiracy. Doesn’t have one iota of impact as to whether or not she is lying or being truthful, though and bringing it up as a defense of Biden is de facto saying you don’t believe it.

The most bizarre conspiracy I’ve seen, though, is that it mirrors a novel her dad wrote in a book. Like, hello, a lot of sexual assaults are exactly as she described including at least one of Trumps 25 accusers.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 1:06 PM. Reason : X]

4/30/2020 1:06:16 PM

Also, Reade called the neighbor from the BI story, out of the blue, and said 'oh hey this Joe Biden thing is coming up again..." and then the neighbor went to BI. That's priming

4/30/2020 1:15:02 PM

https://twitter.com/kthalps/status/1255914354538577921?s=21

So this kind of gets to the heart of the situation from a political standpoint. It’s shitty but what does Biden have to gain from releasing anything if people go this direction and preemptively say he’s holding things back. There is literally no political upside to it. Just downside.

It’s fine to have this opinion, but the only thing that will make people satisfied is if Biden drops out and Bernie is installed as the nominee. I’m not even saying they are wrong but they should just say it.

“Biden might be a rapist, we can’t afford to find out. Install Bernie as the nominee to beat Trump.”

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 2:20 PM. Reason : X]

4/30/2020 2:19:40 PM

And honestly, removing Biden as nominee and installing Bernie might make the most sense. Normal Dems will vote for any not-Trump. Me included. Is it worth the drama dealing with this through November. You get the Bernie votes without losing many normie votes. Why not?

Sure it’s anti-Democratic and deeply hypocritical but at the end of the day the ONLY thing that matters to me is getting rid of Trump.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 2:25 PM. Reason : X]

4/30/2020 2:24:45 PM

yeah, but that option doesn't preclude the possibility that Bernie has the same kinda dirt that's just waiting for October. Trump faced similar allegations and just sailed through it, "it's just locker room talk folks, calm down!" because the majority of people voting for him aren't gonna care. Dems face a different type of scrutiny. I don't know if they should be in jump the ship mode just yet.

However, this coming out now as opposed to later in the election gives me the feeling that Biden is in trouble.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 2:44 PM. Reason : a]

4/30/2020 2:31:45 PM

At this point, absolutely nothing will convince some people that Reade is lying. Like that tweet thread, some people will take lack of evidence as proof it happened.

Also, fuck installing Bernie as the candidate. If Biden drops now, pick the nominee at the convention. If Biden drops after, let the VP pick be the nominee. Not some undemocratic nonsense to appease bernie bros.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 2:44 PM. Reason : a]

4/30/2020 2:44:07 PM

there is a 0.00% chance (outside of getting sick and/or dying) that Biden isn't the nominee

4/30/2020 2:45:48 PM

him "getting sick" is a fairly plausible out for the dems right now.

4/30/2020 2:51:15 PM

So everyone here thinks it would definitely be Bernie if Biden drops out, and not Hillary swooping in at the last minute?

4/30/2020 2:57:55 PM

It might not be Bernie, but it definitely won't be Hillary.

Even if Sanders wins in this hypothetical, it will be a bloody mess getting there. It would not be 'Hey, let's throw Bernie in there easy-peasy-lemon-squeezy!'

4/30/2020 2:59:28 PM

If Biden dropped out, which I don't think is likely, I think it would be Warren or Cuomo.

4/30/2020 3:00:13 PM

Please God, not Cuomo.

4/30/2020 3:05:08 PM

Pete's got the best chance. Let's face it, his military background and relatively clean pedigree to date does him a lot of favors.

4/30/2020 3:07:56 PM

I bet Cuomo has major skeletons in his closet as a new yorker, and i bet trump knows where some of those skeletons are. Trump and has family were bribing a lot of New York officials to get away with their schemes.

4/30/2020 3:09:39 PM

I didn't say I was pleased with the choice, but I think it would be him or Warren.

I would much prefer Warren currently over Biden though. I think a Warren/Pete ticket would have been interesting to see.

4/30/2020 3:09:49 PM

Cuomo would def. poll well right now, given his leadership during the NYC COVID crisis.

4/30/2020 3:15:43 PM

Cuomo is Giuliani.

4/30/2020 3:25:43 PM

Quote :

"I bet Cuomo has major skeletons in his closet as a new yorker"

So did Trump. Nobody cared.

The current political landscape in this country is fucking insane right now. You got people on the right that view their GOP candidates as religious figures that are out to protect their religious rights and the american way of life. Then you got the dems that are more practical in nature and discuss issues such as health care, education, and tackling viable threats to our society such as COVID with logical scientific thinking and procedures. It doesn't matter to the right though, cuz the left are all a bunch of commies that want to give your money to the crack head on the street.

Meanwhile, the left can't find a candidate that would hold up to the right's scrutiny because at the end of the day, they wouldn't vote for the most pristine presidential candidate in the history of mankind if he identified as a Dem.

4/30/2020 3:28:43 PM

Quote :

"So did Trump. Nobody cared."

Stopped reading right there.

4/30/2020 3:29:43 PM

Quote :

" there is a 0.00% chance (outside of getting sick and/or dying) that Biden isn't the nominee"

This is obviously correct but it would make social media and message boards boring tbh.

4/30/2020 3:33:05 PM

Quote :

"At this point, absolutely nothing will convince some people that Reade is lying. Like that tweet thread, some people will take lack of evidence as proof it happened. Also, fuck installing Bernie as the candidate. If Biden drops now, pick the nominee at the convention. If Biden drops after, let the VP pick be the nominee. Not some undemocratic nonsense to appease bernie bros. "

For the first part, the opposite is also true. For the 2nd part, how are either of those options more democratic then giving it to the person who got the 2nd most votes??

4/30/2020 3:38:00 PM

Can you admit that some of the witnesses were primed/coached?

4/30/2020 3:40:12 PM

Just installing Bernie would be the easiest way. God, a convention selection would be a set your own hair on fire clusterfuck.

If you just said “you win Bernie” people would yell on twitter for five minutes and fall in line to vote against Trump.

(Again, caveat being Biden ain’t dropping out).

4/30/2020 3:45:09 PM

Quote :

"LaCasse: Just recently. Tara called me and said, "Oh my gosh, this Joe Biden thing is coming up again." I said, "Oh my God, that." I had forgotten about it."

4/30/2020 3:47:44 PM

I couldn't find any proof of NYMs statement. The guy he references outright denies coaching. I couldn't find any evidence of your neighbor claim since you didn't bother to post any info. Feel free to show me a link or quote.

^thanks got a link?

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 3:54 PM. Reason : E]

4/30/2020 3:53:55 PM

BI released the interview behind their paywall

https://web.archive.org/web/20200428024302/https://www.businessinsider.com/the-former-neighbor-of-joe-bidens-accuser-on-coming-forward-2020-4

4/30/2020 3:58:13 PM

Quote :

"McHugh: When did you and Tara talk? Did she ask you to come forward? Walk me through the process of that. LaCasse: Well, you know, I live a kind of a quiet life. So I didn't really even think about coming forward. And I didn't really want to. But if she needed me to, then I thought, well, I guess I will. I have a really drama-free life. And so I didn't want to bring a bunch of stuff on myself, and I loved Tara to death. But she has some drama. McHugh: When did you first reconnect with Tara after she moved away? Was that 2016? LaCasse: I think that was about it, yeah. McHugh: She reached out to you? LaCasse: Yeah. She did. McHugh: OK. After you and Tara reconnected, when was the first time you discussed the Biden accusation, and the conversations you and Tara had about it? LaCasse: I think it was last year. McHugh: Who initiated that conversation, and what was the context? LaCasse: I think she did. She mentioned that she had come forward with it, and so I said, "Oh my gosh. Yeah. I do remember that.""

4/30/2020 4:00:59 PM

Look, the guy (Nathan) is a clown and him talking to a witness doesn’t have anything to do with Reade’s claim so I really hesitate to further this... but he deleted all his tweets before around 4/20 so you wouldn’t see it.

“Coaching” can mean a lot of thing a which is why I put it in quotes.

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/EWw9C1QXkAEOZIx?format=jpg&name=large

Does anyone know if Ronan Farrow was pitched this? Genuinely curious if he has made any thoughts public because there is basically no one id trust more with due diligence and non-agenda driven reporting (and yes I know who his partner is)

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 4:07 PM. Reason : X]

4/30/2020 4:03:43 PM

I think some rando advising her brother to go back to the wapo and add the sexual assault and him doing that is 100% coaching.

4/30/2020 4:07:06 PM

I also want to clarify that I actually don’t agree with ^. Barring any new information I actually think her story is quite credible and should be disqualifying (even though I know that isn’t reality).

But there is huge difference between questioning a story/witnesses and engaging in conspiracy. ^ did not engage in “shes a Russian op” or “she copied her dads novel” bullshit that is in the twitter fever swamps.

4/30/2020 4:16:58 PM

lol at Biden saying he would consider Republicans in his cabinet. Imagine thinking that sways anyone from GOP side at this point.

I think they're trying to lose.

4/30/2020 4:21:21 PM

I don't believe she is a Russian agent. (The story is being amplified by bot nets, no question about that though)

I also have not heard about the novel thing until today, but don't believe that.

I believe her initial story she reported in 2019 is probably accurate

4/30/2020 4:21:54 PM

Helping someone prepare their testimony isn't coaching, from a legal perspective. Nathan Robinson is obviously biased in this but Amanda Marcotte is a total hack artist so it's good the witness had help.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 4:25 PM. Reason : .]

4/30/2020 4:22:45 PM

Dave, do you honestly not see anything shady about that guy saying 'No, you back to the WaPo and tell this story instead' and then deleting all his tweets about it?

4/30/2020 4:40:33 PM

Biden to appear on Morning Joe tomorrow to respond to the Tara Reade allegations

4/30/2020 4:47:06 PM

Thanks for the expanded interview, I don't think asking someone to come forward is "priming" them. Most witnesses of anything aren't just randomly coming forward, they are being asked my police or attorneys or something.

^^I don't see anything in that deleted tweet that says Robinson told him to go back to the Post.

[Edited on April 30, 2020 at 4:50 PM. Reason : E]

4/30/2020 4:49:52 PM