theorycraft mod will do that for melee, not sure about drdamage

9/13/2007 7:45:45 PM

if you'd only rolled an orc.... +69 spell dmg would kill those twink warriors.

9/13/2007 10:05:20 PM

orc twink warlocks are fucking sick nasty.

9/15/2007 6:44:04 PM

So did they fix Shaman yet?

9/15/2007 7:21:29 PM

i'm interested to see how they 'fix' the afk in bg's thing

9/15/2007 8:49:51 PM

Yep instead I rolled a BE warlock but I think the +200 eventually around +300 dmg will do the trick

9/16/2007 8:48:17 AM

9/17/2007 8:04:26 AM

clutch ret pally

9/17/2007 11:31:27 AM

actually he's not a ret pally haha


i think we sometimes have one respec ret for morogrim though.

9/17/2007 11:44:35 AM

WoW is seriously dead. It's ridiculous that blizzard has taken ~2 months to release a non-content patch since its release on the PTR. People are getting sick of the same old content (same problem as before TBC came out). We all know WotLK isn't gonna be out for at least another year or so. What can we expect in that time? ZA, a 5 man, and a raid instance harder than BT? ZA and the 5 man will get old after about a month, and I'd say only 1% of the WoW population will ever see Sunwell Plateau.

9/17/2007 12:32:39 PM

For sure. while it was a change of pace to have the options of instances at the beginning of TBC (mag, gruul, kara, ssc, TK) i think they blew their load in a sense considering with all of my previously listed instances, plus BT and Hyjal already out there.

The fast guilds are clearing stuff faster with the ease of BC raiding and the non 'hardcore' guilds arent clearing content any faster really. IMO the only guilds that were affected by the easing up of raiding in BC (change in consumables and overall quicker downing of bosses) is the upper middleclass-esque guilds. The kind of 2nd Tier guilds if you will from pre BC. The ones who werent on the cutting edge but were still way ahead of the short bus guilds. And even then, killing these bosses doesnt have the same merit/enjoyment as it did Pre BC. Speeding through these instances just doesnt provide the same excitement as downing a boss that took awhile to work on (C'thun, Patchwerk, Nef, etc) pre BC. And on top of that, Arena season 2 meant nothing to me. In my eyes, the first Arena season is what mattered, proving yourself over everyone else because for the most part no one was established in the arena yet. And a lot of the best teams didnt even return for the second season.

Anyways im done with my rambling, but thats why i quit/just sign on to do arena with friends who werent serious enough to be on my arena teams last season but i still like hanging out with them and getting them some points

9/17/2007 12:48:21 PM

Yeah it seems in arena season 1 the playing field was a lot more level as far as gear goes. I only ran a 2v2 team so I wasnt racking up the points 5v5 did and through such great team matching technology we continue to end up matched against warrior/paladin teams in 5 pieces of season 2 gear and well needless to say Im about tired of warriors charging me and killing me before I even get a chance to move. Oh and has anyone heard anything about then nerfing mace spec? I've heard both stories, but in my opinion it is seriously needed. I'd say when fighting a warrior the proc rate against me has to be nearly 75% its ridiculous.

9/17/2007 3:35:24 PM

^Yeah the big problem with that is that they nerfed Stormherald because of that. As a Shaman I procced with Stormherald maybe 3% of the time. Warriors were getting, like you mentioned, around 50% proc rate with Stormherald/mace spec and people were blaming the weapon.

9/17/2007 4:15:56 PM

that's because they have mace spec, and the stormherald stun effect as well. These 2 working with each other can give you a bad day. It's mostly mace spec is the problem, well whichever gives the fateful words on your screen...

[Mace Stun Effect]

then follows like 2x 2400 crits.

9/17/2007 4:31:05 PM

it wasnt even close to 50% but yes it was overpowered. With talents in mace spec with the speed of that mace it was like ~11% based on talents? and then the weapon itself only procced 2% of the time at max. So you were looking at 13%, but given the fact that a stun is complete incapacitation without a pvp trinket up thats pretty strong.

That being said I never ended up giving in and stuck with my axe spec even tho it was definitely a slight disadvantage for me compared to using cookie cutter mace.

9/17/2007 4:35:55 PM

Yep most of the time it ends up charge stun 2500 MS with mace stun, whirlwhind for like 2700, normal hit for 1800 with mace stun, then 4k execute, followed by "FUCK MACE SPEC GODDAMNIT!"

9/17/2007 4:42:09 PM

dont forget your stun meta gems.

Or specing 35/5/21 (because tossing in con blow is like kicking a kid after you run over his dog)

9/17/2007 5:29:43 PM

would be funny but no PH, no deathwish, and no imp intercept would make it a crappy arena build

9/17/2007 5:32:17 PM

its more for irritating ppl to death then highly competitive. But it will serve fine up to about 1700 or so rating (at least in 2v2 and 3v3 in season 1.)

9/17/2007 5:36:45 PM

mace spec needs a nerf, but so do warriors in general. with a healer they're unstoppable. spriest + lock combo is pretty broken too. it's silly that you only see half the classes represented in the big arena tournaments and the at the top of the ladders. you see like 3 combos too; frost mage + resto/moonkin druid (all of their cc's reset each other's DR), warrior + healer, particularly paladin until really high ranks, then you see more priest/war combos for mana burn, warlock + spriest (3 months and still no patch to fix dots and res).

I quit the shittastic pve of this game, it's proven a colossal waste of time and drain on my life.

9/17/2007 11:59:55 PM

Some combos are going to be stronger than others. Mace warriors by themselves are still meh in PVP, same with paladins, unless they're specced completely ret-pvp.

You've mentioned most of the classes right there, so whats the problem? I can only think of one class that is truly in need of a pvp buff - shamans.

9/18/2007 12:08:03 AM

It's frustrating listening to you say warriors are so OP (which is true) BUT ONLY when they are elite geared. I am a mid-geared warrior and we get owned. Guess you gotta have the right spec.. whats the preferred pvp warr spec?

9/18/2007 8:12:09 AM

most of the classes?
no rogues, no hunters, no shamen, and really mages are kinda meh and usually better replaced with a lock now that anyone can drink in arena.
but seriously, how the fuck can you argue from the "most" classes stand point when blizz have nerfed the fuck out of every skill requiring exclusivity in the game? it's like.. yeah, you can get all these phat pvp loots, if you're a certain class. if not you can get awesome pve loot, but unless you're in BT, it's not gonna work in pvp.

As far as warriors go, I've got MOST (need 2 items) of the best gear until hyjal/BT with arena 2 weapons and I absolutely get my shit pushed against a blue geared MS warrior with his only epic being his crafted weapon or gorehowl. 5 point expose armor, wound poison for his second wind, using bleeds for every finisher due to lack of mitigation, with evasion, blade flurry, and adrenaline rush up, I'm lucky to win 1 out of 10 duels. (pvp gear stats are like 1700ap, 190ish hit, 31% crit 9700hp)

[Edited on September 18, 2007 at 11:05 AM. Reason : and I'm not crying because I suck. I do 2v2 with a priest clicker in pve gear and we're 1800+]

9/18/2007 11:01:50 AM

dear scissors, meet rock.


wow #101.

I am scissors, we need buffs, paper is fine, rock is OP.



warriors beat rogues.. but if you are that geared and loosing to a warrior in L70 blues and a tier 1 BS weapon, you are doing something wrong (or he has all blue pvp gear, stacked with RES, and you have on all pve gear packing maybe 40 resilience, so his crits actually hurt and yours dont)

9/18/2007 11:47:58 AM

Resilience is what I was thinking too, dont underestimate the power of resilience.

9/18/2007 11:51:29 AM

honestly a rogue with 1700+ap and 9700hps (and over 30% crit) should have no problems dealing with a warrior in blues, regardless of how he stacks his gear. In full PvE gear I can take on equally geared warriors and put a nice dent in them before they kill me. Given, I won't kill them, but they also have less than 50% hp's. I really can't imagine a blue warrior taking me down unless he was damn good or really lucky.

9/18/2007 12:00:28 PM

i used to play a warrior. at the time before i quit him, he had full instance/quest blue gear, and then Lunar Crescent. I was easily getting 2200-2400 MS crits on rogues, and basically pummeling them into oblivion. So I can see how he might be getting killed by them.

9/18/2007 12:15:54 PM

to be fair, i saw bigger crits too back when people had blue gear and i had my lunar crescent than during last season with my mooncleaver and full arena 1 gear with ssc accessories due to resilience. Breaking 2k was a rare occasion once resilience came into play at the start of the arena season opposed to when i first hit the BGs with my Lunar Crescent I broke 4k several times a week or so into BC.

the weapons got better, but people's armor increased SUBSTANTIALLY from the greens and blues they had when i had my lunar crescent along with resilience to the point, like i pointed out, i was hitting weaker with much better gear with my mooncleaver.

9/18/2007 12:49:23 PM

rogues need pvp buffs, deep thunder/stormherald hit hard.

9/18/2007 1:45:40 PM

rogues either need more damage mitigation (really this is what dps warriors are for so i'm against it in general) or higher damage output. with the nerfs to haste in the next patch it seems like they won't get higher burst damage anytime soon, and i doubt the armor idea will be addressed either.

9/18/2007 1:54:31 PM

compared to a year ago, how much of the population is gone?

9/18/2007 11:36:19 PM

its growing

9/19/2007 9:20:45 AM

there don't seem to be any population issues on the older servers. newer servers may have issues, but thats why they're made, for lower and newer people.

9/19/2007 9:28:51 AM

Give rogues 2 AP per agility and problem solved Ok so I would love that on my rogue, but on all my other chars not so much. Yeah a paladin/warrior combo in 2v2 if well geared I dont see how they could lose unless going against the same combo. I run a well geared resto shaman with a warrior and I can survive for a long time, but no bubble to avoid a stunlock like a paladin.

9/19/2007 9:49:00 AM

that'd be sick. I'd have somewhere near 3k ap in that case. haha

9/19/2007 10:02:08 AM

^^^ eh it depends. population? or active population? I've been on Stormreaver since it was a release server and was even one of the most pvp active servers for a long time. And it is quite dead now for the most part.

Only 1 Horde guild in BT/Hyjal and probably only 2 or so alliance guilds. and only 2 horde guilds in the next tier down working on ssc. Although this has more to do with free realm transfers that happened last summer :/

To give you an example of how this sucks compared to pre BC on this server, a guild I was a part of (Original Gangstaz) was like the 3rd Horde guild to kill C'thun or something with Gentlemens Club (another top world horde guild for a long time) right on OG's heals that week. And on the alliance side Impervious had an overall world 2nd that same week. In total we had 2 horde and 4 alliance guilds kill C'thun in the same week (the first week anyone was killing him in the world with the hotfix), several of them top 10 worldwide. A similar story for all the same guilds on Nefarian before that too.

Beyond that there were probably 4 other horde guilds working on AQ40 or up to Twin Emps and probably more alliance guilds than that. This may not sound huge but think of it this way: Picture on your server right now 2 Horde guilds that can kill Illidan with 4 others with at least 1 BT boss down. Its like night and day there on SR.

[Edited on September 19, 2007 at 10:06 AM. Reason : ]

9/19/2007 10:06:49 AM

@ rogues tho, definitely do not need more dmg output in my opinion right now. if you need something changed its going to have to go elsewhere. A good rogue should definitely beat more classes than it should lose to at the moment 1v1. Now maybe youre looking for something more viable in group pvp? I can see that perhaps

9/19/2007 10:09:07 AM

1v1 rogues are pretty good depending on their spec. if you blow all your cooldowns you're almost guranteed a kill (except on paladins stupid fucking bubble). The problem we're going to run into soon though is that caster damage is rising while rogue damage is being nerfed. I'll have to wait till the next patch but I wouldn't be surprised if equally geared casters start outdpsing rogues on traditionally melee-friendly bosses.

9/19/2007 10:17:27 AM

At least I can beat warlocks now so I won't complain, but yeah I have given up on beating a warrior that isnt in really shitty gear. Have you guys found it more beneficial to stack AP or crit as a rogue. I am specced combat fists and have ok gear, well it was ok now it kinda sucks. Last I looked I had around a 30-31% crit unbuffed but only like 1300 something AP. Im not raiding and slowly working on some pvp gear, but you only earn points so fast running 2v2. Armory link below tell me where I could improve. Keep in mind I do like to instance on this guy and he is also a farm bot. I guess what bothers me most is I run with a druid and he has his "eviscerate" hitting cloth wearers for 4k now where as mine is lucky to break 2k most of the time. Obviously its due to the fact they gave druids 2 AP per strength.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Destromath&n=Sporebat

Keep in mind I have fort and onslaught elixir on right now, but am wearing a riding crop instead of bladefists breadth or whatever that trinket it. I have enough points to pickup the season 2 shoulders right now and next week can pick up any of the pieces. Still debating if it would be best to save for the MH though with the fact season 3 is gonna require a certain rating and all that stuff. Always open to suggestions.

[Edited on September 19, 2007 at 10:28 AM. Reason : .]

9/19/2007 10:21:48 AM

I'd get rid of that offhand and get something faster if I were you, 1.8 is wayyyy to slow for a rogues offhand, plus you could get a fast sword offhand (latro's is the best at your current gear level unless you wanted to go arena 2). I'd also go for the ass. 4 piece since you already have 3, the energy you'll save over time will be nice, especially on bosses. I'd also try to stack more AP if I were you, anyone with res will laugh at your crit and your white damage will do next to nothing against them.

http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Mal%27Ganis&n=Skryll

I haven't enchanted or put any gems in my chest that I got last night, but that's my setup for maximized dps and it works fairly well in pvp too, though I'd probably drop a lot of hit and put it into Stam/AP if I were going for a pure pvp setup.

Also, get enchants on your gear, it'll raise your stats a lot.

[Edited on September 19, 2007 at 10:48 AM. Reason : .]

9/19/2007 10:47:39 AM

if you're doing pvp and not raiding, I would go 30-31. the last 2 tiers of combat are nice and all, but offer nothing in terms of control. that spec would also play better to your gear being stacked with crit and not hit/ap (you arent gonna get many potency procs with a 1.8 OH and 91 hit rating). for gems I would use shifting nightseye in every red socket, jagged talasite in every yellow, and solid star of elune in every blue. once you break 10k hp, 8res dawnstones in the yellow sockets are nice too.

9/19/2007 11:49:08 AM

yeah a respec seems more viable, obviously I am not going to ditch a season 2 offhand. I think the respec may help. I still want to be viable for running heroics, and I guess for farming any spec is viable for the most part so I'll look into that first and see what I can come up with.

9/19/2007 12:19:07 PM

nah, your combat spec is going to be worlds better for pve farming. get dodge and parry and riposte and you will barely ever have to stop and rest

9/19/2007 1:25:00 PM

anyone know just how hard mace spec+dt is going down for warriors. With the double nerf to hammer smithing (haste nerf for dw + stun nerf in pvp) i am seriously debating switching to axes (or hell, even armor)

9/19/2007 2:02:50 PM

I'd wait and test it out yourself, I haven't heard any huge complaints about it because it seems like most warriors know how broken it was themselves.

9/19/2007 2:10:11 PM

it wont be nerfed enough to make axe better. promise

9/19/2007 2:19:39 PM

i'll have to try it and see. I'll probably junk if for a season 3 weapon anyway

9/19/2007 3:53:02 PM

This game has morphed into something so much more complicated than it started as.


I miss the WoW of yesteryear.

9/19/2007 3:56:52 PM

Anyone in a kara raiding guild? I'm sure many of you are past that, but my guild has pretty much moved on to 25 mans and left a lot back in the dust... we are trying to recruit others, but I just want to join a guild that needs a kara tank.

9/19/2007 4:06:22 PM

or you could move to 25 man content and get better gear

9/19/2007 4:11:03 PM