Without engaging Earls craziness... this thing has the ability to spiral out of control quickly.

I have no clue what angle this will take to de-escalate but I'm pretty certain tweeting about China isn't going to do it.

7/5/2017 8:41:51 AM

http://thehill.com/blogs/pundits-blog/foreign-policy/331578-worried-about-war-with-north-korea-withdraw-from-south

This is a golden opportunity for Trump to implement an "America First" policy and rip up a one-sided deal. If we withdraw the troops, all parties will be better off. I'd compromise and offer the South a deal that they pay what American citizens pay if they want to keep our defense. Same offer for Japan.

7/5/2017 7:14:43 PM

bttt

7/8/2017 12:39:18 PM

Quote :

"Talk to someone who has fled NK. You have to try really really hard and twist yourself into a pretzel to find anything close to a comparison for NK and US. People who do this are harming the country by voting with that craziness inside them."

Obviously, someone who FLED the country is going to have bad things to say. Come on.

https://news.vice.com/story/photos-show-the-privileged-lives-of-north-koreas-new-elite
http://uk.reuters.com/article/uk-northkorea-change-consumption-idUKKBN0OJ2UY20150604
http://www.news.com.au/travel/travel-ideas/weird-and-wacky/north-korea-inside-the-lives-of-pyongyangs-rich-kids/news-story/e9b4dae09f05dbc272495cce2dd9faee

See? Anyone can make it in North Korea if they work hard and make smart decisions.

7/9/2017 2:34:15 AM

Quote :

"This is a golden opportunity for Trump to implement an "America First" policy and rip up a one-sided deal. If we withdraw the troops, all parties will be better off. I'd compromise and offer the South a deal that they pay what American citizens pay if they want to keep our defense. Same offer for Japan."

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/statements/2016/jan/10/donald-trump/donald-trump-mostly-wrong-we-get-practically-nothi/

http://www.latimes.com/nation/la-na-trump-allies-20160930-snap-story.html

Quote :

"Five years ago, Hillary Clinton reached one of the least-noticed diplomatic agreements of her tenure as secretary of State — a deal obligating Japan to continue paying nearly $2 billion a year to help defray the cost of U.S. troops stationed on its territory."

http://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2017/01/31/national/much-japan-pay-host-u-s-forces-depends-ask/#.WWI6aYjyuHs

https://www.wsj.com/articles/q-a-how-much-do-u-s-military-bases-in-japan-and-korea-cost-1461822624

http://www.newsweek.com/us-military-japan-north-korea-asia-590278

7/9/2017 10:23:46 AM

They pay more than nothing (like Trump said exaggerating) but the point stands that their payments fall short and we aren't in a fiscal position to spend money on things that don't directly affect the llves of Americans. Maybe we were for much of the life of the deal but not now. Do the math.

We spend 7 billion a year in 3 countries. Japan pays us 2 billion and Korea pays us 800 million. Germany pays nothing? Most of the payments are also in the form of offsetting rent and wages for native support personnel.

The American people are subsidizing the rest. Who wouldn't want to pay 35% of their taxes and let people in another country pay the rest.

If we are spending 7 billion, we need to be getting at least 7 billion back or its a raw deal.

[Edited on July 9, 2017 at 11:39 AM. Reason : trump exaggerates ]

7/9/2017 11:39:14 AM

Does anyone have a good primer on modern Japanese military and policies? They don't have a normal standing military right? I'm incredibly ignorant to Far East military.

Like what recourse do they have if a NK missile test, as seems to the case, lands in their waters or God forbid their mainland?

7/28/2017 11:46:07 AM

^

7/28/2017 6:28:59 PM

Pretty much what I thought. So the official response will basically be war games as usual (which is obviously better than actual military action).

7/28/2017 7:40:02 PM

The thread title says it all. North Korea isn't doing anything to anyone but the coporate media has to keep the hype alive to justify sanctions. That is the entire goal. Just to sanction the shit out of North Korea so its people can never prosper. All in the name of maximum profits. Sad.

7/30/2017 11:04:03 PM

I thought that this interview was a good read:

https://theintercept.com/2017/08/06/donald-trump-north-korea-intercepted-podcast-john-feffer/

8/6/2017 6:13:12 PM

the american media never misses an opportunity to call the north korean leader irrational. Pay attention. It happens during every segment. Its funny how a statement with no supporting evidence would be made so consistently on every network.

8/29/2017 7:01:20 PM

less than 6 months until the Olympic games start; I wonder in Un is going to stage a nuclear test and/or missile test to coincide with the games?

8/29/2017 8:20:42 PM

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eY9VLCAfAvY
Does this woman even hear herself? Its like the administration is in a costant competition to see who can make the most hypocritical statements on an international stage.

8/29/2017 9:42:50 PM

Quote :

"Unfavorable reviews. North Korea sentenced authors James Pearson and Daniel Tudor and their publisher to death for their book "North Korea Confidential" about life in Stalinist dictatorship after finding their work in poor taste. The authors are, fortunately, not in North Korea and the sentence was issued in absentia, but the court found that the book "viciously slandered the reality of the DPRK.""

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-northkorea-southkorea-media-threat/north-korea-sentences-south-korean-reporters-to-death-over-review-of-book-about-country-idUSKCN1BB2J0?utm_source=Sailthru&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=New%20Campaign&utm_term=%2ASituation%20Report

9/1/2017 9:54:29 AM

https://www.upi.com/North-Korea-moving-flood-victims-into-new-homes/2691479344309/

Brutality!

9/2/2017 12:10:00 AM

Hot news story from your friends at UPI via the Russian embassy in Pyongyang!

9/2/2017 6:05:32 AM

Where do you get your information on North Korea?

9/2/2017 8:01:22 AM

From old books

9/2/2017 2:41:24 PM

Interested to see how many die when the rushed and poor construction causes them to collapse.

9/2/2017 2:47:11 PM

9/2/2017 3:00:13 PM

?

9/2/2017 3:43:30 PM

That is comical

9/2/2017 7:54:47 PM

you believing exactly what the corporate media tells you is comical.

9/2/2017 8:04:58 PM

You thinking the image you posted has any significance to anything is comical.

9/2/2017 8:09:01 PM

I don't but it shows you that there is another side to the story you take as fact. I don't expect it to change anyones mind but I do want you to be aware that there are people who don't buy into the propaganda machine.

but you keep on believing north korea is irrational and could do anything at any moment.

9/2/2017 8:11:51 PM

All the sheeple think North Korea hates Japan.

In reality they love Japan!!

That can launch rockets over their country but it's over water so it's cool!

9/2/2017 8:12:28 PM

Quote :

"I don't but it shows you that there is another side to the story you take as fact."

Believing yourself to be the only one aware that every story has multiple sides is comical, also.

Quote :

"but you keep on believing north korea is irrational and could do anything at any moment."

I feel fairly confident in my opinion that North Korea is merely sabre-rattling and has no plans for a direct attack against anyone, but pretending their missile launch is not provocational to Japan is comical.

[Edited on September 2, 2017 at 8:22 PM. Reason : ]

9/2/2017 8:19:01 PM

Who said I thought I was the only one? I didn't claim to make the graphic. There are hundreds of millions of people who see past the US bullshit. The language being used in the media about the event is intended to make people think the missile was somehow a threat to japan. Japan is next to North Korea. Reciprocity. How the hell are they supposed to fire missiles towards the US without going over Japan?

Quote :

"but pretending their missile launch is not provocational to Japan is comical."

Of course the US/Japan thinks its a problem that they are firing missiles over Japan. The US doesn't even think they should have missiles or a country for that matter.


[Edited on September 2, 2017 at 8:24 PM. Reason : k]

[Edited on September 2, 2017 at 8:25 PM. Reason : everything they do is "provocational" ]

9/2/2017 8:22:52 PM

So should Japan be worried NK is possibly launching nukes over their country???

9/2/2017 8:27:14 PM

Of course they should be worried as long as they are hosting 50,000 troops of the nation that vows to destroy DPRK.

9/2/2017 8:30:30 PM

Quote :

"Who said I thought I was the only one?"

You seem to say so yourself when you say:

Quote :

"you believing exactly what the corporate media tells you is comical."

As if we should feel indebted to you for exposing us to the real "Truth".

9/2/2017 8:53:15 PM

So are you trying to convince us North Korea is acting rationally or that the US is acting irrationally?

9/2/2017 9:35:50 PM

^North Korea is acting rationally but irrational is the wrong word for how the US is acting. The US is acting unreasonably and very aggressively (as always). It shouldn't need convincing if you've followed global relations in the last 60+ years.

Quote :

"As if we should feel indebted to you for exposing us to the real "Truth"."

I give you a little bit more credit than that. I believe that you are making a conscious decision to believe what comes from your government and the corporate media machine knowing good and well its slanted. Probably because you think its goals align with your best interest.

9/2/2017 10:21:20 PM

How is anything NK does rational? I'd like to know the thought process behind your conclusion.

9/2/2017 10:42:43 PM

How is anything they do irrational? I don't even know where to begin. The US was running war games in the South when this missile was tested. Nuclear weapons are the only deterrent that has proven successful. The US and Japan have already done so much to Korea. It would be irrational for them to ignore their own history or the history of American aggression around the world.

9/2/2017 10:58:01 PM

lol. ok let's agree to disagree.

9/2/2017 11:13:02 PM

What do we disagree about? History?

9/2/2017 11:18:24 PM

Quote :

"How is anything NK does rational?"

To be fair, the development of nuclear weapons is an incredibly rational act on their part from the standpoint of them wanting a deterrent strong enough to prevent another nation from invading it.

9/3/2017 12:02:16 AM

Also fuck everyone who thinks North Koreans don't deserve to eat because their government is making a few of the same weapons our government has thousands of. Your supremacy complex is literally starving people.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 12:44 AM. Reason : dare i say white]

9/3/2017 12:43:11 AM

I do agree that building weapons to defend yourself is a rational thing to do.

The existence of NK is however irrational. A country that prevents its citizens from leaving that was created in a weird post WW2 cluster fuck. Also let's not forget the country is consumed by a racist notion they are the master race. so I'd rather they not have hydrogen bombs.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 8:10 AM. Reason : They've been starving for decades. This isn't a new development. ]

9/3/2017 8:08:51 AM

the people who are acting irrational is china. they should have let NK fall years ago and let korea become whole again. but no their irrational fear of K-Pop on their border keeps millions in serfdom.

9/3/2017 9:35:07 AM

Quote :

"A country that prevents its citizens from leaving that was created in a weird post WW2 cluster fuck"

You have to consider the historical context of the rule. OF course it seems irrational without the events that led to it being a rule. The Japanese had a brutal imperial system of extracting resources and production from Korea for 35 years. After the Japanese fell, Koreans who were landlords and cooperators with Japan held all of the power wealth and resources. These are the people who fled to the South and started the South along with American help. South Korea granted automatic citizenship and didn't start prosecuting these people until like 2006 so it was very rational for DPRK to keep them from leaving.

Dean Rusk knew nothing about Korea and was a new member of the State department when he decided to split the country in half to counter the Soviets who already liberated the Peninsula. The US is over 5000 miles away from Korea and is clearly only in it for imperialistic interests. Korea had just been through that with Japan.

Quote :

"Also let's not forget the country is consumed by a racist notion they are the master race. "

Not very different from American exceptionalism. Its more of a counter to them being subjected to Japan and USA doing the same thing to them. Ironic reasoning considering the USA used the bomb to create Korea, and then carried out a barbaric war against Korea all while having racial segregation back home.

Quote :

"They've been starving for decades. This isn't a new development. "

because of US aggression/sanctions/interference

Quote :

"he people who are acting irrational is china. they should have let NK fall years ago and let korea become whole again."

Its very rational for them to support North Korea. They don't want the American puppet state on their border. They don't want American soldiers on their border. You would freak out if there were Chinese bases, nukes and soldier on our border. See the cuban missile crisis. It has nothing to do with k-pop. Chinese already listen to k-pop.

(I have a theory that China is actually helping north korea with their weapons programs. They seem to be advancing too quickly but maybe not since the technology has existed for so long already. )

Again, irrational is the wrong word but its unreasonable for the US to think they should control the Korean Pininsula from 6000 miles away. Kim fought guerilla warfare against the Japanese for years only to have America take half of his country away.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 12:48 PM. Reason : Everyone is rational for their self interests. The US is unreasonable but rational.]

9/3/2017 12:24:55 PM

Quote :

"the people who are acting irrational is china. they should have let NK fall years ago and let korea become whole again. but no their irrational fear of K-Pop on their border keeps millions in serfdom."

Tend to agree here, but it's not the fear of K-Pop, it's the fear of encroachment by capitalism on their border. And I only say it's irrational because in the interest of self-preservation, they've accomplished nothing. There would be zero US troops in South Korea had China never allowed North Korea to be established, backed it (and sent in troops) in the Korean War and caused the stalemate to exist. Had they never touched the Korean peninsula the only US troops they'd have to worry about would be in Japan and the Phillipines.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 12:50 PM. Reason : a]

9/3/2017 12:47:38 PM

Listen to what you are saying though. China is right there and shares a border. You aren't just saying they should sit back and let The US control the region from 6000 miles away, but you are saying its irrational for them not to.

Its worth noting that if the US had never interfered (is there anywhere in the world you can say that?), there would have been no Korean war, and Korea would have been whole from the start.

Quote :

"There would be zero US troops in South Korea had China never allowed North Korea to be established, backed it (and sent in troops) in the Korean War and caused the stalemate to exist."

This isn't even necessarily true. In that scenario, its likely they would have had a revolution at a later time, and then the US would have came back and intervened like everywhere else in the cold war.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 12:57 PM. Reason : history says the US will show up regardless]

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 12:59 PM. Reason : china acted out of moral responsibility]

9/3/2017 12:55:03 PM

Capitalism won in china. You can't be communist and drive around shanghi in a Ferrari. China once did have a reason for keeping NK communist I feel as that time has gone and it'd be better for all of us if there was reunification. I totally get why china has fears of Japan and Korea btw.

9/3/2017 1:12:05 PM

^check out The Party - The Secret World of China's Communist Rulers, by Richard McGregor.

^^

Quote :

"At the Cairo Conference on November 22, 1943, it was agreed that "in due course Korea shall become free and independent";[217][218] at a later meeting in Yalta in February 1945, it was agreed to establish a four-power trusteeship over Korea.[219] On August 14, 1945, Soviet forces entered Korea by amphibious landings enabling them to secure control in the north. Japan surrendered to the Allied Forces on August 15, 1945. The unconditional surrender of Japan, combined with fundamental shifts in global politics and ideology, led to the division of Korea into two occupation zones effectively starting on September 8, 1945, with the United States administering the southern half of the peninsula and the Soviet Union taking over the area north of the 38th parallel. The Provisional Government was ignored, mainly due to American perception that it was too communist-aligned.[220] This division was meant to be temporary and was first intended to return a unified Korea back to its people after the United States, United Kingdom, Soviet Union, and Republic of China could arrange a single government. In December 1945, a conference convened in Moscow to discuss the future of Korea.[221] A 5-year trusteeship was discussed, and a joint Soviet-American commission was established. The commission met intermittently in Seoul but deadlocked over the issue of establishing a national government. In September 1947, with no solution in sight, the United States submitted the Korean question to the United Nations General Assembly. Initial hopes for a unified, independent Korea quickly evaporated as the politics of the Cold War and opposition to the trusteeship plan from anti-communists resulted in the 1948 establishment of two separate nations with diametrically opposed political, economic, and social systems. On December 12, 1948, the General Assembly of the United Nations recognised the Republic of Korea as the sole legal government of Korea.[222] In June 25, 1950 the Korean War broke out when North Korea breached the 38th parallel line to invade the South, ending any hope of a peaceful reunification for the time being. After the war, the 1954 Geneva conference failed to adopt a solution for a unified Korea."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/History_of_Korea#Division_and_Korean_War_.281945.E2.80.931953.29

I.e., you can blame the state of affairs on China and the Soviet Union.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 6:27 PM. Reason : a]

9/3/2017 6:23:32 PM

so you place no blame on the us?

9/3/2017 6:33:57 PM

I don't care about historical context. Preventing your citizens from freely leaving is insane. What's to gain from defending the NK government?

9/3/2017 6:40:26 PM

^^Not in particular. Korea would be similar to Japan had SU/China not messed with it. But, they did. Because they did and because they previously invaded South Korea, a US defense of and permanent presence in South Korea was inevitable.

Now, North Korea spends its time worried the US is going to invade and topple it so it continuously escalates the situation by developing nuclear weapons and making threats while also launching ballistic missiles over US allies. The US is forced to respond in kind.

About the only thing I can blame the US for in this situation is having let this go on for the past 30 years and not striking before they even had a chance at developing nukes. Same mistake was made with Pakistan.

I can also blame the US for invading Iraq (the second time) and in doing so, having completely expended our nation's will to deal with legit problems (such as Ukraine and North Korea). Because of that, we're empowering nations like NK and Russia to continue destabilizing the world while nations like Iran and Saudi Arabia destabilize the Middle East.

US involvement isn't by default some nefarious or bad thing. Our involvement in Germany/France and the rest of Europe as well as Japan after World War 2 was an entirely positive thing. Funny how when the US is occupying a nation and attempting to build up a stable government, things generally go well and when Russia and China get involved suddenly concentration camps start going up like Starbucks' expansions.

I am deliberately ignoring US involvement in "nation building" in the Middle East because we've never actually done that there. Although, from what I've been reading about Afghanistan, we've actually come a long way there and any setbacks we've experienced recently are likely due to Russia intervening on behalf of the Taliban.

[Edited on September 3, 2017 at 6:52 PM. Reason : a]

9/3/2017 6:48:04 PM