^^ has anyone on here ever argued that Democrats weren’t that. A bunch of feel-good ninnies with no backbone. At least the lefts ideas are better than the GOP.

12/2/2017 12:12:15 PM

Shrike thinks everything the party does is perfect

12/2/2017 1:13:05 PM

Democrats are far from perfect. But that doesn't mean Democrats should emulate what the Republican party is doing. What Republicans are doing should in no way be a model for how to govern even if it's to accomplish your own 'noble' ends.

12/2/2017 1:35:37 PM

your idealistic view of a 2 party system doesn't work. nothing gets done. the system was kinda designed to not get anything done unless its an emergency. if the gop way is not the way, the one party system is.

12/2/2017 3:20:33 PM

https://iowastartingline.com/2017/12/03/grassley-implies-working-people-spend-tax-cuts-booze-women-movies/

cool party

12/4/2017 9:44:46 AM

Quote :

"the system was kinda designed to not get anything done unless its an emergency."

There's some truth to this but I don't think it's supposed to take an emergency to get things done.

12/4/2017 9:12:05 PM

The party is supporting Moore again, Republicans are okay with voting for a child predator

12/5/2017 7:03:37 AM

Now we know why they're so hot on making sure women have those babies.

12/5/2017 8:18:57 AM

the only thing worse than supporting Moore is saying you aren't gonna support him, and then coming crawling back 2 weeks later to support him. ewww.

12/5/2017 8:24:12 AM

^This.

On an unrelated note, I am looking for a political party to associate with which does not endorse and support sexual predators. We dont even need to agree on political ideas. Just dont be a sex predator.

12/6/2017 1:31:13 PM

They probably thought the allegations would come to fruition then realized they wouldn't amount to anything important after Trump flipped.

12/6/2017 1:33:46 PM

Or just realized they really needed that vote, and are hoping their endorsement will sway hardline Republicans to vote in what's become a dead-heat race.

12/6/2017 1:44:38 PM

So Franken is resigning, will HCH call for Trump and Moore to resign?

12/7/2017 12:28:15 PM

I still think Franken is a creep, but it took guts to do what he did. I'm not trying to minimize the fact that he 100% needs to go, but if the democrats stand any chance of at least trying to put on the appearance of being the more accountable party, this was a huge step.

12/7/2017 12:47:50 PM

^^ You might have me confused with someone else. I've never been a supporter of Trump. He can't leave office soon enough. However, the allegations against him came out before he was elected. So the chances of him resigning are exactly 0%.

As for Moore, I don't live in Alabama, so I am unable to vote against him.

Regarding Franken, can we not make him a hero for doing what he was pretty much forced to do, all because he couldn't control his sexual urges. He doesn't want to resign, and he still hasn't apologized for what he did. So its not like this is a guy of integrity to begin with.

12/7/2017 1:18:23 PM

so you're saying that the democratic party is more credible than the republican party on this issue, you just don't care because there is nothing you can do about it

12/7/2017 1:24:54 PM

If it will make you feel better, and you want to make sexual assault a partisan issue, than sure, the democrat party made the right move by forcing Franken to resign.

But my whole position has been that sexual predators shouldn't be in any position of power, no matter what their political affiliation happens to be. I don't think this is a controversial or uncommon position. However, when you politicize it like you are doing, you are showing that this isn't done because it was the right thing to do, but rather to score political points.

12/7/2017 1:37:07 PM

12/7/2017 1:38:28 PM

didn't he^ spend public money to settle his sexual harassment lawsuit?

12/7/2017 1:56:59 PM

sure did

12/7/2017 2:08:11 PM

Quote :

"you are showing that this isn't done because it was the right thing to do, but rather to score political points"

the two aren't mutually exclusive. like at all. It was both the 'right' thing to do AND it will help the Dems score political points. In fact, I'd argue that if he didn't step down, it would cause irreparable harm to the party. The GOP obviously doesn't care about anything other than staying in power.

12/7/2017 3:10:38 PM

Franken waits 3 weeks to announce that he'll step down in the coming weeks

12/7/2017 3:26:38 PM

As soon as the republicans announce that they will at some point resign due to their own allegations than sure, it matters that Franken waited and didn't do it immediately. Until then, it's still better

12/7/2017 4:30:11 PM

Quote :

"David Brooks closing column line. Brutal: “The rot afflicting the G.O.P. is comprehensive — moral, intellectual, political and reputational. More and more former Republicans wake up every day and realize: ‘I’m homeless. I’m politically homeless.’”"

12/8/2017 11:10:55 AM

But they still stay in power.

12/8/2017 11:14:30 AM

Exactly. They'll whine about being politically homeless but on voting day will toe the line and salute, because that's what they've always done.

12/8/2017 11:19:52 AM

Doesn't that speak as much to the opposition party, as it does to the R's? I know A LOT of people who didn't vote for Trump, but also couldn't vote for Clinton. Maybe if the D.'s would campaign a non-worse option than the worst president ever.

And to be clear, there is an enormous fight going on for control of the GOP. Right now it is split between centrist conservatives, and far right nationalists. Many Republicans don't fall into the later category, and deserve our support.

[Edited on December 8, 2017 at 11:28 AM. Reason : 1]

12/8/2017 11:25:41 AM

the centrists in the republican party are perfectly fine supporting the far right nationalists though, it's not that big of a fight




[Edited on December 8, 2017 at 11:37 AM. Reason : .]

12/8/2017 11:33:21 AM

Yep, Centrist republicans have been losing out repeatedly to the far-right for like the last 15 years. The saddest part about that David Brooks column is that these conservative "intellectuals" can't even see the role they played in paving the way for the far right's successes. A total inability to self-reflect.

And yes Clinton played a role in the far right' success in 2016. But she wasn't the reason GOP voters chose Trump over the 15+ GOP presidential candidates, she didn't help Roy Moore win over Luther Strange. She didn't hand select Louie Gohmert, Mark Meadows, or Ted Cruz. That was the GOP's deplorable voting base.

12/8/2017 11:48:06 AM

GWB was not a far right nationalist.

12/8/2017 11:51:16 AM

HCH is suffering from the same cognitive dissonance my dad and many of my Republican family members are right now. They think they're 'better' than the far right whackos who give the GOP a bad name. They are ashamed of Roy Moore, but they insist he's an outlier- that most conservatives are just good honest people who value hard work above all else. That's why whenever anyone puts them on the spot and says "holy fucking shit, the GOP is terrible! How is this even possible??" they deflect by saying, "Yeah Trump is terrible, but we didn't have any other choice than HRC. He's not even a Republican anyway."

12/8/2017 12:24:42 PM

^^I don't disagree, but look at some of the asshats that were also elected in 2004:

Louie Gohmert
Joe Barton
Tom Garrett
Tom Price
Etc

It's true that the BIG tea party wave wouldn't happen until 6 years later, but plenty of far right jokers were starting to get traction before then.

12/8/2017 12:34:19 PM

^^ that's because it's basically a religion and they are conditioned by their other religion to have faith and not question things

12/8/2017 1:15:04 PM

^^^ There is way too much to unpack in that post for a Friday afternoon. So I will just say that if your world view of ~50% of the country are evil, racist and sexist, then you need to get out and meet more people. I can disagree with liberals on a majority of their policy issues, but at least I understand that most of them have the same good intentions for this country as most conservatives do.

^^ Completely agree. But at least our leadership was still primarily centrist conservatives through that time.

[Edited on December 8, 2017 at 1:25 PM. Reason : ^lol. I bet you just love the smell of your own farts.]

12/8/2017 1:24:33 PM

i mean... your party elected donald trump and were okay with that so i think i'm on point

12/8/2017 1:33:45 PM

Quote :

" So I will just say that if your world view of ~50% of the country are evil, racist and sexist, then you need to get out and meet more people"

Cute strawman, bro. I never suggested half the country is that way, but I will argue close to a third of Americans are definitely more bigoted and intolerant of anyone other than white Christians than they care to admit. And btw, I encounter more diversity on a daily basis during my office hours than you probably have in your entire lifetime, so spare me the horseshit about being out of touch with the rest of the country. HINT: diversity isn't just based on skin color or gender- it means being around people who come from all walks of life.

Anyway, it is telling that while DJT's approval rating has hovered around 37% since he got elected, his favorability among self-identified republicans is around 80%. So yeah, you're exactly one of those people I'm talking about. You still cling to this fantasy that the GOP is really just getting a lot of "bad press" right now because of a few vocal deplorables that don't represent you and your 'values'. 80 freaking percent of Republicans think Trump is doing an acceptable job as commander in chief. Let that little nugget sink in for just a second. The extreme far right isn't just a small part of the GOP- it IS the GOP right now.

Here's a better way of looking at it. The Dems lost because Clinton wasn't nearly far enough to the left. She was too corporate and moderate for the working class, and too much of a limo driving liberal to appeal to anyone else. The Dems picked her because she was the 'safe' choice, and the popular vote proved they were absolutely correct in doing so. The Dems suck too right now for a lot of different reasons, but Hillary Clinton isn't an active politician right now, so can we just stop talking about her already?

Trump on the other hand wiped the floor with right of center candidates and his main competition (if you even want to call it that) was a far right candidate like Ted Cruz. The GOP didn't give a shit about policy, experience, or anything else, other than running a candidate that would do the bidding of the right wing. Has ANYTHING Trump has done been anywhere close to right of center, or even moderate?

Your party is bad, and you should feel bad.

[Edited on December 8, 2017 at 3:50 PM. Reason : .]

12/8/2017 3:48:31 PM

So Franks is resigning because he asked two aides to be surrogates for him and his wife. He offered a sum of 5 million to do this.

12/8/2017 8:26:57 PM

lol

12/8/2017 8:56:12 PM

bernie would have wiped the floor in a real, open, primary. as bad as trump is, he IS measurably doing a good job. i disagree with almost everything he haa done, but its exactly what he promised and my 401k is soaring. Thats tangible success.

a lot of people clearly dont talk to enough educated people who voted trump. diversity is one thing but this is diversity of thought. you can easily pick out the type people who aren't comfortable with diversity of thought over the internet. they go their lives talking to people who generally think like them.

this is why there is a social norm of "dont discuss politics and religion in public". some people just cant handle hearing a person who thinks differently and will shut down or lash out.

12/8/2017 9:39:22 PM

^^^ You left out Franks' definition of surrogacy.

12/9/2017 1:51:50 AM

I don't have any problem with wanting to do that fertilization the old fashioned way...but the power dynamic problem with someone who works for you makes pursuing it fraught with ethics problems, at best.

12/9/2017 1:58:37 AM

5. Million. Dollars.

12/9/2017 2:20:00 AM

Quote :

"as bad as trump is, he IS measurably doing a good job. i disagree with almost everything he haa done, but its exactly what he promised and my 401k is soaring. Thats tangible success."

Jesus, dude. Your 401k is seeing an initial bump because private enterprise got presidential morning wood after getting a whiff of massive de-regulation cleavage. Trump got into office and all these valuations are based on speculation at the moment. There's nothing tangible backing up any of these companies right now. The rules no longer apply, and now that capital has been given the green light to loot the working poor, they're seeing some initial gains and you're completely mis-reading the long term effects. That 401k of yours is going to come crashing down before his term is up, because legislation like this tax bill is going to suck out every last purchasing dollar from the working class and put it right into the pockets of the richest people on earth. It WILL NOT trickle back down.

The time bomb is ticking, and you've gone completely off the rails with your adversarial position on everything that it is making you applaud Trump in the dumbest ways.

12/9/2017 4:14:42 AM

^^^^What was his def.? I've looked in several places to see if the conception was supposed to take place in a lab, or if he was just basically trying to pay for sex, and I couldn't find it anywhere.

12/9/2017 5:38:22 AM

Quote :

"The sources said Franks approached two female staffers about acting as a potential surrogate for him and his wife, who has struggled with fertility issues for years. But the aides were concerned that Franks was asking to have sexual relations with them. It was not clear to the women whether he was asking about impregnating the women through sexual intercourse or in vitro fertilization. Franks opposes abortion rights as well as procedures that discard embryos. A former staffer also alleged that Franks tried to persuade a female aide that they were in love by having her read an article that described how a person knows they’re in love with someone, the sources said. One woman believed she was the subject of retribution after rebuffing Franks. While she enjoyed access to the congressman before the incident, that access was revoked afterward, she told Republican leaders. [...] Also on Friday, the Associated Press reported that Franks offered to pay an aide $5 million to carry his child and pressured her relentlessly on the matter."

https://www.politico.com/story/2017/12/08/trent-franks-sex-surrogacy-impregnate-287808?lo=ap_a1

12/9/2017 9:53:25 AM

https://www.usaconservative.net/2017/12/04/victim-of-sexual-abuse-tells-the-truth-president-trump-is-not-who-you-think-he-is

12/9/2017 8:16:15 PM

Quote :

"The time bomb is ticking, and you've gone completely off the rails with your adversarial position on everything that it is making you applaud Trump in the dumbest ways"

Its not my position. I'm applauding his effectiveness even though he is mostly doing the opposite of what I want,

I'm mostly explaining how people can support him without being evil. I think I'm poor enough but also rich enough to see where they are coming from. it all makes sense. I just disagree with it ideologically. That doesn't mean I can't acknowledge effective strategy without endorsing it.

They aren't thinking about things that happened in the distant pass, or things that will happen in the distant future. They are thinking about their personal lives RIGHT NOW and 401k is a good example of one of those types of things. That isn't me but I don't think that is evil. Its self-preservation.

Quote :

"Jesus, dude. Your 401k is seeing an initial bump because private enterprise got presidential morning wood after getting a whiff of massive de-regulation cleavage. Trump got into office and all these valuations are based on speculation at the moment. There's nothing tangible backing up any of these companies right now. "

I get what you are saying but the bump we've seen is more tangible than your speculation that the bump is only speculation. Today's value is the only thing we know.

Quote :

"That 401k of yours is going to come crashing down before his term is up, because legislation like this tax bill is going to suck out every last purchasing dollar from the working class and put it right into the pockets of the richest people on earth. "

How the hell are tax CUTS going to take money FROM the working class? The media is pushing a lot of misleading graphics about this. The increase in the standard deduction alone would put a lot more money in my pocket.



[Edited on December 9, 2017 at 9:46 PM. Reason : and oh by the way the yearbook lady lost credibility yesterday]

12/9/2017 9:43:13 PM

you got earl'd

12/10/2017 1:11:22 AM

Quote :

"How the hell are tax CUTS going to take money FROM the working class?"

Because federal spending will not be cut alongside it and in fact, it will be increased. Also because those tax cuts for anyone who isn't already rich expire within 5 years while theirs are permanent. This is a money grab, plain and simple which is they the GOP is willing to put Jerry Sandusky or the guy from Subway into office just so they'll have enough people to vote for it. It's also why the GOP is so adamantly focused on discrediting the Republican veteran running the Special Counsel and will do anything they can to keep Trump in office long enough to sign it into law.

The only way anyone who is not rich sees money from this is if the economy grows significantly simultaneously and grows enough for wages to increase. I've not had a year-over-year raise that is higher than inflation (or even is equivalent to inflation) since I started my professional career in 2008 (except for a salary bump once when I changed companies). I don't know many who have.

Here's a good spot check to determine if something is actually a good thing or not. If you see Mitch McConnell smiling while talking about something, you can pretty much guarantee whatever it is he's talking about is going to hurt the average American.

[Edited on December 10, 2017 at 8:42 AM. Reason : a]

12/10/2017 8:39:46 AM

I thought of something this morning after reading the comments on tax cuts and jobs. These tax cuts will not only not create jobs but might eliminate jobs quicker due to increased automation. The business tax rate factors heavily into buying automation since the payback is over a longer term and why would businesses hire people with increasing healthcare cost when there is a decreasing tax and improving capability automation.

[Edited on December 10, 2017 at 10:55 AM. Reason : .]

12/10/2017 10:54:20 AM