It pains me to post this, I was hoping it would get tabled long enough for Butch to find the next best thing and leave UNC, but it seems his pushing has moved things along in TarHole land.

http://www.newsobserver.com/sports/college/unc/story/1152193.html

Quote :

"CHAPEL HILL - Kenan Stadium is a step closer to getting bigger and more luxurious. The University of North Carolina's Board of Trustees approved the design for a first phase of plans to substantially expand the Tar Heels' football stadium. The design, approved Wednesday, will add two floors to the Kenan Football Center complex on the west end of the field -- one floor of team and recruiting space and one of luxury suites. A large video scoreboard is also in the works but it's not clear exactly where it will go, athletic director Dick Baddour said. The expansion will add a club area and 16-20 luxury boxes, a first for Kenan. All but two ACC football programs have premium seating, Baddour said. "We're one, and Duke is the other." Officials plan to start the first phase at the end of this football season and finish it before the 2009 season begins. Other phases of the project -- which need trustees approval later to begin -- will fill in the bowl's east end, add another video screen, and build an academic support center for athletes. Baddour said the department's primary goal in the expansion was keeping Kenan beautiful. "People are always concerned about the beauty of Kenan Stadium," he said. Baddour told the trustees the cost of the expansion was $22 million. After the meeting Bruce Runberg, associate vice chancellor for facilities planning, explained that number was an estimate for construction only, and said the total budget for the first phase is $50 million. In its recent session, the state legislature approved that amount in debt. Carolina has had tentative plans to renovate Kenan for years, but talk picked up after the university picked former NFL coach Butch Davis to head the football program. He's already been using expansion plans as a recruiting tool."

Butch Davis certainly is a tool.

7/24/2008 11:05:21 AM

toughest place to play EVER.

JUST LOOK AT THE PINE TREES!

7/24/2008 11:09:30 AM

i love that since 2006 they are still ONE STEP CLOSER

i mean, look at this thread last year
message_topic.aspx?topic=489625

i do think its great that they are adding more seats for the opposing fans

7/24/2008 11:10:51 AM

It doesn't matter how many more seats they add if they don't fill the ones they have.

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 11:19 AM. Reason : ^ didn't read your last part. Also true. ]

7/24/2008 11:19:03 AM

7/24/2008 11:31:29 AM

Bitch Davis = Chuck Amato

- Clamoring for stadium expansion and facility upgrades (in Chuck's case we needed them), and using them as recruiting tools to get players that won't be there long enough to really enjoy it.
- Excuses for not winning games (Butch kept talking about how young his team was, even though other teams were just as young).
- Terrible o-line recruiting.
- Great skill player recruiting.
- Great defense recruiting.
- Unsubstantiated hype.

note: I loved Chuck but he couldn't take us where we wanted to be. I appreciate what he did for our program though.

7/24/2008 11:31:44 AM

i was getting ready to say, sounds just like Chuck Amato.

UNC is on the rise and will have a great 1-2 years where they go to a really good bowl.
Then they will fall, just like we did and get rid of Butch.

7/24/2008 11:50:48 AM

^^ I don't know man... Butch has a proven track record here, unlike Amato.

Plus, Butch wasn't lucky enough to fall in to a once in a lifetime type of QB...

7/24/2008 12:03:49 PM

T

J

YATES

[/sarcasm]

7/24/2008 12:25:46 PM

Butch had the pleasure of being in the most talented area for football talent by far. I mean have you seen Miami Northwestern's team? They were the No. 1 high school team in America. They were the ones that beat RB commit James Washington's Boone HS team in the state championship game. I think 5 or 6 of their players are going to Miami this year.

7/24/2008 12:26:19 PM

If anyone doesn't think Chief Butch has their program heading in the right direction, they are in denial. We were very lucky that Baddour made absolutely terrible coaching hires after Mack Brown left.

7/24/2008 12:40:08 PM

Butch game day coaching skills are average, i think. I think he's got a big ego, not uncommon at this level of coaching, that hurts him. When he coached the browns he was also their GM. That's got to take a toll on a person being in both positions of high importance. However, his ability to recruit is what's going to scare the rest of the conference. The 2001 Miami team was absolutely loaded. 2001 was his first year with the browns, but basically recruited that whole team. A retard could have coached that team to the national title

off the top of my head...
defense-Vince Wilfork, Jonathan Vilma, DJ Williams, Sean Taylor, Ed Reed, Antrell Rolle, Vernon Carey
offense-Willis McGahee, Clinton Portis, Frank Gore, Najeh Davenport, Andre Johnson, Roscoe Parrish, Kellen Winslow, Jeremy Shockey

7/24/2008 12:52:51 PM

Butch is definitely an upgrade for them over Bunting, but I ain't buying the "Butch will have the Tar Heels in a BCS bowl and national title contenders by 2010" shit that some are spewing.

7/24/2008 12:57:36 PM

Even putting them at #2 in the Coastal this year is fucking ridiculous.

7/24/2008 1:00:55 PM

Jaybee1200 was ridiculed when rumors of UNC hiring him came around and was proven right "oh Jaybee, Davis would never ever go to UNC, that will never happen, its not a football school"

Jaybee1200 was ridiculed once again once the hiring was announced and he claimed that Davis would have them as one of the best teams in the ACC in 2-4 years and is now well on his way to being vindicated once again.

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 1:25 PM. Reason : d]

7/24/2008 1:05:06 PM

The way I see it there are two possibilities for Carolina Football:
1. They make progress and become a Top 25 team for a year or two until Davis leaves for a real football school and then they sink back into mediocrity

or

2. The hype surrounding the program is completely unsubstantiated and we see a couple Carolina teams that are 3-9, 4-8 or 5-7 until the shine wears off of Davis and Carolina moves on

either way Carolina is not going to have long term success in football

7/24/2008 1:13:39 PM

^^ lol SO OBJECTIVE

what about a 4-8 season has them on the way to being one of the top teams in the ACC? was it the near loss to duke? was it the 12 yards rushing against one of the nation's worst run defenses (us, btw)? or was it the way that UNC had to give davis a raise just to stay there? god i wish i could do my job right only 33% of the time and get a raise. that shit would be awesome.


back on the original topic - i think it's awesome the tarholes are expanding. makes getting seats for away games there that much easier and cheaper.

objectively speaking, that is.

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 1:16 PM. Reason : .]

7/24/2008 1:16:07 PM

^ lol I know right, my girlfriends dad played running back for UNC when they were good, so maybe I can get some seats away from all the unc alumni.

7/24/2008 1:19:03 PM

^^ good recruiting, facility expansion... if your dumbass could read I said 2-4 years... therefore year one (which you so cleverly broke down) wouldn't apply. God damn you are a dumb son of a bitch.

7/24/2008 1:23:20 PM

I hope Rutgers, BC, and UConn are as good as they were.. and Miami and ND are back to normal. As long as they don't win those...5...and against NC State... and lose a couple others then I'll be happy

7/24/2008 2:02:37 PM

^^ you didn't even address my questions. instead of coming up with a logical argument, you swore at me a lot which obviously shows you're of higher intelligence, then called ME dumb. this coming year will be year 2. what signs have they shown that they're on the way to the top? facility expansion? do they already have the $25mil+ for construction pledged? have they broken ground? do you even know how long it takes to expand a stadium? how's their O-line recruiting look (fyi, it's bad)? how about QB? is paulus the savior? was Yates a fluke last year? WR's after hakeem nicks leave?

my point is you can't go patting yourself on the back for saying UNC is going to be good in 2-4 years just because there are "plans in the works" for a bigger stadium. stadium expansion + recruiting = wins? state fans have seen as well as anyone that facilities don't win the ACC.

7/24/2008 2:19:34 PM

No, I have no idea how long it takes to build a stadium. 2 weeks? Wait... whats a stadium?

Moron. At this point in his tenure there he is doing things as good as could have reasonable been hoped for... they werent going to magically go 12-0 his first year with Bunting's players, but he is building up the facilities, which obviously do not not = wins, but its much easier to recruit and then win with good facilities than with bad or nonexistent ones... and he is doing really well recruiting for a team that has had pretty much zero draw for top recruits in football over the last 10 years. At this point, going into year 2, he is doing just about as good as could have been expected but your homer ignorant ass wont admit it... Do I like Carolina? nope, hate them, but I can admit they are going in the right direction and apparently most of the experts that cover the ACC agree (but I am sure you will chalk that up to some JFK assassination level media conspiracy)

and I did address your point by saying your point about them not being good in Year 1 has nothing to do with a discussion about years 2-4

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 2:29 PM. Reason : d]

7/24/2008 2:27:28 PM

UNC was only a score away from beating alot of good teams last year, granted, all their wins but one were by a score or less, just saying, they took it to the hokies last year.

7/24/2008 2:29:49 PM

BUT THEY'RE ALL GAY

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 2:39 PM. Reason : let's keep things in perspective.]

7/24/2008 2:39:12 PM

^ that is true

7/24/2008 2:40:57 PM

see, i can be objective, too.

7/24/2008 2:45:38 PM

Quote :

"UNC was only a score away from beating alot of good teams last year, granted, all their wins but one were by a score or less, just saying, they took it to the hokies last year. "

inches. a season of inches.


/chuck

7/24/2008 3:07:19 PM

Personally, I'm mildly afraid that the "pickers" will be right about their UNC at #2 selection. Being that close in a lot of games says something. I haven't kept up with their recruiting or who they lost from last year, but if Butch is worth his salt, it doesn't bode well for us.

7/24/2008 3:32:45 PM

We were in a lot of games with Chuck too, and rarely got blown out.

7/24/2008 3:35:22 PM

^^ Don't forget the game with us was only close because old noodle arm can read defenses about as well as a 2-year old can read braile.

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 3:39 PM. Reason : asdf]

7/24/2008 3:39:00 PM

Quote :

"Moron. At this point in his tenure there he is doing things as good as could have reasonable been hoped for... they werent going to magically go 12-0 his first year with Bunting's players, but he is building up the facilities, which obviously do not not = wins, but its much easier to recruit and then win with good facilities than with bad or nonexistent ones... and he is doing really well recruiting for a team that has had pretty much zero draw for top recruits in football over the last 10 years. At this point, going into year 2, he is doing just about as good as could have been expected but your homer ignorant ass wont admit it... Do I like Carolina? nope, hate them, but I can admit they are going in the right direction and apparently most of the experts that cover the ACC agree (but I am sure you will chalk that up to some JFK assassination level media conspiracy)"

first, don't get me started on the acc "experts" - see preseason ACC basketball, NC State, circa summer-fall 2007.

second, where was i a homer? honestly? was i ever like "JAYBEE IS A FUCKIN UNC FAN! DAMN UNC MEDIA CONSPIRACY!! I BET JAYBEE WORKS FOR WRAL!!!!"? no, i wasn't. i never even said UNC wasn't going in the right direction. honestly i think they're getting better, which fucking blows, but it's true.

but you're just pissed i called you out for being a dick and saying you called UNC being at the top of the ACC in 2-4 years, when they're not even close. in the right direction, maybe. hell maybe even near the top of their division - which doesn't necessarily even mean top 5 in the acc. but top of the acc overall?

i swear, you spout off about objectivity, but the second someone disagrees with you, you immediately go into the "homer" defense. it never fails.

7/24/2008 3:43:53 PM

Matt Doherty recruited the UNC players who won their last NCAA title in the last 15 years...does that mean he can get that type of player to come play for him at Southern Methodist? Butch won't get 80s-90s Miami level talent at UNC either...although he is certainly a huge upgrade over Bunting

Quote :

"apparently most of the experts that cover the ACC agree (but I am sure you will chalk that up to some JFK assassination level media conspiracy)"

Michigan is the 5th best team in the nation!

/last year's preseason polls

7/24/2008 3:47:13 PM

Quote :

"OLD NOODLE ARM"

i lol'ed

7/24/2008 3:58:01 PM

^^ the exceptions always stand out, the polls arent 100% or there would be no reason to actually play out the season, but the big drops (or quick rises) stand out in memory.

^^^ going by everything I have said and you have said even, if you had to pick between these two options, you would honestly pick B??

A. UNC is in better shape than they were 2 years ago and are more likely to end up in the upper ranks of the ACC than before and stay there with better facilities and better recruiting classes

or

B. The have not improved the program at all, or have even gotten worse.


at this point they are heading in the right direction, you even admitted it... so I think that will continue to happen, but you think it will drop off for some reason

and as shitty as the ACC is right now, it wont take much to get to the top, see WF

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 4:34 PM. Reason : d]

7/24/2008 4:32:45 PM

in all fairness we'll have to wait and see what they do on the field this year...i think everybody is in agreement that Bitch Davis is an upgrade over Mr. Taco Bell, but that doesn't mean a basketball school is ever going to care about football...and if you have an ego like Bitch does, how long are you going to play 2nd fiddle to Droop Dog?

7/24/2008 4:35:17 PM

true... but as I've said before, I view Carolina football to be a lot like Tennessee bball before Pearl got there... a big state school, with a big athletics budget, lots of fans who love the "other" sport and would probably be willing to get into this one if they had a reason to cheer. There is no reason that Carolina (and State for that matter) shouldnt field a better than average team in the ACC. They should both be closer to VT, Clemson, FSU than Duke and WF

7/24/2008 4:41:02 PM

i think everyone would have thought our basketball team was choice A and we ended up as B so its hard to say at this point...

7/24/2008 4:41:09 PM

I wouldnt say that Lowe has led any MAJOR changes to the program itself from Herb... not quite the same

7/24/2008 4:42:35 PM

for starters, Hickson got drafted higher than any of Herb's recruits..but yeah we kind of overachieved his 1st year and came back to reality and shitty PG play last year

7/24/2008 4:45:08 PM

but thats still nowhere near adding on to a stadium, bringing in luxury boxes for the first time, brand new facilities etc.

7/24/2008 4:46:36 PM

well I'm sure if UNC had just gotten a brand new football stadium in 1999 like State basketball did, they wouldnt need to improve their facilities as much

7/24/2008 4:48:43 PM

your option A was that UNC was in better shape than before. Facilities help but as far as a team being in a better position to win I dont count it really especially when its only being TALKED about.

We had better talent than the previous year, with a year to adjust to the coach, coming off a high note on the end of the season, a lot of hype and fan support and we still tanked. Thats why I used my example.

Carolina still hasnt proved anything and I dont have a reason to believe they will be that much better. I cant say it wont happen, Im just saying that I think its a bit premature to assume they are making big improvements.

[Edited on July 24, 2008 at 4:54 PM. Reason : ]

7/24/2008 4:54:16 PM

^^ I never said otherwise...


^ well of course we dont KNOW if its going to happen, I am just saying what they are currently doing is just about as good as could be expected for one year under a new coach, there's not much more he can do at the moment

7/24/2008 4:56:24 PM

Quote :

"for starters, Hickson got drafted higher than any of Herb's recruits..but yeah we kind of overachieved his 1st year and came back to reality and shitty PG play last year"

Cedric Simmons was drafted with the 15th pick. Hickson was drafted with the 19th pick.

7/24/2008 5:01:23 PM

^ BOOM! Brass Monkey... the Funky Monkey

7/24/2008 5:06:44 PM

^^i know hodge was 20 or 21, i thought Ced was 18 or 19? im probably wrong

Quote :

"what they are currently doing is just about as good as could be expected for one year under a new coach"

or maybe they couldve beaten their rivals in Raleigh, who also had a first year coach

7/24/2008 5:11:37 PM

meh, State had home field advantage

7/24/2008 5:12:23 PM

so you're saying the best you can hope a 1st year coach to do is win home games

i'm gonna laugh my ass off when Duke beats them this year

7/24/2008 5:15:28 PM

I'm gonna cry when Duke beats us.

That's gonna be some NC State shit, right there.

7/24/2008 5:18:04 PM

^^ depends on the situation of course... Larry Coker at Miami? no

coming in after Bunting? you get the recruits that Davis has gotten and led a drive for better facilities, I will take it.


^ watch out for The Cut!

7/24/2008 5:23:45 PM