The old topics have expired (that I could find).
I am in the market for a big screen soon. I've been doing research and think that I want the LCD over the Plasma. The new LED is cool, but expensive over 50" and they are new so i'm skeptical.

I want a 52".. and i've been leaning toward a SONY: http://www.bestbuy.com/site/olspage.jsp?skuId=9223798&type=product&id=1218062425828

I think I want the 120Hz (like the one above)

Samsung and Sharp have similar products but different prices.... which brand is the best on the market? Does anyone have one like I linked to above? Advice? Thanks

5/15/2009 8:40:24 PM

I have the 52" Samsung 120 Hz and I must say its the most favorite thing I have ever bought I believe. I noticed they are selling 240 Hz ones now though so I may have to get one of those once the need arises for more than one tv

5/15/2009 8:42:37 PM

if you want affordable: vizio

if you want super cereal quality: samsung

5/15/2009 9:57:57 PM

I have a 46" Samsung 120Hz and I love it. I've gotten so spoiled by the picture quality that I don't enjoy watching movies on other TVs.

It's hard to go wrong with a sony or a sharp either.

5/15/2009 10:51:59 PM

what reasoning are you following for going lcd over plasma? there's only a couple cases in which i'd recommend lcd over plasma especially when factoring in the price of the 120hz

[Edited on May 15, 2009 at 11:16 PM. Reason : .]

5/15/2009 11:16:04 PM

Quote :

"The old topics have expired (that I could find)."

This one's still active.
message_topic.aspx?topic=453257&page=10

5/16/2009 12:15:00 AM

I <3 my 120hz ~50" samsung

5/16/2009 1:13:23 AM

The reading I have done said the LCD technology has surpassed the plasma, as wel as caught up with "blacks", (which i really can't tell the difference between anyway)
and I don't want to worry about burn in and all that stuff.
I went to best buy and their plasma selection was really lacking, which leads me to believe most people are going with LCD this day in age

5/16/2009 10:05:01 AM

Most people are going with LCDs because it's cheaper to get 1080p, the contrast is virtually indistinguishable from plasmas except in rare or contrived circumstances, they use less power, weigh less, etc.

120Hz for judder reduction is something you'll probably never get from plasmas (the "480Hz sub-field drive" crap on plasma ads is meant to confuse buyers into thinking it's better than a 120Hz LCD. The plasma picture is drawn in 8 sub-fields, so a 480 subfields/sec = 60 Hz refresh)

Plasma manufacturers have been backing out of the low-end TV market, because they can't compete with LCD's low cost. Plasmas are only really competitive in the > 46" arena.

I've got a Samsung LN52A650 (all the features of the Sony you posted for less money). If you look around, you can find it for less than $1600 shipped (sold out). The color is great. It has a swivel stand. It only weighs about 60 pounds with the stand detached, so it's easy to mount, supports RSS feeds and weather on screen. It also has a headphone jack, which I think is a nice addition and you can turn off the built-in speakers in the menu if you use a home theater system exclusively. It's one of the best value LCDs available now. (If you get one with old firmware, you might have to flash it, though.)

The Sony LCDs are better than the Samsung I mentioned, but not by much. It wasn't worth the price difference in my opinion.

In contrast, the best value plasma out there was probably the Pioneer Kuro series, which I think is discontinued. I never saw it side by side with my model TV, but having seen both, I don't think the Kuro has a visibly better picture. It's 20 pounds heavier and costs about $2500 if you can find it new, ~$1800 for an open box / return.

Plasmas aren't as bad about burn-in as they used to be, but I wouldn't use one as a computer monitor.

5/16/2009 11:14:44 AM

Also, for the love of god, don't buy from Best Buy unless you hate your money.

5/16/2009 11:23:20 AM

Well I'll probably go with best buy, because that's where i buy all my electronics and never had any hassle..

but i may go with sears because my builder gets a discount there

5/16/2009 3:36:45 PM

Quote :

"Samsung"

Quote :

"Don't go to Best Buy"

5/16/2009 4:26:33 PM

Quote :

"Well I'll probably go with best buy, because that's where i buy all my electronics and never had any hassle.."

a horrible idea

5/16/2009 5:06:48 PM

ahahaha

best buy, seriously?

that's like saying "hay guyz i'm gonna go burn some fucking money in a trash can outside..nobody has ever cared before so i guess it's cool"

5/16/2009 5:25:00 PM

Best buy sells stuff for about 30-40% more than you can get it in a store that's not trying to fleece you.

I'm not usually one to shout about "evil capitalist corporations" but as an informed individual, I strongly discourage anyone from buying anything at Best Buy, ever. Sure they have a good deal here and there, but that's just to get you through the doors so they can rip you off.

The biggest examples of this are the Dynex and Rocketfish "brands" (both owned by Best Buy). I honestly think people should be sent to jail over fraud like this:

Quote :

"Dynex DX-400WPS There are many things that the Dynex DX-400WPS is, of the things a 400w power supply it is not by any stretch of the imagination and this was certainly clear from the beginning given the build quality of this unit. As soon as this unit was opened it was clear that this unit was not nearly as well constructed as other 400w products we have seen. Indeed, in various places the unit was screened for additional and larger components that were excluded from this unit. The components that were included were of poor quality with the best thing we saw in the unit being a few Teapo capacitors as the rest were TL and Fcon. Adding insult to the injury, the unit’s PCB indicates that the power supply is supposed to be a 200-300w unit. This 200w-300w marking turned out to be prophetic as the unit was capable of doing 200w's but was capable of destroying test equipment when 300watts were attempted. Surprisingly though, when running the unit actually demonstrated good voltage regulation with peak changes of less than 0.05v on any of the positive rails through the tests it completed (all two of them that is). However, when running the units efficiency peaked at just 78.82% at 120v input and bottomed out at 73.91% at 100v which is not very good for any unit. When all these performance metrics are considered, this is an exceptionally poor power supply given that competing products in this class, such as the SilverStone Strider ST400, are capable of doing their full rated output within all ATX12v specifications for a mere $46.99 compared to this units RIDICULOUS $79.99 price tag. Looking back at previous power supplies we have reviewed it would be hard to find a worse value than what we have seen here today as at least when the PowerTek Pro 500w blew up and killed test equipment that unit was only $20."

--HardOCP

Whether or not you personally have been victimized by Best Buy, they make a business of it so I think supporting them really isn't appropriate.





All that said, you're considering buying a reputable product, and I guarantee whatever you decide on buying, it will be hundreds, perhaps $1000 more expensive than you can ultimately buy it.

5/16/2009 5:33:52 PM

I don't want to buy it off a website. I want to buy it from a store that I can pick it up from, take it back to if i have a problem, etc...

Which store do you guys recommend for that?

5/16/2009 7:08:34 PM

Best Buy.

Say what you want about them, but they have great return policies. And if you do your homework, most NAME BRAND electronics only carry a 10-15% price premium at BB over online vendors. You just have to do the research first.

Too bad you don't live out here on the west coast, because Video Only and Fry's are badass

5/16/2009 7:16:53 PM

Best Buy does not have a good return policy. A 15% or greater "restocking" fee for returned (non-defective) merchandise. If defective, refunds are only issue by corporate check (for items over $250) "within 10 days". For my XBox 360, those "10 days" were actually almost 90.

As for the "10-15%" premium, on some items that's true, but simply not so on TVs. The TV I paid $1600 for was $2700 at best buy at the time. BB has since dropped the price to $2000, which is still 25% more than I paid for it.

5/16/2009 7:57:47 PM

I have a 52" Sony Bravia W

and I love it more than I love my daughter

5/16/2009 7:59:33 PM

As for some place you should buy a TV. Try Costco. The $50 membership fee is worth it for the reasonable prices, no questions asked return policy (90 days on TVs vs BBs 14 days with a restocking fee), and FREE extended warranty on anything you purchase (2 years on TVs and major electronics, forever on almost anything else). If anything goes wrong, the Costco concierge service will deal with the repair company or manufacturer for you.

5/16/2009 8:03:15 PM

I price matched and bought from Sears.

[Edited on May 16, 2009 at 8:05 PM. Reason : the costco warranty policy is great from what I've read. I bought my smaller TV from BJ's for cheap]

5/16/2009 8:03:44 PM

The Costco warranty is better than great. I know first hand.

The downside is they only take American Express, cash, or check.

5/16/2009 8:22:09 PM

You want to buy from a true boutique type specialty shop. Both the cheapest route and the most technically competent. Buying electronics should be like buying a car - lots of haggling to be done, lots of money to be saved.

5/16/2009 8:37:43 PM

I <3 my epic 46" Sony Bravia 120hz 1080p LCD Flat Panel HDTV.

5/16/2009 8:48:45 PM

in what ways have u read lcd have surpassed plasmas? are u referring to sales?

Quote :

"the contrast is virtually indistinguishable from plasmas except in rare or contrived circumstances"

if u've seen them in a real viewing situation the difference is clear.most lcds have <10k:1 NATIVE contrast ratios and rely on the marketing of dynamic contrast. lcds have caught up in terms of black only when showing all black screens(dynamic) but when it comes to showing dark colors and bright colors the lcds still aren't as good(native). even my gf has said my bedroom lcd (32lna330) looks really washed out and dull compared to my living room plasma(pn50a550) i've also been asked by owners of a 52lnt71f to "make the colors on my tv look more like yours"

Quote :

"because they can't compete with LCD's low cost. Plasmas are only really competitive in the > 46" arena."

true you can find a cheaper 1080p lcd but it's not fair to compare something with a 8k:1CR & 8 ms response time to something w/ 30k:1 CR & .666ms response. compared to an lcd of like quality, tv plasmas are competitive at any size. this combined with the fact plasmas aren't readily available under 42" is why lcds outsell plasmas.

Quote :

"The Sony LCDs are better than the Samsung I mentioned, but not by much. It wasn't worth the price difference in my opinion. "

i agree here samsung makes pretty much all sony's panels except the xbrs.

Quote :

"the best value plasma out there was probably the Pioneer Kuro series"

kuro=!a value tv. it's considered by most to be the best flat panel tv available. Panasonic and samsungs are going to be your value plasmas.

overall lcds display better in a super bright store where they're brightness makes them stand out amongst plasmas. try to see them like u watch tv i.e. turn off the lights. pop in the dark knight or tropic thunder on bluray (not spiderman3 like we show in the stores to sell 120hz lol) and the plasmas will display just as good a picture if not better than the latest ,greatest, most expensive lcds including the led tvs. for the record i'm not a plasma fanboy. lcd has it's place, i love the 6/7/8 series lcds but i think you can get a quality tv for less see 5/6 series plasma. if u're not convinced you are welcome to come over and check out my plasma setup.



[Edited on May 16, 2009 at 9:35 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2009 9:27:20 PM

so LCD's don't look good in dark rooms?

[Edited on May 16, 2009 at 9:32 PM. Reason : i meant dark]

5/16/2009 9:31:59 PM

i won't say they won't but there short comings become more obvious in a darker room. for instance my bedroom lcd shows a deep deep gray rather than black on the darker scenes.something like the 650 will do a much better job than my 330 or my plasma at displaying blacks. BUT with movies like dark knight or tropic thunder the lcds have difficulty displaying both the super black and super bright simultaneously which is how you find the true contrast ratio.

another thing is that 120hz interpolates an extra frame that's isn't in the original content. so while it gets rid of judder in 24fps movies it can make tv look like ass.the main reason 120hz was created was to help with the motion blur associated with lcds , the reason for no 120hz plasmas is bc they display motion better and really don't need it.

lol this thread + the alcohol has made me pop in tropic thunder. " i'm tryna put tiger blam on this jungle's nutz"


[Edited on May 16, 2009 at 10:04 PM. Reason : .]

5/16/2009 10:00:35 PM

i have a 46" samsung 120Hz LCD. it fucking rules

5/16/2009 10:58:01 PM

now.. i'm confused between two things.

"120hz" i thought these high refresh rates were supposed to be be a multiple of the two common frame rates, 30fps, and 24fps. good. so a 30fps show shows one frame out of 4 and a 24fps shows one frame in 5. perfect. So why is there a need for 240hz?

then there is this "smooth motion" horse shit where the TV interpolates frames to make things super smooth. This drives me so insane i want to pull my eyeballs out. Does anyone actually use this?

5/17/2009 1:03:27 AM

Quote :

"I've got a 52" Samsung LN52A650 "

And it is fucking awesome! Got it from hhgregg. Act like you are hesitant to pull the trigger and tell them that you want to think it over and see what other prices are out there. They will not let you leave the store without coming down to much lower price (got mine for $1,900 last summer when it was going for $2,100 on Amazon and $2,500 at Best Buy, Circuit City, etc.)

[Edited on May 17, 2009 at 1:31 AM. Reason : .]

5/17/2009 1:31:02 AM

I use the 120hz technology with a lot of my video games, because my HDTV is actually my computer monitor and my television. Since my hdtv can handle 120hz feeds, I can play the majority of my steam games at 120hz. They look really smooth and my native resolution is 1920 x 1080 @ 120hz. My computer is also top-of-the-line, so I run max settings/resolution on literally all games except for Crysis. The main reason I picked LCD instead is because it is a safer choice for people that decide to use their HDTV as their computer monitor. If you leave your display on without a screen saver on a plasma, it will burn into the screen. LCDs don't have that potential issue. I gotta tell you, there is nothing like playing Oblivion on my system, it's absolutely beautiful.

5/17/2009 9:03:01 AM

^thats a good point/use.

5/17/2009 9:54:57 AM

well...best buy has the one i want on sale for $1999 today. so i'll probably go ahead and just get it. i'll have it delivered elsewhere for the time being until i move into my house in june

5/17/2009 9:55:03 AM

Quote :

"I went to best buy and their plasma selection was really lacking, which leads me to believe most people are going with LCD this day in age"

popularity =/= quality. BestBuy caters to the masses. The masses don't know shit about electronics. I'm not saying LCDs aren't better than plasmas. I'm just saying that the stock at a store which targets the masses is a testament to popularity rather than quality.

Also, the typical employee at best buy doesn't know shit. Or if they do, they don't bother sharing it because they don't think you care or know shit. And the people in the stores with a Magnolia section are no better.

Whatever you do, do your own hw and just use BB as someplace to actually buy the product. Don't depend on them to give you good advice.

Quote :

"well...best buy has the one i want on sale for $1999 today. so i'll probably go ahead and just get it. i'll have it delivered elsewhere for the time being until i move into my house in june"

Why not just wait until then? TVs don't usually get more expensive as time passes. On the other hand, they do sometimes get less expensive. And bestbuy only carries so many tvs. It can't be too long before they have that one on sale again.

5/17/2009 12:17:31 PM

I use the 120 Hz auto motion shit or whatever at all times, when I turn it off it makes my head want to explode by how jittery and jumpy everything appears all of a sudden. The only time its a bit strange is watching say golf or something with a high velocity moving object when it appears as 3 golfballs instead of just one.

5/17/2009 12:25:11 PM

I went ahead and bought the Sony... I also got a 3.1 soundbar with a woofer...

Is the 120Hz an option I have to turn off and on? or is it always on?

also...right now I just have a standard TV with a standard digital cable box..

when i move and transfer my services, do i just need to tell TWC to send me a HD box? Everything else should be the same...i'm already paying for digital cable with the hd channels, i just don't have a hd box right now

5/17/2009 1:57:59 PM

^^to me when its on everything looks super real. kinda like a soap opera times 11. The acting looks fake, it all looks fake and weird. Totally looses the cinematic feel. its so bizarre to me. I want my video as intended, 30 or 24fps on the dot. no interpolation, no 3:2 pulldown.

^depends what you mean by 120hz. "smooth motion" can be turned off or adjusted. if you want it to deal with framerates properly, that'll probably happen automatically, but i'm not sure.

5/17/2009 5:25:56 PM

the tv i got just says 120Hz. i thought it was something that it did automatically, not an option i can turn of and on

also, tell me if this is right...

i bought the sony soundbar with woofer. the woofer has 3 HDMI inputs and 1 output.
Can I just use HDMI cables to plug my cable box and PS3 into the woofer, then 1 HDMI from the woofer to the TV? No other cables needed, right?

And can I turn the audio off the TV and only go through the soundbar, or vice versa? Thanks

[Edited on May 17, 2009 at 6:07 PM. Reason : ya]

5/17/2009 5:52:50 PM

"120hz" without context means nothing. FTFM

You'll probably need the woofer (receiver inside) on in order to pass the signal to the TV. So yeh, you can have TV sound off, stereo on, but you can't have stereo on and TV off with a source that is passed through the stereo. Although you could run an additional audio connection from the source directly to the TV for this situation.

5/17/2009 6:11:16 PM

OK..well i guess it wouldn't hurt to have both the TV audio on and the stereo system... That wouldn't sound bad would it?

And it just seems weird that all I need is HDMI cables for audio and video.. I'm used to having all 3 component cords...

so the coaxial cable goes into my cable box, but then HDMI goes from cable box to TV? (or in this case, my woofer receiver)

5/17/2009 6:17:55 PM

it'd be best to only have one audio source at a time. just turn the TV volume down or mute it or turn the speakes off in the menu.

yes HDMI carries audio and video.

cox to cable box
HDMI from cable box to woofer/receiver
HDMI from woofer/receiver to TV.

Get $12 HDMI cables from Big Lots. i hope you didn't pay the $59 each that best buy wants for 'em.

5/17/2009 6:25:09 PM

i got some from best buy but i got a discount on them... i had to ask for the discount.. since i bought the TV and the 3.1 sound system, they gave me a nice deal on the cables

Actually, I just read the manual and it says that when you turn the system off, sound resumes through the TV speakers.. I guess as long as it is on standby, the cables still work...

[Edited on May 17, 2009 at 6:41 PM. Reason : ya]

5/17/2009 6:33:27 PM

Quote :

"for instance my bedroom lcd shows a deep deep gray rather than black on the darker scenes."

This debate about black levels becomes less important when you find out that many movies (blu-rays even) don't even display true black. They compress the dynamic range of the picture and you end up with dark grey/blue blacks. You can see this when the black bars are darker than the scene ever gets.

5/17/2009 7:19:19 PM

Quote :

"i got some from best buy but i got a discount on them... i had to ask for the discount.. since i bought the TV and the 3.1 sound system, they gave me a nice deal on the cables"

What's that saying about a fool and his money?

I'd be willing to bet that you still paid 3 or 4 times more than you needed to if you bought your cables from BB. even if they told you you were getting a really good deal.

I'm surprised you didn't pay Geek Squad $texas for a custom install too. That seems like about the only thing I can think of that you didn't do to waste money.

5/17/2009 8:12:42 PM

My next TV will be an LED TV. My current one is a high definition CRT, which has the best color reproduction I have ever seen.

5/17/2009 9:50:21 PM

TV I got has "Motionflow" and "cinemotion"

what's the difference? Should I turn them on or off?

what's the best settings to have when i'm playing ps3?

6/19/2009 4:05:29 PM

google?

My guess is that "motion flow" refers to interpolating frames to 120Hz. This should really be turned off unless whatever you're watching is juddery. Image interpolation creates an unrealistic appearance because the motion detection algorithms only compare 2 frames and interpolate along the motion vectors in a straight line. While the picture will be smoother, the motion will seem unnatural.

My guess for the "cinemotion" is it probably enables the 120Hz refresh, but disables any frame interpolation, so you can view movies in their original frame rate without artificial smoothing.

6/19/2009 5:28:36 PM

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/searchtools/item-Details.asp?EdpNo=4820634&sku=S226-5228%20BX

Thoughts?

7/10/2009 3:05:12 PM

i can't believe how many people have bought into the hype of "led" tvs(THEY ARE JUST LCDS w/ LED BACKLIGHTS!) and 120hz but it's not my $ so whatever.

^ i would stay away from the sharp stuff even though they share panels with some of the big names like sonytheir tvs always seemed to be a step behind in both build and picture quality. so if you're for a quality tv i'd say spend a lil more and go w. a sony or samsung or if you looking for a cheaper tv vizio is solid. if you want both better picture and a lower price get a plasma

7/11/2009 3:31:35 PM

^ Good to know. Thanks

7/13/2009 12:09:36 PM