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kiljadn
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BECAUSE THAT MAKES SENSE



you people

1/14/2010 9:30:12 PM

Solinari
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Once again, the United States rides to the rescue

But of course, we're the eternal bad guys. Worse than China, worse than Turkey, worse than Norway, worse than Australia, worse than everyone.

1/14/2010 9:38:27 PM

pooljobs
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real life is not a video game, there is no bar at the bottom of the screen that shows where we are on the good-bad scale. it is possible for a country to do good and bad things.

1/14/2010 9:43:17 PM

Solinari
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ok well let's see how many years people dwell on the good things we do for haiti vs a couple of random rednecks who abused some prisoners in iraq.

1/14/2010 9:51:49 PM

0EPII1
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yes, the US does a lot of good. but it was more than just "a couple of random rednecks who abused some prisoners in iraq." whether you look at the abuse of prisoners in iraq or the extraordinary renditions, the chain of command goes nearly to the top, and it was is hundreds, if not thousands of "random rednecks" who did/still do the abuses.

and your point is moot. the overwhelming majority of the world sees the US as bad just for attacking iraq unilaterally and without provocation... what happened with prisoners and abuses afterwards is just the tip of the iceberg.

however, your overall point is taken. the US gives money to many countries and peoples in and out of times of immediate distress. gg.

1/14/2010 10:02:21 PM

Solinari
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because the chain of command is clearly not involved in the haitian bailout?

here's my point - the us does a lot more good than bad but everyone devotes the vast majority of their energy to constantly complain about and focus on the bad (which, while bad, is not even close to the level of bad that actual bad countries engage in).

1/14/2010 10:23:33 PM

pooljobs
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it surprises you that people pay attention more to bad things than good things? um... hi, welcome to the human condition.

1/14/2010 10:28:30 PM

Solinari
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Just taking the moment to remind all the liberals on here that here's the US doing wonderful things and inviting them to post as many complimentary posts about their country as they have castigating it in the past.

1/14/2010 10:31:19 PM

pooljobs
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i wish i could see the world as clear cut and simple as you see it

1/14/2010 10:32:50 PM

Solinari
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I do not see it as clear cut and simple at all. I am surprised that you would wish for ignorance.

1/14/2010 10:35:23 PM

Supplanter
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Quote :
"Just taking the moment to remind all the liberals on here that here's the US doing wonderful things and inviting them to post as many complimentary posts about their country as they have castigating it in the past."


I for one think President Obama, the chain of command, and US as a country is doing a good thing in its disaster relief efforts and am taking this moment to be complimentary.

1/14/2010 10:38:20 PM

Solinari
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Me too and I'm damn proud of our nation that we don't even debate whether we should do this. It's just automatic immediate and fully committed.

We rock!

[Edited on January 14, 2010 at 10:42 PM. Reason : s]

1/14/2010 10:40:44 PM

0EPII1
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^ Not all the populace is for it, though (which is to be expected, no matter which country it is).

message_topic.aspx?topic=586041

1/14/2010 10:57:43 PM

GrumpyGOP
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We should definitely try to pin the issue in Haiti to the Iraq War. Because that's the cool thing to do.

1/15/2010 2:21:20 AM

mambagrl
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Hard to believe Bush would've had the same reaction as Obama. Sorry, had to say it but we saw Katrina and Haiti is even blacker than New Orleans and not even in the US.

Quote :
"But of course, we're the eternal bad guys"

Its easy to help your friends but can you help your enemies?

1/15/2010 2:34:32 AM

sarijoul
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bush doubled foreign aid during his presidency. it was the largest increase since LBJ or something. gotta give gwb credit where it's due.

1/15/2010 8:01:09 AM

HUR
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Quote :
"I wonder if the US can mobilize efforts there quicker than we did in New Orleans after Katrina?

"


considering Haiti is not in the US; I don't give a fuck if they do or don't. On the other hand we should provide aid and the haitians will be grateful for it. This time though they can't accuse Obama of "not liking black people"

1/15/2010 8:25:21 AM

McDanger
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Quote :
"considering Haiti is not in the US; I don't give a fuck if they do or don't."

This makes practically no sense

1/15/2010 8:31:26 AM

d357r0y3r
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I don't think the government should be giving any money to Haiti. The government has no money to spend. If citizens want to donate money or volunteer, that's a good thing, but something different entirely.

1/15/2010 8:40:19 AM

Boone
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Quote :
"Justin of Raleigh, North Carolina: "Why does Obama say if you want to donate some money, you could go to whitehouse.gov to direct you how to do so? If I wanted to donate to the Red Cross, why do I have to go to the White House page to donate?"

Limbaugh: "Exactly. Would you trust the money's gonna go to Haiti?"

Justin: "No."

Rush: "But would you trust that your name's gonna end up on a mailing list for the Obama people to start asking you for campaign donations for him and other causes?"

Justin: "Absolutely!"

Limbaugh: "Absolutely!""


1/15/2010 9:14:05 AM

pooljobs
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i mean i had to start sending obama emails to the spam folder, he kinda has a point

1/15/2010 9:18:15 AM

EarthDogg
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The Right has Pat Robertson's dumb statement, the Left has Danny Glover...

Quote :
"Says Glover: “When we see what we did at the climate summit in Copenhagen, this is the response, this is what happens, you know what I’m sayin’?” "

1/15/2010 10:05:44 AM

d357r0y3r
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lolwut

1/15/2010 10:06:50 AM

LoneSnark
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Quote :
"here's my point - the us does a lot more good than bad but everyone devotes the vast majority of their energy to constantly complain about and focus on the bad (which, while bad, is not even close to the level of bad that actual bad countries engage in)."

Yes, it is amazing after all the good that Bob Saget has done for the world that all anyone can talk about is how he raped and killed a girl in 1990.

1/15/2010 10:18:13 AM

smc
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Quote :
"I don't think the government should be giving any money to Haiti. The government has no money to spend. If citizens want to donate money or volunteer, that's a good thing, but something different entirely."


Exactly. If we're going to send a small invasion force there, let's just invade. Turn the place into Rip Roaring Casino-Filled 1950's Cuba Part 2. Planet Earth has just helped out with half of the poverty problem. American tourism will take care of the rest.

Same thing with Iraq. We should have just come out and said we own the country, then used the oil to both help reconstruct the hellhole and pay ourselves back. Protesters claim the war was about oil, let's make it so.

If you ask me Bush wasn't evil. He was just a pussy that couldn't carry things to their logical conclusion.

1/15/2010 10:41:54 AM

TKE-Teg
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^I actually agree with that, despite feeling wrong at the same time

1/15/2010 11:14:20 AM

nastoute
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I'm fearful of the brewing violence.

It may get very very bad.

1/15/2010 11:19:17 AM

disco_stu
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You have no money in the bank and you're 5k in debt. A relative asks you for some financial help. What can you do but feel bad? Unless you have a money printing machine, then you're set.

1/15/2010 11:21:08 AM

nastoute
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i thought about this for a sec...

the sight of all those bodies is bothersome

in this situation... you need to start setting up makeshift crematoriums... It sounds so ghastly.

I wonder what the standard operating procedure for these kinds of things...

[Edited on January 15, 2010 at 11:39 AM. Reason : .]

1/15/2010 11:38:52 AM

ssjamind
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^ look at pic 11 on the front page slide show:

http://www.nytimes.com/

right now SOP seems to be to just stack all the bodies somewhere & have mass burials

1/15/2010 11:47:31 AM

nastoute
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I believe the "stack all the bodies"

I'm just not so sure that anyone's mass burying anything...

I just saw the pic with the truck...

oh man...

I mean... it needs to be done... if they're burying them... ok

but jeez

1/15/2010 11:50:19 AM

ssjamind
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fyi

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_natural_disasters_by_death_toll

1/15/2010 12:05:39 PM

d357r0y3r
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Damn, China has had some crazy earthquakes.

1/15/2010 12:07:32 PM

bobster
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It's crazy that the top 10 natural disasters all occur in or around Asia.

1/15/2010 12:32:41 PM

nastoute
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^^^

thanks for the link

I'm saying the next thing with a completely neutral tone

was there some lesson or point you wanted to put forward with the link

for was it just pure information

1/15/2010 12:38:56 PM

disco_stu
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^^ Not so much crazy as logical.

1/15/2010 12:42:01 PM

nastoute
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has anyone every explained what's in the freaking water in asia?

what is the deal with their population... through out all of human history...

1/15/2010 12:44:35 PM

ssjamind
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^ successful civilisations since the bronze age with the carrying capacity to support said enormous populations.

the "re-emergence" of Asia is already underway..

1/15/2010 1:19:28 PM

LoneSnark
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^ Well, they did try to get back in line with the rest of us under Mao, but he only managed to kill 60 million or so.

1/15/2010 3:03:55 PM

HOOPS MALONE
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I personally believe in personal responsibility. there should be no tax dollars and government money going to Hati. you just prolong their suffering because aid does more harm than good. read "the politically incorrect guide to us history".

if you want to give money its better to give to a private church group because they actually do some good and shouldnt be controlled by governmet officials.

1/15/2010 3:44:12 PM

Wolfman Tim
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fyi, China's and India's populations have grown by 25% since that map was made

1/15/2010 4:12:04 PM

RedGuard
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Eastern Asia, the Confucian areas in particular has had strong civil organization for thousands of years with sophisticated bureaucracies and taxation systems. This has resulted in large urban populations which create the population densities that allow for these sorts of massive casualties in the event of a natural disaster.

As for those saying that we shouldn't use any money to help the Haitians, just think of this as a PR campaign by the United States. The relatively small amount we're spending to help this situation (which I'm sure equals less than even a tenth of a percentage point of our Federal budget) helps buy us good will and calm in our immediate vicinity. Also, a total implosion of Haiti is going to result in a massive exodus of Haitians, and most likely, many will take to boats and try to come to the United States, swamping our Coast Guard and law enforcement who will have to go and intercept them. Better to just spend those resources now to prevent that from happening.

1/15/2010 4:48:45 PM

rallydurham
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This should be a scary image for all the liberals out there.

The picture of this ruinous nation should scare the fuck out you guys for supporting the crazy national destruction policies that you support...

Just look how horrible poverty is, why would you want it to spread in America?

1/15/2010 7:12:48 PM

pooljobs
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well preval is generally criticized for "selling out" to privatization, so...

1/15/2010 7:17:46 PM

moron
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http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN1517056920100115?type=marketsNews

$11 million raised so far via the texting donations.

It’s amazing how just making something easy to do gets so many donations. It’s kind of unfortunate this system wasn’t in place for other recent disasters. They probably have TOO much money now.

1/15/2010 7:24:10 PM

mambagrl
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what on earth is rallydurham talking about?

1/15/2010 11:40:32 PM

LoneSnark
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He is pointing out that the more Governments try to do, even ones largely free of corruption, the less legitimacy they maintain. He is trying to ignore the fact that the U.S. has a lot of legitimacy to lose before we get anywhere close to Venezuela, much less Haiti.

1/16/2010 10:45:17 AM

mambagrl
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liberals and spreading poverty does not compute.

Quote :
"The picture of this ruinous nation should scare the fuck out you guys for supporting the crazy national destruction policies that you support...
"

so if we pass public healthcare, we will be more vulnerable to major earthquakes?

Quote :
"He is pointing out that the more Governments try to do, even ones largely free of corruption, the less legitimacy they maintain"

not to mention most of the wealthiest, best nations to live in have these "destruction policies"

1/16/2010 11:13:44 AM

PinkandBlack
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The US military is working with the Dominican Republic to set up temporary relief operations bases right now.

So what private organization should we be sending down for search and rescue? Blackwater? And people are concerned about sinking money in Haiti...how about not sinking it in unaccountable contractors and instead using the good organizations we have like the National Guard?

[Edited on January 16, 2010 at 12:05 PM. Reason : .]

1/16/2010 12:04:38 PM

nastoute
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http://www.cnn.com/2010/WORLD/americas/01/16/haiti.updates.sat/index.html?hpt=T1

Quote :
"9:21 a.m. -- The dumping of bodies into mass graves in Haiti is unnecessary from a public health standpoint, experts said. "The reality is that most of the diseases that live in us -- once our body is dead they can't survive very long," said Oliver Morgan, an epidemiologist at the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention in Atlanta, Georgia."


I didn't know this... and still kind of don't believe it.

I have a hard time believing that rotting dead things everywhere doesn't help spread disease. I think the main problem is water contamination by rotting and decaying flesh. My guess is that these "experts" are thinking from a 21st century 1st world perspective and not in a "the rest of human existence" perspective

that being said, I would never condemn people for mass cremations or burials during times of natural disaster... their minds are in the right place.

[Edited on January 16, 2010 at 1:06 PM. Reason : ,]

1/16/2010 1:01:38 PM

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