why are you so focused on trans issues?

I’m also struggling to understand your logic of voters thinking Dems are too focused on trans issues when it’s Republicans throughout the country who are passing anti-trans legislation

11/12/2021 1:19:00 PM

^^^Yeah I mean maybe it's tough bc you tied your argument to aaronburros dumbshit post. Your posts are more detailed, but his post is just nonsense. If you generally support dem platform I don't see the value in backing his hyperbole/bullshit/whatever. I mean the defund thing is not even party platform.

And in context of what you wrote, it seemed that you were posting those links to prove that "You can say it is because there are actual dem talking points on these issues that suggest they're focusing on it*" It's a big leap from "having talking points" to "focus". Republicans have just as many talking points.

[Edited on November 12, 2021 at 1:49 PM. Reason : E ]

11/12/2021 1:20:30 PM

^^if you struggle to understand at this point (in life, not just this thread) how individuals construct a narrative based on messaging or even absence of messaging, that's a deficit of yours that I can't do much to resolve. Ditto if you can't connect that the context of the discussion regards the mindset of the general voting population and the narrative they've constructed around democratic efforts, especially as it relates to trans issues.

^I pointed out that despite its hyperbole, which I acknowledged, his post had a broader point that democrats need to capitalize on this moment when republicans are barely functional. I am genuinely confused as to what that is an issue because I believe supporting the platform means being critical and identifying where things can and should improve, which in this case is either 1) messaging that resonates with most Americans or 2) subsequent legislative/policy wins that minimize reliance on messaging.

The links were posted to address @Cabbage's suggestion that it may be more what republicans claim dems say rather than actual dem action and @TGL's assertion that dems were neither publicly speaking on these issues or passing affiliated legislation.

11/12/2021 3:28:25 PM

Quote :

" pointed out that despite its hyperbole, which I acknowledged, his post had a broader point that democrats need to capitalize on this moment when republicans are barely functional. I am genuinely confused as to what that is an issue because I believe supporting the platform means being critical and identifying where things can and should improve, which in this case is either 1) messaging that resonates with most Americans or 2) subsequent legislative/policy wins that minimize reliance on messaging."

For the first part, I think you're giving AB's post way too much credit. His words didn't make any attempt to make all the points you are making. For the 2nd point, if you take a look through my TSB history, I have probably been the single most critical poster in Dem/Biden credibility, at least before the last few weeks. So I think it would be clear that Dems need

Quote :

" pointed out that despite its hyperbole, which I acknowledged, his post had a broader point that democrats need to capitalize on this moment when republicans are barely functional. I am genuinely confused as to what that is an issue because I believe supporting the platform means being critical and identifying where things can and should improve, which in this case is either 1) messaging that resonates with most Americans or 2) subsequent legislative/policy wins that minimize reliance on messaging."

For the first part, I think you're giving AB's post way too much credit. His words didn't make any attempt to make all the points you are making. You didn't even attempt to defend 2/3s of his points so you must not have been THAT convinced. And when challenged he responded its reality, so he clearly thinks it's true.

For the 2nd point, if you take a look through my TSB history, I have probably been the single most critical poster in Dem/Biden credibility, at least before the last few weeks. So I think it would be clear I think they need to do way more. Maybe that lack of success has created a narrative about focus but its just that, a narrative, not reality.

11/12/2021 4:25:12 PM

Quote :

"You can choose any of these options, with the reality probably being half the latter and split on the two former, but they all reach the same conclusion that the spirit of the original point is true because it is what resonates in the mind of voters. Perceptions that resonate in the mind of voters is important."

I think you're just muddying the whole point of the objection here.

Had aaronburro originally said that there's a widespread perception that Democrats are focusing on trans, defund police, cartoon characters and Aunt Jemima, and that perception is a problem, I would never had any objection. That's quite obviously true, and Democrats absolutely need better messaging.

But aaronburro didn't say that. He said that Dems are focusing on those things as if it were fact.

I agree that the PERCEPTION is a problem, and that implies to me:

Don't promote that misperception. And when someone does promote that misperception (like aaronburro did), call them out on it. Which I did.

I agree with what you say: That IS what resonates in the minds of many voters. Because of that, it's important at all times to clearly distinguish "X is true" from "A lot of people think X is true". If the latter is true and you think that's a problem, then you sure as hell shouldn't go around phrasing it as the former, perpetuating the problem.

Regarding your links, I think a lot of those are actually REactive to Republican policies (remember the NC bathroom bill?) and therefore I disagree that such comments imply that Democrats FOCUS on those issues.

11/12/2021 4:30:27 PM

^^^ fuck off, dude

11/12/2021 5:27:07 PM

He is making a lot of sense to me. You uber progressives just live in some kind of weird bubble.

11/12/2021 5:54:59 PM

Quote :

"He is making a lot of sense to me. You uber progressives just live in some kind of weird bubble."

...said the man from inside the bubble.

11/12/2021 5:59:06 PM

Yeah…inflation bubble lol

11/12/2021 6:29:06 PM

^^^I don't think I've ever seen you make a post longer than one line. But I guess I'm not super surprised you believe the nonsense burro spouted.


[Edited on November 12, 2021 at 6:30 PM. Reason : No substance ]

11/12/2021 6:29:40 PM

I too am not surprised you have your head in the sand about the state of our electorate. I am def voting dem in 2024 if Trump runs

11/12/2021 6:31:54 PM

You've never read a single one of my posts, clearly


Speaking of my posts here's an interesting one re: trans
https://brentroad.com/message_topic.aspx?topic=650397&page=22#16599636

[Edited on November 12, 2021 at 6:37 PM. Reason : E]

11/12/2021 6:32:28 PM

Is that twitter post suppose to placate middle america? Or are you just projecting?

11/12/2021 6:46:34 PM

That part was directed at geppetto, an active participant in a discussion, not you.

[Edited on November 12, 2021 at 6:53 PM. Reason : "placate middle America" lmao you're having some other argument I guess]

11/12/2021 6:52:24 PM

Fair enough

11/12/2021 6:53:42 PM

I'll address you to make it clear where I stand: I think of a new presidential election was held tomorrow, Biden VS trump I would be very down on bidens chances.

11/12/2021 6:55:20 PM

Quote :

"I too am not surprised you have your head in the sand about the state of our electorate."

Jesus Christ, how far up your ass does your head have to be to not even realize that that's not the subject under discussion?

[Edited on November 12, 2021 at 7:14 PM. Reason : ]

11/12/2021 7:13:42 PM

Oh sorry my democrat friend. Where were you in fucking 2001-04? Most of yall communist ass dems didn’t say shit then while us Moderates were toting the line. And here us moderates are stuck between Manchin and Trump. Gee thanks

11/12/2021 11:17:16 PM

Wow, instead of actually getting back on topic you just drift further away.

11/12/2021 11:33:59 PM

11/13/2021 12:11:48 AM

^^if i were you i’d say the same thing

11/13/2021 1:06:25 AM

OK.

I'm just very thankful I'm not you.

11/13/2021 1:26:10 AM

Lol fair enough

11/13/2021 2:30:00 AM

Quote :

"if i were you i’d say the same thing"

This comment makes me chuckle for some reason. "if I were you I'd say what you just said", well, yea I guess?

11/13/2021 11:15:15 AM

LOL, I'm still not sure what he was actually trying to say with that post or his post before that.

11/13/2021 5:47:37 PM

I guess i just find you and Rwoody so clueless sometimes, i was trying to say if i were you, I’d say the same thing. In other words, if I were as clueless as you, I’d too think i am drifting away. Or something to that effect.

Perhaps I should save comments such as these for the “2024 After Election Democrat Autopsy thread”

I apologize, I will do better in the future. I will try not to be vague, ruin a discussion, etc. Whether you respond or not to this post, I will not respond in this thread for a period of time yet to be determined. I don’t want to discourage others from contributing, and often others have much more thought provoking posts than my quips on why democrats are sucking right now.

11/13/2021 9:21:29 PM

LOL I'm the clueless one?

Immediately after my post where I clarify:

1 Democrats need to be better at messaging

2 The electorate believes a lot of bullshit about the Democrats due to Republican propaganda

and

3 The whole point of my response to aaronburro's post was to point out that his complaints about Democrats are merely a parroting that same Republican propaganda

You make a comment about having "your head in the sand about the state of our electorate", completely ignoring the fact that I even acknowledged the state of the electorate in point 2.

The state of the electorate was never a topic of debate for me, and I'm pretty sure it wasn't for rwoody, either.

What are you even basing that comment on??

It really looks to me like you've failed to even grasp what either of us are actually saying.

11/13/2021 9:49:18 PM

I'm concerned.

How can people justify a vote for this guy? I guess we was right about shooting a person in the street and not losing any votes. Why do we celebrate ignorance and hatred in this country? I cannot identify with the people that surround me.

6/19/2022 3:04:04 PM

DeSantis may be worse, same shit but focused and fewer own goals

6/19/2022 7:51:00 PM

Yeah, he sucks.

6/19/2022 8:50:00 PM

Btw i still think Trump is easily favored over him, Trump is better at saying the quiet parts loud and has that fucked up charisma

6/19/2022 8:55:31 PM

I should have responded to this over half a year ago. I'm still puzzled over the intended message/question here:

Quote :

"Where were you in fucking 2001-04? Most of yall communist ass dems didn’t say shit then while us Moderates were toting the line."

Most of communist ass dems voted for Gore so that we wouldn't have dropped the ball transitioning national security from Clinton to Bush, quite possibly avoiding 9/11. We were also opposing Bush's criminal Iraq invasion.

What were you doing???

What do you think I should've been doing???

I honestly have no fucking idea what you're trying to get at here.

6/20/2022 7:19:49 PM

Guess I'll have to be content to remain in the dark here......

6/23/2022 2:19:30 AM

^Well, how 'bout this? Do you think you're the active poster with the fewest total posts who isn't an alias?

6/23/2022 6:47:53 AM

No

6/23/2022 8:20:31 AM

Who's got you beat that still posts? By the way, no criticism or indictment of your posts. I just noticed and was surprised. Also since you've been registered since 2003.

6/23/2022 9:37:43 AM

I think there is a sports guy that has the lowest and is probably one of, if not the, youngest.

6/23/2022 10:14:55 AM

^^I actually thought your question was related to my previous post and I was wondering how it was supposed to be related. Was it just a general question then? (If so, no worries; no offense or criticism taken. My post count would be even be significantly lower were it not for repeated posts in the 52 books in a year threads over the years (though my posting frequency is significantly greater than it was from 2003 until 2010 or 2015, even ignoring that 52 books thread)).

I wouldn't have been able to name one before the ^ post, which I think is referring to rayef3rw. I was basing my answer on vague memories of seeing an occasional poster pop up here and there with a post count in the double (or even single) digits. That memory may be confused with a different message board, though.

Anyway, for what it's worth, I was just expressing general frustration in seeing conservatives ghosting on debates. I get the impression that they get backed into a corner and cowardly just back out. (I could very easily be wrong; it's simply my impression).

[Edited on June 23, 2022 at 10:47 AM. Reason : ]

6/23/2022 10:44:14 AM

Yes, it was just a general question based on an observation -- completely unrelated to your post. Except that since it was obvious you would not get a reply from your intended target, I changed the subject.

6/23/2022 11:59:06 AM

So if Trump/DeSantis are close when it comes to delegates for the Republican primary, won't they just accuse each other of voter fraud/election rigging?

6/28/2022 2:44:58 PM

Honestly thats prob one of our best hopes that they just shit on each other for 6 months, and maybe Trump encourages 3rd party if DeSantis wins.

6/28/2022 4:05:37 PM

I'm really interested in seeing what Trump does to DeSantis in terms of running a dirty campaign. He's sung DeSantis's praises for years now. It will be hard to go back on those praises, but, well, Trump.

6/28/2022 4:05:39 PM

Quote :

"It will be hard to go back on those praises"

It absolutely will not be

6/28/2022 4:06:18 PM

just incredible

6/28/2022 4:40:44 PM

I say this knowing full well that making statements like this have led plenty a smarter person to majorly eat their words later, but…

The only way I see a republican winning the next presidential election is if Trump doesn’t run. If he does, there’s no way to run against him without earning yourself a stupid nickname and having him trash you for months. If someone else manages to win the primary are the maga folks really going to vote for the guy Trump just bashed over and over?

6/29/2022 12:24:03 AM

You believe that the 2024 election won’t be stolen by trump if he runs?

6/29/2022 12:26:41 AM

I’m not saying it’s not a possibility, but he would have far fewer levers to pull than the last time he tried to

Thought I do think there are a few states that have changed some of their rules into allowing themselves to help him should they situation arise again, so now I’m second guessing my logic

[Edited on June 29, 2022 at 12:43 AM. Reason : A]

6/29/2022 12:42:42 AM

This will be how the right steals the 2024 presidential election

https://www.nytimes.com/2022/06/30/us/supreme-court-state-legislatures-elections.html

6/30/2022 11:54:23 AM

relevant: https://www.npr.org/2022/06/30/1106866830/supreme-court-to-take-on-controversial-election-law-case

Quote :

"The Supreme Court on Thursday agreed to hear a case that could dramatically change how federal elections are conducted. At issue is a legal theory that would give state legislatures unfettered authority to set the rules for federal elections, free of supervision by the state courts and state constitutions. The theory, known as the "independent state legislature theory," stems from the election clause in Article I of the Constitution. It says, "The times, places and manner of holding elections for senators and representatives, shall be prescribed in each state by the legislature thereof." "

6/30/2022 12:19:21 PM

Just now catching up on this thread, but...

The far-left does not win elections outside of a small sample of congressional districts. Only the barely left-of-center has any power, so the right has to accuse the barely left-of-center of being the far left in order to scare everyone else.

Every single fear tactic the right puts out in their propaganda about the left is about talking points of an incredibly small minority within the party, and those voices have continued to be silenced by the centrists (Pelosi, Biden, Harris, Clinton, Obama, etc etc). AOC only has any fame or influence because the right raise her up in order to make her seem like the torch-barer.

While the right has allowed their extreme flank to become its focus.

Pelosi and Biden never reference the far-left. The likes of AOC and Bernie never get mentioned or celebrated. But Trump always makes a point to bring up members of the "Freedom" caucus like Marjory Taylor Green, Madison Cawthorn, and Lauren Boebert.

While "The Squad" gets almost zero press outside of right-wing media.

7/17/2022 9:49:40 PM